Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The 3 hour commute has got to go.

I also work out at home which is so much more efficient. You don't need a lot of fancy equipment. I have some dumbbells and an exercise ball and mat and do a lot with free body weight - squats, presses, push ups, lunges, planks etc. We do have a treadmill but I try to a lot outside.

Anyway, given your commute could you make a case to the firm for telecommuting 2x a week? Seems like you could bill more eliminating those 6 hours.

I thought OP said this was her first year at the firm (after a clerkship maybe?). I would not recommend asking to telework 2x per week when she's this junior.

OP, I would give up the workouts and focus on eating healthy/appropriate quantities which is the main reason people gain weight. I would also give up family and friends for now on the weekends except for those family members that want to either come over and visit with the kids while you work or that want to take the kids out, again while you work. I realize it sucks but it's only for a few years while you sock away money and build experience and plan an exit strategy.

I would also consider moving closer to the firm if possible.

No, don't do the bolded. Yes scale back the daily workouts, move to make the commute more reasonable, but don't give up on your family and friends. You can have a social life and still bill 2200 hours. I know -- I've done it.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP back. This thread has gotten off topic, but thank you for those who answered the question.

So, here is my day generally if I'm not dealing with interviewing at schools or travelling for work (not billable):

Wake up at 5:30 AM -- breakfast, clothing, pack myself for the day, straighten up, and deal with all the emergency emails I had overnight (I generally don't bill for these 1-3 minute emails, because I cannot bill for 0.01 of an hour)
6:30-7:00 AM -- leave for DC.
8-8:30 AM -- arrive in office and set up computer to deal with emails/calls
9:00 - 10:00 AM -- gym/shower/dressed
10 AM - 7 PM -- work like crazy, but dealing with pitches, responses to team members on cases that I'm not on (but collegial office so can't ignore), work for cases that I'm told cannot be billed, practice-group meetings, interviews, billable hour tracking, trainings, bathroom, lunch all suck up actual work time and I'm careful to only bill clients the $500+/hour for time that I am 100% productive. Plus, pro bono does not fully count and I always am on a pro bono case. If pro bono counted, that alone would allow me to make my hours. Or, if I billed on bathroom breaks as I know my colleagues do, that would help. Or if I did billable work during travel (knowing that it is less productive in tiny, uncomfortable seats with people constantly interrupting you), that would help. But, I don't and I won't play that game.
8:30 PM -- arrive home, eat, try to unwind.
11 PM - ... -- sometimes have to go back to work, but sometimes have a very interrupted sleep with 2 children that wake up often.

My weekends are not free: (1) we don't have a weekend nanny; (2) we have church and other activities; (3) I have a family and friends; (5) we try to go away on weekends to make up for not taking vacation. I try not to work on weekends, but yes, I do work then too.

I am barely sleeping as it is. Am I expected to sleep less? And, yes, I have to go to the gym -- the people in my office are fat and I gained 20 pounds in the first 6 months at the firm.

I am in a specialty practice.

Agree with others that what you describe will not work in BigLaw. As others have said:

- Need a shorter commute or one where you can work while in transit. This is by far your biggest problem.
- Gym everyday is a luxury. Can't say you can't do it, but it will have to mean giving up something else of value.
1 and 2 are resulting in you having only 9 hours to bill. To bill 2000 per year, you need 8 per day basically and billing 8 in 9 would be incredibly incredibly efficient (and therefore unlikely).
- Quick e-mails may be billable. Depends on the e-mail.
- You need to get off non-billable as much as possible. Get your hours before being a good firm citizen/pro bono contributor.
- I know you want your weekends off, but if you can get an hour or two on the weekends, it helps give you a little wiggle room during the week.

DP, but OP if you're committed to 5 workouts a week the absolute least you can do is get 2 of them in on the weekends. You should also do some 20-minute HIIT video or something at home for the other 3 and focus on eating healthy to avoid gaining weight instead of wasting time at the office. This gives you 5 more hours to bill during the week without even changing your schedule -- possibly more since you say "lunch" is sucking up your time, and your new brown bag salad can be eaten at your desk while you bill.

Anonymous wrote:OP back. This thread has gotten off topic, but thank you for those who answered the question.

