IB kids also have required CAS hours and tons of writing assignments that are graded overseas like the EE, TOK essay and Paper 1, 2 and 3s. You cant compare and IB diploma to a few AP classes.

At the IB-only high schools, are the diploma candidates the only applicants under consideration by the admissions committees at UVA/W&M or elite out of state schools? (Are there high achieving students at the IB-only high schools that choose not to pursue the diploma?)

This is false and you have no idea what you are talking about. HL classes are two year classes and students are limited to 4 of them. All IB classes are considered college level and receive 1.0 grade bump. Colleges, individually, decide whether they will grant credit for HL, SL, AP, DE and CLEP and the scores required.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I thought Virginia Tech was a welding school?

I'd be disgusted if my kid had to go there.

Really-- it's engineering school is ranked 16th, and it is a top 10 school in civil, industrial, biological and environmental engineering. Definately a contender for my TJ kid who is applying to environmental engineering programs (where VT ranks 6th). Can't beat the price for kid who will probably also have to think about grad school costs. And in several areas, can't beat the educational quality. Certainly beats UVA in engineering. So, you do you. The state welders school is my kid's safety though. (And my kid has no intention of applying to UVA. Too big. Too weak in engineering. Hates the rich frat boy vibe).

Please don't feed the trolls.

Or the irrational VA Tech boosters.

The IB diploma requires 3 HL classes and 3 SL classes. SL classes are equivalent to high school honors classes and not college level work. The IBO's own literature states this. So a student who receives the IB diploma has taken the equivalent of 3 AP classes and 3 honors classes, plus the extended essay. It is not equivalent to taking 6 AP classes. A better reference point for the percentage of students receiving the IB diploma at AP schools would be the percentage of seniors who have earned passing scores in 3-4 AP classes. In the past I have seen reports detailing the number of students receiving AP scholar awards from each school, but I cannot find this currently.

I think that for students who would end up taking 3-4 AP courses during high school, the IB and the AP curriculums would both provide similar levels of instruction. But for the smaller group of students who can successfully take 6+ AP courses during high school, some of their courses would not be as rigorous if they pursued the IB diploma.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Robinson had 700+ seniors this year. 156 IB Diploma candidates. @45 UVA acceptances and @35 are going.

Totally reasonable

says you. based on what?

Anyone who gets an IB diploma has done some serious work. I would expect to see higher than 30% accepted from that group. But, I guess we don't know from what was posted how many actually applied.

IB full diploma is very impressive. But, Two things. Not every IB diploma candidate makes it through. And (even more shocking), not every kid wants to attend UVA. In fact, I would think WM would appeal more to many of these kids. You need the applied vs accepted numbers for kids who ultimately get the full diploma to make sense of the data.

There is nothing special about IB diploma students. Many have average SAT/ACT scores and are lucky to get into JMU/GMU/VCU.

Well, that's a bit snarky.

Actually, this years class was exceptional. I think at graduation they said with 156 Diploma candidates, it was the largest and most successful IB program in the country. This class sent at least one student to each Ivy, a few to Stanford, Duke, Vandy, NYU, Berkley, Michigan, MIT, Chicago, Rice, NW, the military academies and a variety of International universities in Europe. As for stats, I can only speak for my DC, who had over 1500 on the SAT and an UW 4.0, W 4.7 gpa, over 300 hours of community service, multiple varsity sports, leadership positions and a part time job.

It was an awful grind to complete all the requirements for the full diploma. Kudos to any of the kids who make the effort.

They can make the effort, but the majority are still not UVA-quality students.

That's debatable. I think the more impressive thing is how successful the IB program is at Robinson. I always hear about Marshall and South Lakes on this board, but it's interesting how little we hear from people about Robinson. It sounds like it's sort of the best of the bunch when it comes to being an IB school in a middle class area.

