Anonymous wrote:

dony898 wrote:Everyone dunks on English majors until they need help writing a single coherent sentence on LinkedIn.

I have nothing but respect for English and history majors, but writing a single coherent sentence on LinkedIn is a perfect example of what ChatGPT is good for.

If someone needs a little help because they have no idea how to write, then maybe. But if they truly want to write well, even on LinkedIn, then ChatGPT isn’t quite enough.

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Anonymous wrote:An example of Chaucer's Canterbury Tales in Middle English. Understanding it is only the beginning.

"Whan that Aprill with his shoures soote

The droghte of Marche hath perced to the roote,

And bathed every veyne in swich licour,

Of which vertu engendred is the flour."

but, why do people need to understand this? I read Shakespeare, Flaubert, etc.. but I don't see the point in needing to understand very old English. My DH is English. He doesn't even like reading those types of books

Which then begs the question, why do I need to study so many subjects that I will never use in my career? It's not necessarily the specific subject matter that's important, its the the thought processes and skills that we develop that's important.

I can understand learning history, social science, but none of those classes are taught in ye olde English. So, again, why does one need to understand Chaucer's old English?

I think it's important to read some classics, but I don't think it's important to read every classic.

Majoring in English is not only (or primarily) about reading the classics. It's about thinking about literature and the ways that literature reflect (or doesn't reflect) society and our culture. It's about expanding our imaginations and empathy through seeing the world through others' perspectives. And it's about close reading and defending ideas with specific examples.

I agree with you, but sadly that is what is lacking in today's society and spefically here on DCUM

Dcum -- and the world -- would be a better place with more English majors and fewer business majors.

We need more doctors and nurses.

Yes. And at least one med school thinks that English majors make better doctors: https://www.mountsinai.org/about/newsroom/2015/npr-all-things-considered-a-top-medical-school-revamps-requirements-to-lure-english-majors

If they thought they made better doctors then why do have their med school students come from science backgrounds?

They think it’s valuable to bring humanities majors in to become doctors but if they believed they were better then one would assume they would take the majority of their class through this program.

Not PP, but I think its because medicine is inherently rooted in science whereas the humanities brings in the art.

Oh, boy. If you’re a doctor, you’re clearly not a very good one. After you master the science, the practice of medicine is 70% art.

Your post does not disagree with anything said even though you think so. And no, medicine is not 70% art. We aren’t in the 20th century anymore.

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Anonymous wrote:Because we are living in a minor dark age.

oh yes, the age of space travel is such a dark age.

This statement is quite illustrative, embodying the idea that technology cannot create darkness. Asinine.

I sure hope it’s a minor dark age. We’ve become unmoored from ethics, rule of law, and basic compassion. Ignorance and stupidity are celebrated. We’re in an anti-intellectual age of unreason, ruled by idiot-savant tech billionaires.

If AI ever does reach the point of singularity, we’re pretty likely to be wiped out.

Not at all sure it’s a minor dark age. I think we could have a cataclysmic event in the next 50 years that eliminates most humans. So do the technophiles, which is why they’re busy trying to find a way to populate space and constructing bunkers in New Zealand.

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Anonymous wrote:The wealthiest person I know (a multi-millionaire) majored in English, went on later to get an MBA, and successfully started two companies. He encouraged his own children to get a solid liberal arts education before picking a career.

Two of the wealthiest people (Gates and Zuckerberg) on the planet didn’t even graduate college at all.

You can’t start making arguments for a field of study based on ultimate financial success because it always ends with the wealthiest people who were nearly all STEM majors or college dropout STEM majors.

That was during a different era(s). Gates rode the computerization boom, Zuckerberg the internet boom. Technology is not quite the free-for-all it was then.

And, BTW, they both dropped out of Harvard. They were hardly academic slouches although I suspect both are on the spectrum.

Ok…the kid that founded Scale AI dropped out of MIT 5 years ago and just sold 1/2 his company for $15BN. He’s 25…is that recent enough?

My kid’s CS roommate just dropped out because he received funding from Y Combinator.

We are now in the AI boom once more led by STEM folks.

