Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Kidneygate made mistakes in their original correspondence with Brennan. They were too overreaching, and didn't focus specifically on the specific images that kidneygate created, which is the heart of the matter. But Brennan now knows she used images in her piece that came originally from a specific creator, and yet has continued to portray herself as the aggrieved one while at the same time removing the images that came from kidneygate. It is nothing like what Larson did, but it also isn't a great look for Brennan.

Agree. It also wouldn’t kill her to acknowledge kidneygate generally as that has likely been the Twitter account to do the most investigative fact finding in this case and almost undoubtedly influenced Brennan although she certainly went outside of kidneygate’s work in doing her own.


I’m just annoyed that this has happened because it’s a victory for Larson. “Even the anti-plagiarists plagiarize sometimes, borrowing ideas when we live online now is just life” etc.

Exactly. It is an unfortunate development. Brennan can still rectify the situation, but she doesn't seem like she is going to do so.

Anonymous wrote:Kidneygate made mistakes in their original correspondence with Brennan. They were too overreaching, and didn't focus specifically on the specific images that kidneygate created, which is the heart of the matter. But Brennan now knows she used images in her piece that came originally from a specific creator, and yet has continued to portray herself as the aggrieved one while at the same time removing the images that came from kidneygate. It is nothing like what Larson did, but it also isn't a great look for Brennan.

Agree. It also wouldn’t kill her to acknowledge kidneygate generally as that has likely been the Twitter account to do the most investigative fact finding in this case and almost undoubtedly influenced Brennan although she certainly went outside of kidneygate’s work in doing her own.

I’m just annoyed that this has happened because it’s a victory for Larson. “Even the anti-plagiarists plagiarize sometimes, borrowing ideas when we live online now is just life” etc.

Anonymous wrote:Kidneygate made mistakes in their original correspondence with Brennan. They were too overreaching, and didn't focus specifically on the specific images that kidneygate created, which is the heart of the matter. But Brennan now knows she used images in her piece that came originally from a specific creator, and yet has continued to portray herself as the aggrieved one while at the same time removing the images that came from kidneygate. It is nothing like what Larson did, but it also isn't a great look for Brennan.

I don’t think Kidneygate’s initial email was overreaching at all. And come on, if this saga has taught us anything, it’s that just because the opposite party is, IDK, not adopting the right tone or whatever that makes you comfortable — that doesn’t justify your objectively wrong actions against them. Some people really live in a universe where social etiquette trumps all right/wrong, which is weird.

It's also unfortunate because in a piece about plagiarism, Brennan should been meticulous about sourcing her images correctly and not passing the images off as her own, when they are obviously identical copies.

Kidneygate made mistakes in their original correspondence with Brennan. They were too overreaching, and didn't focus specifically on the specific images that kidneygate created, which is the heart of the matter. But Brennan now knows she used images in her piece that came originally from a specific creator, and yet has continued to portray herself as the aggrieved one while at the same time removing the images that came from kidneygate. It is nothing like what Larson did, but it also isn't a great look for Brennan.

Anonymous wrote:It’s very accusatory, threatening, and I don’t think it’s accurate. I am familiar with kidneygate’s account and Brennan’s posts. I do not think Brennan relied on kidneygate account to put her timeline together. I am unconvinced that every screenshot is copied. I think kidneygate made a lot of assumptions, and chose to come out guns blazing instead of from a place of collaboration.

I still think it’s possible Brennan didn’t even know these were screenshots from this Twitter account, if for instance she got them from another source. I think making your first contact this aggressive is a mistake, and I think accusing Brennan of basing her entire posts (which I think must have taken her hours to compile) on kidneygate’s account was really unwise without more evidence that a few similar looking screenshots. Screenshotting takes seconds, even if you are adding a highlight. Brennan’s research is clearly original.

It is inaccurate to describe the images as simple screenshots. Kidneygate used Photoshop to manipulate the original court images to make the text line up, remove page breaks, etc. There was real work there. And the images are pixel by pixel the same.