We hear about Robinson, Lake Braddock and West Springfield all the time on this forum when people are priced out of other areas and looking for more affordable alternatives. Marshall, South Lakes and Robinson are also regularly held out as examples of good IB programs in FCPS, although one could still ask whether IB is the best program for those schools when 80% of their graduates fail to receive IB diplomas.

But, either way, being an IB diploma candidate in the top 20-30% or so of students at a huge public like Robinson doesn't mean you necessarily are a competitive candidate at UVA, which both seeks geographic diversity and has many other applicants from NoVa.

That's like saying an AP school is not successful because 80% of the students pass fewer than 7 AP classes.

Not really. IB is more binary and prescriptive. I'm not sure why Robinson accepted IB when Woodson rejected it, but at least pupil placement to Lake Braddock is available to those who prefer AP.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Robinson had 700+ seniors this year. 156 IB Diploma candidates. @45 UVA acceptances and @35 are going.

Totally reasonable

says you. based on what?

Anyone who gets an IB diploma has done some serious work. I would expect to see higher than 30% accepted from that group. But, I guess we don't know from what was posted how many actually applied.

IB full diploma is very impressive. But, Two things. Not every IB diploma candidate makes it through. And (even more shocking), not every kid wants to attend UVA. In fact, I would think WM would appeal more to many of these kids. You need the applied vs accepted numbers for kids who ultimately get the full diploma to make sense of the data.

There is nothing special about IB diploma students. Many have average SAT/ACT scores and are lucky to get into JMU/GMU/VCU.

Well, that's a bit snarky.

Actually, this years class was exceptional. I think at graduation they said with 156 Diploma candidates, it was the largest and most successful IB program in the country. This class sent at least one student to each Ivy, a few to Stanford, Duke, Vandy, NYU, Berkley, Michigan, MIT, Chicago, Rice, NW, the military academies and a variety of International universities in Europe. As for stats, I can only speak for my DC, who had over 1500 on the SAT and an UW 4.0, W 4.7 gpa, over 300 hours of community service, multiple varsity sports, leadership positions and a part time job.

It was an awful grind to complete all the requirements for the full diploma. Kudos to any of the kids who make the effort.

They can make the effort, but the majority are still not UVA-quality students.

That's debatable. I think the more impressive thing is how successful the IB program is at Robinson. I always hear about Marshall and South Lakes on this board, but it's interesting how little we hear from people about Robinson. It sounds like it's sort of the best of the bunch when it comes to being an IB school in a middle class area.

We hear about Robinson, Lake Braddock and West Springfield all the time on this forum when people are priced out of other areas and looking for more affordable alternatives. Marshall, South Lakes and Robinson are also regularly held out as examples of good IB programs in FCPS, although one could still ask whether IB is the best program for those schools when 80% of their graduates fail to receive IB diplomas.

But, either way, being an IB diploma candidate in the top 20-30% or so of students at a huge public like Robinson doesn't mean you necessarily are a competitive candidate at UVA, which both seeks geographic diversity and has many other applicants from NoVa.

That's like saying an AP school is not successful because 80% of the students pass fewer than 7 AP classes.

Exactly. There parallel is telling. Having looked into IB, I actually am looking forward to having my kids attend Robinson. I think it's a fantastic program and if the county limited enrollment people would be trying to stab each other to get access.

I mean, look at Falls Church City. It has IB and people rave about it too.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Robinson had 700+ seniors this year. 156 IB Diploma candidates. @45 UVA acceptances and @35 are going.

Totally reasonable

says you. based on what?

Anyone who gets an IB diploma has done some serious work. I would expect to see higher than 30% accepted from that group. But, I guess we don't know from what was posted how many actually applied.

IB full diploma is very impressive. But, Two things. Not every IB diploma candidate makes it through. And (even more shocking), not every kid wants to attend UVA. In fact, I would think WM would appeal more to many of these kids. You need the applied vs accepted numbers for kids who ultimately get the full diploma to make sense of the data.

