Anonymous
Post 01/18/2015 15:01     Subject: Do atheists have souls?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:^^ I'm saying that without a soul guilt for any act is illogical .


It's illogical to be held accountable to your fellow human beings? What?

My value, my worth, and my guilt (or lack of) is made relevant according to my peers and community. That's sufficient enough for me to try and be a considerate human being.


Why on earth would somebody give up the fun parts of religion (fun ceremonies and holidays to share with your family and friends, stories to tell each other that become endowed with meaning over time, built up within a culture, beautiful art, beautiful music) and keep the crappy parts (the feeling that you have to be good instead of trying to maximize ones selfish happiness)?


You're an idiot who proved what I've been saying all along - that those who practice religion do so b/c they're selfish. Did you READ what you posted?

On a personal note, I don't need an Easter dinner to be my main form of "fun."

Anonymous
Post 01/18/2015 14:58     Subject: Do atheists have souls?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:^^ I'm saying that without a soul guilt for any act is illogical .


It's illogical to be held accountable to your fellow human beings? What?

My value, my worth, and my guilt (or lack of) is made relevant according to my peers and community. That's sufficient enough for me to try and be a considerate human being.



Good for you. You made up a wacky religion so you could feel special!! Of course it's based on nothing but your feelings.


How is that a wacky religion?

It's certainly more compassionate than "an eye for an eye."
Anonymous
Post 01/18/2015 14:43     Subject: Do atheists have souls?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:^^^ uhhhh because that's the moral of the stories you are celebrating .... And because there are a lot more cooler and fun groups you can be involved in than church.


sure, but once you give those up, why not give up the dull parts of religion as well?


there are organizations - unitarian "churches" ethical societies, and humanist communities, that have all the good things of religion without the supernatural belief in a deity and the physically impossible stories that go along with it (e.g. rising from the dead, walking on water, parting the sea, riding on a winged horse, living forever, if you believe). People involved in groups like this don't have to bend their minds to try to accept outrageous "faith-based" ideas or keep their perfectly logical, legitimate conclusions to themselves to fit into the community and to keep from offending people who harbor such beliefs.


but the problem with these organizations is that they are still trying to constrict you with the bad parts of religion: a false morality.

Isn't "morality" just a way for the powers to keep everybody down? It is the morality part that is bad, not the fun fairy tales.
Anonymous
Post 01/18/2015 13:35     Subject: Do atheists have souls?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:^^^ uhhhh because that's the moral of the stories you are celebrating .... And because there are a lot more cooler and fun groups you can be involved in than church.


sure, but once you give those up, why not give up the dull parts of religion as well?


there are organizations - unitarian "churches" ethical societies, and humanist communities, that have all the good things of religion without the supernatural belief in a deity and the physically impossible stories that go along with it (e.g. rising from the dead, walking on water, parting the sea, riding on a winged horse, living forever, if you believe). People involved in groups like this don't have to bend their minds to try to accept outrageous "faith-based" ideas or keep their perfectly logical, legitimate conclusions to themselves to fit into the community and to keep from offending people who harbor such beliefs.

Worshiping an awesome God and our savior Jesus Christ IS "the good thing of religion."
Anonymous
Post 01/18/2015 13:22     Subject: Do atheists have souls?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Can we say that whatever belief system or nonbelief system that leads people to try and be better people ( in all of those abstract ways of kindness, charity, respect] is of value?

Can the believer look at an atheist and say, you're trying to live your life according to a value system and so am I, and leave it at that?

Can the atheist look at the believer and say, I don't agree with you but there is good intent, and leave it at that?

It seems to me that if we accept that other men and women are whole people, different in some ways but often similar, that we can move closer to acceptance and civility.


If people come to feel that way about others, fine, but there is usually more to it than that. Some believers really feel and are taught by their faith that they have an obligation to save people's souls. In some cases their faith teaching them that people of other faiths or no faith are acutely less moral than they are and are a danger to society. No statistics or scientific evidence to the contrary will convince them otherwise, because their faith teaches them something different.

Some atheists strongly feel that teaching supernatural beliefs to children is harmful and that perpetuating the idea that such beliefs are valuable is harmful to society.

Also please consider that the basic "value system" of atheists and many varieties of religious believers is very much the same about most issues - (honesty, morality,compassion, etc) The differences come in the unsubstantiated beliefs (miracles, claims of divinity, power of prayer, etc) and the sometimes conflicting beliefs (my son of God is your prophet, who is someone else's Jewish carpenter and yet other person's myth based on earlier myths)


I'll give you that it was a very simplistic idea I put out there, but it makes a good starting point.

I'm not trying to convert you or anyone else. But we can still talk about my belief in God without being told I'm mistaken out of hand. And an atheist can tell me why they side with science over theology and I don't need to debate him/her. A statement of belief can stand on its own.
Anonymous
Post 01/18/2015 12:47     Subject: Do atheists have souls?
Anonymous wrote:Can we say that whatever belief system or nonbelief system that leads people to try and be better people ( in all of those abstract ways of kindness, charity, respect] is of value?

