Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, you are hostile and uncooperative. You need to find a way to work with him and communicate with him for your children's sake. If you want to use their rooms as an excuse so they cannot have overnights or visits, that's hurting your kids.

Send him to pottery barn, crate and barrell or a company with free design services and tell him schedule an in-person or online appointment and they can guide him and the kids through choosing furniture, bedding, etc. Tell him the kids sizes and what stores to take them to. Its about your kids not you.

My husband's ex was horribly hostile to him and used the kids to get at him. (she had the affair, not him, he tried to stay for the kids and ignore it). He's a great husband and father, but even with our kids, he has no clue the sizes and other things as we divide and conquer on who does what and I do the shopping for everyone including him. Could he figure it out, sure, but at this point, so could my teens but I would help for our kids sake. I've seen the outcome of parents fighting and one keeping the other parent from the kids. None of his adults kids are in healthy relationships or stable. One is going through their own terrible divorce and he's in a horrific custody battle with a woman exactly like his mom.

No she isn’t. Take your issues to your own thread and stop projecting them onto OP. She is under no obligation to decorate her ex husband’s house.

—NP

You don’t get it and that’s why you are divorced. It’s not about him, it’s about the kids and supporting them. This will have a long term impact on the kids and how you behave now the kids will model later on and that’s the point. They will repeat this in their own lives. If you love your kids, you do things you don’t want to for their sake.

Yes, this is exactly the point - but not in the way that you think, PP. Part of divorce, is being a role model for your children about setting healthy boundaries. My exH never took physical custody of our kids even though he was offered 50/50. He did have them for visitation, but never bought housing with separate bedrooms for them even though he could afford it, and never even bought them beds for any room in his house. He chose to send them the message that he didn't want to make an effort for them and as a result they did not spend a lot of time there.

It was really important that I show them that it was OK to set boundaries, by modeling that in my own behavior. No, after divorce, it was absolutely not my job to encourage or make him take custody or get them beds. But, I did get them a therapist with whom they could discuss their feelings about this and who could help them express their needs directly to him. I wanted to teach my daughter that no spouse or partner has a right to her labor, and that it is OK to say "no" to unreasonable demands, especially for things that people can do for themselves. And, I definitely didn't want to teach my son that he had a right to use someone else like his dad seemed to feel free to use me. I was always very polite to their dad, but not a pushover. Now they are grown-ups and TBH, I think they feel like I was too nice to their dad. Out of their own direct experiences with him they came to see him as an unreliable guy who wasn't able to care for them properly and never really had their best interests at heart. That's sad, but it's not something I can fix or control, and the amount of effort I would have put in (and did put in when we were together) to help him and cover for him so he could look like a great dad was effort that would have been better invested in myself and my relationship with my kids.

OP should grey or yellow rock her DH and engage in parallel parenting. If he has been abusive in any way, she can have all communication go through attorneys and any parental coordination can be done in writing through third party apps. She should focus on herself and her relationship with the kids and let her husband focus on himself and his relationship with the kids. Be cordial if you must be together for family or school events, but it's OK to keep it brief and polite.

We aren’t talking about your ex and sometimes you have to do things for the kids sake and take the high road. Marriage and coparenting are a partnership.

Marriage and coparenting may be a partnership, but divorce is not. Divorce is by definition about ending the partnership. Divorce is about drawing boundaries for the sake of your own health and safety and that of your kids. Divorce is about each party becoming independent and responsible for his/her 50% of a child’s care and 100% responsible for his/her own relationship with the kids.

Yes, often you have to do things for the kid’s sake. Propping up a Potemkin parent isn’t a service to the child: it’s a service to the spouse who can’t or won’t parent. Better to let them figure it out and succeed or fail on their own. Rescuing is infantilizing.

Coparenting is a form of partnership and you do it for your kids best interests. You probably set him up to fail and refuse to let him see the kids and find all kinds of excuses why. It’s not about the kids for you, it’s about you. You cannot have a relationship as a noncustodial parent if the other parent refuses or sabotages you.

Your agenda is weird and obvious. You could continue your argument into eternity that OP should assume every parenting duty in both her house and her ex's "for the sake of the kids", and vilify her if she didn't. But a ex who requests custody has to parent, actively, that means everything from buying furniture to doing pickup after basketball practice. And no, he doesn't get to keep custody, offload it onto her, and then have you come on here accusing her of not putting the kids first. It's such an old, sexist argument.

Op should give him half the kids stuff and replace it. Why is he the only one? Why can’t she?

Actually in my state and I assume many others, kids’ stuff apart from furniture is not considered marital property to be divided and it’s a legal gray area. But regardless of that fact, if there isn’t a final settlement he cannot legally take property out of the marital home without temporary orders. He could ask for it and she could agree, but it sounds like he has had many months to do so and has not. He could also file for temporary orders to get whatever furniture or furnishings he wants if she was reluctant to provide them. Unfortunately there are no magical legal orders that can force him to take stuff or furnish space for their children, and it sounds like that’s the situation OP and her kids are in.

This is a classic case of “if he wanted to, he would.”

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:When my brother got divorced, he needed to set up a whole rental house and “house stuff” is not his thing at all. Our family helped a lot - it is a lot of work and takes a certain level of knowledge and skill. You have to make 1003 decisions. But he very much wanted the kid spaces especially to be set up for them to be comfortable and feel at home and he knew he needed to ask for help.

