Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:do the athletes and legacy admits feel the same way? I’d say no, and yet the dopes at the ivies are more likely athletes than URM or legacy, who have a higher admission standard than the Ivy AI. And I am the parent of one (athlete)

I have no problem with athletes getting in. At my Wall Street company, the hardest working employee was a Harvard quarterback. At least they had to work their butts off to be a top athlete and get recruited. Unlike legacies and URMs, who were just born a certain way.

Agree with this.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"DP here. URMs absolutely have lower test scores and GPAs for admittance to T25. You have to be really, really, really out of the loop not to know that. White kids and Asian kids would never get admitted with most of the URM scores and GPAs. It is not good or bad, it just is."

You're clueless. Their scores as a group might be lower that those of the wealthy white kids with professional parents who attended college. But no POC at a top school is getting in with a score that low. It would be pretty difficult to keep up with the ultra high achievers if you couldn't at least score in the top quintile, and it's really rare for URM students to flunk out of the most elite schools.

DP.

Numbers don't lie.

I’m white. This chart actually shows that Black kids have SATs almost as high the SATs of the white kids and probably have a lot of test score overlap with the white kids, especially after you adjust for high school quality.

+1 and those test scores for Black students is top 0.5% as compared to the top 5% for white students.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"DP here. URMs absolutely have lower test scores and GPAs for admittance to T25. You have to be really, really, really out of the loop not to know that. White kids and Asian kids would never get admitted with most of the URM scores and GPAs. It is not good or bad, it just is."

You're clueless. Their scores as a group might be lower that those of the wealthy white kids with professional parents who attended college. But no POC at a top school is getting in with a score that low. It would be pretty difficult to keep up with the ultra high achievers if you couldn't at least score in the top quintile, and it's really rare for URM students to flunk out of the most elite schools.

DP.

Numbers don't lie.

I’m white. This chart actually shows that Black kids have SATs almost as high the SATs of the white kids and probably have a lot of test score overlap with the white kids, especially after you adjust for high school quality.

I never assume a URM wasn’t qualified. But I know my kid still wouldn’t have gotten in with the same stats. That’s the thing about a hook.

Anonymous wrote:"DP here. URMs absolutely have lower test scores and GPAs for admittance to T25. You have to be really, really, really out of the loop not to know that. White kids and Asian kids would never get admitted with most of the URM scores and GPAs. It is not good or bad, it just is."

You're clueless. Their scores as a group might be lower that those of the wealthy white kids with professional parents who attended college. But no POC at a top school is getting in with a score that low. It would be pretty difficult to keep up with the ultra high achievers if you couldn't at least score in the top quintile, and it's really rare for URM students to flunk out of the most elite schools.

DP.

Numbers don't lie.

Anonymous wrote:DS has had a similar experience. He looks white, but has a URM last name. When he has performed well at school, he’s had both teachers and fellow students say “I didn’t know you were smart.” He’s also been called a “fake” minority. It’s the worst of both worlds. Minorities don’t think he’s ethnic enough and whites automatically think he’s dumb.

It’s been an eye opener since college acceptances have been rolling in. People assume he’s been accepted to his schools bc of his ethnicity. When you look at naviance for his school, he’s in the green. The whole issue makes him incredibly self conscious and he doesn’t say anything.

I’m white and I 100% support preference for URM. DC’s in a world where people first assume he’s dumb just because of his name. And he doesn’t even “look” like a minority.

This is how some Asian American students and their parents feel if they get high test scores/grades and into magnets. People automatically assume "tiger mom" and "tutoring/prep classes".

Neither is true for my Asian American magnet kid with a near perfect SAT score. DC self studies.

The side effect of AA is that people will always wonder if your child was accepted on their merits or if they were a diversity admit. It’s the kind of thing most people wonder but don’t say out loud. It astonishes me that people are actually saying this.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:That's terrible people say rude things. Your daughter sounds amazing. Congrats on her acceptances!

I sincerely doubt that anyone says what OP is claiming, and I’ve been active in both private and public high schools. No one says that

Sure they say that. Maybe not as much to their face. Kid in my high school got accepted to an Ivy, was ranked somewhere around 5 in the class. No one else in the class attended an Ivy or anything close.

When my daughter was applying to colleges we used to go over the Naviance graphs. The one ivy acceptance (Yale) in my kids school in the previous 3-4 years was from a kid of African immigrants. Had excellent grades (very close to a 4.0 UW) but a 1090 on the SAT (before TO). All of the other kids with a 4.0 and 1500+ SAT scores were rejected.

Similar situation at my kid's HS.

No one is getting admitted to Yale with a 1090 SAT.

Stop it.

DP here. URMs absolutely have lower test scores and GPAs for admittance to T25. You have to be really, really, really out of the loop not to know that. White kids and Asian kids would never get admitted with most of the URM scores and GPAs. It is not good or bad, it just is.

You must not know many smart URM kids at t25 schools because the majority of URM kids getting in these schools are just as accomplished and academically gifted. Most are not even AA (from Africa and the Caribbean) and can hold their own against any high stats group. My DC was waitlisted at our state flagship and ended up at a t20 with a 4.6 gpa (IB diploma) and competitive SATs (700+ high math score). My cousin’s DC has an almost perfect SAT score and was deferred from Princeton EA this year. Both have leadership and great ECs. My cousin’s kid is an athlete but admittedly no recruited for the sport. These are not first generation AA kids. They work hard and they are not taking your precious spots at any of these top schools.

No pressure over here on my child to prove anything to anyone. I wouldn’t about other people’s kids and focus on a good strategy for the success of my own child.