So, here is my day generally if I'm not dealing with interviewing at schools or travelling for work (not billable):

Wake up at 5:30 AM -- breakfast, clothing, pack myself for the day, straighten up, and deal with all the emergency emails I had overnight (I generally don't bill for these 1-3 minute emails, because I cannot bill for 0.01 of an hour)
6:30-7:00 AM -- leave for DC.
8-8:30 AM -- arrive in office and set up computer to deal with emails/calls
9:00 - 10:00 AM -- gym/shower/dressed
10 AM - 7 PM -- work like crazy, but dealing with pitches, responses to team members on cases that I'm not on (but collegial office so can't ignore), work for cases that I'm told cannot be billed, practice-group meetings, interviews, billable hour tracking, trainings, bathroom, lunch all suck up actual work time and I'm careful to only bill clients the $500+/hour for time that I am 100% productive. Plus, pro bono does not fully count and I always am on a pro bono case. If pro bono counted, that alone would allow me to make my hours. Or, if I billed on bathroom breaks as I know my colleagues do, that would help. Or if I did billable work during travel (knowing that it is less productive in tiny, uncomfortable seats with people constantly interrupting you), that would help. But, I don't and I won't play that game.
8:30 PM -- arrive home, eat, try to unwind.
11 PM - ... -- sometimes have to go back to work, but sometimes have a very interrupted sleep with 2 children that wake up often.

My weekends are not free: (1) we don't have a weekend nanny; (2) we have church and other activities; (3) I have a family and friends; (5) we try to go away on weekends to make up for not taking vacation. I try not to work on weekends, but yes, I do work then too.

I am barely sleeping as it is. Am I expected to sleep less? And, yes, I have to go to the gym -- the people in my office are fat and I gained 20 pounds in the first 6 months at the firm.

I am in a specialty practice.

Agree with others that what you describe will not work in BigLaw. As others have said:

- Need a shorter commute or one where you can work while in transit. This is by far your biggest problem.
- Gym everyday is a luxury. Can't say you can't do it, but it will have to mean giving up something else of value.
1 and 2 are resulting in you having only 9 hours to bill. To bill 2000 per year, you need 8 per day basically and billing 8 in 9 would be incredibly incredibly efficient (and therefore unlikely).
- Quick e-mails may be billable. Depends on the e-mail.
- You need to get off non-billable as much as possible. Get your hours before being a good firm citizen/pro bono contributor.
- I know you want your weekends off, but if you can get an hour or two on the weekends, it helps give you a little wiggle room during the week.

I’m really glad OP followed up with details because I was kinda starting to feel bad for her and think, wow, maybe biglaw does suck and I’ve been doing it so long I’ve forgotten how much. Nope. It’s OP. I metro to/from work and bill for reading cases or emails or whatever. I do ZERO pro bono because at this point in my career (and life — I have two young kids) it just can’t happen. Make different choices, OP. Geez.

Some thoughts:

1) Assuming you must do all the pro bono work that you have, is it litigation? If so, can you recruit an additional associate to your case to share the load or have a summer associate or a staff attorney do some of the research or even first-round drafting?

2) Are you making the most of the staff and support available? Secretary, paralegals, research librarians?

3) You need to be billing for time you are working, and work is work even if you're not all bright eyed and bushy tailed. I'm sure I read and analyze faster at 9am than I do at 11pm. But I'm still billing if I stay up late to work.

4) Responding to colleagues. We also have a collegial office and people will respond to queries without billing. But this is limited to simple queries that people can answer off the top of their head. So if I know someone has recently done XYZ, I might call them with a question or two so they can point me in the right direction or confirm that my reading of XYZ requirement is same as theirs was. But these kinds of queries shouldn't require you to actually go off and do work to formulate a response. Is that happening, where you are going off and having to do actual research or analysis to answer such queries?

Anonymous wrote:The 3 hour commute has got to go.

I also work out at home which is so much more efficient. You don't need a lot of fancy equipment. I have some dumbbells and an exercise ball and mat and do a lot with free body weight - squats, presses, push ups, lunges, planks etc. We do have a treadmill but I try to a lot outside.

Anyway, given your commute could you make a case to the firm for telecommuting 2x a week? Seems like you could bill more eliminating those 6 hours.

