Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP has a very odd obsession. What a strange way to spend your time.

Here’s some serious, honest life advice:

Spend your time either 1) earning more money to afford a better school or 2) applying for scholarships.

Don’t waste your mental efforts and time on moaning about how you are a victim. Help your child out in productive ways.

Good luck OP!

Not OP is it’s ok to be frustrating with being in the middle where you have “too much” to get any kind of help and “not enough” to get any kind of help. Like taxes and government, no one cares about the middle.

You're not "middle"

Yes, they are. A family that makes $150,000 a year is expected to pay full tuition just like a family that makes $2 million a year is expected to pay full tuition. But $100,000? Many schools give you a free ride.

Once you get to about $150, you’re lumped in with people making $800,000 and $2 million and $5million a year. You’re too privileged for help and not privileged enough to buy your way in with fancy boarding schools, private coaching, elite travel sports, and big donations.

Also at $150k (and higher), how is it possible to spend $80k on tuition? It's just not. So to consider a private school, merit is necessary in order to achieve actual affordability meaning ED is not an option because the school very well may consider the offer of full tuition or close "affordable". So if ED has a higher acceptance rate, some kids dont have that option.

(Similarly, for many, a private school is not an option period ED or not. Its public or bust).

I dont actually know why I responded to this....this has all been done before...now people will jump in about salaries and saving money...Cue the angry response in 10, 9, 8...

Why can't you run the NPC, and if the school is affordable apply ED? If it is unaffordable ED it will remain so RD.

/not angry, just confused.

Because the NPC is just the first offer, not the final word, and applying ED removes your ability to bargain.

Almost all schools will make a better FA offer if you can show that you have gotten a better FA offer from a peer school.

So it plays out like this.

You can afford $50k/year for college but $40k would be a lot better. (Yes, $10k may be pocket change to you but it is real money to some people.)

Your number one choice is Smith. You run the NPC, it says $50k, you apply ED and get in. Done. You’re going to Smith for $50k.

Or, you apply RD to Bryn Mawr and Smith. Smith says you can afford $50k, Bryn Mawr says $40k. You show the Bryn Mawr offer to Smith. Smith comes back to you with a package that has you paying $40k. Done. You’re going to Smith for $40k.

OR

Smith says, we’re sorry but we can’t do better than $45k, and you go to your second-favorite school, Bryn Mawr, for $40k.

The thing is, Smith is going to need to see Bryn Mawr’s actual offer. They’re not going to negotiate over a number spit out of Bryn Mawr’s NPC. ED means you can only get a FA offer from one school, and thus eliminates your ability to bargain, thus raising the final price you pay for college.

So ED is a major advantage for people rich enough to treat $10k a year, more or less, as pocket change. People to whom $10k represents real money cannot afford to relinquish their bargaining power, even if they have a clear first-choice school and even if that school is arguably affordable.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's literally a scam in an anti-trust way:

https://www.highereddive.com/news/32-colleges-accused-of-using-early-decision-to-drive-up-costs/757337/

Zero chance of this suit succeeding.

+1 ED does nto 'reduce competition" -- they are absolutely competing with each other to get those ED applicants just as much as they are competing to get the strongest RD applicants. And the argument that they use ED to reduce FA makes zero sense, since you can get out of ED if they fail to meet your FA needs.

They literally agree to keep their "hands off" kids who have been offered admission in ED by one of their supposed competitors. I can't imagine a clearer agreement not to compete/reduction in competition. (You seem to think any agreement that doesn't eliminate ALL competition is fine, but that's not how it works.)

I don't understand. You are saying college A should be fighting for a student even though that student has fully indicated they prefer college B and has agreed to attend if admitted? I mean why would college A care? They have plenty of other students who want them. Sounds like a toxic relationship.

Right, that would be like Comcast offering you a better price for broadband after you'd already signed up for FiOS. Crazy. Nobody wants that.

