Anonymous
05/23/2024 20:28
Subject: Do many people pick publics because of money?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Virginia has some fantastic state schools. Why pay for private when you can get a better education, with a larger alumni network, at a public?
VA state schools are good at some things but overall mediocre in STEM.
+1. I thought every one knew this?
but it's false. Go look at what Jim Ryan has done in the last 8 years at UVA, especially in the sciences. The pp
has a kid who didn't get in so keeps up with the same assertion, same sentence structure (poor) over and over.
Anonymous
05/23/2024 13:28
Subject: Re:Do many people pick publics because of money?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:You realize that both UVA and WM are both so good that people from out of state want to attend them also, right? It’s not like it’s a huge compromise for top students to go there. The lower in-state tuition might be a necessity for some families, a bonus for some, and completely inconsequential for others.
This. I would pick a public, in-state university for my kid any day over private. VA has a handful of excellent schools at reasonable rates. I went to a flagship state school and do well as an attorney. I did have law school loans and have since learned what a burden that can be at the beginning of one's career. I'd like to avoid that for my kids. Being debt-free allows you to take more risks or pursue opportunities which would otherwise not be available to those who shoulder hefty monthly student loan payments. I see no reason to pursue that option.
Plus, paying nearly $100K for a year of undergrad is just insanity. For someone in finance, I'm surprised that you consider that a good deal.
for the most part, it's not a good deal. It's an emotional purchase, which UMC/wealthy people fall for as easy as middle income people.
Anonymous
05/23/2024 13:27
Subject: Do many people pick publics because of money?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Virginia has some fantastic state schools. Why pay for private when you can get a better education, with a larger alumni network, at a public?
VA state schools are good at some things but overall mediocre in STEM.
+1. I thought every one knew this?
Anonymous
05/23/2024 13:26
Subject: Do many people pick publics because of money?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:You understand that tuition rates have grown astronomically faster than wages since you were in college, right?
It's now a question of worth. Sure, we could pay for any college, but is it a wise use of our money to pay 90K for a SLAC vs. 40K for UMD? I'm not so sure it is.
These days, most likely, no, it's not worth it.
Maybe 20 years ago it may have been, but not today.
Anonymous
05/23/2024 13:25
Subject: Do many people pick publics because of money?
Anonymous wrote:You understand that tuition rates have grown astronomically faster than wages since you were in college, right?
It's now a question of worth. Sure, we could pay for any college, but is it a wise use of our money to pay 90K for a SLAC vs. 40K for UMD? I'm not so sure it is.
Anonymous
05/23/2024 13:23
Subject: Re:Do many people pick publics because of money?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:There are belief shifts happening about the value of education, as education has become astronomically expensive. People are starting to take seriously the idea that very good publics basically have the same outcomes. If your kid can get into a top 10 school, MAYBE worth the networks, but after that, research suggests that it's just not. And so a lot of smart people are stepping back and redefining what "best" means. Used to be "best" reputation/prestige. Now it's "best" outcomes. And when you spin it like that, a lot of smart folks are going to choose publics. A lot of people have come to understand that it's fundamentally a waste of hundreds of thousands of dollars to pay for private over public, or private with merit aid (unless your kid has very specific needs or interests).
I would absolutely advise my kid to go to a strong public rather than saddle themselves with years and years of debt to go to a private.
Definitely! My son even says it himself; why pay more? He’s thriving at a large instate public.
This is not new, if anything the period of MC kids were going to elite schools was a brief anomaly. We're now back to Gilded Age income disparity, there's no room for strivers. But read the posts here, most parents want their kid to be Dilbert--state school was always the route to that.
Anonymous
05/23/2024 12:32
Subject: Do many people pick publics because of money?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:You understand that tuition rates have grown astronomically faster than wages since you were in college, right?
Of course I understand. We can easily afford to pay tuition. However, even if we couldn’t, I would encourage my children to apply and attend the best college possible.
I know many kids going to UVA and W&M could have gone to “better” schools. I’m sure this is more from public high schools, not private. If you are already paying 50k for high school tuition, paying 80k for college tuition probably would not be a factor in deciding where to go to college.
1. If you couldn't afford to pay, then why would you encourage your children to apply and attend the "best college possible"?
2. Your statement about a person paying $50K being able to pay $80K (and rising)(It's actually $90K now, generally) makes assumptions and is erroneous.