Nobody mentioned anything about the prestige of the school. It’s safe to say most who landed great jobs as English majors also attended these top schools.

Well, not everyone values wealth as the only indicator of whether an education is worthwhile. Bully for the 25-year old, but if wealth is the only thing he valued, he’s going to be one f*cked up kid. I would not wish early billionaire status on any of my children.

It’s probably not your call…but I’m not sure if you are more f**ked up to have $15BN at 25 or 35 or 45.

However, PP was trying to claim we are in a different era vs Zuckerberg or Gates…which is true, it’s the AI era but it looks awfully similar to those other eras.

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Anonymous wrote:The wealthiest person I know (a multi-millionaire) majored in English, went on later to get an MBA, and successfully started two companies. He encouraged his own children to get a solid liberal arts education before picking a career.

Two of the wealthiest people (Gates and Zuckerberg) on the planet didn’t even graduate college at all.

You can’t start making arguments for a field of study based on ultimate financial success because it always ends with the wealthiest people who were nearly all STEM majors or college dropout STEM majors.

That was during a different era(s). Gates rode the computerization boom, Zuckerberg the internet boom. Technology is not quite the free-for-all it was then.

And, BTW, they both dropped out of Harvard. They were hardly academic slouches although I suspect both are on the spectrum.

Ok…the kid that founded Scale AI dropped out of MIT 5 years ago and just sold 1/2 his company for $15BN. He’s 25…is that recent enough?

My kid’s CS roommate just dropped out because he received funding from Y Combinator.

We are now in the AI boom once more led by STEM folks.

Nobody mentioned anything about the prestige of the school. It’s safe to say most who landed great jobs as English majors also attended these top schools.

Well, not everyone values wealth as the only indicator of whether an education is worthwhile. Bully for the 25-year old, but if wealth is the only thing he valued, he’s going to be one f*cked up kid. I would not wish early billionaire status on any of my children.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just another sign of how uncivilized we’ve become.

Notice the lack of humanity in the tech world.

Sure. And business, legal, government and religion are full of compassion.

+1. Visiting London right now, and the people who received a classical liberal arts education were colonial monsters.

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Anonymous wrote:An example of Chaucer's Canterbury Tales in Middle English. Understanding it is only the beginning.

"Whan that Aprill with his shoures soote

The droghte of Marche hath perced to the roote,

And bathed every veyne in swich licour,

Of which vertu engendred is the flour."

but, why do people need to understand this? I read Shakespeare, Flaubert, etc.. but I don't see the point in needing to understand very old English. My DH is English. He doesn't even like reading those types of books

Which then begs the question, why do I need to study so many subjects that I will never use in my career? It's not necessarily the specific subject matter that's important, its the the thought processes and skills that we develop that's important.

I can understand learning history, social science, but none of those classes are taught in ye olde English. So, again, why does one need to understand Chaucer's old English?

I think it's important to read some classics, but I don't think it's important to read every classic.

Majoring in English is not only (or primarily) about reading the classics. It's about thinking about literature and the ways that literature reflect (or doesn't reflect) society and our culture. It's about expanding our imaginations and empathy through seeing the world through others' perspectives. And it's about close reading and defending ideas with specific examples.

I agree with you, but sadly that is what is lacking in today's society and spefically here on DCUM

Dcum -- and the world -- would be a better place with more English majors and fewer business majors.

We need more doctors and nurses.

Yes. And at least one med school thinks that English majors make better doctors: https://www.mountsinai.org/about/newsroom/2015/npr-all-things-considered-a-top-medical-school-revamps-requirements-to-lure-english-majors

If they thought they made better doctors then why do have their med school students come from science backgrounds?

They think it’s valuable to bring humanities majors in to become doctors but if they believed they were better then one would assume they would take the majority of their class through this program.

Not PP, but I think its because medicine is inherently rooted in science whereas the humanities brings in the art.

Oh, boy. If you’re a doctor, you’re clearly not a very good one. After you master the science, the practice of medicine is 70% art.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The wealthiest person I know (a multi-millionaire) majored in English, went on later to get an MBA, and successfully started two companies. He encouraged his own children to get a solid liberal arts education before picking a career.