There is nothing special about IB diploma students. Many have average SAT/ACT scores and are lucky to get into JMU/GMU/VCU.

Well, that's a bit snarky.

Actually, this years class was exceptional. I think at graduation they said with 156 Diploma candidates, it was the largest and most successful IB program in the country. This class sent at least one student to each Ivy, a few to Stanford, Duke, Vandy, NYU, Berkley, Michigan, MIT, Chicago, Rice, NW, the military academies and a variety of International universities in Europe. As for stats, I can only speak for my DC, who had over 1500 on the SAT and an UW 4.0, W 4.7 gpa, over 300 hours of community service, multiple varsity sports, leadership positions and a part time job.

It was an awful grind to complete all the requirements for the full diploma. Kudos to any of the kids who make the effort.

They can make the effort, but the majority are still not UVA-quality students.

That's debatable. I think the more impressive thing is how successful the IB program is at Robinson. I always hear about Marshall and South Lakes on this board, but it's interesting how little we hear from people about Robinson. It sounds like it's sort of the best of the bunch when it comes to being an IB school in a middle class area.

We hear about Robinson, Lake Braddock and West Springfield all the time on this forum when people are priced out of other areas and looking for more affordable alternatives. Marshall, South Lakes and Robinson are also regularly held out as examples of good IB programs in FCPS, although one could still ask whether IB is the best program for those schools when 80% of their graduates fail to receive IB diplomas.

But, either way, being an IB diploma candidate in the top 20-30% or so of students at a huge public like Robinson doesn't mean you necessarily are a competitive candidate at UVA, which both seeks geographic diversity and has many other applicants from NoVa.

That's like saying an AP school is not successful because 80% of the students pass fewer than 7 AP classes.

PP Robinson IB poster here... DC and all peers so far have posted scores on SM and reported that they received the diploma. Have yet to hear about a miss, but it wouldn't be odd that someone wouldn't post that. If we get a report on totals, I will pass it along.

Also, although DC got into UVA EA and is going there, also loved VT campus. Most kids looking at in state va schools, choose VT over UVA for engineering...its just a much better program, Don't understand why people feel the need to dump on other peoples choices and judge other kids stats when you have no idea what they are. Seems very petty and immature for adults/parents to do so.

Congrats to everyone wherever they are going!

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Robinson had 700+ seniors this year. 156 IB Diploma candidates. @45 UVA acceptances and @35 are going.

Totally reasonable

says you. based on what?

Anyone who gets an IB diploma has done some serious work. I would expect to see higher than 30% accepted from that group. But, I guess we don't know from what was posted how many actually applied.

IB full diploma is very impressive. But, Two things. Not every IB diploma candidate makes it through. And (even more shocking), not every kid wants to attend UVA. In fact, I would think WM would appeal more to many of these kids. You need the applied vs accepted numbers for kids who ultimately get the full diploma to make sense of the data.

There is nothing special about IB diploma students. Many have average SAT/ACT scores and are lucky to get into JMU/GMU/VCU.

Well, that's a bit snarky.

Actually, this years class was exceptional. I think at graduation they said with 156 Diploma candidates, it was the largest and most successful IB program in the country. This class sent at least one student to each Ivy, a few to Stanford, Duke, Vandy, NYU, Berkley, Michigan, MIT, Chicago, Rice, NW, the military academies and a variety of International universities in Europe. As for stats, I can only speak for my DC, who had over 1500 on the SAT and an UW 4.0, W 4.7 gpa, over 300 hours of community service, multiple varsity sports, leadership positions and a part time job.

It was an awful grind to complete all the requirements for the full diploma. Kudos to any of the kids who make the effort.

They can make the effort, but the majority are still not UVA-quality students.

That's debatable. I think the more impressive thing is how successful the IB program is at Robinson. I always hear about Marshall and South Lakes on this board, but it's interesting how little we hear from people about Robinson. It sounds like it's sort of the best of the bunch when it comes to being an IB school in a middle class area.