It’s not just a money thing. An expensive dresser that is the wrong size is much worse than an ikea one that fits. Hanging pictures, painting, the right size rug - all that stuff is not intuitive to everyone. Having extra mattress pads. Hooks in the right places. The kind of towels and shampoo the kids are used to. All that sort of thing.

lol. What woman would ever say “house stuff” was not her thing and that she could not set up a space for her own children without extensive assistance?

Op kept everything….

OP did not “keep” anything. Her ex moved out and the property division is still in progress. Her ex will get his fair share of their property eventually. In the meantime it is his responsibility to set up a household for his kids. This is just one of the consequences of divorce. If you are suggesting that she simply pack up half the furniture and send it to his house - that’s really a bad idea.

If he’s waiting for his share, then that includes half the kids stuff and furniture.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, you are hostile and uncooperative. You need to find a way to work with him and communicate with him for your children's sake. If you want to use their rooms as an excuse so they cannot have overnights or visits, that's hurting your kids.

Send him to pottery barn, crate and barrell or a company with free design services and tell him schedule an in-person or online appointment and they can guide him and the kids through choosing furniture, bedding, etc. Tell him the kids sizes and what stores to take them to. Its about your kids not you.

My husband's ex was horribly hostile to him and used the kids to get at him. (she had the affair, not him, he tried to stay for the kids and ignore it). He's a great husband and father, but even with our kids, he has no clue the sizes and other things as we divide and conquer on who does what and I do the shopping for everyone including him. Could he figure it out, sure, but at this point, so could my teens but I would help for our kids sake. I've seen the outcome of parents fighting and one keeping the other parent from the kids. None of his adults kids are in healthy relationships or stable. One is going through their own terrible divorce and he's in a horrific custody battle with a woman exactly like his mom.

No she isn’t. Take your issues to your own thread and stop projecting them onto OP. She is under no obligation to decorate her ex husband’s house.

—NP

You don’t get it and that’s why you are divorced. It’s not about him, it’s about the kids and supporting them. This will have a long term impact on the kids and how you behave now the kids will model later on and that’s the point. They will repeat this in their own lives. If you love your kids, you do things you don’t want to for their sake.

Yes, this is exactly the point - but not in the way that you think, PP. Part of divorce, is being a role model for your children about setting healthy boundaries. My exH never took physical custody of our kids even though he was offered 50/50. He did have them for visitation, but never bought housing with separate bedrooms for them even though he could afford it, and never even bought them beds for any room in his house. He chose to send them the message that he didn't want to make an effort for them and as a result they did not spend a lot of time there.

It was really important that I show them that it was OK to set boundaries, by modeling that in my own behavior. No, after divorce, it was absolutely not my job to encourage or make him take custody or get them beds. But, I did get them a therapist with whom they could discuss their feelings about this and who could help them express their needs directly to him. I wanted to teach my daughter that no spouse or partner has a right to her labor, and that it is OK to say "no" to unreasonable demands, especially for things that people can do for themselves. And, I definitely didn't want to teach my son that he had a right to use someone else like his dad seemed to feel free to use me. I was always very polite to their dad, but not a pushover. Now they are grown-ups and TBH, I think they feel like I was too nice to their dad. Out of their own direct experiences with him they came to see him as an unreliable guy who wasn't able to care for them properly and never really had their best interests at heart. That's sad, but it's not something I can fix or control, and the amount of effort I would have put in (and did put in when we were together) to help him and cover for him so he could look like a great dad was effort that would have been better invested in myself and my relationship with my kids.

OP should grey or yellow rock her DH and engage in parallel parenting. If he has been abusive in any way, she can have all communication go through attorneys and any parental coordination can be done in writing through third party apps. She should focus on herself and her relationship with the kids and let her husband focus on himself and his relationship with the kids. Be cordial if you must be together for family or school events, but it's OK to keep it brief and polite.

We aren’t talking about your ex and sometimes you have to do things for the kids sake and take the high road. Marriage and coparenting are a partnership.

Marriage and coparenting may be a partnership, but divorce is not. Divorce is by definition about ending the partnership. Divorce is about drawing boundaries for the sake of your own health and safety and that of your kids. Divorce is about each party becoming independent and responsible for his/her 50% of a child’s care and 100% responsible for his/her own relationship with the kids.

Yes, often you have to do things for the kid’s sake. Propping up a Potemkin parent isn’t a service to the child: it’s a service to the spouse who can’t or won’t parent. Better to let them figure it out and succeed or fail on their own. Rescuing is infantilizing.

Coparenting is a form of partnership and you do it for your kids best interests. You probably set him up to fail and refuse to let him see the kids and find all kinds of excuses why. It’s not about the kids for you, it’s about you. You cannot have a relationship as a noncustodial parent if the other parent refuses or sabotages you.

Your agenda is weird and obvious. You could continue your argument into eternity that OP should assume every parenting duty in both her house and her ex's "for the sake of the kids", and vilify her if she didn't. But a ex who requests custody has to parent, actively, that means everything from buying furniture to doing pickup after basketball practice. And no, he doesn't get to keep custody, offload it onto her, and then have you come on here accusing her of not putting the kids first. It's such an old, sexist argument.

Op should give him half the kids stuff and replace it. Why is he the only one? Why can’t she?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, you are hostile and uncooperative. You need to find a way to work with him and communicate with him for your children's sake. If you want to use their rooms as an excuse so they cannot have overnights or visits, that's hurting your kids.

