Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My son’s best friend went to West Point - he’s extremely bright and driven, wanted to have a sense of mission and challenge himself to the utmost

He liked his time at the USMA. However he has found the last 5 years of his life extremely stultifying, working in a ponderous bureaucracy with people who aren’t particularly bright, driven or mission-focused

He gets out in August and is rolling straight into a top MBA program, and is a bit depressed that he’ll be almost 30 before beginning his real career and regrets what he viewed as a lot of wasted time as an Army officer

I’m sure a random parent acquaintance of this kid is a great source of info for OP.

Then don't post on DCUM FFS. What else are you going to get here other than anecdotes?

Also, that's what he gets for going to USMA and then into the Army. Similar scenario for DH, except he went to USNA, they sent him post grad to MIT, then on to submarines. When he go out he went to Wharton. His time in the fleet he was surrounded by very bright and motivated people because they don't take dummies in the sub force. Be selective about what you do in the military.

OP did specifically say if you know little or nothing about this, don’t respond. Random mom who has a kid, who has a friend that went to an academy means you know nothing about it

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My son’s best friend went to West Point - he’s extremely bright and driven, wanted to have a sense of mission and challenge himself to the utmost

He liked his time at the USMA. However he has found the last 5 years of his life extremely stultifying, working in a ponderous bureaucracy with people who aren’t particularly bright, driven or mission-focused

He gets out in August and is rolling straight into a top MBA program, and is a bit depressed that he’ll be almost 30 before beginning his real career and regrets what he viewed as a lot of wasted time as an Army officer

You can't get into a top MBA program without 4-5 years of work, anyway, and graduating from West Point and being in the Army likely helped him get into the top MBA program because they like diversity of backgrounds. We had a few in my class at the Stanford GSB and they were a huge plus to the quality of conversation in the classroom, as he likely has more leadership experience than most, if not all, of his classmates. If it is truly a top MBA program and he does well, then he will be competitive for any career after finishing. I guess he can wish that he'd "wasted" his last 5 years at an investment bank or consulting firm working 80 hour weeks, but then he would have had a lot more competition to get into that top MBA program.

Yes, as an officer, you should be able to show management experience and ideally some relevant experience in the field you want to go into.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My son’s best friend went to West Point - he’s extremely bright and driven, wanted to have a sense of mission and challenge himself to the utmost

He liked his time at the USMA. However he has found the last 5 years of his life extremely stultifying, working in a ponderous bureaucracy with people who aren’t particularly bright, driven or mission-focused

He gets out in August and is rolling straight into a top MBA program, and is a bit depressed that he’ll be almost 30 before beginning his real career and regrets what he viewed as a lot of wasted time as an Army officer

I’m sure a random parent acquaintance of this kid is a great source of info for OP.

Then don't post on DCUM FFS. What else are you going to get here other than anecdotes?

Also, that's what he gets for going to USMA and then into the Army. Similar scenario for DH, except he went to USNA, they sent him post grad to MIT, then on to submarines. When he go out he went to Wharton. His time in the fleet he was surrounded by very bright and motivated people because they don't take dummies in the sub force. Be selective about what you do in the military.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP- only listen to the responses from people who actually went to an academy or did ROTC themselves of currently have a child doing either. All of these “my husband 20 yrs ago” my “close relative” ect. are pretty irrelevant and/or wrong.

Op here. Yes, thanks and agree. And to add, I am not a fan of this current admin but my dc isn’t going to make a career choice based on what books are in the USMA library. My military family members trend toward Dem but they all lived and survived under admins they didn’t love. And Ds is agnostic.

It’s not “the books”. It’s the embrace of white supremacy, dishonesty, and a narrow minded education. He can still be a doctor outside of the military. No other administration embraced the nazi salute, disappeared people, or ignored the courts.

Grads are being asked to encourage kids to join right now because there’s less interest. None of the grads I know feel they can, in good conscience, do this.

But since you don’t care, start with a medical exam. I hope your son has the personal strength to not follow illegal orders.

The issue of less interest was real but it was over the past 4 years and is already showing signs that it's resolving under the new administration. We are a USNA family who lives in ANP and have ties to admissions. You clearly have no idea what you are talking about.

I absolutely know what I’m talking about. You are a propagandist. But since you know SO much, now tell me how many of them are evangelical end-timers. People who think combat is doing “lord’s work”? The academies have become more evangelical and I’m not at all surprised if you’ve seen that type of recruit increase with the convicted cult leader, Trump, in office. Again, this is not your father’s military and the more unprofessional lunatics in charge like Hegseth and Trump, the less professional, less admirable, less safe the whole military will be. The old apolitical, ethical guys are being pushed out and the true believer cult members are emboldened. Dark times for our military.

