Anonymous
05/04/2022 17:42
Subject: Re:“We hold that Roe and Casey must be overruled," Justice Alito writes in an initial majority draft
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:States Rights is part of the Constitution, abortion isnt.
Go read the Ninth Amendment. You know, the one right before the Tenth one with the “States Rights” in it.
Correct. It’s just so obvious here. What power does the state have to criminalize abortion? Where does the constitution give the government that power?
Explain it to me because that is the question. And I don’t think there is a legitimate state interest in denying pregnant women access to medical care that, if denied, would increase their chances of harm.
They're argument is that the State has the inherent power to control everything not specifically excluded. It flips the entire principle of our democracy upside down. Under their interpretation of the Constitution power flows down instead of up. Rights are not inherent to individuals but rather courtesies given to the people by the government.
Did you grow up here?
Anonymous
05/04/2022 17:25
Subject: “We hold that Roe and Casey must be overruled," Justice Alito writes in an initial majority draft
Supposedly the R’s are now considering supporting families due to the impending SC decision https://www.washingtonpost.com/us-policy/2022/05/03/gop-families-roe-wade/
I’m betting they’ll provide one box of Pampers after birth and then crow about how much they are doing.
I’m betting they’ll provide one box of Pampers after birth and then crow about how much they are doing.
Anonymous
05/04/2022 17:08
Subject: Re:“We hold that Roe and Casey must be overruled," Justice Alito writes in an initial majority draft
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:As every woman who enjoys sex and is good in bed knows: giving it gives us just as much power as refusing to
The unemployed, uneducated, divorced men who can't seem to find a woman to have their babies are about to not even get laid ever again- why would a woman even mercy f'ck them- its simply not worth the risk..
maybe they will compensate with more booze, more opiates and more time with their Dog...until they die
Prostitutes are gonna make a killing...they should be smart and raise their rates to $10K an hour
Conservative woman here. Why on EARTH are liberal women hating on, and planning to punish, ALL men? Clearly men are individual thinkers?
To Motivate them , Dear.
After All, access to sexual pleasure with women who they highly desire and , as a result, have the power to validate them ( or Not) is what motivates them to work so hard
Otherwise, we would all still be living in caves or wearing burkas
My liberal wife has told me she has no plans to deny me sex because of the SCOTUS. She wishes I would be more assetive and put the moves on her MORE often.
Sex strike?! Is this what we’ve come to? Now we are debasing ourselves as being purely sex objects? LMAO. I’m not going to punish DH for something he has nothing to do with. I’m not going to forgo my pleasure over this. Dumbest. Idea. Ever.
Well pregnancy can only be an outcome through 2 ways- PIV and IVF. Withholding PIV will be a woman's only recourse should abortion and BC become unavailable/restricted/etc. You can get pleasure from other means such as oral- and apparently sodomy is possibly off the table.
But this is why there cant be exclusions of rape because if they take away abortion and BC then married women might get ideas in their head about withholding sex and that cant happen so even if a wife does get raped by her husband, she would have to carry to term.
Anonymous
05/04/2022 16:43
Subject: Re:“We hold that Roe and Casey must be overruled," Justice Alito writes in an initial majority draft
Anonymous wrote:Because let's face it: Upper middle Class and upper class women will always have access to BC and selective termination- or just the morning after pill
AND
wealthy successful men will ALWAYS want their mistress to have an Abortion
These low income, un-educated and unemployed white men are being pandered to by these R wing GOP... and right out of even being able to get LAID
when instead, they should be doing real work on their behalf ( as stated above) : raise their wages, bring back high paying jobs, give their female prospects 18 months maternity leave, guarantee a free college education
Canada has a higher percentage of kids /family than the USA and these policies- not religion/ abortion rights- are why
This is a very good point, but I think there is so much anger clouding their minds that to think creatively eludes them. I'm thinking of my brother as I write this. He loves his victimhood and takes every opportunity to point it out to my sister and I. He has started mansplaining since Trump and telling us were dumb. Never did that during the Bush years. She and I went to college, he dropped out, FWIW.
