Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Since I am the only Swede on here, woohoo Sweden!

Congrats on the win!

Now Colombia!!!!

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m trying to understand where the hate for Japan comes from. What did Senegal do or what stats did they have to support this bs going around that they deserved it more than Japan. It’s pure conjecture.

Their stats were equivalent to Senegal, and they only made it through to this round because of the fair play rule – they had fewer red/ yellow cards than Senegal. This is the first time that rule has been used at this stage to knock out a team.

Many people don't like that rule in general, and think that the stereotype of people of color being more aggressive/ physical might have come into play with the number of yellow cards that Senegal received. I think I missed this game, but in Japan's last game they thought they were going to make it through because of the fair play rule, and apparently they really just passed the ball around and did not play their hardest and a lot of people thought that was a bad attitude to have and not sportsmanlike.

Before Colombia scored, Senegal were also just passing the ball around for spells, because they knew if it remained like that they would go through. People talk about sportsmanlike, but Niang’s goal to beat Poland wasn’t very sportsmanlike. The ref waved him on when he shouldn’t have, and Niang exploited this to give Senegal the win. Seeing as Senegal and Japan were tied in all tiebreakers up until the disciplinary points, which was the 6th tiebreaker, I don’t see how it’s unfair that Japan went through. If you want to say Senegal got handed more yellows because they’re African, then how do you know Japan couldn’t also have been susceptible to receive cards for being Asian? They are minorities just as well. The disciplinary points tiebreaker IS fair, because it is a tangible stat that can be measured. Drawing lots, the next tiebreaker, is what would truly have been unfair.

LOL, this is the world's game, and in that context neither Africans nor Asians are "minorities."

Population of Africa = 1.2 bn
Population of Asia = 4.4 bn
Popopulation of N.Am + Europe combined = 1.3 bn

FWIW, I don't like the "fair play" tiebreaker either b/c different refs can have very different propensities for handing out cards. Even within a given league, certain refs are just more card happy than others - whether it's because of different interpretations of what constitutes a foul, or sometimes just down to different style of game management. So I think it can be pretty random (though not nearly as random as the old way - of just drawing lots).

The rule being what it is though, it's not surprising that a team like Japan would have something of an advantage - just based on their style of play. Looking at their possession stats, head-to-head Japan had a 53% - 47% advantage in their match against Senegal, but the difference was even greater when both played the other two teams in the group. Against Columbia, Japan had the ball 58% of the time, compared to Senegal's 44%. Senegal only had the ball 41% of the match against Poland, while Japan had possession for 54% of the match against the same opponents. So Senegal just spent a lot more of their time defending, which is when yellow cards are most likely to be given out.

I still think a PK shootout the next morning would be a better way to do it. I've witnessed it done that way in some youth tournaments, and I think the drama of something like that happening on the world cup stage would be fun to watch.

That’s a nice sentiment regarding them not being minorities, but it ignores the fact that the tournament is being held in Russia, and the point that refs can have different propensities for handing out cards could affect Japan just as much Senegal. As for style of play, Japan were the more disciplined, more proactive team, so I still believe they were more than deserving to go through. As for groups being decided by a shootout, I believe it’s going to be part of the format once they expand the field, so you just might get your wish.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m trying to understand where the hate for Japan comes from. What did Senegal do or what stats did they have to support this bs going around that they deserved it more than Japan. It’s pure conjecture.

Their stats were equivalent to Senegal, and they only made it through to this round because of the fair play rule – they had fewer red/ yellow cards than Senegal. This is the first time that rule has been used at this stage to knock out a team.

Many people don't like that rule in general, and think that the stereotype of people of color being more aggressive/ physical might have come into play with the number of yellow cards that Senegal received. I think I missed this game, but in Japan's last game they thought they were going to make it through because of the fair play rule, and apparently they really just passed the ball around and did not play their hardest and a lot of people thought that was a bad attitude to have and not sportsmanlike.

Before Colombia scored, Senegal were also just passing the ball around for spells, because they knew if it remained like that they would go through. People talk about sportsmanlike, but Niang’s goal to beat Poland wasn’t very sportsmanlike. The ref waved him on when he shouldn’t have, and Niang exploited this to give Senegal the win. Seeing as Senegal and Japan were tied in all tiebreakers up until the disciplinary points, which was the 6th tiebreaker, I don’t see how it’s unfair that Japan went through. If you want to say Senegal got handed more yellows because they’re African, then how do you know Japan couldn’t also have been susceptible to receive cards for being Asian? They are minorities just as well. The disciplinary points tiebreaker IS fair, because it is a tangible stat that can be measured. Drawing lots, the next tiebreaker, is what would truly have been unfair.

LOL, this is the world's game, and in that context neither Africans nor Asians are "minorities."

Population of Africa = 1.2 bn
Population of Asia = 4.4 bn
Popopulation of N.Am + Europe combined = 1.3 bn

FWIW, I don't like the "fair play" tiebreaker either b/c different refs can have very different propensities for handing out cards. Even within a given league, certain refs are just more card happy than others - whether it's because of different interpretations of what constitutes a foul, or sometimes just down to different style of game management. So I think it can be pretty random (though not nearly as random as the old way - of just drawing lots).

The rule being what it is though, it's not surprising that a team like Japan would have something of an advantage - just based on their style of play. Looking at their possession stats, head-to-head Japan had a 53% - 47% advantage in their match against Senegal, but the difference was even greater when both played the other two teams in the group. Against Columbia, Japan had the ball 58% of the time, compared to Senegal's 44%. Senegal only had the ball 41% of the match against Poland, while Japan had possession for 54% of the match against the same opponents. So Senegal just spent a lot more of their time defending, which is when yellow cards are most likely to be given out.