West Point does not seem "evangelical" to me, nor is combat presented as doing "the Lord's work."

The Air Force Academy is. I'll try to find a recent article that talked about that.

Anonymous wrote:My son’s best friend went to West Point - he’s extremely bright and driven, wanted to have a sense of mission and challenge himself to the utmost

He liked his time at the USMA. However he has found the last 5 years of his life extremely stultifying, working in a ponderous bureaucracy with people who aren’t particularly bright, driven or mission-focused

He gets out in August and is rolling straight into a top MBA program, and is a bit depressed that he’ll be almost 30 before beginning his real career and regrets what he viewed as a lot of wasted time as an Army officer

You can't get into a top MBA program without 4-5 years of work, anyway, and graduating from West Point and being in the Army likely helped him get into the top MBA program because they like diversity of backgrounds. We had a few in my class at the Stanford GSB and they were a huge plus to the quality of conversation in the classroom, as he likely has more leadership experience than most, if not all, of his classmates. If it is truly a top MBA program and he does well, then he will be competitive for any career after finishing. I guess he can wish that he'd "wasted" his last 5 years at an investment bank or consulting firm working 80 hour weeks, but then he would have had a lot more competition to get into that top MBA program.

Anonymous wrote:My son’s best friend went to West Point - he’s extremely bright and driven, wanted to have a sense of mission and challenge himself to the utmost

He liked his time at the USMA. However he has found the last 5 years of his life extremely stultifying, working in a ponderous bureaucracy with people who aren’t particularly bright, driven or mission-focused

He gets out in August and is rolling straight into a top MBA program, and is a bit depressed that he’ll be almost 30 before beginning his real career and regrets what he viewed as a lot of wasted time as an Army officer

I’m sure a random parent acquaintance of this kid is a great source of info for OP.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP- only listen to the responses from people who actually went to an academy or did ROTC themselves of currently have a child doing either. All of these “my husband 20 yrs ago” my “close relative” ect. are pretty irrelevant and/or wrong.

Op here. Yes, thanks and agree. And to add, I am not a fan of this current admin but my dc isn’t going to make a career choice based on what books are in the USMA library. My military family members trend toward Dem but they all lived and survived under admins they didn’t love. And Ds is agnostic.

It’s not “the books”. It’s the embrace of white supremacy, dishonesty, and a narrow minded education. He can still be a doctor outside of the military. No other administration embraced the nazi salute, disappeared people, or ignored the courts.

Grads are being asked to encourage kids to join right now because there’s less interest. None of the grads I know feel they can, in good conscience, do this.

But since you don’t care, start with a medical exam. I hope your son has the personal strength to not follow illegal orders.

The issue of less interest was real but it was over the past 4 years and is already showing signs that it's resolving under the new administration. We are a USNA family who lives in ANP and have ties to admissions. You clearly have no idea what you are talking about.

I absolutely know what I’m talking about. You are a propagandist. But since you know SO much, now tell me how many of them are evangelical end-timers. People who think combat is doing “lord’s work”? The academies have become more evangelical and I’m not at all surprised if you’ve seen that type of recruit increase with the convicted cult leader, Trump, in office. Again, this is not your father’s military and the more unprofessional lunatics in charge like Hegseth and Trump, the less professional, less admirable, less safe the whole military will be. The old apolitical, ethical guys are being pushed out and the true believer cult members are emboldened. Dark times for our military.

West Point does not seem "evangelical" to me, nor is combat presented as doing "the Lord's work."

I didn’t say the academies are teaching it from an evangelical standpoint. Academies are attracting more evangelicals so their student body is becoming more evangelical. Yes, evangelicals think it’s the “lords work”.

My son’s best friend went to West Point - he’s extremely bright and driven, wanted to have a sense of mission and challenge himself to the utmost

He liked his time at the USMA. However he has found the last 5 years of his life extremely stultifying, working in a ponderous bureaucracy with people who aren’t particularly bright, driven or mission-focused

He gets out in August and is rolling straight into a top MBA program, and is a bit depressed that he’ll be almost 30 before beginning his real career and regrets what he viewed as a lot of wasted time as an Army officer

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP- only listen to the responses from people who actually went to an academy or did ROTC themselves of currently have a child doing either. All of these “my husband 20 yrs ago” my “close relative” ect. are pretty irrelevant and/or wrong.

