Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think that Walls admissions are a mess now because the test was scrapped. The process used to work sort of because the test was a first screening tool that eliminated many applicants who were not a good fit for Walls. The interview process was never great but it worked ok to sort through the remaining applicants. Also, applicants were sorted on how well they did on the test.

DCPS as usual did not think things through. They scrapped the test in the name of equity but gave no further thought to how applicants will be chosen. This has created a mess with interviewers implicit bias reigning supreme. I’m guessing Walls is short staffed and doesn’t have the time or manpower to sort this out within the limitations imposed on them by DCPS

And by "good fit" this once only applied to academic test taking acumen. It's not everything but it's something. Now who knows what "good fit" means?

Being able to take a test well matters for, you know, school.

They should bring back the test.

PP here. Yes I agree test should be back, but taking a high stakes test well isn't the only thing that matters for school and it's not the end all be all of academic potential. The current alternatives here are far inferior. It's not like colleges with optional SATs where instead there's a rigorous process for screening applicants. It's test or ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

They frequently have other tests, like AP tests, and there's more variation in coursework at the high school than the middle school level. For exam schools, it's been very common - until the last few years - to use test scores either exclusively or in a very heavy way, and it's produced incredibly high-performing and desirable schools. And part of the appeal is transparency and planning. In DC, even if you have a kid who consistently gets good grades and top scores, you have no idea whether they're going to get into a top high school.

Those AP tests aren't always high stakes and there's some discretion at most schools over which tests to take and when they are taken. Agree that any competitive HS will have this component. NYC is an interesting case study -- the most competitive schools are predominantly East and South Asian and that's because applicants dominate testing, but the schools are struggling to address diversity and equity, even for black and brown students who could thrive at those schools.

I don't know if that's the goal for Walls but an entrance exam sets a reasonable floor to select the most deserving applicants.

The Chicago magnet admissions model is the one to admire and copy, not NYC's. Chicago goes with great transparency and stability in magnet admissions, along with a comprehensive, college admissions-style applications. In Chicago, low SES applicants with high GPAs are entitled to good support from the school system to apply.

At the rate the DCPS is going in muddying the waters with Walls admissions, nobody should be surprised if the District is sued. Boston Latin (7th-12th grades) was sued in the late 1990s by a white family with a 6th grader who was rejected despite a higher exam score than many successful minority applicants. The result was a settlement agreement forcing Boston to scrap a 30% minority admissions set-aside/quota.

Anonymous wrote:I think that Walls admissions are a mess now because the test was scrapped. The process used to work sort of because the test was a first screening tool that eliminated many applicants who were not a good fit for Walls. The interview process was never great but it worked ok to sort through the remaining applicants. Also, applicants were sorted on how well they did on the test.

DCPS as usual did not think things through. They scrapped the test in the name of equity but gave no further thought to how applicants will be chosen. This has created a mess with interviewers implicit bias reigning supreme. I’m guessing Walls is short staffed and doesn’t have the time or manpower to sort this out within the limitations imposed on them by DCPS

THIS. Ech.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To the "Do what Banneker does crowd"...NO!

Never received any interview, period. Reached out a few times via email and phone and still haven't received any communication. There were still going thru apps at least two weeks before the lottery (that's what I was told). At least SWW lets you know where you stand regardless of the outcome.

DC applied from a private and I wanna believe that it didn't play a factor. But not getting an interview has got me wondering. Where's the equity in that?

Reranked schools in the lottery sensing we were being ghosted and was be admitted to SWW. A lot of families are not as fortunate to have options.

DCPS needs to take over all of it with one qualifying process for the selective high schools.

Your experience is an outlier.

Perhaps, but it is what I have to gauge things by. I'm betting it's not as much of an outlier as some think. The thought process is that Walls favors private school applicants. What if Banneker does the opposite? Not out the realm of possibility on either side.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think that Walls admissions are a mess now because the test was scrapped. The process used to work sort of because the test was a first screening tool that eliminated many applicants who were not a good fit for Walls. The interview process was never great but it worked ok to sort through the remaining applicants. Also, applicants were sorted on how well they did on the test.

DCPS as usual did not think things through. They scrapped the test in the name of equity but gave no further thought to how applicants will be chosen. This has created a mess with interviewers implicit bias reigning supreme. I’m guessing Walls is short staffed and doesn’t have the time or manpower to sort this out within the limitations imposed on them by DCPS

And by "good fit" this once only applied to academic test taking acumen. It's not everything but it's something. Now who knows what "good fit" means?

Being able to take a test well matters for, you know, school.

They should bring back the test.

PP here. Yes I agree test should be back, but taking a high stakes test well isn't the only thing that matters for school and it's not the end all be all of academic potential. The current alternatives here are far inferior. It's not like colleges with optional SATs where instead there's a rigorous process for screening applicants. It's test or ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

They frequently have other tests, like AP tests, and there's more variation in coursework at the high school than the middle school level. For exam schools, it's been very common - until the last few years - to use test scores either exclusively or in a very heavy way, and it's produced incredibly high-performing and desirable schools. And part of the appeal is transparency and planning. In DC, even if you have a kid who consistently gets good grades and top scores, you have no idea whether they're going to get into a top high school.