As for the letter, let's assume that you are totally right and even further, and say that kidneygate was totally unhinged in their emails to Brennan (and for the record, I don't think that email is unreasonable, perhaps angry, but not unreasonable). But let's assume your point of view. Even if that is true, it isn't disputed at this point that the images came from the kidneygate account. So why is Brennan refusing to acknowledge that now? Kidneygate could have been totally unreasonable, and yet those images still originally came from that account. The source of the images is not really up for any real debate at this point, and obviously Brennan agrees with that because she has removed the images that came from kidneygate.

I actually didn't think badly of Brennan at first and I believe it was an honest mistake, but her doubling down now that Brennan has the truth is pretty disappointing. It would cost Brennan nothing to be honest and say her her original version included images created originally by kidneygate.

Anonymous wrote:At a minimum, Brennan should stop posts like this. It isn't making her look good.

All of these writers and reporters really need to step away from Twitter for a month. They can’t even see how it makes them behave.

This is what kidneygate originally sent. Not unlike the bolded in PP’s comment above. And comes off reasonable IMO.

It’s very accusatory, threatening, and I don’t think it’s accurate. I am familiar with kidneygate’s account and Brennan’s posts. I do not think Brennan relied on kidneygate account to put her timeline together. I am unconvinced that every screenshot is copied. I think kidneygate made a lot of assumptions, and chose to come out guns blazing instead of from a place of collaboration.

I still think it’s possible Brennan didn’t even know these were screenshots from this Twitter account, if for instance she got them from another source. I think making your first contact this aggressive is a mistake, and I think accusing Brennan of basing her entire posts (which I think must have taken her hours to compile) on kidneygate’s account was really unwise without more evidence that a few similar looking screenshots. Screenshotting takes seconds, even if you are adding a highlight. Brennan’s research is clearly original.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FCWMjVuXsAIrFXP?format=jpg&name=small" border="0" class="embeddedImage" />

This is what kidneygate originally sent. Not unlike the bolded in PP’s comment above. And comes off reasonable IMO.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:At a minimum, Brennan should stop posts like this. It isn't making her look good.

Disagree. Kidneygate is being needlessly accusatory here. I think part of Brennan’s point is: she did this thing on her free time to further a conversation. She obviously wasn’t trying to steal anything from anyone. Kidneygate could have asked for attribution instead of attacking her angrily. They didn’t. Brennan is in fact in the hospital with her dad, an ocean away from her husband and clearly under stress. Being polite and granting someone benefit if the doubt is merited. But sending numerous angry DMs and putting someone “on blast”. Brennan has every right to call out this behavior.

Had kidneygate just DMed Brennan and saying “this is a great timeline but I do think some of those screenshots are from my account (which you mat not have realized) — can you provide attribution? I have put a lot of work into reporting on this issue”, Brennan would have been gracious. Instead, kidneygate sent multiple angry and accusatory DMs.

But… that’s exactly what kidneygate did. It’s bizarre because Brennan very clearly lifted the screenshots from kidneygate, as evidenced by the stitched up court documents that kidneygate put together.

How do you know kidneygate was not accusatory or angry in their DM? Brennan said they were, and the tone of kidneygate tweets on the matter have been very terse and aggrieved.

DP. Kidneygate posted their first email/DM. It didn't seem that off to me.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:At a minimum, Brennan should stop posts like this. It isn't making her look good.

Disagree. Kidneygate is being needlessly accusatory here. I think part of Brennan’s point is: she did this thing on her free time to further a conversation. She obviously wasn’t trying to steal anything from anyone. Kidneygate could have asked for attribution instead of attacking her angrily. They didn’t. Brennan is in fact in the hospital with her dad, an ocean away from her husband and clearly under stress. Being polite and granting someone benefit if the doubt is merited. But sending numerous angry DMs and putting someone “on blast”. Brennan has every right to call out this behavior.