Op here. Yes, thanks and agree. And to add, I am not a fan of this current admin but my dc isn’t going to make a career choice based on what books are in the USMA library. My military family members trend toward Dem but they all lived and survived under admins they didn’t love. And Ds is agnostic.

It’s not “the books”. It’s the embrace of white supremacy, dishonesty, and a narrow minded education. He can still be a doctor outside of the military. No other administration embraced the nazi salute, disappeared people, or ignored the courts.

Grads are being asked to encourage kids to join right now because there’s less interest. None of the grads I know feel they can, in good conscience, do this.

But since you don’t care, start with a medical exam. I hope your son has the personal strength to not follow illegal orders.

The issue of less interest was real but it was over the past 4 years and is already showing signs that it's resolving under the new administration. We are a USNA family who lives in ANP and have ties to admissions. You clearly have no idea what you are talking about.

I absolutely know what I’m talking about. You are a propagandist. But since you know SO much, now tell me how many of them are evangelical end-timers. People who think combat is doing “lord’s work”? The academies have become more evangelical and I’m not at all surprised if you’ve seen that type of recruit increase with the convicted cult leader, Trump, in office. Again, this is not your father’s military and the more unprofessional lunatics in charge like Hegseth and Trump, the less professional, less admirable, less safe the whole military will be. The old apolitical, ethical guys are being pushed out and the true believer cult members are emboldened. Dark times for our military.

West Point does not seem "evangelical" to me, nor is combat presented as doing "the Lord's work."

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP- only listen to the responses from people who actually went to an academy or did ROTC themselves of currently have a child doing either. All of these “my husband 20 yrs ago” my “close relative” ect. are pretty irrelevant and/or wrong.

Op here. Yes, thanks and agree. And to add, I am not a fan of this current admin but my dc isn’t going to make a career choice based on what books are in the USMA library. My military family members trend toward Dem but they all lived and survived under admins they didn’t love. And Ds is agnostic.

It’s not “the books”. It’s the embrace of white supremacy, dishonesty, and a narrow minded education. He can still be a doctor outside of the military. No other administration embraced the nazi salute, disappeared people, or ignored the courts.

Grads are being asked to encourage kids to join right now because there’s less interest. None of the grads I know feel they can, in good conscience, do this.

But since you don’t care, start with a medical exam. I hope your son has the personal strength to not follow illegal orders.

The issue of less interest was real but it was over the past 4 years and is already showing signs that it's resolving under the new administration. We are a USNA family who lives in ANP and have ties to admissions. You clearly have no idea what you are talking about.

I absolutely know what I’m talking about. You are a propagandist. But since you know SO much, now tell me how many of them are evangelical end-timers. People who think combat is doing “lord’s work”? The academies have become more evangelical and I’m not at all surprised if you’ve seen that type of recruit increase with the convicted cult leader, Trump, in office. Again, this is not your father’s military and the more unprofessional lunatics in charge like Hegseth and Trump, the less professional, less admirable, less safe the whole military will be. The old apolitical, ethical guys are being pushed out and the true believer cult members are emboldened. Dark times for our military.

Well this thread went another direction!

I work for the Army (also Army vet and USMA parent) and have followed the recruiting data pretty closely. 2024 was actually a banner year for Army recruiting - black females showing the highest gains - but overall increases in minorities. Data here https://recruiting.army.mil/pao/facts_figures/ - There is not enough data yet to see if there are new trends since Trump inauguration/Hegseth appointment, but I will watch closely.

Having said that - it is typically the economy, not politics, that drives recruitment. A few may be more motivated by politics, but most kids enlist because they had a relative who served and saw the benefits or they see opportunity to leave state/earn GI bill for college.

Recruiting to join as enlisted? Or recruiting for academies? Those have always been two very different applicant types.

Women are outnumbering the men in part because more men are unqualified by way of drug use and arrest history. It’s a shame this administration just thinks these patriotic, smart, courageous black women are just “woke DEI” hires. I hope they all get the credit, promotions, and benefits they thought they’d receive, but Project 2025 says they won’t.

And it’s too bad. The military is not only critical to our country’s safety and global responsibilities, it was the also our biggest social program: frequently breaking the poverty cycle and educating people who would not have otherwise been able to afford college.

Two rapists, one with a drinking problem, and neither with respect for the seriousness of their roles as CIC and SecDef is insulting and dangerous. They are an affront to the leadership skills and professionalism of our troops.

