Anonymous wrote:I'm not even sure if I like any labels. Aren't we are all somewhere on the spectrum? In any case, labels are helpful for some, but they aren't for everyone, and I think we need to be more flexible with them changing. I'm learning so much talking to my son. He came out as bisexual to me, and he doesn't like labels, so I've been having a lot of talks at home lately about it. Being flexible is important all the way around.

+1
Important to keep communication channels open. Mental health is huge. They are teens and just discovering themselves.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm not even sure if I like any labels. Aren't we are all somewhere on the spectrum? In any case, labels are helpful for some, but they aren't for everyone, and I think we need to be more flexible with them changing. I'm learning so much talking to my son. He came out as bisexual to me, and he doesn't like labels, so I've been having a lot of talks at home lately about it. Being flexible is important all the way around.

No, thanks, we aren’t

No we really are somewhere in the gender spectrum.

You probably aren’t as masculine or feminine as others your same gender are. You have seen, im sure, very manly men and very feminine women. They are on the extremes of the spectrum. Everyone else is between those extremes, and people who are non-binary are somewhere in the middle.

Being a feminine man or a masculine woman doesn’t change the reality that you are, in fact, a man or a woman.

There's a difference between biological sex and gender. Non-binary people are focused mostly on the idea of gender, which is a societal construct that exists on a continuum and arises out of lived reality (Google "constitutive communication"...it's been around for well over two decades since I wrote a doctoral dissertation based on it that long ago and it wasn't new then). Does my kid know that they're a woman biologically? Sure. They just choose not to focus on that because what sex organs they have has nothing to do with the person they are, and they'd prefer that people react to them in a reality based on behavior and personality (which they have control over), not biology (which they don't).

I thank you for this explanation. The problem is that all of society is now expected to bend over backwards not to assume the gender of a person. I am taking classes in a medical field and the professors now refer to "people with female genitalia" rather than to women. The phrase "assigned female at birth" is just ridiculous. You get "assigned" the name Larla at birth, not your gender. The sex/gender pronouncement doesn't even happen at birth. If the mom has prenatal testing done, she can find out the chromosomes of her fetus very early on. The chromosomes don't lie and the assignment of gender has nothing to do with parturition (coming out of the birth canal). So, someone really needs to come up with a better term than "assigned at birth." It's not accurate. Just say that your chromosomes are female (or male, or an aberration).

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just seems like a colossal waste of time and mental energy, apart from kids with actual gender dysphoria.

Also reading this chain made me feel like we are doing girls a disservice but making it seem like being a woman is so terrible and such a burden to carry. FFS.

My child doesn’t think being a woman is terrible, they just don’t identify as one. They don’t want to be a man either.

Despite what this generation thinks, there is not a third option.

Google “spectrum” and get back to me.

Google “reality” and get back to me.

Omg are you kidding me? This from the person who is getting their ideas about reality from what their WASP mom told them in 1960? Hi, guess what, there is a ton of science on this, including research from doctors, psychologists, cultural anthropologists, and more, and the reality is that there are more than just two genders. I guess you can live inside your own world all you want but, yeah, that’s not reality.

Psychologists and “cultural anthropologists” are not scientists, dear. There is zero credible research to support your statements

See there is this thing called the social sciences...

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just seems like a colossal waste of time and mental energy, apart from kids with actual gender dysphoria.

Also reading this chain made me feel like we are doing girls a disservice but making it seem like being a woman is so terrible and such a burden to carry. FFS.

My child doesn’t think being a woman is terrible, they just don’t identify as one. They don’t want to be a man either.

And you don't see a problem with that? That your child is that removed from reality?

She doesn't "want" to be a man? What in the world would your precious like in life, PP? I'm being totally serious.

Do I see a problem with what? That my child doesn’t want to be a man? No, no I don’t.

The point is that people who identify as non-binary aren’t doing so because they think there is something terrible about being a boy or a girl. They just aren’t a big or a girl.

I am feeling lucky right now that I know what gender is and I know that it’s not binary. Seriously a ten-minute dive into Wikipedia could clear up so many misconceptions on this thread.

They've got you snowed.

They have a mom who loves them and accepts them and makes them do chores and homework and brush their teeth. We are good, thanks.

And they hate being a girl. That's not abnormal but it's not something to celebrate. Your welcome.

There is a difference between hating being a girl and just not being a girl.

Here, you might find this helpful.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-binary_gender

Well it sure ain't self-love or self-accreptance.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm not even sure if I like any labels. Aren't we are all somewhere on the spectrum? In any case, labels are helpful for some, but they aren't for everyone, and I think we need to be more flexible with them changing. I'm learning so much talking to my son. He came out as bisexual to me, and he doesn't like labels, so I've been having a lot of talks at home lately about it. Being flexible is important all the way around.

No, thanks, we aren’t

No we really are somewhere in the gender spectrum.

You probably aren’t as masculine or feminine as others your same gender are. You have seen, im sure, very manly men and very feminine women. They are on the extremes of the spectrum. Everyone else is between those extremes, and people who are non-binary are somewhere in the middle.