Send him to pottery barn, crate and barrell or a company with free design services and tell him schedule an in-person or online appointment and they can guide him and the kids through choosing furniture, bedding, etc. Tell him the kids sizes and what stores to take them to. Its about your kids not you.

My husband's ex was horribly hostile to him and used the kids to get at him. (she had the affair, not him, he tried to stay for the kids and ignore it). He's a great husband and father, but even with our kids, he has no clue the sizes and other things as we divide and conquer on who does what and I do the shopping for everyone including him. Could he figure it out, sure, but at this point, so could my teens but I would help for our kids sake. I've seen the outcome of parents fighting and one keeping the other parent from the kids. None of his adults kids are in healthy relationships or stable. One is going through their own terrible divorce and he's in a horrific custody battle with a woman exactly like his mom.

No she isn’t. Take your issues to your own thread and stop projecting them onto OP. She is under no obligation to decorate her ex husband’s house.

—NP

You don’t get it and that’s why you are divorced. It’s not about him, it’s about the kids and supporting them. This will have a long term impact on the kids and how you behave now the kids will model later on and that’s the point. They will repeat this in their own lives. If you love your kids, you do things you don’t want to for their sake.

Yes, this is exactly the point - but not in the way that you think, PP. Part of divorce, is being a role model for your children about setting healthy boundaries. My exH never took physical custody of our kids even though he was offered 50/50. He did have them for visitation, but never bought housing with separate bedrooms for them even though he could afford it, and never even bought them beds for any room in his house. He chose to send them the message that he didn't want to make an effort for them and as a result they did not spend a lot of time there.

It was really important that I show them that it was OK to set boundaries, by modeling that in my own behavior. No, after divorce, it was absolutely not my job to encourage or make him take custody or get them beds. But, I did get them a therapist with whom they could discuss their feelings about this and who could help them express their needs directly to him. I wanted to teach my daughter that no spouse or partner has a right to her labor, and that it is OK to say "no" to unreasonable demands, especially for things that people can do for themselves. And, I definitely didn't want to teach my son that he had a right to use someone else like his dad seemed to feel free to use me. I was always very polite to their dad, but not a pushover. Now they are grown-ups and TBH, I think they feel like I was too nice to their dad. Out of their own direct experiences with him they came to see him as an unreliable guy who wasn't able to care for them properly and never really had their best interests at heart. That's sad, but it's not something I can fix or control, and the amount of effort I would have put in (and did put in when we were together) to help him and cover for him so he could look like a great dad was effort that would have been better invested in myself and my relationship with my kids.

OP should grey or yellow rock her DH and engage in parallel parenting. If he has been abusive in any way, she can have all communication go through attorneys and any parental coordination can be done in writing through third party apps. She should focus on herself and her relationship with the kids and let her husband focus on himself and his relationship with the kids. Be cordial if you must be together for family or school events, but it's OK to keep it brief and polite.

We aren’t talking about your ex and sometimes you have to do things for the kids sake and take the high road. Marriage and coparenting are a partnership.

Marriage and coparenting may be a partnership, but divorce is not. Divorce is by definition about ending the partnership. Divorce is about drawing boundaries for the sake of your own health and safety and that of your kids. Divorce is about each party becoming independent and responsible for his/her 50% of a child’s care and 100% responsible for his/her own relationship with the kids.

Yes, often you have to do things for the kid’s sake. Propping up a Potemkin parent isn’t a service to the child: it’s a service to the spouse who can’t or won’t parent. Better to let them figure it out and succeed or fail on their own. Rescuing is infantilizing.

Coparenting is a form of partnership and you do it for your kids best interests. You probably set him up to fail and refuse to let him see the kids and find all kinds of excuses why. It’s not about the kids for you, it’s about you. You cannot have a relationship as a noncustodial parent if the other parent refuses or sabotages you.

Your agenda is weird and obvious. You could continue your argument into eternity that OP should assume every parenting duty in both her house and her ex's "for the sake of the kids", and vilify her if she didn't. But a ex who requests custody has to parent, actively, that means everything from buying furniture to doing pickup after basketball practice. And no, he doesn't get to keep custody, offload it onto her, and then have you come on here accusing her of not putting the kids first. It's such an old, sexist argument.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:When my brother got divorced, he needed to set up a whole rental house and “house stuff” is not his thing at all. Our family helped a lot - it is a lot of work and takes a certain level of knowledge and skill. You have to make 1003 decisions. But he very much wanted the kid spaces especially to be set up for them to be comfortable and feel at home and he knew he needed to ask for help.

It’s not just a money thing. An expensive dresser that is the wrong size is much worse than an ikea one that fits. Hanging pictures, painting, the right size rug - all that stuff is not intuitive to everyone. Having extra mattress pads. Hooks in the right places. The kind of towels and shampoo the kids are used to. All that sort of thing.

lol. What woman would ever say “house stuff” was not her thing and that she could not set up a space for her own children without extensive assistance?

Op kept everything….

OP did not “keep” anything. Her ex moved out and the property division is still in progress. Her ex will get his fair share of their property eventually. In the meantime it is his responsibility to set up a household for his kids. This is just one of the consequences of divorce. If you are suggesting that she simply pack up half the furniture and send it to his house - that’s really a bad idea.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, you are hostile and uncooperative. You need to find a way to work with him and communicate with him for your children's sake. If you want to use their rooms as an excuse so they cannot have overnights or visits, that's hurting your kids.