Anonymous
05/04/2022 16:41
Subject: Re:“We hold that Roe and Casey must be overruled," Justice Alito writes in an initial majority draft
Anonymous wrote:I'm just saying...maybe instead of spending decades locked in this battle AND clouding it with religious and politics
Tackle it Economically: If these GOP people want more white children born to the lower class and lower middle class ( increasingly their voter base), then:
* Pass 18 month Paid Maternity Leave
* Mandate Free Health Care- so poor white men don't continue to lose much of their salaries and stay in sh+tty jobs just for insurance
* Subsidize College education ( Like European Countries & Canada) so that a working class or even middle class white man can afford to send the kids he wants the woman to have
* Bring back high paying factory jobs / Union Jobs to America 'cause not every man is college material and if a woman isn't gonna see a man with poor income as a viable prospect
Do these things AND JUST maybe these working class White men wouldn't be misdirecting their anger and hostility at the only target in the room: the women of their social class
But lots of people still just don't want a child, or can't have a child. You don't need to point at them and say: we made it so easy for you to carry and raise this child you didn't want. Here, go do it. Sure, a social safety net and better social structures would make it easier for more people to have children. You might find an uptick in voluntary birth rates with these things. But that doesn't address the college student who got drunk and had unprotected sex one night (or was raped one night). Or any of the other people who have abortions, for any number of reasons. I hate that we have to go to the worst stories with abortion - a woman who aborted a very wanted child at six months because of a horrible condition; the person raped by a relative; etc. You don't need to have been traumatized to decide that an abortion is the best choice for you. You don't need to have ZERO support in the world and be on the brink of literal starvation. Or you shouldn't need that.
Anonymous
05/04/2022 16:32
Subject: Re:“We hold that Roe and Casey must be overruled," Justice Alito writes in an initial majority draft
Because let's face it: Upper middle Class and upper class women will always have access to BC and selective termination- or just the morning after pill
AND
wealthy successful men will ALWAYS want their mistress to have an Abortion
These low income, un-educated and unemployed white men are being pandered to by these R wing GOP... and right out of even being able to get LAID
when instead, they should be doing real work on their behalf ( as stated above) : raise their wages, bring back high paying jobs, give their female prospects 18 months maternity leave, guarantee a free college education
Canada has a higher percentage of kids /family than the USA and these policies- not religion/ abortion rights- are why
AND
wealthy successful men will ALWAYS want their mistress to have an Abortion
These low income, un-educated and unemployed white men are being pandered to by these R wing GOP... and right out of even being able to get LAID
when instead, they should be doing real work on their behalf ( as stated above) : raise their wages, bring back high paying jobs, give their female prospects 18 months maternity leave, guarantee a free college education
Canada has a higher percentage of kids /family than the USA and these policies- not religion/ abortion rights- are why
Anonymous
05/04/2022 16:23
Subject: Re:“We hold that Roe and Casey must be overruled," Justice Alito writes in an initial majority draft
I'm just saying...maybe instead of spending decades locked in this battle AND clouding it with religious and politics
Tackle it Economically: If these GOP people want more white children born to the lower class and lower middle class ( increasingly their voter base), then:
* Pass 18 month Paid Maternity Leave
* Mandate Free Health Care- so poor white men don't continue to lose much of their salaries and stay in sh+tty jobs just for insurance
* Subsidize College education ( Like European Countries & Canada) so that a working class or even middle class white man can afford to send the kids he wants the woman to have
* Bring back high paying factory jobs / Union Jobs to America 'cause not every man is college material and if a woman isn't gonna see a man with poor income as a viable prospect
Do these things AND JUST maybe these working class White men wouldn't be misdirecting their anger and hostility at the only target in the room: the women of their social class
Tackle it Economically: If these GOP people want more white children born to the lower class and lower middle class ( increasingly their voter base), then:
* Pass 18 month Paid Maternity Leave
* Mandate Free Health Care- so poor white men don't continue to lose much of their salaries and stay in sh+tty jobs just for insurance
* Subsidize College education ( Like European Countries & Canada) so that a working class or even middle class white man can afford to send the kids he wants the woman to have
* Bring back high paying factory jobs / Union Jobs to America 'cause not every man is college material and if a woman isn't gonna see a man with poor income as a viable prospect
Do these things AND JUST maybe these working class White men wouldn't be misdirecting their anger and hostility at the only target in the room: the women of their social class
Anonymous
05/04/2022 16:07
Subject: “We hold that Roe and Casey must be overruled," Justice Alito writes in an initial majority draft
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Wow it's almost like letting judges create laws without push back means they could also toss away those same laws.
Who could have foreseen such a obvious turn of events aside from anyone with any hint of pattern recognition whatsoever.