/sarc

But you already signed a 2 year agreement with Verizon because they offered $50/mo high speed internet and 4 free iPhone 16s.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's literally a scam in an anti-trust way:

https://www.highereddive.com/news/32-colleges-accused-of-using-early-decision-to-drive-up-costs/757337/

Zero chance of this suit succeeding.

+1 ED does nto 'reduce competition" -- they are absolutely competing with each other to get those ED applicants just as much as they are competing to get the strongest RD applicants. And the argument that they use ED to reduce FA makes zero sense, since you can get out of ED if they fail to meet your FA needs.

They literally agree to keep their "hands off" kids who have been offered admission in ED by one of their supposed competitors. I can't imagine a clearer agreement not to compete/reduction in competition. (You seem to think any agreement that doesn't eliminate ALL competition is fine, but that's not how it works.)

I don't understand. You are saying college A should be fighting for a student even though that student has fully indicated they prefer college B and has agreed to attend if admitted? I mean why would college A care? They have plenty of other students who want them. Sounds like a toxic relationship.

Right, that would be like Comcast offering you a better price for broadband after you'd already signed up for FiOS. Crazy. Nobody wants that.

/sarc

Telecommunications companies and universities do not have the same business models or objectives but go off.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's literally a scam in an anti-trust way:

https://www.highereddive.com/news/32-colleges-accused-of-using-early-decision-to-drive-up-costs/757337/

Zero chance of this suit succeeding.

+1 ED does nto 'reduce competition" -- they are absolutely competing with each other to get those ED applicants just as much as they are competing to get the strongest RD applicants. And the argument that they use ED to reduce FA makes zero sense, since you can get out of ED if they fail to meet your FA needs.

They literally agree to keep their "hands off" kids who have been offered admission in ED by one of their supposed competitors. I can't imagine a clearer agreement not to compete/reduction in competition. (You seem to think any agreement that doesn't eliminate ALL competition is fine, but that's not how it works.)

I don't understand. You are saying college A should be fighting for a student even though that student has fully indicated they prefer college B and has agreed to attend if admitted? I mean why would college A care? They have plenty of other students who want them. Sounds like a toxic relationship.

Right, that would be like Comcast offering you a better price for broadband after you'd already signed up for FiOS. Crazy. Nobody wants that.

/sarc

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP has a very odd obsession. What a strange way to spend your time.

Here’s some serious, honest life advice:

Spend your time either 1) earning more money to afford a better school or 2) applying for scholarships.

Don’t waste your mental efforts and time on moaning about how you are a victim. Help your child out in productive ways.

Good luck OP!

Not OP is it’s ok to be frustrating with being in the middle where you have “too much” to get any kind of help and “not enough” to get any kind of help. Like taxes and government, no one cares about the middle.

You're not "middle"

Yes, they are. A family that makes $150,000 a year is expected to pay full tuition just like a family that makes $2 million a year is expected to pay full tuition. But $100,000? Many schools give you a free ride.

Once you get to about $150, you’re lumped in with people making $800,000 and $2 million and $5million a year. You’re too privileged for help and not privileged enough to buy your way in with fancy boarding schools, private coaching, elite travel sports, and big donations.

US Income Percentile
In 2024, an individual income of $150,000 placed a worker in the top 10% of earners in the United States, as the threshold for the top 10% individual income was $150,000. This income level is significantly above the median individual income of $50,200 for the same year. For household income, $150,000 falls below the threshold for the top 10%, which was $234,769 in 2024.

https://dqydj.com/income-percentile-calculator/

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP has a very odd obsession. What a strange way to spend your time.

Here’s some serious, honest life advice:

Spend your time either 1) earning more money to afford a better school or 2) applying for scholarships.

Don’t waste your mental efforts and time on moaning about how you are a victim. Help your child out in productive ways.

Good luck OP!

Not OP is it’s ok to be frustrating with being in the middle where you have “too much” to get any kind of help and “not enough” to get any kind of help. Like taxes and government, no one cares about the middle.

You're not "middle"

Yes, they are. A family that makes $150,000 a year is expected to pay full tuition just like a family that makes $2 million a year is expected to pay full tuition. But $100,000? Many schools give you a free ride.