Send him to pottery barn, crate and barrell or a company with free design services and tell him schedule an in-person or online appointment and they can guide him and the kids through choosing furniture, bedding, etc. Tell him the kids sizes and what stores to take them to. Its about your kids not you.

My husband's ex was horribly hostile to him and used the kids to get at him. (she had the affair, not him, he tried to stay for the kids and ignore it). He's a great husband and father, but even with our kids, he has no clue the sizes and other things as we divide and conquer on who does what and I do the shopping for everyone including him. Could he figure it out, sure, but at this point, so could my teens but I would help for our kids sake. I've seen the outcome of parents fighting and one keeping the other parent from the kids. None of his adults kids are in healthy relationships or stable. One is going through their own terrible divorce and he's in a horrific custody battle with a woman exactly like his mom.

No she isn’t. Take your issues to your own thread and stop projecting them onto OP. She is under no obligation to decorate her ex husband’s house.

—NP

You don’t get it and that’s why you are divorced. It’s not about him, it’s about the kids and supporting them. This will have a long term impact on the kids and how you behave now the kids will model later on and that’s the point. They will repeat this in their own lives. If you love your kids, you do things you don’t want to for their sake.

Yes, this is exactly the point - but not in the way that you think, PP. Part of divorce, is being a role model for your children about setting healthy boundaries. My exH never took physical custody of our kids even though he was offered 50/50. He did have them for visitation, but never bought housing with separate bedrooms for them even though he could afford it, and never even bought them beds for any room in his house. He chose to send them the message that he didn't want to make an effort for them and as a result they did not spend a lot of time there.

It was really important that I show them that it was OK to set boundaries, by modeling that in my own behavior. No, after divorce, it was absolutely not my job to encourage or make him take custody or get them beds. But, I did get them a therapist with whom they could discuss their feelings about this and who could help them express their needs directly to him. I wanted to teach my daughter that no spouse or partner has a right to her labor, and that it is OK to say "no" to unreasonable demands, especially for things that people can do for themselves. And, I definitely didn't want to teach my son that he had a right to use someone else like his dad seemed to feel free to use me. I was always very polite to their dad, but not a pushover. Now they are grown-ups and TBH, I think they feel like I was too nice to their dad. Out of their own direct experiences with him they came to see him as an unreliable guy who wasn't able to care for them properly and never really had their best interests at heart. That's sad, but it's not something I can fix or control, and the amount of effort I would have put in (and did put in when we were together) to help him and cover for him so he could look like a great dad was effort that would have been better invested in myself and my relationship with my kids.

OP should grey or yellow rock her DH and engage in parallel parenting. If he has been abusive in any way, she can have all communication go through attorneys and any parental coordination can be done in writing through third party apps. She should focus on herself and her relationship with the kids and let her husband focus on himself and his relationship with the kids. Be cordial if you must be together for family or school events, but it's OK to keep it brief and polite.

We aren’t talking about your ex and sometimes you have to do things for the kids sake and take the high road. Marriage and coparenting are a partnership.

Marriage and coparenting may be a partnership, but divorce is not. Divorce is by definition about ending the partnership. Divorce is about drawing boundaries for the sake of your own health and safety and that of your kids. Divorce is about each party becoming independent and responsible for his/her 50% of a child’s care and 100% responsible for his/her own relationship with the kids.

Yes, often you have to do things for the kid’s sake. Propping up a Potemkin parent isn’t a service to the child: it’s a service to the spouse who can’t or won’t parent. Better to let them figure it out and succeed or fail on their own. Rescuing is infantilizing.

Coparenting is a form of partnership and you do it for your kids best interests. You probably set him up to fail and refuse to let him see the kids and find all kinds of excuses why. It’s not about the kids for you, it’s about you. You cannot have a relationship as a noncustodial parent if the other parent refuses or sabotages you.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Update: we are both undergoing home observations and the kids had to do theirs at their dad’s last week. Apparently he hadn’t changed or added anything. The kids were asked to give a house tour. One of them tried to show off the cool sink in the downstairs bathroom but hit the pantry and hall closet first, oops.

They got upstairs and the person conducting the observation questioned them when the youngest said “actually we don’t know which rooms are ours or if we have rooms”. Not sure what the response to that was or how the house was assessed.

I think that ultimately I’m being scrutinized closely and expected to have everything just-right at my house, and STBX is being given credit for having a house with a roof. Lesson learned.

Kids were disappointed because they thought that maybe they would have rooms all filled up with surprises in time for the observation like some kind of sad divorce HGTV show.

For the kids sake. You could have helped. This is pure cruel to the kids. Both of you are the problem.

Thanks for your input but it’s pretty hard to help a man who can’t even respond to a simple message of whether or not he wants to see his kids. If I’m going to push and use an attorney’s assistance to get communication from him it’s going to be about whether he is available to see our children next week, not about whether a bedroom theme should be Harry Potter or Hello Kitty.

Do a set schedule. Why all the drama?