3. Yes, people pick publics and privates with merit aid over "better" brand-name schools because of money.
Dh and I want to HYP grad schools. I earned high six figures and Dh now earns seven figures. I don’t think it would have been possible without our education.
As a graduate of elite Ivies, undergrad and grad, I can tell you there are plenty of failed Ivy grads who never really launched. They eke out middle class existences.
Yeah, I also know Ivy grads who are living middle class lives. But to call this "failure", "not launching", and "eking out an existence" is a sign that you are a complete asz.
Angry? Are you one of the failed to launch Ivy graduates?
Whether you like it or not, there is a strong implication / assumption that going to an Ivy is supposed to be a route to success, it's certainly why so many are heavily invested in the rigmarole of Ivy admissions so they can get the vaulted gold ticket to a lifetime of prosperity and why parents fork out so much money for a degree. In reality, this doesn't work for everyone, and for a lot more Ivy grads than you'd expect. A surprising number flame out despite the promises of their academic pedigree. And I do use the words flame out for a reason - they did not live up to their potential as implied by the admissions to the Ivy.
Just food for thoughts for parents debating whether it's worth spending 380k for an Ivy degree versus half that at a flagship state or another college with a strong merit package.
Anonymous
05/23/2024 12:12
Subject: Re:Do many people pick publics because of money?
I’ve seen it and it’s sad because the depression rates and suicide rates are high for this particular group.Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:You realize that both UVA and WM are both so good that people from out of state want to attend them also, right? It’s not like it’s a huge compromise for top students to go there. The lower in-state tuition might be a necessity for some families, a bonus for some, and completely inconsequential for others.
This. I would pick a public, in-state university for my kid any day over private. VA has a handful of excellent schools at reasonable rates. I went to a flagship state school and do well as an attorney. I did have law school loans and have since learned what a burden that can be at the beginning of one's career. I'd like to avoid that for my kids. Being debt-free allows you to take more risks or pursue opportunities which would otherwise not be available to those who shoulder hefty monthly student loan payments. I see no reason to pursue that option.
Plus, paying nearly $100K for a year of undergrad is just insanity. For someone in finance, I'm surprised that you consider that a good deal.
You realize every ROI has a numerator as well as a denominator, right? At least they teach that in B School if nothing else.
OP makes the faulty assumption that all private school grads go on to lucrative 1st year salaries, which we all know to be a grossly oversold mistruth. Overpaying for a lofty private does not guarantee $300K 1st year out. In fact, I know many Ivy grads who are still making less than $150K even in their 40s. At its core, private uni is really just a marketing scam.
Anonymous
05/23/2024 11:54
Subject: Do many people pick publics because of money?
Anonymous wrote:I work at a FIRREA agency and you can look up anyone's salary. All my colleagues make in the mid 200s and come from all over - Ivies, Public Ivies, SLACs, and tons of no-name regional state schools. Everyone is making the same money.
The folks from state schools are likely ahead financially because they took out zero or minimal student loans. They also tended to start at my agency very early in their career (like early or mid 20s), whereas folks with brand-name degrees bounced around in private sector before landing in .gov
No. Some kid take out loans for state schools, a lot can’t afford $40k/year and parents didn’t save or make just enough no need aid.
And plenty of kids come out of privates/Ivies with no loans because parents paid. The kids in families p under $200k HHI are completely free needs blind at Ivies- so you don’t know wth you are talking about.
Anonymous
05/23/2024 11:41
Subject: Do many people pick publics because of money?
I work at a FIRREA agency and you can look up anyone's salary. All my colleagues make in the mid 200s and come from all over - Ivies, Public Ivies, SLACs, and tons of no-name regional state schools. Everyone is making the same money.
The folks from state schools are likely ahead financially because they took out zero or minimal student loans. They also tended to start at my agency very early in their career (like early or mid 20s), whereas folks with brand-name degrees bounced around in private sector before landing in .gov
The folks from state schools are likely ahead financially because they took out zero or minimal student loans. They also tended to start at my agency very early in their career (like early or mid 20s), whereas folks with brand-name degrees bounced around in private sector before landing in .gov
Anonymous
05/23/2024 10:59
Subject: Re:Do many people pick publics because of money?