If decide to let judges legislate from the bench, they will inevitably do so in a way that you don't agree with.
Roe didn’t legislate any rights away. Nice try.
Did you even read what you quoted? Here, let me bold the relevant section for you.
letting judges create laws without push back means they could also toss away those same laws.
Yes I did. And I don’t believe Roe created any law. It preserved the rights of women to access healthcare with limitations pursuant to the interest of the state. In my opinion, the state interest cited in Roe was BS. But they didn’t legislate from the bench.
There was no 'right' to abortion before the justices created it. Yes, they were legislating from the bench. Yes, they're doing it again right now.
You're upset because they're legislating from the bench in a way you don't agree with, but you shouldn't hide behind that emotion with lies.
There was no right for black kids to go to public schools with white kids before the justices created it.
There was no right for black people to marry white people before the justices created it.
There was no right for people to use birth control before the justices created it.
There was no right for parents to send their kids to private schools before the justices created it.
Those things were always rights and government was violating them when they previously prevented them.
Because you said so?
Because all people are entitled to life liberty and property (covers the last two). Additionally we have this thing called the 14th amendment which affords equal protection under the law—meaning laws inferring privileges (like public school and civil marriage) must be applied equally.
The right to abortion was also covered under liberty, until it wasn't.
It still stands.
DP: it still exists. The draft opinion is bad law. The existence of a right to privacy, individual rights themselves, is not a concept that can be ceded. That is the underlying argument. That is the 200+ years of "deeply rooted history" that cannot be forgotten. Government doesn't grant the people privileges. The people grant government powers and retain. We the people.
Exactly.
But can we call a spade a spade here and look into how, when and why these unemployed/ underemployed, low earner men who no woman wants to have a baby for because they are such poor prospects.... when did these men ( concentrated mostly in the South ) start trying to impose laws on women's bodies ?
Was it when their wages collapsed or after women started getting more educated, going away to college, voting , having their own bank accounts and Birth control ?
Cause it seems to me that these efforts in these Red neck states with high concentrations of low wage earning and un-educated men are much like the laws we see in Afghanistan, Yemen and places like that where women are oppressed because the men's prospects are so so poor that , in effect, the only way to get a Wife is to have a girl's father sell you one.
To me, all attempts to oppress women stem from poor economic status and prospects for the Men in that society
Case in point: during the Crack epidemic in the USA , we saw a dramatic rise in teen births where young women ( 15, 16, 17 year old girls ) were becoming pregnant by association with high earning drug dealers in their neighborhoods. In many cases, one 19 year old male had as many as 4 babies born to him in a Year... and all by the free choice of these young women . Why ? Because they saw these drug dealers as flush with cash, able to pay for a house, a car, a steady source of cash and they had social power- so the women were attracted to them and wanted to have their babies- even when it jeoperrdized their own independence and their own futures.
Now, back to these Red Necks no woman wants to have a baby for : the solution is not to try to force a woman to have your baby- the solution is to get a better education, a higher paying job, maybe lobby for 18 months paid maternity leave and Free day care for children, pay raises for YOU so maybe a woman sees you as a better prospect.
No woman wants to have a loser's baby. Pass a law that compels them to have your baby and they are just gonna never even F'ck you ever again- not even a mercy F'ck
The sad thing is I don't think this will deter GOP men. Many will look the other way when men rape women because they want children. Or, the govt. will instill handmaids. It pains me to say it, but at the rate we're going - I see this as an eventuality.
Anonymous
05/04/2022 15:57
Subject: “We hold that Roe and Casey must be overruled," Justice Alito writes in an initial majority draft
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Wow it's almost like letting judges create laws without push back means they could also toss away those same laws.
Who could have foreseen such a obvious turn of events aside from anyone with any hint of pattern recognition whatsoever.
If decide to let judges legislate from the bench, they will inevitably do so in a way that you don't agree with.
Roe didn’t legislate any rights away. Nice try.
Did you even read what you quoted? Here, let me bold the relevant section for you.
letting judges create laws without push back means they could also toss away those same laws.
Yes I did. And I don’t believe Roe created any law. It preserved the rights of women to access healthcare with limitations pursuant to the interest of the state. In my opinion, the state interest cited in Roe was BS. But they didn’t legislate from the bench.
There was no 'right' to abortion before the justices created it. Yes, they were legislating from the bench. Yes, they're doing it again right now.