Those AP tests aren't always high stakes and there's some discretion at most schools over which tests to take and when they are taken. Agree that any competitive HS will have this component. NYC is an interesting case study -- the most competitive schools are predominantly East and South Asian and that's because applicants dominate testing, but the schools are struggling to address diversity and equity, even for black and brown students who could thrive at those schools.

I don't know if that's the goal for Walls but an entrance exam sets a reasonable floor to select the most deserving applicants.

Whenever there are appreciably fewer slots than students who could succeed, there will always be plenty of qualified, deserving students left out no matter what. So the entire "thing" is cosmically "unfair" in that sense.

This being the case, a uniform test administered to all students would seem to be the least unfair admission criteria. Does that mean test scores must be the end all be all? No. But jettisoning a uniform test altogether would seem to make things relatively more unfair, not less.

I mean some kids' "potential" might be more borne out by high test scores, notwithstanding mediocre middle school grades obtained when kids (especially boys) are still in the throws of getting their executive function skills together.

What about these kids' potential? In many cases, talented but perhaps heretofore unmotivated kids perform better in more challenging environments, which tend to be more stimulating.

Do these kids matter? You see, it's not possible to make this process "fair". It's all a trade-off on what type of kids you are looking to preference.

For now, it looks like we want to write off demonstrably smart kids that might not have performed up to par by traditional school metrics (i.e., grades).

Some kids are good a "school." Other kids are better at showing their talents on "high stakes" tests. Why is one better than the other? Let's keep them both part of the mix.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think that Walls admissions are a mess now because the test was scrapped. The process used to work sort of because the test was a first screening tool that eliminated many applicants who were not a good fit for Walls. The interview process was never great but it worked ok to sort through the remaining applicants. Also, applicants were sorted on how well they did on the test.

DCPS as usual did not think things through. They scrapped the test in the name of equity but gave no further thought to how applicants will be chosen. This has created a mess with interviewers implicit bias reigning supreme. I’m guessing Walls is short staffed and doesn’t have the time or manpower to sort this out within the limitations imposed on them by DCPS

And by "good fit" this once only applied to academic test taking acumen. It's not everything but it's something. Now who knows what "good fit" means?

Being able to take a test well matters for, you know, school.

They should bring back the test.

PP here. Yes I agree test should be back, but taking a high stakes test well isn't the only thing that matters for school and it's not the end all be all of academic potential. The current alternatives here are far inferior. It's not like colleges with optional SATs where instead there's a rigorous process for screening applicants. It's test or ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

They frequently have other tests, like AP tests, and there's more variation in coursework at the high school than the middle school level. For exam schools, it's been very common - until the last few years - to use test scores either exclusively or in a very heavy way, and it's produced incredibly high-performing and desirable schools. And part of the appeal is transparency and planning. In DC, even if you have a kid who consistently gets good grades and top scores, you have no idea whether they're going to get into a top high school.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think that Walls admissions are a mess now because the test was scrapped. The process used to work sort of because the test was a first screening tool that eliminated many applicants who were not a good fit for Walls. The interview process was never great but it worked ok to sort through the remaining applicants. Also, applicants were sorted on how well they did on the test.

DCPS as usual did not think things through. They scrapped the test in the name of equity but gave no further thought to how applicants will be chosen. This has created a mess with interviewers implicit bias reigning supreme. I’m guessing Walls is short staffed and doesn’t have the time or manpower to sort this out within the limitations imposed on them by DCPS

And by "good fit" this once only applied to academic test taking acumen. It's not everything but it's something. Now who knows what "good fit" means?

Being able to take a test well matters for, you know, school.

They should bring back the test.

PP here. Yes I agree test should be back, but taking a high stakes test well isn't the only thing that matters for school and it's not the end all be all of academic potential. The current alternatives here are far inferior. It's not like colleges with optional SATs where instead there's a rigorous process for screening applicants. It's test or ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think that Walls admissions are a mess now because the test was scrapped. The process used to work sort of because the test was a first screening tool that eliminated many applicants who were not a good fit for Walls. The interview process was never great but it worked ok to sort through the remaining applicants. Also, applicants were sorted on how well they did on the test.

DCPS as usual did not think things through. They scrapped the test in the name of equity but gave no further thought to how applicants will be chosen. This has created a mess with interviewers implicit bias reigning supreme. I’m guessing Walls is short staffed and doesn’t have the time or manpower to sort this out within the limitations imposed on them by DCPS

And by "good fit" this once only applied to academic test taking acumen. It's not everything but it's something. Now who knows what "good fit" means?

Being able to take a test well matters for, you know, school.

They should bring back the test.

Anonymous wrote:To the "Do what Banneker does crowd"...NO!

Never received any interview, period. Reached out a few times via email and phone and still haven't received any communication. There were still going thru apps at least two weeks before the lottery (that's what I was told). At least SWW lets you know where you stand regardless of the outcome.

