Anonymous wrote:The Jewish identity is both hard to define and even harder to maintain. In a world where "Judeo-Christian" values are touted, its very difficult to discern how Jews are different and for those who want to maintain a Jewish identity, often separation and distinction are necessary to avoid the complete absorption of the Jewish people.

Some people define themselves as Jews by the history - Holocaust, some identify with Israel, some observe religious practice. Others distinguish themselves by not being involved with other religions - staying away from Christmas, refusing to go to churches, etc.

For those who intermarry and then follow the thought that as long as we feel Jewish, its ok to have a Christmas tree with a Star of David, it is unlikely (though certainly not impossible) that future generations from that family will have any Jewish identity at all. There's no judgment in that statement, its just a reality.

None of this means that Jews look down on people who arent Jewish or feel that they are better than non-Jews. It just means that as a very, very small minority (though it often doesnt seem that way in this area), separation and distinction is absolutely necessary to maintaining an identity.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:NP here; Jew married to a Non-Jew. Responding to various points that have been brought up in this thread.

I belong to a reform synagogue that is accepting of interfaith marriage and very welcoming to all. I don't go to services but I am involved in other aspects of synagogue life, volunteering, participating in various educational opportunities etc. To me being a Jew is so much a part of my identity and I appreciate the values that Judism teaches, but the actual services or spiritual aspects do not move me. There are lots of "Jewish atheists" in my synagogue.

We have a tree and I have a Star of David topper. I'm irreverant that way. I also give a big holiday party every year and call it Chrismukka and serve brisket and latkes with candy canes and egg nog. (lots of other stuff too but you get the idea)

My friends come from all over. I don't exclusively hang out with Jews. As I mentioned above, my husband is not Jewish.

I bend over backwards to avoid the "cheap" stereotype. Eg. I never quibble about a restaurant bill and I tip well.

There is a "Jewish Look" because the grandparents and great grandparents of the majority of Jews in the U.S came from Eastern Europe and the former Soviet block countries during the years 1884-1924. My great grandparents and grandparents came from Russia and Poland.

There are many of us that don't necessarily support the current Israeli government, but all of us believe in Israel's right to exist and the need for a Jewish homeland. I didn't support the GWB administration here at home, but I was and still am proud to be an American. I don't think that being critical of the Israeli govt equates with being antisemitic. Sometimes it does, but it isn't automatic.

This post makes me sad and frustrated. A Star of David topper on your Christmas tree. Say goodbye to some more Jews. Your kids won't care.

Anonymous wrote:The Jewish identity is both hard to define and even harder to maintain. In a world where "Judeo-Christian" values are touted, its very difficult to discern how Jews are different and for those who want to maintain a Jewish identity, often separation and distinction are necessary to avoid the complete absorption of the Jewish people.

Some people define themselves as Jews by the history - Holocaust, some identify with Israel, some observe religious practice. Others distinguish themselves by not being involved with other religions - staying away from Christmas, refusing to go to churches, etc.

For those who intermarry and then follow the thought that as long as we feel Jewish, its ok to have a Christmas tree with a Star of David, it is unlikely (though certainly not impossible) that future generations from that family will have any Jewish identity at all. There's no judgment in that statement, its just a reality.

None of this means that Jews look down on people who arent Jewish or feel that they are better than non-Jews. It just means that as a very, very small minority (though it often doesnt seem that way in this area), separation and distinction is absolutely necessary to maintaining an identity.

Anonymous wrote:NP here; Jew married to a Non-Jew. Responding to various points that have been brought up in this thread.

I belong to a reform synagogue that is accepting of interfaith marriage and very welcoming to all. I don't go to services but I am involved in other aspects of synagogue life, volunteering, participating in various educational opportunities etc. To me being a Jew is so much a part of my identity and I appreciate the values that Judism teaches, but the actual services or spiritual aspects do not move me. There are lots of "Jewish atheists" in my synagogue.