Two of the wealthiest people (Gates and Zuckerberg) on the planet didn’t even graduate college at all.

You can’t start making arguments for a field of study based on ultimate financial success because it always ends with the wealthiest people who were nearly all STEM majors or college dropout STEM majors.

That was during a different era(s). Gates rode the computerization boom, Zuckerberg the internet boom. Technology is not quite the free-for-all it was then.

And, BTW, they both dropped out of Harvard. They were hardly academic slouches although I suspect both are on the spectrum.

Ok…the kid that founded Scale AI dropped out of MIT 5 years ago and just sold 1/2 his company for $15BN. He’s 25…is that recent enough?

My kid’s CS roommate just dropped out because he received funding from Y Combinator.

We are now in the AI boom once more led by STEM folks.

Nobody mentioned anything about the prestige of the school. It’s safe to say most who landed great jobs as English majors also attended these top schools.

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:History and English were considered respectable majors in the past. I know many who went on to law school or medical school. They’re generally thought to have good writing and analytical skills. Now, people scoff when you saying you’re majoring in English or history. I know there’s AI to worry about, but isn’t that true for CS and accounting too?

I don’t know a single English major that went on to medical school.

No way you know many.

You make general conclusions based on how many people you know?

https://www.businessinsider.com/english-major-medical-school-doctors-2017-11

3% of doctors were humanities majors…does it really matter that it’s the 7th most popular when the #1 major listed is like 70% just on its own?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The wealthiest person I know (a multi-millionaire) majored in English, went on later to get an MBA, and successfully started two companies. He encouraged his own children to get a solid liberal arts education before picking a career.

Two of the wealthiest people (Gates and Zuckerberg) on the planet didn’t even graduate college at all.

You can’t start making arguments for a field of study based on ultimate financial success because it always ends with the wealthiest people who were nearly all STEM majors or college dropout STEM majors.

That was during a different era(s). Gates rode the computerization boom, Zuckerberg the internet boom. Technology is not quite the free-for-all it was then.

And, BTW, they both dropped out of Harvard. They were hardly academic slouches although I suspect both are on the spectrum.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:History and English were considered respectable majors in the past. I know many who went on to law school or medical school. They’re generally thought to have good writing and analytical skills. Now, people scoff when you saying you’re majoring in English or history. I know there’s AI to worry about, but isn’t that true for CS and accounting too?

I don’t know a single English major that went on to medical school.

No way you know many.

You make general conclusions based on how many people you know?

https://www.businessinsider.com/english-major-medical-school-doctors-2017-11

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Many people think its easy - I speak English, how difficult can it be? They don't understand (or don't want to understand) what the major entails. The breadth and type of literature that is read is not easy. Just try reading Chaucer's work in its original Middle English with a deep understanding followed by critical analysis and writing. I understand it's difficult to get a high paying job like in finance which is why many English majors do go on to grad school.

l

GMU English grad here again. No, it was really really easy. They even had movie classes, movies! And I skipped the hard books. Just pay attention in class and take some notes, I never read a single Faulkner book.

Uh, that’s because you went to GMU.

Anonymous wrote:The wealthiest person I know (a multi-millionaire) majored in English, went on later to get an MBA, and successfully started two companies. He encouraged his own children to get a solid liberal arts education before picking a career.

Previously, he was a billionaire.

Anonymous wrote:Just another sign of how uncivilized we’ve become.

Notice the lack of humanity in the tech world.

Sure. And business, legal, government and religion are full of compassion.

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Anonymous wrote:What matters is how it's viewed in the real world/industry as they actually pay for the value of the education/product. Doesn't matter what you feel. They know the best.

It's obviously less respected for reasons.

If you use it as a step for law school, then you'll be respected when you go to a law schools and become a lawyer.

It's less respected because people have lost touch with the value of a liberal arts education. And this country is the poorer for it. People are so narrow-minded and snobby in their little political and socioeconomic silos. And the country goes down the toilet.

Just like anything else, market decides value. Degrees in humanities are just less valuable. Crying doesn't change it.