Once you get to about $150, you’re lumped in with people making $800,000 and $2 million and $5million a year. You’re too privileged for help and not privileged enough to buy your way in with fancy boarding schools, private coaching, elite travel sports, and big donations.

Also at $150k (and higher), how is it possible to spend $80k on tuition? It's just not. So to consider a private school, merit is necessary in order to achieve actual affordability meaning ED is not an option because the school very well may consider the offer of full tuition or close "affordable". So if ED has a higher acceptance rate, some kids dont have that option.

(Similarly, for many, a private school is not an option period ED or not. Its public or bust).

I dont actually know why I responded to this....this has all been done before...now people will jump in about salaries and saving money...Cue the angry response in 10, 9, 8...

Why can't you run the NPC, and if the school is affordable apply ED? If it is unaffordable ED it will remain so RD.

/not angry, just confused.

We have access to the internet, so have saved in the 529 accounts every month since our children were born. No family wealth.

We can also read, so we were aware how expensive a private college education would be, so we decided to live in Virginia and aim for public schools. We saved enough for our children to attend in-state colleges. Saving for college is one of the basic responsibilities of parenthood.

I think the college-educated parents who earn $150K+ and are out of their minds upset that they cannot get access to FA, ED or whatever for an Ivy League school are just silly and immature. No one has the right to admission to ANY school, let alone to have someone else foot the bill for it.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP has a very odd obsession. What a strange way to spend your time.

Here’s some serious, honest life advice:

Spend your time either 1) earning more money to afford a better school or 2) applying for scholarships.

Don’t waste your mental efforts and time on moaning about how you are a victim. Help your child out in productive ways.

Good luck OP!

Not OP is it’s ok to be frustrating with being in the middle where you have “too much” to get any kind of help and “not enough” to get any kind of help. Like taxes and government, no one cares about the middle.

You're not "middle"

Yes, they are. A family that makes $150,000 a year is expected to pay full tuition just like a family that makes $2 million a year is expected to pay full tuition. But $100,000? Many schools give you a free ride.

Once you get to about $150, you’re lumped in with people making $800,000 and $2 million and $5million a year. You’re too privileged for help and not privileged enough to buy your way in with fancy boarding schools, private coaching, elite travel sports, and big donations.

Also at $150k (and higher), how is it possible to spend $80k on tuition? It's just not. So to consider a private school, merit is necessary in order to achieve actual affordability meaning ED is not an option because the school very well may consider the offer of full tuition or close "affordable". So if ED has a higher acceptance rate, some kids dont have that option.

(Similarly, for many, a private school is not an option period ED or not. Its public or bust).

I dont actually know why I responded to this....this has all been done before...now people will jump in about salaries and saving money...Cue the angry response in 10, 9, 8...

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Early decision is a rich kid advantage. The rest of us can’t commit until we know what kind of scholarship or aid we’re offered.

And you will know what kind of scholarship or aid you are offered if you apply and are accepted ED. If you don't like the package, you can back out of ED -- it is the one reason students are allowed you to back out of ED. So either you don't know this provision, or you are just being obstreperous.

Or….it’s recently changed or it’s not the same for all schools. I know my kid isn’t applying ED to a particular law school because they don’t release the aid offered until much later. So ED is a financial gamble.

You have the minimum FA number from the NPC, there is no financial gamble involved.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP has a very odd obsession. What a strange way to spend your time.

Here’s some serious, honest life advice:

Spend your time either 1) earning more money to afford a better school or 2) applying for scholarships.

Don’t waste your mental efforts and time on moaning about how you are a victim. Help your child out in productive ways.

Good luck OP!

Not OP is it’s ok to be frustrating with being in the middle where you have “too much” to get any kind of help and “not enough” to get any kind of help. Like taxes and government, no one cares about the middle.

You're not "middle"

Yes, they are. A family that makes $150,000 a year is expected to pay full tuition just like a family that makes $2 million a year is expected to pay full tuition. But $100,000? Many schools give you a free ride.