I thought OP said this was her first year at the firm (after a clerkship maybe?). I would not recommend asking to telework 2x per week when she's this junior.

OP, I would give up the workouts and focus on eating healthy/appropriate quantities which is the main reason people gain weight. I would also give up family and friends for now on the weekends except for those family members that want to either come over and visit with the kids while you work or that want to take the kids out, again while you work. I realize it sucks but it's only for a few years while you sock away money and build experience and plan an exit strategy.

I would also consider moving closer to the firm if possible.

The 3 hour commute has got to go.

I also work out at home which is so much more efficient. You don't need a lot of fancy equipment. I have some dumbbells and an exercise ball and mat and do a lot with free body weight - squats, presses, push ups, lunges, planks etc. We do have a treadmill but I try to a lot outside.

Anyway, given your commute could you make a case to the firm for telecommuting 2x a week? Seems like you could bill more eliminating those 6 hours.

As others have said, you're making this way too hard for yourself. Either conform to the biglaw norms (bill for emails and working on travel) or get used to being miserable. Also, 3 hours daily commute is making your life harder than it needs to be.

OP, is there anyway you could take mass transit to/from work? I don't know where you live or where you work, but I choose to take metro over driving for two reasons: 1) I can read/draft emails on metro, so I can bill time during my commute, and 2) it enables me to get some exercise, walking to/from work and metro and the garage. Yes, it's not a ton, but those brisk walks, coupled by a 10-15 minute walk at lunch time, gets me a few miles and gets my heart rate up. I also bring my lunch, to help keep my weight in check.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP back. This thread has gotten off topic, but thank you for those who answered the question.

So, here is my day generally if I'm not dealing with interviewing at schools or travelling for work (not billable):

Wake up at 5:30 AM -- breakfast, clothing, pack myself for the day, straighten up, and deal with all the emergency emails I had overnight (I generally don't bill for these 1-3 minute emails, because I cannot bill for 0.01 of an hour)
6:30-7:00 AM -- leave for DC.
8-8:30 AM -- arrive in office and set up computer to deal with emails/calls
9:00 - 10:00 AM -- gym/shower/dressed
10 AM - 7 PM -- work like crazy, but dealing with pitches, responses to team members on cases that I'm not on (but collegial office so can't ignore), work for cases that I'm told cannot be billed, practice-group meetings, interviews, billable hour tracking, trainings, bathroom, lunch all suck up actual work time and I'm careful to only bill clients the $500+/hour for time that I am 100% productive. Plus, pro bono does not fully count and I always am on a pro bono case. If pro bono counted, that alone would allow me to make my hours. Or, if I billed on bathroom breaks as I know my colleagues do, that would help. Or if I did billable work during travel (knowing that it is less productive in tiny, uncomfortable seats with people constantly interrupting you), that would help. But, I don't and I won't play that game.
8:30 PM -- arrive home, eat, try to unwind.
11 PM - ... -- sometimes have to go back to work, but sometimes have a very interrupted sleep with 2 children that wake up often.

My weekends are not free: (1) we don't have a weekend nanny; (2) we have church and other activities; (3) I have a family and friends; (5) we try to go away on weekends to make up for not taking vacation. I try not to work on weekends, but yes, I do work then too.

I am barely sleeping as it is. Am I expected to sleep less? And, yes, I have to go to the gym -- the people in my office are fat and I gained 20 pounds in the first 6 months at the firm.

I am in a specialty practice.

Okay, you have an hour and half commute each way, don't bill for all the time you work, constantly work pro bono that doesn't count toward your billables, take an hour during the day to work out, and don't start work until 10am.

This isn't a BigLaw problem, this is a you problem. You chose a three hour commute each day. You're choosing not to bill accurately (pro tip: partners are going to write off a lot of your time before it gets to the client anyway, so saying you won't bill on an airplane because you cannot be 100% productive for the full hour is self defeating nonsense). You're going away on weekends and complaining about not making your hours, this is just completely self-created chaos.

