have seen no such evidence either. At best, all they did was post 2 or 3 examples of Common Core standards that they thought were "poorly written" (just their own subjective opinion, at that) - which constitutes what, barely even a single-digit percentage of the corpus of standards? Do you quit playing baseball because of 2 or 3 strikes out of hundreds of pitches? No. Does an orange farmer throw out his entire crop of oranges because 2 or 3 oranges were bad? No. Didn't we just talk about grit, Louie Zamperini and not being quitters above? Did Louie Zamperini say "screw it" and throw himself to the sharks after not being rescued after 2 or 3 hours? No. Yet apparently these same posters want us to scrap EVERYTHING and throw it all to the sharks, even before the first test results are in, just because, in their own biased opinion, they think 2 or 3 standards are "poorly written."

There's either some seriously disingenuous rhetoric being thrown around by these folks, or some serious cognitive dissonance going on.

LOL! Far more than that--and that is just Kindergarten.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/class-struggle/post/why-common-core-standards-will-fail/2012/02/23/gIQATLgbUR_blog.html

Read the article and note the study from Loveless about the connection between standards and achievement.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Rather than continually dodging, deflecting, waving hands, circular arguments, continual restatement of the same failed talking points and trying to change the subject every time you find yourselves painted into corners you anti-CC posters might want to start familiarizing yourself with this:

http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/aristotle-logic/

Key principles to apply, which seem to be thoroughly lacking on your part.

You're welcome.

Since you are so smart, you should be able to give us evidence that achievement is connected to standards.

Then, once you have done that, you can give us evidence that Common Core standards are good.

Well, I didn't provide the link to Aristotelian logic, but nonetheless, perhaps first you could provide evidence that

1. achievement is unconnected to standards
2. the Common Core standards (WHICH standards?) are bad

Opponents of the Common Core standards say that they have provided evidence for #2 on this thread, although I disagree. I don't remember seeing any evidence at all, convincing or unconvincing, for #1.

I have seen no such evidence either. At best, all they did was post 2 or 3 examples of Common Core standards that they thought were "poorly written" (just their own subjective opinion, at that) - which constitutes what, barely even a single-digit percentage of the corpus of standards? Do you quit playing baseball because of 2 or 3 strikes out of hundreds of pitches? No. Does an orange farmer throw out his entire crop of oranges because 2 or 3 oranges were bad? No. Didn't we just talk about grit, Louie Zamperini and not being quitters above? Did Louie Zamperini say "screw it" and throw himself to the sharks after not being rescued after 2 or 3 hours? No. Yet apparently these same posters want us to scrap EVERYTHING and throw it all to the sharks, even before the first test results are in, just because, in their own biased opinion, they think 2 or 3 standards are "poorly written."

There's either some seriously disingenuous rhetoric being thrown around by these folks, or some serious cognitive dissonance going on.

^^^everybody needing to go to college

Anonymous wrote:

Also, the Common Core standards are not responsible for the demand that everyone needs to go to college, or for local school boards getting rid of vocational education.

Go read the purpose of the common core standards.

I can't find anything specifically labeled "purpose", but here is the answer to the question "Why are the Common Core State Standards important?"

High standards that are consistent across states provide teachers, parents, and students with a set of clear expectations to ensure that all students have the skills and knowledge necessary to succeed in college, career, and life upon graduation from high school, regardless of where they live. These standards are aligned to the expectations of colleges, workforce training programs, and employers. The standards promote equity by ensuring all students are well prepared to collaborate and compete with their peers in the United States and abroad. Unlike previous state standards, which varied widely from state to state, the Common Core enables collaboration among states on a range of tools and policies, including the:
•Development of textbooks, digital media, and other teaching materials
•Development and implementation of common comprehensive assessment systems that replace existing state testing systems in order to measure student performance annually and provide teachers with specific feedback to help ensure students are on the path to success
•Development of tools and other supports to help educators and schools ensure all students are able to learn the new standards

I don't see anything in there about everything needing to go to college, or about the desirability of getting rid of vocational training. Quite the opposite, in fact.

Anonymous wrote:

Education still is run by the local school boards and the states.