But yeah, OP. If you’re not worried about this, first be sure he can pass the medical tests. It’s very thorough and kids are frequently surprised to find out they don’t pass.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP- only listen to the responses from people who actually went to an academy or did ROTC themselves of currently have a child doing either. All of these “my husband 20 yrs ago” my “close relative” ect. are pretty irrelevant and/or wrong.

Op here. Yes, thanks and agree. And to add, I am not a fan of this current admin but my dc isn’t going to make a career choice based on what books are in the USMA library. My military family members trend toward Dem but they all lived and survived under admins they didn’t love. And Ds is agnostic.

It’s not “the books”. It’s the embrace of white supremacy, dishonesty, and a narrow minded education. He can still be a doctor outside of the military. No other administration embraced the nazi salute, disappeared people, or ignored the courts.

Grads are being asked to encourage kids to join right now because there’s less interest. None of the grads I know feel they can, in good conscience, do this.

But since you don’t care, start with a medical exam. I hope your son has the personal strength to not follow illegal orders.

The issue of less interest was real but it was over the past 4 years and is already showing signs that it's resolving under the new administration. We are a USNA family who lives in ANP and have ties to admissions. You clearly have no idea what you are talking about.

I absolutely know what I’m talking about. You are a propagandist. But since you know SO much, now tell me how many of them are evangelical end-timers. People who think combat is doing “lord’s work”? The academies have become more evangelical and I’m not at all surprised if you’ve seen that type of recruit increase with the convicted cult leader, Trump, in office. Again, this is not your father’s military and the more unprofessional lunatics in charge like Hegseth and Trump, the less professional, less admirable, less safe the whole military will be. The old apolitical, ethical guys are being pushed out and the true believer cult members are emboldened. Dark times for our military.

Well this thread went another direction!

I work for the Army (also Army vet and USMA parent) and have followed the recruiting data pretty closely. 2024 was actually a banner year for Army recruiting - black females showing the highest gains - but overall increases in minorities. Data here https://recruiting.army.mil/pao/facts_figures/ - There is not enough data yet to see if there are new trends since Trump inauguration/Hegseth appointment, but I will watch closely.

Having said that - it is typically the economy, not politics, that drives recruitment. A few may be more motivated by politics, but most kids enlist because they had a relative who served and saw the benefits or they see opportunity to leave state/earn GI bill for college.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP- only listen to the responses from people who actually went to an academy or did ROTC themselves of currently have a child doing either. All of these “my husband 20 yrs ago” my “close relative” ect. are pretty irrelevant and/or wrong.

Op here. Yes, thanks and agree. And to add, I am not a fan of this current admin but my dc isn’t going to make a career choice based on what books are in the USMA library. My military family members trend toward Dem but they all lived and survived under admins they didn’t love. And Ds is agnostic.

It’s not “the books”. It’s the embrace of white supremacy, dishonesty, and a narrow minded education. He can still be a doctor outside of the military. No other administration embraced the nazi salute, disappeared people, or ignored the courts.

Grads are being asked to encourage kids to join right now because there’s less interest. None of the grads I know feel they can, in good conscience, do this.

But since you don’t care, start with a medical exam. I hope your son has the personal strength to not follow illegal orders.

The issue of less interest was real but it was over the past 4 years and is already showing signs that it's resolving under the new administration. We are a USNA family who lives in ANP and have ties to admissions. You clearly have no idea what you are talking about.

I absolutely know what I’m talking about. You are a propagandist. But since you know SO much, now tell me how many of them are evangelical end-timers. People who think combat is doing “lord’s work”? The academies have become more evangelical and I’m not at all surprised if you’ve seen that type of recruit increase with the convicted cult leader, Trump, in office. Again, this is not your father’s military and the more unprofessional lunatics in charge like Hegseth and Trump, the less professional, less admirable, less safe the whole military will be. The old apolitical, ethical guys are being pushed out and the true believer cult members are emboldened. Dark times for our military.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I hope your son has the personal strength to not follow illegal orders.

What are these illegal orders you are performatively outraged about?

Invading Canada.

lmao if you think that's going to happen.

I doubt you were outraged about Obama's intervention in Libya in 2011, which actually happened and was illegal.

ROTC would be my choice over an Academy.

Anonymous wrote:

I hope your son has the personal strength to not follow illegal orders.

What are these illegal orders you are performatively outraged about?

Invading Canada.