DP. OP has not explained all the details of the divorce proceedings. It sounds like they are both taking maximalist positions instead of offering reasonable schedules. Not to say this is necessarily OP’s fault but I wonder what would happen if she offered something reasonable like 2 nights/week. Strongly suspect a guy like her ex would take it. OP may not be able to let go and accept he will get significant custody though. I have seen this happen - a woman fighting tooth and nail for years now and the dad likely going to end up with something she could have offered him on day 1 that he would have taken. She is convinced he is a bad father and will take any small incident to prove it (despite the fact that her kids are VERY challenging so it’s pretty much assured that there will be issues). She truly believed that she could change her ex via the court system, and when that did not work, that she could just get full custody. From my perspective this has just greatly dragged out the kids’ adjustment and obviously destroyed any ability to coparent well. He was a sh*t partner but a good dad (albeit with different parenting values from her).

She’s not trying to change him, she’s setting him up to fail to get full custody and no contact. Child support goes by time share. No visits, more money. It’s not about the kids or her needs. If the rooms are stressing the kids, she’d help to make them more comfortable. She’s setting it up for everyone to fail not caring about the trauma it’s causing for the kids as she’s rationalizing it as he’s bad and unworthy. No matter what, he is still the kids dad and the behavior from the parents has a long term impact on the kids.

She's "setting him up to fail" by not furnishing the kids' rooms at his house? Are you remotely serious? Is she setting him up to fail if she doesn't also come over and cook, fold their laundry, and put them to bed in his house? At what point do you feel their dad should assume parenting responsibilities in his home?

Usually one person in the house handles those things. My spouse wouldn't set up our kids rooms as I handle it and our kids would prefer I do as I'd take the time to get it exactly right. If you care about your kids/step-kids sometimes you do things not because you want to or easier on the other parent but becuase its for the kids. See how that works. You cannot complain if you are not willing to be part of the solution and you are hurting your kids, not him.

Right, and so the person who doesn't handle kid stuff like that should not have custody, just visitation. You can't just demand 50 50 custody but also insist your ex spouse handle the parenting. You have to be the sole parent during your custody time and handle everything including housing and their rooms.

Kids are barely there. He may figure there is no need to set it up till he gets more time.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Update: we are both undergoing home observations and the kids had to do theirs at their dad’s last week. Apparently he hadn’t changed or added anything. The kids were asked to give a house tour. One of them tried to show off the cool sink in the downstairs bathroom but hit the pantry and hall closet first, oops.

They got upstairs and the person conducting the observation questioned them when the youngest said “actually we don’t know which rooms are ours or if we have rooms”. Not sure what the response to that was or how the house was assessed.

I think that ultimately I’m being scrutinized closely and expected to have everything just-right at my house, and STBX is being given credit for having a house with a roof. Lesson learned.

Kids were disappointed because they thought that maybe they would have rooms all filled up with surprises in time for the observation like some kind of sad divorce HGTV show.

For the kids sake. You could have helped. This is pure cruel to the kids. Both of you are the problem.

Thanks for your input but it’s pretty hard to help a man who can’t even respond to a simple message of whether or not he wants to see his kids. If I’m going to push and use an attorney’s assistance to get communication from him it’s going to be about whether he is available to see our children next week, not about whether a bedroom theme should be Harry Potter or Hello Kitty.

Do a set schedule. Why all the drama?

DP. OP has not explained all the details of the divorce proceedings. It sounds like they are both taking maximalist positions instead of offering reasonable schedules. Not to say this is necessarily OP’s fault but I wonder what would happen if she offered something reasonable like 2 nights/week. Strongly suspect a guy like her ex would take it. OP may not be able to let go and accept he will get significant custody though. I have seen this happen - a woman fighting tooth and nail for years now and the dad likely going to end up with something she could have offered him on day 1 that he would have taken. She is convinced he is a bad father and will take any small incident to prove it (despite the fact that her kids are VERY challenging so it’s pretty much assured that there will be issues). She truly believed that she could change her ex via the court system, and when that did not work, that she could just get full custody. From my perspective this has just greatly dragged out the kids’ adjustment and obviously destroyed any ability to coparent well. He was a sh*t partner but a good dad (albeit with different parenting values from her).

She’s not trying to change him, she’s setting him up to fail to get full custody and no contact. Child support goes by time share. No visits, more money. It’s not about the kids or her needs. If the rooms are stressing the kids, she’d help to make them more comfortable. She’s setting it up for everyone to fail not caring about the trauma it’s causing for the kids as she’s rationalizing it as he’s bad and unworthy. No matter what, he is still the kids dad and the behavior from the parents has a long term impact on the kids.

She's "setting him up to fail" by not furnishing the kids' rooms at his house? Are you remotely serious? Is she setting him up to fail if she doesn't also come over and cook, fold their laundry, and put them to bed in his house? At what point do you feel their dad should assume parenting responsibilities in his home?

Usually one person in the house handles those things. My spouse wouldn't set up our kids rooms as I handle it and our kids would prefer I do as I'd take the time to get it exactly right. If you care about your kids/step-kids sometimes you do things not because you want to or easier on the other parent but becuase its for the kids. See how that works. You cannot complain if you are not willing to be part of the solution and you are hurting your kids, not him.

Right, and so the person who doesn't handle kid stuff like that should not have custody, just visitation. You can't just demand 50 50 custody but also insist your ex spouse handle the parenting. You have to be the sole parent during your custody time and handle everything including housing and their rooms.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Update: we are both undergoing home observations and the kids had to do theirs at their dad’s last week. Apparently he hadn’t changed or added anything. The kids were asked to give a house tour. One of them tried to show off the cool sink in the downstairs bathroom but hit the pantry and hall closet first, oops.