I still think a PK shootout the next morning would be a better way to do it. I've witnessed it done that way in some youth tournaments, and I think the drama of something like that happening on the world cup stage would be fun to watch.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m trying to understand where the hate for Japan comes from. What did Senegal do or what stats did they have to support this bs going around that they deserved it more than Japan. It’s pure conjecture.

Their stats were equivalent to Senegal, and they only made it through to this round because of the fair play rule – they had fewer red/ yellow cards than Senegal. This is the first time that rule has been used at this stage to knock out a team.

Many people don't like that rule in general, and think that the stereotype of people of color being more aggressive/ physical might have come into play with the number of yellow cards that Senegal received. I think I missed this game, but in Japan's last game they thought they were going to make it through because of the fair play rule, and apparently they really just passed the ball around and did not play their hardest and a lot of people thought that was a bad attitude to have and not sportsmanlike.

Before Colombia scored, Senegal were also just passing the ball around for spells, because they knew if it remained like that they would go through. People talk about sportsmanlike, but Niang’s goal to beat Poland wasn’t very sportsmanlike. The ref waved him on when he shouldn’t have, and Niang exploited this to give Senegal the win. Seeing as Senegal and Japan were tied in all tiebreakers up until the disciplinary points, which was the 6th tiebreaker, I don’t see how it’s unfair that Japan went through. If you want to say Senegal got handed more yellows because they’re African, then how do you know Japan couldn’t also have been susceptible to receive cards for being Asian? They are minorities just as well. The disciplinary points tiebreaker IS fair, because it is a tangible stat that can be measured. Drawing lots, the next tiebreaker, is what would truly have been unfair.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I was rooting for Senegal to go through. But if we’re using feelings to determine who should’ve qualified, and not the predetermined rules that were set before the tournament, then I still feel Japan should’ve gone through. After all, they were the only team out of the bottom 3 to beat the group winners, Colombia.

I'm not using feelings. I would feel the same if the situation were reversed. I'm not from Senegal. I object on principle. Note this is the first time this rule has ever been applied at this stage, so I doubt any team was objecting. It's usually after a rule is applied that controversy arises and it gets reviewed.

I remember a similar instance for the NFL a couple of years back. I'm hard pressed to remember which team, but there was a touchdown that should have been recalled because the player who had the ball's knee came fully down to the ground, so technically, he shouldn't have been allowed to keep running. The coach of the team the touchdown went against demanded a video review. Because he asked for one, it was denied and the touchdown counted, costing him the game. As I recall, it was some arcane rule that had been put in place because coaches wer using video review as a stall tactic. To my knowledge, after the controversy, the rule was changed and no longer applies.

Anonymous wrote:I was rooting for Senegal to go through. But if we’re using feelings to determine who should’ve qualified, and not the predetermined rules that were set before the tournament, then I still feel Japan should’ve gone through. After all, they were the only team out of the bottom 3 to beat the group winners, Colombia.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m trying to understand where the hate for Japan comes from. What did Senegal do or what stats did they have to support this bs going around that they deserved it more than Japan. It’s pure conjecture.

Their stats were equivalent to Senegal, and they only made it through to this round because of the fair play rule – they had fewer red/ yellow cards than Senegal. This is the first time that rule has been used at this stage to knock out a team.

Many people don't like that rule in general, and think that the stereotype of people of color being more aggressive/ physical might have come into play with the number of yellow cards that Senegal received. I think I missed this game, but in Japan's last game they thought they were going to make it through because of the fair play rule, and apparently they really just passed the ball around and did not play their hardest and a lot of people thought that was a bad attitude to have and not sportsmanlike.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m trying to understand where the hate for Japan comes from. What did Senegal do or what stats did they have to support this bs going around that they deserved it more than Japan. It’s pure conjecture.

Their stats were equivalent to Senegal, and they only made it through to this round because of the fair play rule – they had fewer red/ yellow cards than Senegal. This is the first time that rule has been used at this stage to knock out a team.

Many people don't like that rule in general, and think that the stereotype of people of color being more aggressive/ physical might have come into play with the number of yellow cards that Senegal received. I think I missed this game, but in Japan's last game they thought they were going to make it through because of the fair play rule, and apparently they really just passed the ball around and did not play their hardest and a lot of people thought that was a bad attitude to have and not sportsmanlike.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Columbia got what it deserved. Soccer gods punished that faker goalie. Ho back home.

I guess the soccer gods also arranged for a ref that favored the English. Faker goalie? LOL what game were you watching, did you not see Kane, Henderson, Trippier and co playing like absolute wimps who make a meal out of the slightest contact? Pathetic.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:More info/

Aware of the situation, Japan - for whom extra bookings could have resulted in elimination - played out the closing stages of their game against Poland at walking pace despite trailing 1-0.

https://en.as.com/en/2018/07/02/football/1530534251_707060.html

How is what Japan did any different than teams who only defend because all they need is a draw?

You do what you can to win and keep going, Senegal knew the stats, the rules, and could have tried to score a goal to continue in the tournament.

Anonymous wrote:More info/

Aware of the situation, Japan - for whom extra bookings could have resulted in elimination - played out the closing stages of their game against Poland at walking pace despite trailing 1-0.

https://en.as.com/en/2018/07/02/football/1530534251_707060.html

Anonymous wrote:I’m trying to understand where the hate for Japan comes from. What did Senegal do or what stats did they have to support this bs going around that they deserved it more than Japan. It’s pure conjecture.