Anonymous wrote:Were all the posts after 11:30 pm by the same poster?

Listen, at my son's school, no one talks about who is on financial aid, but it is also clear that there are families where it would be impossible for them to pay one or two full tuitions. So in a sense, you do know. And it never enters into the minds of parents or kids in any way.

Having said that, I don't think there is ANYTHING wrong with having a discussion about whether FA has been abused by families with wealth. Obviously, the intention here is to see that the system is improved. I certainly don't think anyone would question why a single mom earning 55K would get financial aid. But I would question why a person earning about $200K in a huge house is getting it.

Anonymous wrote:12:32 I knew what I was signing up for, absolutely, but I didn't know that people abused the FA process and I didn't know that so many people, including apparently you, seem just fine with that. For the record, my child would probably get $6,000 - $8,000 in aid if we applied. You're telling me that's peanuts? I know tuition doesn't cover the full cost (duh). That's besides the point. This is $6,000 - $8,000 less the school has to raise each year. That's basic math. If a few more families did that, we'd be able to give a full scholarship. And you think that's not problematic? I mean, people with second homes on FA? Yes! And children's trust funds don't get counted. Amazing! The system is WACKED.

I clicked around for information on FA and Bullis' (my child does not attend, we know several children who do) covers many of the very things we've discussed here. So obviously the FA folks are thinking this through.

Who qualifies for financial aid at Bullis?
All financial aid at Bullis is need based. Aid amounts are based exclusively on demonstrated financial need. We try to accommodate as many families as possible within the financial aid budget the Board approves each year.
Bullis expects that a family will have researched all of its own resources before coming to the school for financial aid. Since the school wants to give financial aid to the families that need it the most, we have to be able to assess the financial strength of each family applying for aid. To do this, many factors need to be considered. Some of these include: (1) income, both taxable and nontaxable; (2) assets (home equity, other real estate, savings, stocks, etc.); (3) number of dependents; (4) age of parent(s); and (5) number of children attending tuition-charging schools. We also consider a number of variables when making tuition aid awards: consumer debt, earning potential for spouse not employed outside the home, automobiles (fair market and/or lease value), recreational vehicles, second homes, vacation expenses and student travel/enrichment activities.

Anonymous wrote:12:00 I think the idea is there would be more FA for those who needed it if folks didn't take advantage of the system. Why are people squelching this discussion? The intentions of folks like me who think schools should examine their FA policies is to bring about corrective measures.

Anonymous wrote:10:28 I am not advocating throwing out the baby with the bath water. I'm advocating retooling the system so private schools don't subsidize a luxury lifestyle through FA. I make sacrifices. I pay full freight. It ticks me off. We all pay for this nonsense through tuition. Also, what is this strain of reasoning: The world is imperfect, let's not try to fix anything. Also, most social welfare programs are large and anonymous. These folks are doing this for the entire community to observe! It's almost a disorder.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I guess I am saying that people are arguing from very different perspectives and based on vastly different assumptions of what things are necessities in life.

You are so right! I've lived at all sorts of income levels -- from below the poverty line (but not welfare dependent or hungry) to affluent (but not wealthy enough that the next generation can live at the same level without having good jobs of their own) -- and it's interesting to see what people think they are entitled to and how they talk about "choice" without recognizing how radically different the available options are at different income levels. And, so often, their comparisons are to people at similar income levels and all they see is what someone else has that they lack. So my law partners or neighbors all send their kids to private school -- I deserve that too, even though I can't afford it because I have medical expenses or bought my house at the peak of the market. They don't compare themselves to people who have less -- e.g. this kid will be going to a terrible public school if she can't get into private and my kid would be going to a decent public school. And the adults in her family are already living frugally and working multiple jobs.

In the end, though, I wonder about the economics. How much FA goes toward discounting tuition enough to find more buyers for private school? If $30,000 of FA goes to five high income families who, together, pay the equivalent of four full tuitions is the $30,000 better spent from the school's financial perspective than if the school were to give the whole $30,000 to one kid? In each case the school has spent the same amount, but in one case it generated significant income and in another it generated no income.

Anonymous wrote:I'd like to hear from the million dollar house dweller receiving financial aid who says I and others have NO CLUE. Well, please, clue me in. If you're telling me you have a million dollar mortgage, I say, okay, you're an idiot. You can't afford that, clearly. Sell your house (without any equity) and rent something you can afford. If you say there is a tax advantage, that's true. But that doesn't mean you live in a house you can't afford for a tax break. You live in a house you CAN afford for a tax break, or you rent. You don't penalize other children of need because you spent more on housing than you should have.