We have a tree and I have a Star of David topper. I'm irreverant that way. I also give a big holiday party every year and call it Chrismukka and serve brisket and latkes with candy canes and egg nog. (lots of other stuff too but you get the idea)

My friends come from all over. I don't exclusively hang out with Jews. As I mentioned above, my husband is not Jewish.

I bend over backwards to avoid the "cheap" stereotype. Eg. I never quibble about a restaurant bill and I tip well.

There is a "Jewish Look" because the grandparents and great grandparents of the majority of Jews in the U.S came from Eastern Europe and the former Soviet block countries during the years 1884-1924. My great grandparents and grandparents came from Russia and Poland.

There are many of us that don't necessarily support the current Israeli government, but all of us believe in Israel's right to exist and the need for a Jewish homeland. I didn't support the GWB administration here at home, but I was and still am proud to be an American. I don't think that being critical of the Israeli govt equates with being antisemitic. Sometimes it does, but it isn't automatic.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:NP here; Jew married to a Non-Jew. Responding to various points that have been brought up in this thread.

I belong to a reform synagogue that is accepting of interfaith marriage and very welcoming to all. I don't go to services but I am involved in other aspects of synagogue life, volunteering, participating in various educational opportunities etc. To me being a Jew is so much a part of my identity and I appreciate the values that Judism teaches, but the actual services or spiritual aspects do not move me. There are lots of "Jewish atheists" in my synagogue.

We have a tree and I have a Star of David topper. I'm irreverant that way. I also give a big holiday party every year and call it Chrismukka and serve brisket and latkes with candy canes and egg nog. (lots of other stuff too but you get the idea)

My friends come from all over. I don't exclusively hang out with Jews. As I mentioned above, my husband is not Jewish.

I bend over backwards to avoid the "cheap" stereotype. Eg. I never quibble about a restaurant bill and I tip well.

There is a "Jewish Look" because the grandparents and great grandparents of the majority of Jews in the U.S came from Eastern Europe and the former Soviet block countries during the years 1884-1924. My great grandparents and grandparents came from Russia and Poland.

There are many of us that don't necessarily support the current Israeli government, but all of us believe in Israel's right to exist and the need for a Jewish homeland. I didn't support the GWB administration here at home, but I was and still am proud to be an American. I don't think that being critical of the Israeli govt equates with being antisemitic. Sometimes it does, but it isn't automatic.

I think that most would agree that there is a "Jewish Look" just as there is an Irish Look, a Swedish Look, an Italian Look, etc. The question is, why is it offensive to say "you don't look Jewish" or "she looks Jewish" whereas it is not offensive to say e.g. "you don't look Irish" or "she looks so Swedish"?

Because this "observation" is often associated with general stereotyping or outright bigotry. In earlier days, looking, e.g., Irish, was also associated with these things ("no Irish need apply"). Not so much anymore.

I'm Jewish, but I guess I didn't look it, at least when I was a teenager. I had several experiences with "friends" and acquaintances making blatantly antisemitic remarks to me -- about others. The best was one when one pretty girl whose pants I wanted to get into was talking about a particular family she didn't like, and I asked her why. She wrinkled her nose, and said under her breath in a drippingly contemptuous tone, "they're Jews." I guess my expression gave me away, and she started to apologize, but that was of course it for us. Happily, I went to the same college with her blonde, blue-eyed cousin, with whom I also had a mutual attraction, and who I fucked. We had a good laugh about her cousin as part of our pillow talk.

Living well isn't the best revenge; it's fucking their cousin and laughing about them with her.

But back to the original point, yeah, "you don't look Jewish" is up there with asking a black girl if you can touch her hair.

Sorry, not buying it. Just because it has been associated with bigotry over the years doesn't mean that everyone making that observation in the here and now is a bigot. As you say, not so much anymore. Reacting with offense at such a statement is just a knee-jerk, cry-antisemitism response. Not buying it.

Aside from that, you sound like a misogynistic jerk.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:NP here; Jew married to a Non-Jew. Responding to various points that have been brought up in this thread.