There are a few issues here. Some you may be able to change and some not. The commute is a huge issue. I am also a biglaw associate (9yrs) with 2 young children. But I live a 15 minute walk from the office - and I chose to do that (and give up the big house/yard, etc) precisely because of the issues you mention. I spend 30 mins commuting each day and it is a pleasant walk which allows me to clear my head and get into "office mode" or "mom mode". I do continue to work after the kids are asleep and I am lucky because they are both very good sleepers. A lot about having good sleepers is luck, but there may be some things you can work on with your kids to encourage better sleep habits. The gym - I hear what you're saying about needing to exercise, and it's great that you do - but you might have to do that less frequently or find another way to incorporate exercise into your life (e.g. could you cycle to work?) It seems crazy to me that you don't start working until 10am, despite getting up at 5:30am.
I think the way you are billing is also not right. Perhaps your firm does this differently, but when I started work, I was told that I should bill for all the work I did - no matter if I thought I might have been a bit slow or inefficient or whatever. I just bill what I do. If the partner reviewing the bill (or the client) thinks that some time should be written off or whatever then that is a decision for them. You, as the junior associate, are absolutely not entitled to make that call. Same with billable work during travel. If you aren't using that time to work then don't bill, but if you are, then you bill. It's not a "game", it's how billable time works, and the partners will correct billing discrepancies like this and clients may also strike off time.
You also need to take control of the non-billable work that you do. Some is unavoidable, but others that you've listed are not. Pro bono is great, but if you're in a firm that doesn't fully credit pro bono hours then you need to do less of it, quite simply. (You should also think about moving to a firm that does credit pro bono work, like my firm and many others). Doing interviews, if you mean interviewing law students for jobs, is incredibly time consuming and you should just say no to that.
Honestly, to me it reads that what you are saying is: how can I do a full 2000 billable hour year as a biglaw associate while only working a 45 hour week (including non-billable time)? The answer is, you can't. So you either need to change the way you work or your career.

Why on earth are you doing huge amounts of non-billable pro bono?!?!

I agree that if you "don't and won't" bill for all of your time, you aren't going to hit your hours.

Anonymous wrote:OP back. This thread has gotten off topic, but thank you for those who answered the question.

So, here is my day generally if I'm not dealing with interviewing at schools or travelling for work (not billable):

Wake up at 5:30 AM -- breakfast, clothing, pack myself for the day, straighten up, and deal with all the emergency emails I had overnight (I generally don't bill for these 1-3 minute emails, because I cannot bill for 0.01 of an hour)
6:30-7:00 AM -- leave for DC.
8-8:30 AM -- arrive in office and set up computer to deal with emails/calls
9:00 - 10:00 AM -- gym/shower/dressed
10 AM - 7 PM -- work like crazy, but dealing with pitches, responses to team members on cases that I'm not on (but collegial office so can't ignore), work for cases that I'm told cannot be billed, practice-group meetings, interviews, billable hour tracking, trainings, bathroom, lunch all suck up actual work time and I'm careful to only bill clients the $500+/hour for time that I am 100% productive. Plus, pro bono does not fully count and I always am on a pro bono case. If pro bono counted, that alone would allow me to make my hours. Or, if I billed on bathroom breaks as I know my colleagues do, that would help. Or if I did billable work during travel (knowing that it is less productive in tiny, uncomfortable seats with people constantly interrupting you), that would help. But, I don't and I won't play that game.
8:30 PM -- arrive home, eat, try to unwind.
11 PM - ... -- sometimes have to go back to work, but sometimes have a very interrupted sleep with 2 children that wake up often.

My weekends are not free: (1) we don't have a weekend nanny; (2) we have church and other activities; (3) I have a family and friends; (5) we try to go away on weekends to make up for not taking vacation. I try not to work on weekends, but yes, I do work then too.

I am barely sleeping as it is. Am I expected to sleep less? And, yes, I have to go to the gym -- the people in my office are fat and I gained 20 pounds in the first 6 months at the firm.

I am in a specialty practice.

I say this with the absolute best of intentions: you are not cut out for big law. The idea that you won't bill for an email because you can't bill for .01 of an hour is, while laudable, just not how big law works. you need to start billing every single email at .1. The idea that you won't bill during travel time because you're not as productive? HA. that's borderline hysterical. All of your colleagues are doing it and you will be left behind in the dust or end up like you are now - just completely fried.

You need to get out. You don't have the disposition to stomach big law.

Anonymous wrote:OP back. This thread has gotten off topic, but thank you for those who answered the question.