Once you get to about $150, you’re lumped in with people making $800,000 and $2 million and $5million a year. You’re too privileged for help and not privileged enough to buy your way in with fancy boarding schools, private coaching, elite travel sports, and big donations.

I 100% agree that universities set income thresholds too low. A family that earns $150k has much more in common with a 30k family than it does with a family that earns $800k.

It’s unfair indeed. I hope one day things change, but I am not feeling optimistic. The rich are greedily eating up everything right now and no one is objecting a bit.
I don’t get it. Americans have lost their sense of justice and fairness.

Yes there is certainly an argument to be made about income thresholds and affordability.

But any advantage that full pay affords would be present whether ED is an option or not, as would be that of athletic recruiting and legacy admissions.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP has a very odd obsession. What a strange way to spend your time.

Here’s some serious, honest life advice:

Spend your time either 1) earning more money to afford a better school or 2) applying for scholarships.

Don’t waste your mental efforts and time on moaning about how you are a victim. Help your child out in productive ways.

Good luck OP!

Not OP is it’s ok to be frustrating with being in the middle where you have “too much” to get any kind of help and “not enough” to get any kind of help. Like taxes and government, no one cares about the middle.

You're not "middle"

Yes, they are. A family that makes $150,000 a year is expected to pay full tuition just like a family that makes $2 million a year is expected to pay full tuition. But $100,000? Many schools give you a free ride.

Once you get to about $150, you’re lumped in with people making $800,000 and $2 million and $5million a year. You’re too privileged for help and not privileged enough to buy your way in with fancy boarding schools, private coaching, elite travel sports, and big donations.

I 100% agree that universities set income thresholds too low. A family that earns $150k has much more in common with a 30k family than it does with a family that earns $800k.

It’s unfair indeed. I hope one day things change, but I am not feeling optimistic. The rich are greedily eating up everything right now and no one is objecting a bit.
I don’t get it. Americans have lost their sense of justice and fairness.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP has a very odd obsession. What a strange way to spend your time.

Here’s some serious, honest life advice:

Spend your time either 1) earning more money to afford a better school or 2) applying for scholarships.

Don’t waste your mental efforts and time on moaning about how you are a victim. Help your child out in productive ways.

Good luck OP!

Not OP is it’s ok to be frustrating with being in the middle where you have “too much” to get any kind of help and “not enough” to get any kind of help. Like taxes and government, no one cares about the middle.

You're not "middle"

Yes, they are. A family that makes $150,000 a year is expected to pay full tuition just like a family that makes $2 million a year is expected to pay full tuition. But $100,000? Many schools give you a free ride.

Once you get to about $150, you’re lumped in with people making $800,000 and $2 million and $5million a year. You’re too privileged for help and not privileged enough to buy your way in with fancy boarding schools, private coaching, elite travel sports, and big donations.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP has a very odd obsession. What a strange way to spend your time.

Here’s some serious, honest life advice:

Spend your time either 1) earning more money to afford a better school or 2) applying for scholarships.

Don’t waste your mental efforts and time on moaning about how you are a victim. Help your child out in productive ways.

Good luck OP!

Not OP is it’s ok to be frustrating with being in the middle where you have “too much” to get any kind of help and “not enough” to get any kind of help. Like taxes and government, no one cares about the middle.

You're not "middle"

Anonymous wrote:OP has a very odd obsession. What a strange way to spend your time.

Here’s some serious, honest life advice:

Spend your time either 1) earning more money to afford a better school or 2) applying for scholarships.

Don’t waste your mental efforts and time on moaning about how you are a victim. Help your child out in productive ways.

Good luck OP!

Not OP is it’s ok to be frustrating with being in the middle where you have “too much” to get any kind of help and “not enough” to get any kind of help. Like taxes and government, no one cares about the middle.

OP has a very odd obsession. What a strange way to spend your time.

Here’s some serious, honest life advice:

Spend your time either 1) earning more money to afford a better school or 2) applying for scholarships.

Don’t waste your mental efforts and time on moaning about how you are a victim. Help your child out in productive ways.

Good luck OP!