I belong to a reform synagogue that is accepting of interfaith marriage and very welcoming to all. I don't go to services but I am involved in other aspects of synagogue life, volunteering, participating in various educational opportunities etc. To me being a Jew is so much a part of my identity and I appreciate the values that Judism teaches, but the actual services or spiritual aspects do not move me. There are lots of "Jewish atheists" in my synagogue.

We have a tree and I have a Star of David topper. I'm irreverant that way. I also give a big holiday party every year and call it Chrismukka and serve brisket and latkes with candy canes and egg nog. (lots of other stuff too but you get the idea)

My friends come from all over. I don't exclusively hang out with Jews. As I mentioned above, my husband is not Jewish.

I bend over backwards to avoid the "cheap" stereotype. Eg. I never quibble about a restaurant bill and I tip well.

There is a "Jewish Look" because the grandparents and great grandparents of the majority of Jews in the U.S came from Eastern Europe and the former Soviet block countries during the years 1884-1924. My great grandparents and grandparents came from Russia and Poland.

There are many of us that don't necessarily support the current Israeli government, but all of us believe in Israel's right to exist and the need for a Jewish homeland. I didn't support the GWB administration here at home, but I was and still am proud to be an American. I don't think that being critical of the Israeli govt equates with being antisemitic. Sometimes it does, but it isn't automatic.

I think that most would agree that there is a "Jewish Look" just as there is an Irish Look, a Swedish Look, an Italian Look, etc. The question is, why is it offensive to say "you don't look Jewish" or "she looks Jewish" whereas it is not offensive to say e.g. "you don't look Irish" or "she looks so Swedish"?

Because this "observation" is often associated with general stereotyping or outright bigotry. In earlier days, looking, e.g., Irish, was also associated with these things ("no Irish need apply"). Not so much anymore.

I'm Jewish, but I guess I didn't look it, at least when I was a teenager. I had several experiences with "friends" and acquaintances making blatantly antisemitic remarks to me -- about others. The best was one when one pretty girl whose pants I wanted to get into was talking about a particular family she didn't like, and I asked her why. She wrinkled her nose, and said under her breath in a drippingly contemptuous tone, "they're Jews." I guess my expression gave me away, and she started to apologize, but that was of course it for us. Happily, I went to the same college with her blonde, blue-eyed cousin, with whom I also had a mutual attraction, and who I fucked. We had a good laugh about her cousin as part of our pillow talk.

Living well isn't the best revenge; it's fucking their cousin and laughing about them with her.

But back to the original point, yeah, "you don't look Jewish" is up there with asking a black girl if you can touch her hair.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:NP here; Jew married to a Non-Jew. Responding to various points that have been brought up in this thread.

I belong to a reform synagogue that is accepting of interfaith marriage and very welcoming to all. I don't go to services but I am involved in other aspects of synagogue life, volunteering, participating in various educational opportunities etc. To me being a Jew is so much a part of my identity and I appreciate the values that Judism teaches, but the actual services or spiritual aspects do not move me. There are lots of "Jewish atheists" in my synagogue.

We have a tree and I have a Star of David topper. I'm irreverant that way. I also give a big holiday party every year and call it Chrismukka and serve brisket and latkes with candy canes and egg nog. (lots of other stuff too but you get the idea)

My friends come from all over. I don't exclusively hang out with Jews. As I mentioned above, my husband is not Jewish.

I bend over backwards to avoid the "cheap" stereotype. Eg. I never quibble about a restaurant bill and I tip well.

There is a "Jewish Look" because the grandparents and great grandparents of the majority of Jews in the U.S came from Eastern Europe and the former Soviet block countries during the years 1884-1924. My great grandparents and grandparents came from Russia and Poland.

There are many of us that don't necessarily support the current Israeli government, but all of us believe in Israel's right to exist and the need for a Jewish homeland. I didn't support the GWB administration here at home, but I was and still am proud to be an American. I don't think that being critical of the Israeli govt equates with being antisemitic. Sometimes it does, but it isn't automatic.