We hear about Robinson, Lake Braddock and West Springfield all the time on this forum when people are priced out of other areas and looking for more affordable alternatives. Marshall, South Lakes and Robinson are also regularly held out as examples of good IB programs in FCPS, although one could still ask whether IB is the best program for those schools when 80% of their graduates fail to receive IB diplomas.

But, either way, being an IB diploma candidate in the top 20-30% or so of students at a huge public like Robinson doesn't mean you necessarily are a competitive candidate at UVA, which both seeks geographic diversity and has many other applicants from NoVa.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Bottom line: UVA and W&M affirmatively do not want NOVA applicants or students. They want NOVA tax revenue, but those of us that live here are poison and are to be avoided. A GPA barely above a B+ from a school in seven central Virginia counties, together with standardized test scores in roughly the 75+ percentile, is enough for UVA, from that locality. The NOVA requirements are dramatically higher. UVA and W&M demand, receive, hold, and expend public funds. But they do NOT equally accommodate VA resident applicants by any measure.

Completely and verifiably UNTRUE. UVA's class of 2020 has 1130 students from Northern Virginia out of a class of 3720 (source: http://admission.virginia.edu/uva-admission-quotas-northern-virginia). UVA accepted 224 kids from my D's Northern VA HS last year (TJ).

Read this blog from UVA admissions for more info on how UVA selects its student body: http://uvaapplication.blogspot.com/

Uh, please. Even if true, it is TJ STUDENTS! They were self-selected into four years ago! You CANNOT compare TJ results to any other public school in NOVA, even FCPS! Langley and McLean send only a dozen or so out of classes of 500! This is what NOVA parents are upset about (if you at a TJ parent, then this is not your world). Only 663 students from Fairfax Country for class of 2020. Just in FCPS there are 33 high schools. And UVA has to also account for VA residents who are at private day schools in MD and D.C. as well as elite boarding schools. Sure, if you are at TJ you have a reasonable shot of getting in - put you've already won the sweepstakes four years ago. If my B+ student at McLean High School wants to apply, forget it. Not going to happen

Once again, enrollment is not acceptance, nor for that matter is it application. It is meaningless to know that "only a dozen" McLean grads go to UVA (if that is even true). What is relevant here is how many applied and how many were accepted.

Further, even if it is true that a large share of acceptances from FFX are TJ students, I'm not sure why that matters. If TJ didn't exist, those students would presumably be spread about the remaining FFX high schools, applying from those high schools, and gaining admission. (And if you are the one arguing that FFX deserves "more" because it pays more taxes, I'll note that parents who send their kids to TJ or to private schools pay taxes just like every other FFX resident does.)

But luckily, this information is available on-line, so we needn't speculate. In fact, according to the VA Council on Higher Education, though it is true that "only" 692 students from FFX enrolled at UVA for the 2015-2016 school year, 1,129 FFX residents were **accepted** for that year, out of 2,696 applicants. So 41.9% of applicants from FFX were admitted.

But you are concerned about TJ and private schools, so let's look at Arlington, since there appear to be more complete data on APS on-line (via Arlington Magazine) than for other counties.

From the Virginia Council of Higher education, the data on UVA students from Arlington County:

http://research.schev.edu/enrollment/b8_admissions_locality.asp

2015-2016--335 applied, 152 accepted (45.4%), 76 enrolled (yield= 50%)
2014-2015--320/124 (38.7%), 74 enrolled (59.7%)
2013-2014--296/136 (45.9%), 64 enrolled (47.1%)
2012-2013--298/122 (40.9%), 64 enrolled (52.5%)
2011-2012--255/117 (45.9%), 63 enrolled (53.8%)

(Note that these numbers do not suggest a pattern of declining admission rates from Arlington County.)