You're upset because they're legislating from the bench in a way you don't agree with, but you shouldn't hide behind that emotion with lies.
There was no right for black kids to go to public schools with white kids before the justices created it.
There was no right for black people to marry white people before the justices created it.
There was no right for people to use birth control before the justices created it.
There was no right for parents to send their kids to private schools before the justices created it.
Those things were always rights and government was violating them when they previously prevented them.
Because you said so?
Because all people are entitled to life liberty and property (covers the last two). Additionally we have this thing called the 14th amendment which affords equal protection under the law—meaning laws inferring privileges (like public school and civil marriage) must be applied equally.
The right to abortion was also covered under liberty, until it wasn't.
It still stands.
DP: it still exists. The draft opinion is bad law. The existence of a right to privacy, individual rights themselves, is not a concept that can be ceded. That is the underlying argument. That is the 200+ years of "deeply rooted history" that cannot be forgotten. Government doesn't grant the people privileges. The people grant government powers and retain. We the people.
Exactly.
But can we call a spade a spade here and look into how, when and why these unemployed/ underemployed, low earner men who no woman wants to have a baby for because they are such poor prospects.... when did these men ( concentrated mostly in the South ) start trying to impose laws on women's bodies ?
Was it when their wages collapsed or after women started getting more educated, going away to college, voting , having their own bank accounts and Birth control ?
Cause it seems to me that these efforts in these Red neck states with high concentrations of low wage earning and un-educated men are much like the laws we see in Afghanistan, Yemen and places like that where women are oppressed because the men's prospects are so so poor that , in effect, the only way to get a Wife is to have a girl's father sell you one.
To me, all attempts to oppress women stem from poor economic status and prospects for the Men in that society
Case in point: during the Crack epidemic in the USA , we saw a dramatic rise in teen births where young women ( 15, 16, 17 year old girls ) were becoming pregnant by association with high earning drug dealers in their neighborhoods. In many cases, one 19 year old male had as many as 4 babies born to him in a Year... and all by the free choice of these young women . Why ? Because they saw these drug dealers as flush with cash, able to pay for a house, a car, a steady source of cash and they had social power- so the women were attracted to them and wanted to have their babies- even when it jeoperrdized their own independence and their own futures.
Now, back to these Red Necks no woman wants to have a baby for : the solution is not to try to force a woman to have your baby- the solution is to get a better education, a higher paying job, maybe lobby for 18 months paid maternity leave and Free day care for children, pay raises for YOU so maybe a woman sees you as a better prospect.
No woman wants to have a loser's baby. Pass a law that compels them to have your baby and they are just gonna never even F'ck you ever again- not even a mercy F'ck
Anonymous
05/04/2022 15:51
Subject: Re:“We hold that Roe and Casey must be overruled," Justice Alito writes in an initial majority draft
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:As every woman who enjoys sex and is good in bed knows: giving it gives us just as much power as refusing to
The unemployed, uneducated, divorced men who can't seem to find a woman to have their babies are about to not even get laid ever again- why would a woman even mercy f'ck them- its simply not worth the risk..
maybe they will compensate with more booze, more opiates and more time with their Dog...until they die
Prostitutes are gonna make a killing...they should be smart and raise their rates to $10K an hour
I can't wait to hear all the complaining in the relationship thread about dead bedrooms now. It's just always us women you know never wanting to put out. Oh and the fact that we don't want to have another f****** kid
Conservative woman here. Why on EARTH are liberal women hating on, and planning to punish, ALL men? Clearly men are individual thinkers?
To Motivate them , Dear.
After All, access to sexual pleasure with women who they highly desire and , as a result, have the power to validate them ( or Not) is what motivates them to work so hard
Otherwise, we would all still be living in caves or wearing burkas
The invention of the birth control pill and legalization of abortion let me access sex much more often and much more free than they did before, without having to get married either beforehand or after the pregnancy.
Once women have to risk pregnancy every time they have sex, or depend on men to use birth control, it's a return to either abstinence or charging cash up front to cover health care costs.