Being a feminine man or a masculine woman doesn’t change the reality that you are, in fact, a man or a woman.

There's a difference between biological sex and gender. Non-binary people are focused mostly on the idea of gender, which is a societal construct that exists on a continuum and arises out of lived reality (Google "constitutive communication"...it's been around for well over two decades since I wrote a doctoral dissertation based on it that long ago and it wasn't new then). Does my kid know that they're a woman biologically? Sure. They just choose not to focus on that because what sex organs they have has nothing to do with the person they are, and they'd prefer that people react to them in a reality based on behavior and personality (which they have control over), not biology (which they don't).

But why does there need to be a label? Most people are either male or female sex, and in terms of gender, who cares? If your kid doesn’t want to be female, what exactly, do they not want to be that they consider female? Seems like they are attaching stereotypes to the gender and rejecting those.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just seems like a colossal waste of time and mental energy, apart from kids with actual gender dysphoria.

Also reading this chain made me feel like we are doing girls a disservice but making it seem like being a woman is so terrible and such a burden to carry. FFS.

My child doesn’t think being a woman is terrible, they just don’t identify as one. They don’t want to be a man either.

And you don't see a problem with that? That your child is that removed from reality?

She doesn't "want" to be a man? What in the world would your precious like in life, PP? I'm being totally serious.

Do I see a problem with what? That my child doesn’t want to be a man? No, no I don’t.

The point is that people who identify as non-binary aren’t doing so because they think there is something terrible about being a boy or a girl. They just aren’t a big or a girl.

I am feeling lucky right now that I know what gender is and I know that it’s not binary. Seriously a ten-minute dive into Wikipedia could clear up so many misconceptions on this thread.

They've got you snowed.

They have a mom who loves them and accepts them and makes them do chores and homework and brush their teeth. We are good, thanks.

And they hate being a girl. That's not abnormal but it's not something to celebrate. Your welcome.

There is a difference between hating being a girl and just not being a girl.

Here, you might find this helpful.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-binary_gender

Newsflash: they’re still a girl.

It's amazing how men have snowed all of these women. The misogyny is coming from inside the house.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just seems like a colossal waste of time and mental energy, apart from kids with actual gender dysphoria.

Also reading this chain made me feel like we are doing girls a disservice but making it seem like being a woman is so terrible and such a burden to carry. FFS.

My child doesn’t think being a woman is terrible, they just don’t identify as one. They don’t want to be a man either.

Despite what this generation thinks, there is not a third option.

Google “spectrum” and get back to me.

Google “reality” and get back to me.

Omg are you kidding me? This from the person who is getting their ideas about reality from what their WASP mom told them in 1960? Hi, guess what, there is a ton of science on this, including research from doctors, psychologists, cultural anthropologists, and more, and the reality is that there are more than just two genders. I guess you can live inside your own world all you want but, yeah, that’s not reality.

Psychologists and “cultural anthropologists” are not scientists, dear. There is zero credible research to support your statements

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just seems like a colossal waste of time and mental energy, apart from kids with actual gender dysphoria.

Also reading this chain made me feel like we are doing girls a disservice but making it seem like being a woman is so terrible and such a burden to carry. FFS.

My child doesn’t think being a woman is terrible, they just don’t identify as one. They don’t want to be a man either.

And you don't see a problem with that? That your child is that removed from reality?

She doesn't "want" to be a man? What in the world would your precious like in life, PP? I'm being totally serious.

Do I see a problem with what? That my child doesn’t want to be a man? No, no I don’t.

The point is that people who identify as non-binary aren’t doing so because they think there is something terrible about being a boy or a girl. They just aren’t a big or a girl.

I am feeling lucky right now that I know what gender is and I know that it’s not binary. Seriously a ten-minute dive into Wikipedia could clear up so many misconceptions on this thread.

They've got you snowed.

They have a mom who loves them and accepts them and makes them do chores and homework and brush their teeth. We are good, thanks.

And they hate being a girl. That's not abnormal but it's not something to celebrate. Your welcome.

There is a difference between hating being a girl and just not being a girl.

Here, you might find this helpful.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-binary_gender

Newsflash: they’re still a girl.

Okay so we’re not doing any research today I see. I get it, it’s late and learning is hard.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just seems like a colossal waste of time and mental energy, apart from kids with actual gender dysphoria.

Also reading this chain made me feel like we are doing girls a disservice but making it seem like being a woman is so terrible and such a burden to carry. FFS.

My child doesn’t think being a woman is terrible, they just don’t identify as one. They don’t want to be a man either.

And you don't see a problem with that? That your child is that removed from reality?

She doesn't "want" to be a man? What in the world would your precious like in life, PP? I'm being totally serious.

Do I see a problem with what? That my child doesn’t want to be a man? No, no I don’t.

The point is that people who identify as non-binary aren’t doing so because they think there is something terrible about being a boy or a girl. They just aren’t a big or a girl.

I am feeling lucky right now that I know what gender is and I know that it’s not binary. Seriously a ten-minute dive into Wikipedia could clear up so many misconceptions on this thread.