They got upstairs and the person conducting the observation questioned them when the youngest said “actually we don’t know which rooms are ours or if we have rooms”. Not sure what the response to that was or how the house was assessed.

I think that ultimately I’m being scrutinized closely and expected to have everything just-right at my house, and STBX is being given credit for having a house with a roof. Lesson learned.

Kids were disappointed because they thought that maybe they would have rooms all filled up with surprises in time for the observation like some kind of sad divorce HGTV show.

For the kids sake. You could have helped. This is pure cruel to the kids. Both of you are the problem.

Thanks for your input but it’s pretty hard to help a man who can’t even respond to a simple message of whether or not he wants to see his kids. If I’m going to push and use an attorney’s assistance to get communication from him it’s going to be about whether he is available to see our children next week, not about whether a bedroom theme should be Harry Potter or Hello Kitty.

Do a set schedule. Why all the drama?

DP. OP has not explained all the details of the divorce proceedings. It sounds like they are both taking maximalist positions instead of offering reasonable schedules. Not to say this is necessarily OP’s fault but I wonder what would happen if she offered something reasonable like 2 nights/week. Strongly suspect a guy like her ex would take it. OP may not be able to let go and accept he will get significant custody though. I have seen this happen - a woman fighting tooth and nail for years now and the dad likely going to end up with something she could have offered him on day 1 that he would have taken. She is convinced he is a bad father and will take any small incident to prove it (despite the fact that her kids are VERY challenging so it’s pretty much assured that there will be issues). She truly believed that she could change her ex via the court system, and when that did not work, that she could just get full custody. From my perspective this has just greatly dragged out the kids’ adjustment and obviously destroyed any ability to coparent well. He was a sh*t partner but a good dad (albeit with different parenting values from her).

She’s not trying to change him, she’s setting him up to fail to get full custody and no contact. Child support goes by time share. No visits, more money. It’s not about the kids or her needs. If the rooms are stressing the kids, she’d help to make them more comfortable. She’s setting it up for everyone to fail not caring about the trauma it’s causing for the kids as she’s rationalizing it as he’s bad and unworthy. No matter what, he is still the kids dad and the behavior from the parents has a long term impact on the kids.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, you are hostile and uncooperative. You need to find a way to work with him and communicate with him for your children's sake. If you want to use their rooms as an excuse so they cannot have overnights or visits, that's hurting your kids.

Send him to pottery barn, crate and barrell or a company with free design services and tell him schedule an in-person or online appointment and they can guide him and the kids through choosing furniture, bedding, etc. Tell him the kids sizes and what stores to take them to. Its about your kids not you.

My husband's ex was horribly hostile to him and used the kids to get at him. (she had the affair, not him, he tried to stay for the kids and ignore it). He's a great husband and father, but even with our kids, he has no clue the sizes and other things as we divide and conquer on who does what and I do the shopping for everyone including him. Could he figure it out, sure, but at this point, so could my teens but I would help for our kids sake. I've seen the outcome of parents fighting and one keeping the other parent from the kids. None of his adults kids are in healthy relationships or stable. One is going through their own terrible divorce and he's in a horrific custody battle with a woman exactly like his mom.

No she isn’t. Take your issues to your own thread and stop projecting them onto OP. She is under no obligation to decorate her ex husband’s house.

—NP

You don’t get it and that’s why you are divorced. It’s not about him, it’s about the kids and supporting them. This will have a long term impact on the kids and how you behave now the kids will model later on and that’s the point. They will repeat this in their own lives. If you love your kids, you do things you don’t want to for their sake.

Yes, this is exactly the point - but not in the way that you think, PP. Part of divorce, is being a role model for your children about setting healthy boundaries. My exH never took physical custody of our kids even though he was offered 50/50. He did have them for visitation, but never bought housing with separate bedrooms for them even though he could afford it, and never even bought them beds for any room in his house. He chose to send them the message that he didn't want to make an effort for them and as a result they did not spend a lot of time there.

It was really important that I show them that it was OK to set boundaries, by modeling that in my own behavior. No, after divorce, it was absolutely not my job to encourage or make him take custody or get them beds. But, I did get them a therapist with whom they could discuss their feelings about this and who could help them express their needs directly to him. I wanted to teach my daughter that no spouse or partner has a right to her labor, and that it is OK to say "no" to unreasonable demands, especially for things that people can do for themselves. And, I definitely didn't want to teach my son that he had a right to use someone else like his dad seemed to feel free to use me. I was always very polite to their dad, but not a pushover. Now they are grown-ups and TBH, I think they feel like I was too nice to their dad. Out of their own direct experiences with him they came to see him as an unreliable guy who wasn't able to care for them properly and never really had their best interests at heart. That's sad, but it's not something I can fix or control, and the amount of effort I would have put in (and did put in when we were together) to help him and cover for him so he could look like a great dad was effort that would have been better invested in myself and my relationship with my kids.

OP should grey or yellow rock her DH and engage in parallel parenting. If he has been abusive in any way, she can have all communication go through attorneys and any parental coordination can be done in writing through third party apps. She should focus on herself and her relationship with the kids and let her husband focus on himself and his relationship with the kids. Be cordial if you must be together for family or school events, but it's OK to keep it brief and polite.

We aren’t talking about your ex and sometimes you have to do things for the kids sake and take the high road. Marriage and coparenting are a partnership.