I think that most would agree that there is a "Jewish Look" just as there is an Irish Look, a Swedish Look, an Italian Look, etc. The question is, why is it offensive to say "you don't look Jewish" or "she looks Jewish" whereas it is not offensive to say e.g. "you don't look Irish" or "she looks so Swedish"?

Because this "observation" is often associated with general stereotyping or outright bigotry. In earlier days, looking, e.g., Irish, was also associated with these things ("no Irish need apply"). Not so much anymore.

I'm Jewish, but I guess I didn't look it, at least when I was a teenager. I had several experiences with "friends" and acquaintances making blatantly antisemitic remarks to me -- about others. The best was one when one pretty girl whose pants I wanted to get into was talking about a particular family she didn't like, and I asked her why. She wrinkled her nose, and said under her breath in a drippingly contemptuous tone, "they're Jews." I guess my expression gave me away, and she started to apologize, but that was of course it for us. Happily, I went to the same college with her blonde, blue-eyed cousin, with whom I also had a mutual attraction, and who I fucked. We had a good laugh about her cousin as part of our pillow talk.

Living well isn't the best revenge; it's fucking their cousin and laughing about them with her.

But back to the original point, yeah, "you don't look Jewish" is up there with asking a black girl if you can touch her hair.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:NP here; Jew married to a Non-Jew. Responding to various points that have been brought up in this thread.

I belong to a reform synagogue that is accepting of interfaith marriage and very welcoming to all. I don't go to services but I am involved in other aspects of synagogue life, volunteering, participating in various educational opportunities etc. To me being a Jew is so much a part of my identity and I appreciate the values that Judism teaches, but the actual services or spiritual aspects do not move me. There are lots of "Jewish atheists" in my synagogue.

We have a tree and I have a Star of David topper. I'm irreverant that way. I also give a big holiday party every year and call it Chrismukka and serve brisket and latkes with candy canes and egg nog. (lots of other stuff too but you get the idea)

My friends come from all over. I don't exclusively hang out with Jews. As I mentioned above, my husband is not Jewish.

I bend over backwards to avoid the "cheap" stereotype. Eg. I never quibble about a restaurant bill and I tip well.

There is a "Jewish Look" because the grandparents and great grandparents of the majority of Jews in the U.S came from Eastern Europe and the former Soviet block countries during the years 1884-1924. My great grandparents and grandparents came from Russia and Poland.

There are many of us that don't necessarily support the current Israeli government, but all of us believe in Israel's right to exist and the need for a Jewish homeland. I didn't support the GWB administration here at home, but I was and still am proud to be an American. I don't think that being critical of the Israeli govt equates with being antisemitic. Sometimes it does, but it isn't automatic.

I think that most would agree that there is a "Jewish Look" just as there is an Irish Look, a Swedish Look, an Italian Look, etc. The question is, why is it offensive to say "you don't look Jewish" or "she looks Jewish" whereas it is not offensive to say e.g. "you don't look Irish" or "she looks so Swedish"?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How come at multicultural night at my kid's school most of the Jewish kids said their heritage is Jewish or Israeli and not Russian/Polish etc...when that is probably more likely since you kinda can't have Israeli heritage seeing as the country is only 64 years old?

Jews have been in Israel for thousands of years.

http://www.jewfaq.org/israel.htm

http://arabisraeliconflict.info/arab-israel-facts/fact-1-jewish-history-israel

If you we're to ask the heritage of Polish Jews they wouldn't respond they are Polish. They'd respond they are Jewish.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How come at multicultural night at my kid's school most of the Jewish kids said their heritage is Jewish or Israeli and not Russian/Polish etc...when that is probably more likely since you kinda can't have Israeli heritage seeing as the country is only 64 years old?

Jews have been in Israel for thousands of years.

http://www.jewfaq.org/israel.htm

http://arabisraeliconflict.info/arab-israel-facts/fact-1-jewish-history-israel

Anonymous wrote:How come at multicultural night at my kid's school most of the Jewish kids said their heritage is Jewish or Israeli and not Russian/Polish etc...when that is probably more likely since you kinda can't have Israeli heritage seeing as the country is only 64 years old?