They've got you snowed.

They have a mom who loves them and accepts them and makes them do chores and homework and brush their teeth. We are good, thanks.

And they hate being a girl. That's not abnormal but it's not something to celebrate. Your welcome.

There is a difference between hating being a girl and just not being a girl.

Here, you might find this helpful.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-binary_gender

Newsflash: they’re still a girl.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just seems like a colossal waste of time and mental energy, apart from kids with actual gender dysphoria.

Also reading this chain made me feel like we are doing girls a disservice but making it seem like being a woman is so terrible and such a burden to carry. FFS.

My child doesn’t think being a woman is terrible, they just don’t identify as one. They don’t want to be a man either.

And you don't see a problem with that? That your child is that removed from reality?

She doesn't "want" to be a man? What in the world would your precious like in life, PP? I'm being totally serious.

Do I see a problem with what? That my child doesn’t want to be a man? No, no I don’t.

The point is that people who identify as non-binary aren’t doing so because they think there is something terrible about being a boy or a girl. They just aren’t a big or a girl.

I am feeling lucky right now that I know what gender is and I know that it’s not binary. Seriously a ten-minute dive into Wikipedia could clear up so many misconceptions on this thread.

They've got you snowed.

They have a mom who loves them and accepts them and makes them do chores and homework and brush their teeth. We are good, thanks.

And they hate being a girl. That's not abnormal but it's not something to celebrate. Your welcome.

There is a difference between hating being a girl and just not being a girl.

Here, you might find this helpful.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-binary_gender

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm not even sure if I like any labels. Aren't we are all somewhere on the spectrum? In any case, labels are helpful for some, but they aren't for everyone, and I think we need to be more flexible with them changing. I'm learning so much talking to my son. He came out as bisexual to me, and he doesn't like labels, so I've been having a lot of talks at home lately about it. Being flexible is important all the way around.

No, thanks, we aren’t

No we really are somewhere in the gender spectrum.

You probably aren’t as masculine or feminine as others your same gender are. You have seen, im sure, very manly men and very feminine women. They are on the extremes of the spectrum. Everyone else is between those extremes, and people who are non-binary are somewhere in the middle.

Being a feminine man or a masculine woman doesn’t change the reality that you are, in fact, a man or a woman.

There's a difference between biological sex and gender. Non-binary people are focused mostly on the idea of gender, which is a societal construct that exists on a continuum and arises out of lived reality (Google "constitutive communication"...it's been around for well over two decades since I wrote a doctoral dissertation based on it that long ago and it wasn't new then). Does my kid know that they're a woman biologically? Sure. They just choose not to focus on that because what sex organs they have has nothing to do with the person they are, and they'd prefer that people react to them in a reality based on behavior and personality (which they have control over), not biology (which they don't).

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just seems like a colossal waste of time and mental energy, apart from kids with actual gender dysphoria.

Also reading this chain made me feel like we are doing girls a disservice but making it seem like being a woman is so terrible and such a burden to carry. FFS.

My child doesn’t think being a woman is terrible, they just don’t identify as one. They don’t want to be a man either.

And you don't see a problem with that? That your child is that removed from reality?

She doesn't "want" to be a man? What in the world would your precious like in life, PP? I'm being totally serious.

Do I see a problem with what? That my child doesn’t want to be a man? No, no I don’t.

The point is that people who identify as non-binary aren’t doing so because they think there is something terrible about being a boy or a girl. They just aren’t a big or a girl.

I am feeling lucky right now that I know what gender is and I know that it’s not binary. Seriously a ten-minute dive into Wikipedia could clear up so many misconceptions on this thread.

They've got you snowed.

They have a mom who loves them and accepts them and makes them do chores and homework and brush their teeth. We are good, thanks.

And they hate being a girl. That's not abnormal but it's not something to celebrate. Your welcome.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Every single person here who says that all these kids are confused and the whole thing is troubling would have said the exact same thing about a gay kid in the eighties.

No way. The kid who’s currently heterosexual cisgender is like the gay kid in the 1980’s. In terms of acceptance and popularity the gender queer kids now are like the jocks and cheerleaders of the 20th century.

Times have changed.

As evidenced by all the parents on here like OP who love that their kids are the popular ones right?

Anonymous wrote:Every single person here who says that all these kids are confused and the whole thing is troubling would have said the exact same thing about a gay kid in the eighties.

No way. The kid who’s currently heterosexual cisgender is like the gay kid in the 1980’s. In terms of acceptance and popularity the gender queer kids now are like the jocks and cheerleaders of the 20th century.

Times have changed.

Anonymous wrote:PP's post is exactly what bothers me about this.

Just because someone isn't SUPER feminine or masculine, doesn't mean they aren't their cis gender. There are many ways to be female (or male).

You might be talking about my post, in which case I’m sorry I wasn’t clear. Of course being super masculine or super feminine doesn’t mean you aren’t cisgender, I’m just pointing out their existence to show that there is a spectrum and we all fall somewhere on that spectrum.