Anonymous
Post 01/07/2022 09:16     Subject: Re:Is it ethical to outsource pregnancy?
Anonymous wrote:NP. I'm against surrogacy even if the surrogate is well off, not vulnerable, etc. I think paying to rent someone's body is immoral. It's treating them like a commodity.


Are you okay with altruistic surrogacy (e.g. not paid, like blood and organ donation)?
Anonymous
Post 01/07/2022 09:16     Subject: Is it ethical to outsource pregnancy?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
I just can’t imagine a wealthy woman agreeeing to carry and nurture *your* baby for nine months, giving birth, and then gleefully handing him over to you, most likely never to be seen again.

Talk about trauma for both the baby AND the mother! Birth mothers definitely should have ongoing psychological support available.


This is literally the most common scenario in the us. Maybe not always a wealthy woman but a financially secure and independent woman yes yes yes.

Just because you cannot imagine something doesn’t mean it does not exist.

Wow. Continue in your delusion if you think most of these young women are financially “secure”, and they just want to get pregnant so you can have your dream baby.


I have never had a surrogate and am done having babies. I had hyperemesis three times (that is when you throw up the whole time and lose 10% of your body weight from 'morning' sickness). I also had crippling pelvic pain in the second and third pregnancies and was hospitalized twice with preeclampsia. Had surrogacy been something even somewhat financially feasible for me I would have been first in line. But I could not adequately compensate someone for that, so there was no way.

There is only one delusional person here, and its you.
Anonymous
Post 01/07/2022 08:42     Subject: Is it ethical to outsource pregnancy?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
I just can’t imagine a wealthy woman agreeeing to carry and nurture *your* baby for nine months, giving birth, and then gleefully handing him over to you, most likely never to be seen again.

Talk about trauma for both the baby AND the mother! Birth mothers definitely should have ongoing psychological support available.



But truly there are people like that! My friend was one of them. She loved being pregnant but already had 2 kids and her husband didn’t want any more. So the surrogacy was a compromise. She went through pregnancy again and carried the baby for another family. Win-win! See the posts above too!
+1 These people exist. My friend loves being pregnant and would do it a million times if her husband was on board. She talks about becoming a surrogate after their next kid.

+1 Yes, some of us actually like being pregnant! We realize it’s not for everyone but my body is so much happier when I’m pregnant and I have really easy deliveries so giving birth isn’t quite the ordeal it is for some. - DP (not a surrogate (yet) but interested in becoming one potentially)
Anonymous
Post 01/07/2022 07:34     Subject: Re:Is it ethical to outsource pregnancy?
NP. I'm against surrogacy even if the surrogate is well off, not vulnerable, etc. I think paying to rent someone's body is immoral. It's treating them like a commodity.
Anonymous
Post 01/07/2022 00:43     Subject: Is it ethical to outsource pregnancy?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
I just can’t imagine a wealthy woman agreeeing to carry and nurture *your* baby for nine months, giving birth, and then gleefully handing him over to you, most likely never to be seen again.

Talk about trauma for both the baby AND the mother! Birth mothers definitely should have ongoing psychological support available.



But truly there are people like that! My friend was one of them. She loved being pregnant but already had 2 kids and her husband didn’t want any more. So the surrogacy was a compromise. She went through pregnancy again and carried the baby for another family. Win-win! See the posts above too!


+1 Yes, some of us actually like being pregnant! We realize it’s not for everyone but my body is so much happier when I’m pregnant and I have really easy deliveries so giving birth isn’t quite the ordeal it is for some. - DP (not a surrogate (yet) but interested in becoming one potentially)
Anonymous
Post 01/06/2022 23:56     Subject: Is it ethical to outsource pregnancy?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
I just can’t imagine a wealthy woman agreeeing to carry and nurture *your* baby for nine months, giving birth, and then gleefully handing him over to you, most likely never to be seen again.

Talk about trauma for both the baby AND the mother! Birth mothers definitely should have ongoing psychological support available.


This is literally the most common scenario in the us. Maybe not always a wealthy woman but a financially secure and independent woman yes yes yes.

Just because you cannot imagine something doesn’t mean it does not exist.

Wow. Continue in your delusion if you think most of these young women are financially “secure”, and they just want to get pregnant so you can have your dream baby.


You’re very sure that you’re right, for someone with no actual sources or direct experience. Are you the same one who knew exactly how IVF works because you googled it?


Why exactly would a financially secure and independent woman want to carry and nurture YOUR baby for NINE months, and endure ALL the necessary SACRIFICES?


Once again: because you cannot imagine something doesn’t mean it does not exist. Your experiences are not universal, nor is your perspective.

This is true even if you put some of your opinions in CAPITAL LETTERS.
Anonymous
Post 01/06/2022 23:48     Subject: Is it ethical to outsource pregnancy?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
I just can’t imagine a wealthy woman agreeeing to carry and nurture *your* baby for nine months, giving birth, and then gleefully handing him over to you, most likely never to be seen again.

Talk about trauma for both the baby AND the mother! Birth mothers definitely should have ongoing psychological support available.


This is literally the most common scenario in the us. Maybe not always a wealthy woman but a financially secure and independent woman yes yes yes.

Just because you cannot imagine something doesn’t mean it does not exist.

Wow. Continue in your delusion if you think most of these young women are financially “secure”, and they just want to get pregnant so you can have your dream baby.


You’re very sure that you’re right, for someone with no actual sources or direct experience. Are you the same one who knew exactly how IVF works because you googled it?