Anonymous wrote:There are belief shifts happening about the value of education, as education has become astronomically expensive. People are starting to take seriously the idea that very good publics basically have the same outcomes. If your kid can get into a top 10 school, MAYBE worth the networks, but after that, research suggests that it's just not. And so a lot of smart people are stepping back and redefining what "best" means. Used to be "best" reputation/prestige. Now it's "best" outcomes. And when you spin it like that, a lot of smart folks are going to choose publics. A lot of people have come to understand that it's fundamentally a waste of hundreds of thousands of dollars to pay for private over public, or private with merit aid (unless your kid has very specific needs or interests).
I would absolutely advise my kid to go to a strong public rather than saddle themselves with years and years of debt to go to a private.
+1 I'd also encourage people who think their elite college degree is the reason for their success to look more closely at their neighbors and the people they work with. You might be surprised at where your peers went to undergrad.
I work at a "brand name" company and in my department we have people who went to regional publics (including me), regional LACs, top public schools, elite LACs. No undergrad Ivies but one who did Ivy grad school. All doing well and working in the same place.
Also this whole discussion presupposes you have kids who are competitive to T15 private schools. Sure, maybe if I had a student like that, I'd be willing to stretch our budget to cover HYP. But more often it's a very expensive private school vs. public school for a good but not amazing student. Then, I don't see how the financial trade-off makes sense unless (maybe) there is something really unique offered at that private school.
Anonymous
05/23/2024 10:55
Subject: Re:Do many people pick publics because of money?
Anonymous wrote:There are belief shifts happening about the value of education, as education has become astronomically expensive. People are starting to take seriously the idea that very good publics basically have the same outcomes. If your kid can get into a top 10 school, MAYBE worth the networks, but after that, research suggests that it's just not. And so a lot of smart people are stepping back and redefining what "best" means. Used to be "best" reputation/prestige. Now it's "best" outcomes. And when you spin it like that, a lot of smart folks are going to choose publics. A lot of people have come to understand that it's fundamentally a waste of hundreds of thousands of dollars to pay for private over public, or private with merit aid (unless your kid has very specific needs or interests).
I would absolutely advise my kid to go to a strong public rather than saddle themselves with years and years of debt to go to a private.
Definitely! My son even says it himself; why pay more? He’s thriving at a large instate public.
Anonymous
05/23/2024 10:51
Subject: Re:Do many people pick publics because of money?
There are belief shifts happening about the value of education, as education has become astronomically expensive. People are starting to take seriously the idea that very good publics basically have the same outcomes. If your kid can get into a top 10 school, MAYBE worth the networks, but after that, research suggests that it's just not. And so a lot of smart people are stepping back and redefining what "best" means. Used to be "best" reputation/prestige. Now it's "best" outcomes. And when you spin it like that, a lot of smart folks are going to choose publics. A lot of people have come to understand that it's fundamentally a waste of hundreds of thousands of dollars to pay for private over public, or private with merit aid (unless your kid has very specific needs or interests).
I would absolutely advise my kid to go to a strong public rather than saddle themselves with years and years of debt to go to a private.
I would absolutely advise my kid to go to a strong public rather than saddle themselves with years and years of debt to go to a private.
Anonymous
05/23/2024 09:51
Subject: Do many people pick publics because of money?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:You understand that tuition rates have grown astronomically faster than wages since you were in college, right?
Of course I understand. We can easily afford to pay tuition. However, even if we couldn’t, I would encourage my children to apply and attend the best college possible.
I know many kids going to UVA and W&M could have gone to “better” schools. I’m sure this is more from public high schools, not private. If you are already paying 50k for high school tuition, paying 80k for college tuition probably would not be a factor in deciding where to go to college.
1. If you couldn't afford to pay, then why would you encourage your children to apply and attend the "best college possible"?
2. Your statement about a person paying $50K being able to pay $80K (and rising)(It's actually $90K now, generally) makes assumptions and is erroneous.
3. Yes, people pick publics and privates with merit aid over "better" brand-name schools because of money.
Dh and I want to HYP grad schools. I earned high six figures and Dh now earns seven figures. I don’t think it would have been possible without our education.
As a graduate of elite Ivies, undergrad and grad, I can tell you there are plenty of failed Ivy grads who never really launched. They eke out middle class existences.
Yeah, I also know Ivy grads who are living middle class lives. But to call this "failure", "not launching", and "eking out an existence" is a sign that you are a complete asz.
Anonymous
05/23/2024 09:49
Subject: Do many people pick publics because of money?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Virginia has some fantastic state schools. Why pay for private when you can get a better education, with a larger alumni network, at a public?
VA state schools are good at some things but overall mediocre in STEM.
You are stupid.