DC applied from a private and I wanna believe that it didn't play a factor. But not getting an interview has got me wondering. Where's the equity in that?

Reranked schools in the lottery sensing we were being ghosted and was be admitted to SWW. A lot of families are not as fortunate to have options.

DCPS needs to take over all of it with one qualifying process for the selective high schools.

Your experience is an outlier.

Anonymous wrote:I think that Walls admissions are a mess now because the test was scrapped. The process used to work sort of because the test was a first screening tool that eliminated many applicants who were not a good fit for Walls. The interview process was never great but it worked ok to sort through the remaining applicants. Also, applicants were sorted on how well they did on the test.

DCPS as usual did not think things through. They scrapped the test in the name of equity but gave no further thought to how applicants will be chosen. This has created a mess with interviewers implicit bias reigning supreme. I’m guessing Walls is short staffed and doesn’t have the time or manpower to sort this out within the limitations imposed on them by DCPS

And by "good fit" this once only applied to academic test taking acumen. It's not everything but it's something. Now who knows what "good fit" means?

Anonymous wrote:

He openly said Walls doesn't take kids with IEPs, and he was staunchly opposed to schools reopening. He needed to go.

We knew several kids with IEPs who were admitted when he was principal. All have been highly successful at Walls.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To the "Do what Banneker does crowd"...NO!

Never received any interview, period. Reached out a few times via email and phone and still haven't received any communication. There were still going thru apps at least two weeks before the lottery (that's what I was told). At least SWW lets you know where you stand regardless of the outcome.

DC applied from a private and I wanna believe that it didn't play a factor. But not getting an interview has got me wondering. Where's the equity in that?

Reranked schools in the lottery sensing we were being ghosted and was be admitted to SWW. A lot of families are not as fortunate to have options.

DCPS needs to take over all of it with one qualifying process for the selective high schools.

From my observation over the last several years, these admissions process changes and lack of transparency are DCPS driven. Walls' longtime former principal was a staunch advocate for upholding admissions standards and process and was removed from his position. Active (and oblique) changes to the admissions process began after his removal.

He openly said Walls doesn't take kids with IEPs, and he was staunchly opposed to schools reopening. He needed to go.

I think that Walls admissions are a mess now because the test was scrapped. The process used to work sort of because the test was a first screening tool that eliminated many applicants who were not a good fit for Walls. The interview process was never great but it worked ok to sort through the remaining applicants. Also, applicants were sorted on how well they did on the test.

DCPS as usual did not think things through. They scrapped the test in the name of equity but gave no further thought to how applicants will be chosen. This has created a mess with interviewers implicit bias reigning supreme. I’m guessing Walls is short staffed and doesn’t have the time or manpower to sort this out within the limitations imposed on them by DCPS

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To the "Do what Banneker does crowd"...NO!

Never received any interview, period. Reached out a few times via email and phone and still haven't received any communication. There were still going thru apps at least two weeks before the lottery (that's what I was told). At least SWW lets you know where you stand regardless of the outcome.

DC applied from a private and I wanna believe that it didn't play a factor. But not getting an interview has got me wondering. Where's the equity in that?

Reranked schools in the lottery sensing we were being ghosted and was be admitted to SWW. A lot of families are not as fortunate to have options.

DCPS needs to take over all of it with one qualifying process for the selective high schools.

From my observation over the last several years, these admissions process changes and lack of transparency are DCPS driven. Walls' longtime former principal was a staunch advocate for upholding admissions standards and process and was removed from his position. Active (and oblique) changes to the admissions process began after his removal.

I think it’s telling that the person who wants DCPS to run the whole process from the central office is the person whose child is not currently attending a DCPS school.

+1

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To the "Do what Banneker does crowd"...NO!

Never received any interview, period. Reached out a few times via email and phone and still haven't received any communication. There were still going thru apps at least two weeks before the lottery (that's what I was told). At least SWW lets you know where you stand regardless of the outcome.

DC applied from a private and I wanna believe that it didn't play a factor. But not getting an interview has got me wondering. Where's the equity in that?

Reranked schools in the lottery sensing we were being ghosted and was be admitted to SWW. A lot of families are not as fortunate to have options.

DCPS needs to take over all of it with one qualifying process for the selective high schools.

Banneker sounds like a process failure but the stated policy is closer to private school admission than Walls. Our experience with Banneker was very different than yours (don't know if accepted because accepted at higher ranked school). The execution was clearly a problem. Walls gives lip service to equity but it sure favors private school applicants over the DCPS pipeline even for kids who excel in DCPS MS. Private schools don't struggle to sort through applications, interviews, tests scores. There's no secret sauce. An "application" school must be strategically resourced to handle applications. It shouldn't be an afterthought.

I don't know if DCPS running application process is the solution. There should be clear guidelines and an open process so any applicant knows where they stand. Walls should flip the current scoring to a weighted GPA for 26 point and 5 points for an interview. It would get more random but at least reward academic achievement first and foremost.

We know from experience that DCPS running things is never the solution