Why exactly would a financially secure and independent woman want to carry and nurture YOUR baby for NINE months, and endure ALL the necessary SACRIFICES?
Anonymous
Post 01/06/2022 23:44     Subject: Is it ethical to outsource pregnancy?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
I just can’t imagine a wealthy woman agreeeing to carry and nurture *your* baby for nine months, giving birth, and then gleefully handing him over to you, most likely never to be seen again.

Talk about trauma for both the baby AND the mother! Birth mothers definitely should have ongoing psychological support available.


This is literally the most common scenario in the us. Maybe not always a wealthy woman but a financially secure and independent woman yes yes yes.

Just because you cannot imagine something doesn’t mean it does not exist.

Wow. Continue in your delusion if you think most of these young women are financially “secure”, and they just want to get pregnant so you can have your dream baby.


You’re very sure that you’re right, for someone with no actual sources or direct experience. Are you the same one who knew exactly how IVF works because you googled it?

Anonymous
Post 01/06/2022 23:28     Subject: Is it ethical to outsource pregnancy?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
I just can’t imagine a wealthy woman agreeeing to carry and nurture *your* baby for nine months, giving birth, and then gleefully handing him over to you, most likely never to be seen again.

Talk about trauma for both the baby AND the mother! Birth mothers definitely should have ongoing psychological support available.


This is literally the most common scenario in the us. Maybe not always a wealthy woman but a financially secure and independent woman yes yes yes.

Just because you cannot imagine something doesn’t mean it does not exist.

Wow. Continue in your delusion if you think most of these young women are financially “secure”, and they just want to get pregnant so you can have your dream baby.
Anonymous
Post 01/06/2022 23:22     Subject: Is it ethical to outsource pregnancy?
Anonymous wrote:
I just can’t imagine a wealthy woman agreeeing to carry and nurture *your* baby for nine months, giving birth, and then gleefully handing him over to you, most likely never to be seen again.

Talk about trauma for both the baby AND the mother! Birth mothers definitely should have ongoing psychological support available.


This is literally the most common scenario in the us. Maybe not always a wealthy woman but a financially secure and independent woman yes yes yes.

Just because you cannot imagine something doesn’t mean it does not exist.
Anonymous
Post 01/06/2022 22:56     Subject: Is it ethical to outsource pregnancy?
Anonymous wrote:
I just can’t imagine a wealthy woman agreeeing to carry and nurture *your* baby for nine months, giving birth, and then gleefully handing him over to you, most likely never to be seen again.

Talk about trauma for both the baby AND the mother! Birth mothers definitely should have ongoing psychological support available.



But truly there are people like that! My friend was one of them. She loved being pregnant but already had 2 kids and her husband didn’t want any more. So the surrogacy was a compromise. She went through pregnancy again and carried the baby for another family. Win-win! See the posts above too!
Anonymous
Post 01/06/2022 22:51     Subject: Is it ethical to outsource pregnancy?

I just can’t imagine a wealthy woman agreeeing to carry and nurture *your* baby for nine months, giving birth, and then gleefully handing him over to you, most likely never to be seen again.

Talk about trauma for both the baby AND the mother! Birth mothers definitely should have ongoing psychological support available.
Anonymous
Post 01/06/2022 22:34     Subject: Is it ethical to outsource pregnancy?
Anonymous wrote:I'm trying to get across to you how common power imbalances are in our society. How easily even middle class people can be victimized. And literally you would never know.

Child marriage happens all the time in the US. Tell me again how we can be trusted with surrogacy b.c we are so much better than the Third World?

Payment doesn't make everything OK.


And I’m trying to get across to you that your zeal for “protecting the vulnerable” (which means anyone with a uterus I guess ) infantilizes women. Women can’t be allowed to make this decision for themselves because… child marriage exists? Because domestic abuse exists? Because 🤡🤡🤡🤡?

I don’t know if you were the same person who was going nuts about hAnDmAiD’S TaLe and CHATTEL!!! but honestly I think you sound a lot more controlling when it comes to women’s bodies.

Despite the fact that you seem to think you are the only person in the world who knows anything about power imbalances or abuse, all of us know that these things exist. You have not told a person in this thread anything they didn’t already know. Some of us just don’t think that your response makes any sense. In fairness, you haven’t really tried to explain it much past name-calling and 🤡🤡🤡🤡.
Anonymous
Post 01/06/2022 22:25     Subject: Is it ethical to outsource pregnancy?
Anonymous wrote:People on this thread know nothing about surrogacy in practice and just throw their opinions in the pot.
We used a surrogate. She was not poor. She agreed to carry the baby and go to the doctor and deliver at a hospital. Other than that she did whatever she wanted to do. We kept in touch of course and there were lots of legalities doctors lawyers etc etc. She DID NOT want another baby and gladly gave the baby to us. We paid her. I wish we could have paid her more but the RE made the most money.


And the surrogacy agency, which none of these fools have mentioned. You want to see where the biggest ethical issues are, look there.

I, too, am an parent through surrogacy. I raised these same points a few pages back, as have other IPs. People completely ignored my post. The folks arguing here have zero understanding of the facts and reality of how this actually works. They simply prefer to fight the things they can imagine without knowledge or experience. It’s fascinating and appalling in equal measure.

I fear for this country if this is what constitutes honest debate.
Anonymous
Post 01/06/2022 22:04     Subject: Is it ethical to outsource pregnancy?
"Hey I don't think loan sharking is ethical and it should be illegal"

Zomg what is wrong with you, you think all money should be illegal. Don't you have a savings account, you hypocrite.

Do you know how you sound? 🤡🤡🤡🤡