Marriage and coparenting may be a partnership, but divorce is not. Divorce is by definition about ending the partnership. Divorce is about drawing boundaries for the sake of your own health and safety and that of your kids. Divorce is about each party becoming independent and responsible for his/her 50% of a child’s care and 100% responsible for his/her own relationship with the kids.

Yes, often you have to do things for the kid’s sake. Propping up a Potemkin parent isn’t a service to the child: it’s a service to the spouse who can’t or won’t parent. Better to let them figure it out and succeed or fail on their own. Rescuing is infantilizing.

Coparenting is a form of partnership and you do it for your kids best interests. You probably set him up to fail and refuse to let him see the kids and find all kinds of excuses why. It’s not about the kids for you, it’s about you. You cannot have a relationship as a noncustodial parent if the other parent refuses or sabotages you.

Your agenda is weird and obvious. You could continue your argument into eternity that OP should assume every parenting duty in both her house and her ex's "for the sake of the kids", and vilify her if she didn't. But a ex who requests custody has to parent, actively, that means everything from buying furniture to doing pickup after basketball practice. And no, he doesn't get to keep custody, offload it onto her, and then have you come on here accusing her of not putting the kids first. It's such an old, sexist argument.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, you are hostile and uncooperative. You need to find a way to work with him and communicate with him for your children's sake. If you want to use their rooms as an excuse so they cannot have overnights or visits, that's hurting your kids.

Send him to pottery barn, crate and barrell or a company with free design services and tell him schedule an in-person or online appointment and they can guide him and the kids through choosing furniture, bedding, etc. Tell him the kids sizes and what stores to take them to. Its about your kids not you.

My husband's ex was horribly hostile to him and used the kids to get at him. (she had the affair, not him, he tried to stay for the kids and ignore it). He's a great husband and father, but even with our kids, he has no clue the sizes and other things as we divide and conquer on who does what and I do the shopping for everyone including him. Could he figure it out, sure, but at this point, so could my teens but I would help for our kids sake. I've seen the outcome of parents fighting and one keeping the other parent from the kids. None of his adults kids are in healthy relationships or stable. One is going through their own terrible divorce and he's in a horrific custody battle with a woman exactly like his mom.

No she isn’t. Take your issues to your own thread and stop projecting them onto OP. She is under no obligation to decorate her ex husband’s house.

—NP

You don’t get it and that’s why you are divorced. It’s not about him, it’s about the kids and supporting them. This will have a long term impact on the kids and how you behave now the kids will model later on and that’s the point. They will repeat this in their own lives. If you love your kids, you do things you don’t want to for their sake.

Yes, this is exactly the point - but not in the way that you think, PP. Part of divorce, is being a role model for your children about setting healthy boundaries. My exH never took physical custody of our kids even though he was offered 50/50. He did have them for visitation, but never bought housing with separate bedrooms for them even though he could afford it, and never even bought them beds for any room in his house. He chose to send them the message that he didn't want to make an effort for them and as a result they did not spend a lot of time there.

It was really important that I show them that it was OK to set boundaries, by modeling that in my own behavior. No, after divorce, it was absolutely not my job to encourage or make him take custody or get them beds. But, I did get them a therapist with whom they could discuss their feelings about this and who could help them express their needs directly to him. I wanted to teach my daughter that no spouse or partner has a right to her labor, and that it is OK to say "no" to unreasonable demands, especially for things that people can do for themselves. And, I definitely didn't want to teach my son that he had a right to use someone else like his dad seemed to feel free to use me. I was always very polite to their dad, but not a pushover. Now they are grown-ups and TBH, I think they feel like I was too nice to their dad. Out of their own direct experiences with him they came to see him as an unreliable guy who wasn't able to care for them properly and never really had their best interests at heart. That's sad, but it's not something I can fix or control, and the amount of effort I would have put in (and did put in when we were together) to help him and cover for him so he could look like a great dad was effort that would have been better invested in myself and my relationship with my kids.

OP should grey or yellow rock her DH and engage in parallel parenting. If he has been abusive in any way, she can have all communication go through attorneys and any parental coordination can be done in writing through third party apps. She should focus on herself and her relationship with the kids and let her husband focus on himself and his relationship with the kids. Be cordial if you must be together for family or school events, but it's OK to keep it brief and polite.

We aren’t talking about your ex and sometimes you have to do things for the kids sake and take the high road. Marriage and coparenting are a partnership.

Marriage and coparenting may be a partnership, but divorce is not. Divorce is by definition about ending the partnership. Divorce is about drawing boundaries for the sake of your own health and safety and that of your kids. Divorce is about each party becoming independent and responsible for his/her 50% of a child’s care and 100% responsible for his/her own relationship with the kids.

Yes, often you have to do things for the kid’s sake. Propping up a Potemkin parent isn’t a service to the child: it’s a service to the spouse who can’t or won’t parent. Better to let them figure it out and succeed or fail on their own. Rescuing is infantilizing.

Coparenting is a form of partnership and you do it for your kids best interests. You probably set him up to fail and refuse to let him see the kids and find all kinds of excuses why. It’s not about the kids for you, it’s about you. You cannot have a relationship as a noncustodial parent if the other parent refuses or sabotages you.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, you are hostile and uncooperative. You need to find a way to work with him and communicate with him for your children's sake. If you want to use their rooms as an excuse so they cannot have overnights or visits, that's hurting your kids.

Send him to pottery barn, crate and barrell or a company with free design services and tell him schedule an in-person or online appointment and they can guide him and the kids through choosing furniture, bedding, etc. Tell him the kids sizes and what stores to take them to. Its about your kids not you.