Of course, as you pointed out, a couple of these kids might have gone to TJ (although not that many from Arlington), and certainly some are in private school, and some may be homeschooled. So let's use the information that APS reports to Arlington Magazine to see what's going on with the Arlington public school students.

http://www.arlingtonmagazine.com/top-15-where-arlington-grads-were-accepted-to-college/9/

In 2015, 297 students from HB Woodlawn, Wakefield, Washington-Lee, and Yorktown high schools applied to UVA. So 88.6% of the 335 applications to UVA in 2015 were from students who graduated from APS. Of those 297 students, 117 were accepted, for an acceptance rate of 39.4%. (Mathematically, that means that the acceptance rate for the 11% of Arlington County applicants to UVA that did not go to APS--the TJ and private school and homeschool grads--was 92%.)

Let's look at W&M. The data from the Virginia Council of Higher Education:

2015-2016--276 applied, 144 accepted (52.2%), 58 enrolled (yield = 40.3%)
2014-2015--231/103 (44.6%), 45 enrolled (43.7%)
2013-2014--235/122 (51.9%), 47 enrolled (38.5%)
2012-2013--218/103 (47.2%), 40 enrolled (38.8%)
2011-2012--209/107 (51.2%), 44 enrolled (41.1%)

As with UVA, there is no apparent pattern of declining admission rates from Arlington County.

Now let's see what the data are for the Arlington County students who actually went to APS. In 2015, 242 students from the 4 APS high schools applied to W&M; so 87.6% of Arlington applicants to W&M were APS students. Of those 242 students, 117 were accepted (same number as were accepted by UVA that year), for an acceptance rate of 48.3%. Let's let that sink in: ALMOST ONE HALF of the students graduating from Arlington Public Schools who applied to W&M were accepted in 2015. (Mathematically, that means the acceptance rate for the 12% of Arlington County applicants to W&M that did not go to APS was 79%.)

Conclusion: Your statements aren't supported by the data.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Robinson had 700+ seniors this year. 156 IB Diploma candidates. @45 UVA acceptances and @35 are going.

Totally reasonable

says you. based on what?

Anyone who gets an IB diploma has done some serious work. I would expect to see higher than 30% accepted from that group. But, I guess we don't know from what was posted how many actually applied.

IB full diploma is very impressive. But, Two things. Not every IB diploma candidate makes it through. And (even more shocking), not every kid wants to attend UVA. In fact, I would think WM would appeal more to many of these kids. You need the applied vs accepted numbers for kids who ultimately get the full diploma to make sense of the data.

There is nothing special about IB diploma students. Many have average SAT/ACT scores and are lucky to get into JMU/GMU/VCU.

Well, that's a bit snarky.

Actually, this years class was exceptional. I think at graduation they said with 156 Diploma candidates, it was the largest and most successful IB program in the country. This class sent at least one student to each Ivy, a few to Stanford, Duke, Vandy, NYU, Berkley, Michigan, MIT, Chicago, Rice, NW, the military academies and a variety of International universities in Europe. As for stats, I can only speak for my DC, who had over 1500 on the SAT and an UW 4.0, W 4.7 gpa, over 300 hours of community service, multiple varsity sports, leadership positions and a part time job.

It was an awful grind to complete all the requirements for the full diploma. Kudos to any of the kids who make the effort.

They can make the effort, but the majority are still not UVA-quality students.

That's debatable. I think the more impressive thing is how successful the IB program is at Robinson. I always hear about Marshall and South Lakes on this board, but it's interesting how little we hear from people about Robinson. It sounds like it's sort of the best of the bunch when it comes to being an IB school in a middle class area.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Bottom line: UVA and W&M affirmatively do not want NOVA applicants or students. They want NOVA tax revenue, but those of us that live here are poison and are to be avoided. A GPA barely above a B+ from a school in seven central Virginia counties, together with standardized test scores in roughly the 75+ percentile, is enough for UVA, from that locality. The NOVA requirements are dramatically higher. UVA and W&M demand, receive, hold, and expend public funds. But they do NOT equally accommodate VA resident applicants by any measure.