So, here is my day generally if I'm not dealing with interviewing at schools or travelling for work (not billable):

Wake up at 5:30 AM -- breakfast, clothing, pack myself for the day, straighten up, and deal with all the emergency emails I had overnight (I generally don't bill for these 1-3 minute emails, because I cannot bill for 0.01 of an hour)
6:30-7:00 AM -- leave for DC.
8-8:30 AM -- arrive in office and set up computer to deal with emails/calls
9:00 - 10:00 AM -- gym/shower/dressed
10 AM - 7 PM -- work like crazy, but dealing with pitches, responses to team members on cases that I'm not on (but collegial office so can't ignore), work for cases that I'm told cannot be billed, practice-group meetings, interviews, billable hour tracking, trainings, bathroom, lunch all suck up actual work time and I'm careful to only bill clients the $500+/hour for time that I am 100% productive. Plus, pro bono does not fully count and I always am on a pro bono case. If pro bono counted, that alone would allow me to make my hours. Or, if I billed on bathroom breaks as I know my colleagues do, that would help. Or if I did billable work during travel (knowing that it is less productive in tiny, uncomfortable seats with people constantly interrupting you), that would help. But, I don't and I won't play that game.
8:30 PM -- arrive home, eat, try to unwind.
11 PM - ... -- sometimes have to go back to work, but sometimes have a very interrupted sleep with 2 children that wake up often.

My weekends are not free: (1) we don't have a weekend nanny; (2) we have church and other activities; (3) I have a family and friends; (5) we try to go away on weekends to make up for not taking vacation. I try not to work on weekends, but yes, I do work then too.

I am barely sleeping as it is. Am I expected to sleep less? And, yes, I have to go to the gym -- the people in my office are fat and I gained 20 pounds in the first 6 months at the firm.

I am in a specialty practice.

Okay, you have an hour and half commute each way, don't bill for all the time you work, constantly work pro bono that doesn't count toward your billables, take an hour during the day to work out, and don't start work until 10am.

This isn't a BigLaw problem, this is a you problem. You chose a three hour commute each day. You're choosing not to bill accurately (pro tip: partners are going to write off a lot of your time before it gets to the client anyway, so saying you won't bill on an airplane because you cannot be 100% productive for the full hour is self defeating nonsense). You're going away on weekends and complaining about not making your hours, this is just completely self-created chaos.

Your commute is 1.5 hours?

OP back. This thread has gotten off topic, but thank you for those who answered the question.

So, here is my day generally if I'm not dealing with interviewing at schools or travelling for work (not billable):

Wake up at 5:30 AM -- breakfast, clothing, pack myself for the day, straighten up, and deal with all the emergency emails I had overnight (I generally don't bill for these 1-3 minute emails, because I cannot bill for 0.01 of an hour)
6:30-7:00 AM -- leave for DC.
8-8:30 AM -- arrive in office and set up computer to deal with emails/calls
9:00 - 10:00 AM -- gym/shower/dressed
10 AM - 7 PM -- work like crazy, but dealing with pitches, responses to team members on cases that I'm not on (but collegial office so can't ignore), work for cases that I'm told cannot be billed, practice-group meetings, interviews, billable hour tracking, trainings, bathroom, lunch all suck up actual work time and I'm careful to only bill clients the $500+/hour for time that I am 100% productive. Plus, pro bono does not fully count and I always am on a pro bono case. If pro bono counted, that alone would allow me to make my hours. Or, if I billed on bathroom breaks as I know my colleagues do, that would help. Or if I did billable work during travel (knowing that it is less productive in tiny, uncomfortable seats with people constantly interrupting you), that would help. But, I don't and I won't play that game.
8:30 PM -- arrive home, eat, try to unwind.
11 PM - ... -- sometimes have to go back to work, but sometimes have a very interrupted sleep with 2 children that wake up often.

My weekends are not free: (1) we don't have a weekend nanny; (2) we have church and other activities; (3) I have a family and friends; (5) we try to go away on weekends to make up for not taking vacation. I try not to work on weekends, but yes, I do work then too.

I am barely sleeping as it is. Am I expected to sleep less? And, yes, I have to go to the gym -- the people in my office are fat and I gained 20 pounds in the first 6 months at the firm.

I am in a specialty practice.