Anonymous
05/04/2022 15:43
Subject: “We hold that Roe and Casey must be overruled," Justice Alito writes in an initial majority draft
"me"=men
Anonymous
05/04/2022 15:43
Subject: Re:“We hold that Roe and Casey must be overruled," Justice Alito writes in an initial majority draft
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:As every woman who enjoys sex and is good in bed knows: giving it gives us just as much power as refusing to
The unemployed, uneducated, divorced men who can't seem to find a woman to have their babies are about to not even get laid ever again- why would a woman even mercy f'ck them- its simply not worth the risk..
maybe they will compensate with more booze, more opiates and more time with their Dog...until they die
Prostitutes are gonna make a killing...they should be smart and raise their rates to $10K an hour
Conservative woman here. Why on EARTH are liberal women hating on, and planning to punish, ALL men? Clearly men are individual thinkers?
To Motivate them , Dear.
After All, access to sexual pleasure with women who they highly desire and , as a result, have the power to validate them ( or Not) is what motivates them to work so hard
Otherwise, we would all still be living in caves or wearing burkas
The invention of the birth control pill and legalization of abortion let me access sex much more often and much more free than they did before, without having to get married either beforehand or after the pregnancy.
Once women have to risk pregnancy every time they have sex, or depend on men to use birth control, it's a return to either abstinence or charging cash up front to cover health care costs.
Anonymous
05/04/2022 15:42
Subject: Re:“We hold that Roe and Casey must be overruled," Justice Alito writes in an initial majority draft
How was it that England became free of the imperious control of the Catholic Church , after all ?
England broke away and set out on a path of establishing that Power on Earth stemmed from Man, not God because A WOMAN- Ann Bolyn refused to F'ck him until he severed his ties.
England broke away and set out on a path of establishing that Power on Earth stemmed from Man, not God because A WOMAN- Ann Bolyn refused to F'ck him until he severed his ties.
Anonymous
05/04/2022 15:38
Subject: Re:“We hold that Roe and Casey must be overruled," Justice Alito writes in an initial majority draft
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:As every woman who enjoys sex and is good in bed knows: giving it gives us just as much power as refusing to
The unemployed, uneducated, divorced men who can't seem to find a woman to have their babies are about to not even get laid ever again- why would a woman even mercy f'ck them- its simply not worth the risk..
maybe they will compensate with more booze, more opiates and more time with their Dog...until they die
Prostitutes are gonna make a killing...they should be smart and raise their rates to $10K an hour
Conservative woman here. Why on EARTH are liberal women hating on, and planning to punish, ALL men? Clearly men are individual thinkers?
To Motivate them , Dear.
After All, access to sexual pleasure with women who they highly desire and , as a result, have the power to validate them ( or Not) is what motivates them to work so hard
Otherwise, we would all still be living in caves or wearing burkas
Anonymous
05/04/2022 15:33
Subject: “We hold that Roe and Casey must be overruled," Justice Alito writes in an initial majority draft
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Wow it's almost like letting judges create laws without push back means they could also toss away those same laws.
Who could have foreseen such a obvious turn of events aside from anyone with any hint of pattern recognition whatsoever.
If decide to let judges legislate from the bench, they will inevitably do so in a way that you don't agree with.
Roe didn’t legislate any rights away. Nice try.
Did you even read what you quoted? Here, let me bold the relevant section for you.
letting judges create laws without push back means they could also toss away those same laws.
Yes I did. And I don’t believe Roe created any law. It preserved the rights of women to access healthcare with limitations pursuant to the interest of the state. In my opinion, the state interest cited in Roe was BS. But they didn’t legislate from the bench.
There was no 'right' to abortion before the justices created it. Yes, they were legislating from the bench. Yes, they're doing it again right now.
You're upset because they're legislating from the bench in a way you don't agree with, but you shouldn't hide behind that emotion with lies.
There was no right for black kids to go to public schools with white kids before the justices created it.
There was no right for black people to marry white people before the justices created it.
There was no right for people to use birth control before the justices created it.
There was no right for parents to send their kids to private schools before the justices created it.
Those things were always rights and government was violating them when they previously prevented them.
Because you said so?
Because all people are entitled to life liberty and property (covers the last two). Additionally we have this thing called the 14th amendment which affords equal protection under the law—meaning laws inferring privileges (like public school and civil marriage) must be applied equally.
The right to abortion was also covered under liberty, until it wasn't.
It still stands.
DP: it still exists. The draft opinion is bad law. The existence of a right to privacy, individual rights themselves, is not a concept that can be ceded. That is the underlying argument. That is the 200+ years of "deeply rooted history" that cannot be forgotten. Government doesn't grant the people privileges. The people grant government powers and retain. We the people.