If on the other hand you actually have some substantial equity left in your house, tell me why it's fair that you accumulate wealth while borrowing from others.
**

That would be me. So I can use zillow too and see our house is estimated at $1 million. That is a zillow estimate. The real value is more like 850 best based on comparables on the street. The tax assessed value has gone from 600 all the way to $1.1 million and has now headed back down to 900 or so. The mortgage total is at just over 750. After taxes and commissions etc there is nothing left if we sold. Why would we sell in this market anyway? Call me an idiot, fine I can take it. Bt it isn;t very nice to namecall or accuse when you know one fact (an expensive house) without knowing any other inputs into the FA decisions, other aspects of our financial situation.

Regarding the house in question, the monthly mortgage is not unreasonable, how much do you think a 3 bedroom apartment or rental costs in a safe neighborhood where we can walk to work and school? With the tax advantage, it makes owning better than renting. We are certainly not accumulating wealth, but if we do then we would expect to get less or no FA. If we had savings, more equity, higher incomes,less expenses, etc, then our financial situation would be different and viewed differently by our school.

We are not penalizing other children of need. That is a pretty outrageous accusation. If the school deemed us not needy of FA we would not get any. We wouldn't. It is not merit based. It is measured by financial models which take all the inputs and spit out what the parent contribution should be. The schools consider this number when awarding aid. In a city like DC a school may award a bit more more aid given the cost of living. How are we penalizing other children? Because we are taking money away from the FA pot? The school wants a balance of full pays, full scholarships and partial pays. We are grateful for the FA we get, and will at some point give back what we can, as we can.

Anonymous wrote:I am a single mother that makes 55,000 per year! My son's father barely supports him! I have a home and my DS will be starting first grade at a private school this fall thanks to FA. After reading this forum I am very worried about the mindset of parents towards families that receive FA! Are your kids going to bring dinner conversations into school? If my child does not look "poor" enough is there going to be a mob of angry parents demanding my tax info! I am a wonderful saver and shopper! I do not shop often but when I do I love to shop at second hand stores! My DS always looks great because his mother is a savvy shopper! Are parents going to look him in possibly a name brand outfit and make assumptions? Even though I may have paid LESS than Target prices! If we go to the beach for the weekend and he comes to school and mentions it, are parents going to lose their minds? I surely hope this is not the case! Becase you will never hear me bragging about FA. I am grateful, but hurt that I can not afford to send my child to this wonderful school with out assistance! However, if I were to even catch a wisper of some parent making a remark to me or my child that I feel is inappropiate I would/will confront that person! KNOW for sure what you are talking about before you assume a situation! Your gossip can hurt a child! I surely hope this will never be the case but after reading this forum I am prepared to deal with any parent that thinks they have the right to make judgements about my FA situation! So I urge you all to think about the damage you could do if you let your thoughts turn into words!

Anonymous wrote:Is the Financial Aid given to parents public information? Aren't there privacy rules? I don't think that information should be disclosed because it causes a lot of the judgement calls that have been going on in this forum. In addition, the negative feelings non financial aid parents have can be passed on to their kids who can go ahead and make the recipient kids feel poorly in school for something that has nothing to do with the child.

Anyone agree?

Anonymous wrote:Again: The system is wacked. People who get FA and spend $10,000 a year on international travel? People who rent huge homes for $5,000 a month when they could downsize and save on rent? What's the fancy rental for except appearances. Oh, and people on FA who drive $50,000 cars instead of $25,000? Something is wrong with this picture. I make sacrifices, pay full freight only to subsidize this? I'm fine subsidizing students who really need FA. Folks who don't are gaming the system.

Anonymous wrote:What makes you think that what is driving me is not an actual desire to see a fair utilization of the scarce resource of financial aid? What makes you think that my 'judgment' is not based on solid information?!

If you are comfortable that your need is real, then don't worry. I would think you would be happy to see that the process by which aid is allocated is examined and discussed, so that real need is addressed. I certainly never questioned any inquiry into my family's financial situation when I was on financial aid.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think there is a fundamental misunderstanding about financial aid here. It is not charity. It is a discount to help maximize revenues.

I don't think I understand you here. Are you saying it's a revenue-maximizing behavior for schools to offer financial aid? Maybe I could agree if you're defining "revenue" broadly to include characteristics the school might want to obtain besides dollars (e.g., an economically diverse student body). But if you're defining "revenue" in the traditional way (i.e., cash money), I don't think I agree with you. It seems many well-regarded schools in the DC area would have little trouble filling every empty seat with students paying full-freight even if they were to eliminate financial aid entirely. Offering financial aid might provide schools with certain goodwill benefits that carry some intangible value (in much the same way I derive some goodwill benefit by dropping a dollar in the Salvation Army bucket), but I don't see how offering financial aid is truly maximizing revenues.