Completely and verifiably UNTRUE. UVA's class of 2020 has 1130 students from Northern Virginia out of a class of 3720 (source: http://admission.virginia.edu/uva-admission-quotas-northern-virginia). UVA accepted 224 kids from my D's Northern VA HS last year (TJ).

Read this blog from UVA admissions for more info on how UVA selects its student body: http://uvaapplication.blogspot.com/

Uh, please. Even if true, it is TJ STUDENTS! They were self-selected into four years ago! You CANNOT compare TJ results to any other public school in NOVA, even FCPS! Langley and McLean send only a dozen or so out of classes of 500! This is what NOVA parents are upset about (if you at a TJ parent, then this is not your world). Only 663 students from Fairfax Country for class of 2020. Just in FCPS there are 33 high schools. And UVA has to also account for VA residents who are at private day schools in MD and D.C. as well as elite boarding schools. Sure, if you are at TJ you have a reasonable shot of getting in - put you've already won the sweepstakes four years ago. If my B+ student at McLean High School wants to apply, forget it. Not going to happen

677 kids from Fairfax County enrolled for the class of 2020. UVA's yield is approx 43% so that extrapolates into about 1575 acceptances for Fairfax County resident students (though granted in state yield could be higher).

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I thought Virginia Tech was a welding school?

I'd be disgusted if my kid had to go there.

Really-- it's engineering school is ranked 16th, and it is a top 10 school in civil, industrial, biological and environmental engineering. Definately a contender for my TJ kid who is applying to environmental engineering programs (where VT ranks 6th). Can't beat the price for kid who will probably also have to think about grad school costs. And in several areas, can't beat the educational quality. Certainly beats UVA in engineering. So, you do you. The state welders school is my kid's safety though. (And my kid has no intention of applying to UVA. Too big. Too weak in engineering. Hates the rich frat boy vibe).

Please don't feed the trolls.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Bottom line: UVA and W&M affirmatively do not want NOVA applicants or students. They want NOVA tax revenue, but those of us that live here are poison and are to be avoided. A GPA barely above a B+ from a school in seven central Virginia counties, together with standardized test scores in roughly the 75+ percentile, is enough for UVA, from that locality. The NOVA requirements are dramatically higher. UVA and W&M demand, receive, hold, and expend public funds. But they do NOT equally accommodate VA resident applicants by any measure.

Completely and verifiably UNTRUE. UVA's class of 2020 has 1130 students from Northern Virginia out of a class of 3720 (source: http://admission.virginia.edu/uva-admission-quotas-northern-virginia). UVA accepted 224 kids from my D's Northern VA HS last year (TJ).

Read this blog from UVA admissions for more info on how UVA selects its student body: http://uvaapplication.blogspot.com/

Uh, please. Even if true, it is TJ STUDENTS! They were self-selected into four years ago! You CANNOT compare TJ results to any other public school in NOVA, even FCPS! Langley and McLean send only a dozen or so out of classes of 500! This is what NOVA parents are upset about (if you at a TJ parent, then this is not your world). Only 663 students from Fairfax Country for class of 2020. Just in FCPS there are 33 high schools. And UVA has to also account for VA residents who are at private day schools in MD and D.C. as well as elite boarding schools. Sure, if you are at TJ you have a reasonable shot of getting in - put you've already won the sweepstakes four years ago. If my B+ student at McLean High School wants to apply, forget it. Not going to happen

UVA was a safety school for the top TJ kids, not so much for the rest. 124 were rejected last year, 81 decided to attend. This year 66 decided to attend. I think the drop off is due to the
changed admissions policy that resulted in http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/one-third-of-tj-freshmen-need-math-science-remediation/article/623696

These kids are now graduating.