Had kidneygate just DMed Brennan and saying “this is a great timeline but I do think some of those screenshots are from my account (which you mat not have realized) — can you provide attribution? I have put a lot of work into reporting on this issue”, Brennan would have been gracious. Instead, kidneygate sent multiple angry and accusatory DMs.

Kidneygate posted their original email to Brennan, and while it is a little angry, it doesn't sound unreasonable. It wasn't that far off from the bolded IMO.

But what I don't get is why Brennan is doubling down when anyone with eyes can see that the images are literally identical to the pixel. It is making Brennan look bad IMO. There is only one thing that she has to say "In my original version, I used images that I've since learned were created by Twitter account kidneygate. I've since changed the images." Done, no harm no foul. But instead, she is doubling down in a way that seems increasingly weird. The self-pitying post above comes across as really off when Brennan has herself removed the copied images from her essays.

It is unfortunate. I don't understand what Brennan is doing. I'm going to assume it is her difficult personal circumstances now, but that doesn't mean it is right.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:At a minimum, Brennan should stop posts like this. It isn't making her look good.

Disagree. Kidneygate is being needlessly accusatory here. I think part of Brennan’s point is: she did this thing on her free time to further a conversation. She obviously wasn’t trying to steal anything from anyone. Kidneygate could have asked for attribution instead of attacking her angrily. They didn’t. Brennan is in fact in the hospital with her dad, an ocean away from her husband and clearly under stress. Being polite and granting someone benefit if the doubt is merited. But sending numerous angry DMs and putting someone “on blast”. Brennan has every right to call out this behavior.

Had kidneygate just DMed Brennan and saying “this is a great timeline but I do think some of those screenshots are from my account (which you mat not have realized) — can you provide attribution? I have put a lot of work into reporting on this issue”, Brennan would have been gracious. Instead, kidneygate sent multiple angry and accusatory DMs.

But… that’s exactly what kidneygate did. It’s bizarre because Brennan very clearly lifted the screenshots from kidneygate, as evidenced by the stitched up court documents that kidneygate put together.

How do you know kidneygate was not accusatory or angry in their DM? Brennan said they were, and the tone of kidneygate tweets on the matter have been very terse and aggrieved.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:At a minimum, Brennan should stop posts like this. It isn't making her look good.

Disagree. Kidneygate is being needlessly accusatory here. I think part of Brennan’s point is: she did this thing on her free time to further a conversation. She obviously wasn’t trying to steal anything from anyone. Kidneygate could have asked for attribution instead of attacking her angrily. They didn’t. Brennan is in fact in the hospital with her dad, an ocean away from her husband and clearly under stress. Being polite and granting someone benefit if the doubt is merited. But sending numerous angry DMs and putting someone “on blast”. Brennan has every right to call out this behavior.

Had kidneygate just DMed Brennan and saying “this is a great timeline but I do think some of those screenshots are from my account (which you mat not have realized) — can you provide attribution? I have put a lot of work into reporting on this issue”, Brennan would have been gracious. Instead, kidneygate sent multiple angry and accusatory DMs.

But… that’s exactly what kidneygate did. It’s bizarre because Brennan very clearly lifted the screenshots from kidneygate, as evidenced by the stitched up court documents that kidneygate put together.

Anonymous wrote:At a minimum, Brennan should stop posts like this. It isn't making her look good.

Disagree. Kidneygate is being needlessly accusatory here. I think part of Brennan’s point is: she did this thing on her free time to further a conversation. She obviously wasn’t trying to steal anything from anyone. Kidneygate could have asked for attribution instead of attacking her angrily. They didn’t. Brennan is in fact in the hospital with her dad, an ocean away from her husband and clearly under stress. Being polite and granting someone benefit if the doubt is merited. But sending numerous angry DMs and putting someone “on blast”. Brennan has every right to call out this behavior.

Had kidneygate just DMed Brennan and saying “this is a great timeline but I do think some of those screenshots are from my account (which you mat not have realized) — can you provide attribution? I have put a lot of work into reporting on this issue”, Brennan would have been gracious. Instead, kidneygate sent multiple angry and accusatory DMs.