Can the believer look at an atheist and say, you're trying to live your life according to a value system and so am I, and leave it at that?

Can the atheist look at the believer and say, I don't agree with you but there is good intent, and leave it at that?

It seems to me that if we accept that other men and women are whole people, different in some ways but often similar, that we can move closer to acceptance and civility.


If people come to feel that way about others, fine, but there is usually more to it than that. Some believers really feel and are taught by their faith that they have an obligation to save people's souls. In some cases their faith teaching them that people of other faiths or no faith are acutely less moral than they are and are a danger to society. No statistics or scientific evidence to the contrary will convince them otherwise, because their faith teaches them something different.

Some atheists strongly feel that teaching supernatural beliefs to children is harmful and that perpetuating the idea that such beliefs are valuable is harmful to society.

Also please consider that the basic "value system" of atheists and many varieties of religious believers is very much the same about most issues - (honesty, morality,compassion, etc) The differences come in the unsubstantiated beliefs (miracles, claims of divinity, power of prayer, etc) and the sometimes conflicting beliefs (my son of God is your prophet, who is someone else's Jewish carpenter and yet other person's myth based on earlier myths)
Anonymous
Post 01/18/2015 11:09     Subject: Do atheists have souls?
Can we say that whatever belief system or nonbelief system that leads people to try and be better people ( in all of those abstract ways of kindness, charity, respect] is of value?

Can the believer look at an atheist and say, you're trying to live your life according to a value system and so am I, and leave it at that?

Can the atheist look at the believer and say, I don't agree with you but there is good intent, and leave it at that?

It seems to me that if we accept that other men and women are whole people, different in some ways but often similar, that we can move closer to acceptance and civility.
Anonymous
Post 01/18/2015 10:27     Subject: Do atheists have souls?
Anonymous wrote:Without souls "human beings" are "man" and logically no more special than "worms". Anything otherwise is made up nonsense based on your "feelings" which becomes some people's kooky "religion"


You're right, we're really not that different from worms in terms of our overall significance. Most of us do have slightly more evolved brains, however. Significance: Most.
Anonymous
Post 01/18/2015 09:52     Subject: Do atheists have souls?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:^^^ uhhhh because that's the moral of the stories you are celebrating .... And because there are a lot more cooler and fun groups you can be involved in than church.


sure, but once you give those up, why not give up the dull parts of religion as well?


there are organizations - unitarian "churches" ethical societies, and humanist communities, that have all the good things of religion without the supernatural belief in a deity and the physically impossible stories that go along with it (e.g. rising from the dead, walking on water, parting the sea, riding on a winged horse, living forever, if you believe). People involved in groups like this don't have to bend their minds to try to accept outrageous "faith-based" ideas or keep their perfectly logical, legitimate conclusions to themselves to fit into the community and to keep from offending people who harbor such beliefs.
Anonymous
Post 01/18/2015 08:53     Subject: Do atheists have souls?
Anonymous wrote:^^^ uhhhh because that's the moral of the stories you are celebrating .... And because there are a lot more cooler and fun groups you can be involved in than church.


sure, but once you give those up, why not give up the dull parts of religion as well?
Anonymous
Post 01/18/2015 08:51     Subject: Do atheists have souls?
^^^ uhhhh because that's the moral of the stories you are celebrating .... And because there are a lot more cooler and fun groups you can be involved in than church.
Anonymous
Post 01/18/2015 08:48     Subject: Do atheists have souls?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:^^ I'm saying that without a soul guilt for any act is illogical .


It's illogical to be held accountable to your fellow human beings? What?

My value, my worth, and my guilt (or lack of) is made relevant according to my peers and community. That's sufficient enough for me to try and be a considerate human being.


Why on earth would somebody give up the fun parts of religion (fun ceremonies and holidays to share with your family and friends, stories to tell each other that become endowed with meaning over time, built up within a culture, beautiful art, beautiful music) and keep the crappy parts (the feeling that you have to be good instead of trying to maximize ones selfish happiness)?
Anonymous
Post 01/18/2015 08:33     Subject: Do atheists have souls?
Someone who's life is improved by killing you and taking your money has an equally valid faith .
Anonymous
Post 01/18/2015 08:31     Subject: Do atheists have souls?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:^^ I'm saying that without a soul guilt for any act is illogical .


It's illogical to be held accountable to your fellow human beings? What?

My value, my worth, and my guilt (or lack of) is made relevant according to my peers and community. That's sufficient enough for me to try and be a considerate human being.



Good for you. You made up a wacky religion so you could feel special!! Of course it's based on nothing but your feelings.
Anonymous
Post 01/18/2015 08:27     Subject: Do atheists have souls?
Without souls "human beings" are "man" and logically no more special than "worms". Anything otherwise is made up nonsense based on your "feelings" which becomes some people's kooky "religion"