NCLB has had the greatest impact on schools than anything else that I can name. A negative impact. Common Core just takes it a step further.

I could just as easily say that people like you have the biggest negative impact on our nation than anything else I can name. And your obsession with getting rid of Common Core just takes it a step further.

And, I'd have exactly as much of a sound basis for saying so as your own negative comments about Common Core do.

Anonymous wrote:

Rather than continually dodging, deflecting, waving hands, circular arguments, continual restatement of the same failed talking points and trying to change the subject every time you find yourselves painted into corners you anti-CC posters might want to start familiarizing yourself with this:

http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/aristotle-logic/

Key principles to apply, which seem to be thoroughly lacking on your part.

You're welcome.

Since you are so smart, you should be able to give us evidence that achievement is connected to standards.

Then, once you have done that, you can give us evidence that Common Core standards are good.

Well, I didn't provide the link to Aristotelian logic, but nonetheless, perhaps first you could provide evidence that

1. achievement is unconnected to standards
2. the Common Core standards (WHICH standards?) are bad

Opponents of the Common Core standards say that they have provided evidence for #2 on this thread, although I disagree. I don't remember seeing any evidence at all, convincing or unconvincing, for #1.

Anonymous wrote:

Also, the Common Core standards are not responsible for the demand that everyone needs to go to college, or for local school boards getting rid of vocational education.

Go read the purpose of the common core standards.

You're reaching again, stretching the truth again. The purpose statement says nothing about getting rid of vocational education, nor does it insist "everyone" needs to go to college.

Are you even capable of making even one statement that isn't desperately bending the truth?

Anonymous wrote:

Education still is run by the local school boards and the states.

NCLB has had the greatest impact on schools than anything else that I can name. A negative impact. Common Core just takes it a step further.

If the Common Core standards are a federal takeover of education, then how come states can either not adopt them or back out after adopting them -- as they are doing now, to the cheers of some of the opponents of the Common Core on this thread? Seems like a pretty ineffective takeover to me.

Rather than continually dodging, deflecting, waving hands, circular arguments, continual restatement of the same failed talking points and trying to change the subject every time you find yourselves painted into corners you anti-CC posters might want to start familiarizing yourself with this:

http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/aristotle-logic/

Key principles to apply, which seem to be thoroughly lacking on your part.

You're welcome.

Since you are so smart, you should be able to give us evidence that achievement is connected to standards.

Then, once you have done that, you can give us evidence that Common Core standards are good.

Education still is run by the local school boards and the states.

NCLB has had the greatest impact on schools than anything else that I can name. A negative impact. Common Core just takes it a step further.

Rather than continually dodging, deflecting, waving hands, circular arguments, continual restatement of the same failed talking points and trying to change the subject every time you find yourselves painted into corners you anti-CC posters might want to start familiarizing yourself with this:

http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/aristotle-logic/

Key principles to apply, which seem to be thoroughly lacking on your part.

You're welcome.

Also, the Common Core standards are not responsible for the demand that everyone needs to go to college, or for local school boards getting rid of vocational education.

Go read the purpose of the common core standards.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

They got a much better education back then - much more content and rigor. But then things went downhill, and for the last couple of decades, the content a student was exposed to by 8th grade has been nowhere near what it was back then. Common Core is trying to raise the bar again

They did it without centralized standards. They did it with education run by the local school boards and states. What changed? The demand that everyone needs to go to college. Getting rid of vocational education. etc..

Education still is run by the local school boards and the states.

Also, the Common Core standards are not responsible for the demand that everyone needs to go to college, or for local school boards getting rid of vocational education.

+100

Anonymous wrote:

They got a much better education back then - much more content and rigor. But then things went downhill, and for the last couple of decades, the content a student was exposed to by 8th grade has been nowhere near what it was back then. Common Core is trying to raise the bar again

They did it without centralized standards. They did it with education run by the local school boards and states. What changed? The demand that everyone needs to go to college. Getting rid of vocational education. etc..

Education still is run by the local school boards and the states.

Also, the Common Core standards are not responsible for the demand that everyone needs to go to college, or for local school boards getting rid of vocational education.