My husband's ex was horribly hostile to him and used the kids to get at him. (she had the affair, not him, he tried to stay for the kids and ignore it). He's a great husband and father, but even with our kids, he has no clue the sizes and other things as we divide and conquer on who does what and I do the shopping for everyone including him. Could he figure it out, sure, but at this point, so could my teens but I would help for our kids sake. I've seen the outcome of parents fighting and one keeping the other parent from the kids. None of his adults kids are in healthy relationships or stable. One is going through their own terrible divorce and he's in a horrific custody battle with a woman exactly like his mom.

No she isn’t. Take your issues to your own thread and stop projecting them onto OP. She is under no obligation to decorate her ex husband’s house.

—NP

You don’t get it and that’s why you are divorced. It’s not about him, it’s about the kids and supporting them. This will have a long term impact on the kids and how you behave now the kids will model later on and that’s the point. They will repeat this in their own lives. If you love your kids, you do things you don’t want to for their sake.

Yes, this is exactly the point - but not in the way that you think, PP. Part of divorce, is being a role model for your children about setting healthy boundaries. My exH never took physical custody of our kids even though he was offered 50/50. He did have them for visitation, but never bought housing with separate bedrooms for them even though he could afford it, and never even bought them beds for any room in his house. He chose to send them the message that he didn't want to make an effort for them and as a result they did not spend a lot of time there.

It was really important that I show them that it was OK to set boundaries, by modeling that in my own behavior. No, after divorce, it was absolutely not my job to encourage or make him take custody or get them beds. But, I did get them a therapist with whom they could discuss their feelings about this and who could help them express their needs directly to him. I wanted to teach my daughter that no spouse or partner has a right to her labor, and that it is OK to say "no" to unreasonable demands, especially for things that people can do for themselves. And, I definitely didn't want to teach my son that he had a right to use someone else like his dad seemed to feel free to use me. I was always very polite to their dad, but not a pushover. Now they are grown-ups and TBH, I think they feel like I was too nice to their dad. Out of their own direct experiences with him they came to see him as an unreliable guy who wasn't able to care for them properly and never really had their best interests at heart. That's sad, but it's not something I can fix or control, and the amount of effort I would have put in (and did put in when we were together) to help him and cover for him so he could look like a great dad was effort that would have been better invested in myself and my relationship with my kids.

OP should grey or yellow rock her DH and engage in parallel parenting. If he has been abusive in any way, she can have all communication go through attorneys and any parental coordination can be done in writing through third party apps. She should focus on herself and her relationship with the kids and let her husband focus on himself and his relationship with the kids. Be cordial if you must be together for family or school events, but it's OK to keep it brief and polite.

We aren’t talking about your ex and sometimes you have to do things for the kids sake and take the high road. Marriage and coparenting are a partnership.

Marriage and coparenting may be a partnership, but divorce is not. Divorce is by definition about ending the partnership. Divorce is about drawing boundaries for the sake of your own health and safety and that of your kids. Divorce is about each party becoming independent and responsible for his/her 50% of a child’s care and 100% responsible for his/her own relationship with the kids.

Yes, often you have to do things for the kid’s sake. Propping up a Potemkin parent isn’t a service to the child: it’s a service to the spouse who can’t or won’t parent. Better to let them figure it out and succeed or fail on their own. Rescuing is infantilizing.

Coparenting is a form of partnership and you do it for your kids best interests. You probably set him up to fail and refuse to let him see the kids and find all kinds of excuses why. It’s not about the kids for you, it’s about you. You cannot have a relationship as a noncustodial parent if the other parent refuses or sabotages you.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:When my brother got divorced, he needed to set up a whole rental house and “house stuff” is not his thing at all. Our family helped a lot - it is a lot of work and takes a certain level of knowledge and skill. You have to make 1003 decisions. But he very much wanted the kid spaces especially to be set up for them to be comfortable and feel at home and he knew he needed to ask for help.

It’s not just a money thing. An expensive dresser that is the wrong size is much worse than an ikea one that fits. Hanging pictures, painting, the right size rug - all that stuff is not intuitive to everyone. Having extra mattress pads. Hooks in the right places. The kind of towels and shampoo the kids are used to. All that sort of thing.

lol. What woman would ever say “house stuff” was not her thing and that she could not set up a space for her own children without extensive assistance?

Op kept everything….

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:When my brother got divorced, he needed to set up a whole rental house and “house stuff” is not his thing at all. Our family helped a lot - it is a lot of work and takes a certain level of knowledge and skill. You have to make 1003 decisions. But he very much wanted the kid spaces especially to be set up for them to be comfortable and feel at home and he knew he needed to ask for help.

It’s not just a money thing. An expensive dresser that is the wrong size is much worse than an ikea one that fits. Hanging pictures, painting, the right size rug - all that stuff is not intuitive to everyone. Having extra mattress pads. Hooks in the right places. The kind of towels and shampoo the kids are used to. All that sort of thing.

If you notice op kept all the stuff and furniture vs splitting it.

And? If you notice he has left and purchased a brand new house with multiple empty rooms. we don’t have any of the details to make judgements about what is a fair split but we do know the court will.

Yes, and he should have taken half the furniture. Or, maybe because OP refused, he didn't take anything and is waiting for the court to decide. She could let them take stuff from her house and replace it.