My kid works at one of the elite IBs and he had to interview (involves solving around 5 problems) some applicants for the summer analyst positions. He was told by the upper management to 'pass' and move forward black applicants if they can solve at least 1 problem (Hispanic applicants 2) while all others had to solve at least 3 and more likely 4 problems to move forward in the process. He was not successful in finding 1 black applicant who could move forward out of about a dozen candidates with about half URMs.

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:That's terrible people say rude things. Your daughter sounds amazing. Congrats on her acceptances!

I sincerely doubt that anyone says what OP is claiming, and I’ve been active in both private and public high schools. No one says that

Sure they say that. Maybe not as much to their face. Kid in my high school got accepted to an Ivy, was ranked somewhere around 5 in the class. No one else in the class attended an Ivy or anything close.

When my daughter was applying to colleges we used to go over the Naviance graphs. The one ivy acceptance (Yale) in my kids school in the previous 3-4 years was from a kid of African immigrants. Had excellent grades (very close to a 4.0 UW) but a 1090 on the SAT (before TO). All of the other kids with a 4.0 and 1500+ SAT scores were rejected.

Similar situation at my kid's HS.

No one is getting admitted to Yale with a 1090 SAT.

Stop it.

DP here. URMs absolutely have lower test scores and GPAs for admittance to T25. You have to be really, really, really out of the loop not to know that. White kids and Asian kids would never get admitted with most of the URM scores and GPAs. It is not good or bad, it just is.

Not all T25 It's easier to get into some schools if you're white than black like Emory and Georgetown. And some of you don't realize that the top 1% of black test takers is a 1390 if I remember correctly so a 1350 for a black child is great compared to a 1450 for a white child.

This isn’t the brag you think it is.

That 1390 was probably taken once and with little to no test prep. I'll take that over a cushy test prepped super score. And.... it's in the 90th percentile. Colleges will take this from a URM with excellent grades, ECs without question. If white and Asian parents want to be mad, then tough.

I’m not sure why you think URM don’t prep. When they look into it, asians prep the most, followed by blacks, hispanics and then whites. 11th grade black students are the single most group likely to prep. It a lot of difference between different types of prep (I.e. tutoring, vs classes) either.

One of the studies: https://www.jstor.org/stable/40984541

“ One of the noteworthy findings in the
BC study is the racial and ethnic differences in the use of test preparation: blacks
and Hispanics are more likely than whites from comparable backgrounds to utilize
test preparation. The black-white gap is especially pronounced in the use of high
school courses, private courses and private tutors. The Hispanic-white gap is more
modest, and is limited to the use of private tutors.”

Another: https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.1111/j.1573-7861.2012.01326.x

“ Black non-Hispanic students are more likely to participate in test prep, and there are also significant interaction effects of race and grade level on prep, with black 11th graders having the highest predicted probability of prep.”

Anonymous wrote:do the athletes and legacy admits feel the same way? I’d say no, and yet the dopes at the ivies are more likely athletes than URM or legacy, who have a higher admission standard than the Ivy AI. And I am the parent of one (athlete)

I have no problem with athletes getting in. At my Wall Street company, the hardest working employee was a Harvard quarterback. At least they had to work their butts off to be a top athlete and get recruited. Unlike legacies and URMs, who were just born a certain way.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:That's terrible people say rude things. Your daughter sounds amazing. Congrats on her acceptances!

I sincerely doubt that anyone says what OP is claiming, and I’ve been active in both private and public high schools. No one says that

Sure they say that. Maybe not as much to their face. Kid in my high school got accepted to an Ivy, was ranked somewhere around 5 in the class. No one else in the class attended an Ivy or anything close.

When my daughter was applying to colleges we used to go over the Naviance graphs. The one ivy acceptance (Yale) in my kids school in the previous 3-4 years was from a kid of African immigrants. Had excellent grades (very close to a 4.0 UW) but a 1090 on the SAT (before TO). All of the other kids with a 4.0 and 1500+ SAT scores were rejected.

Similar situation at my kid's HS.

No one is getting admitted to Yale with a 1090 SAT.

Stop it.

DP here. URMs absolutely have lower test scores and GPAs for admittance to T25. You have to be really, really, really out of the loop not to know that. White kids and Asian kids would never get admitted with most of the URM scores and GPAs. It is not good or bad, it just is.

Not all T25 It's easier to get into some schools if you're white than black like Emory and Georgetown. And some of you don't realize that the top 1% of black test takers is a 1390 if I remember correctly so a 1350 for a black child is great compared to a 1450 for a white child.

This isn’t the brag you think it is.

That 1390 was probably taken once and with little to no test prep. I'll take that over a cushy test prepped super score. And.... it's in the 90th percentile. Colleges will take this from a URM with excellent grades, ECs without question. If white and Asian parents want to be mad, then tough.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:That's terrible people say rude things. Your daughter sounds amazing. Congrats on her acceptances!

I sincerely doubt that anyone says what OP is claiming, and I’ve been active in both private and public high schools. No one says that

Sure they say that. Maybe not as much to their face. Kid in my high school got accepted to an Ivy, was ranked somewhere around 5 in the class. No one else in the class attended an Ivy or anything close.

When my daughter was applying to colleges we used to go over the Naviance graphs. The one ivy acceptance (Yale) in my kids school in the previous 3-4 years was from a kid of African immigrants. Had excellent grades (very close to a 4.0 UW) but a 1090 on the SAT (before TO). All of the other kids with a 4.0 and 1500+ SAT scores were rejected.

Similar situation at my kid's HS.

No one is getting admitted to Yale with a 1090 SAT.

Stop it.

DP here. URMs absolutely have lower test scores and GPAs for admittance to T25. You have to be really, really, really out of the loop not to know that. White kids and Asian kids would never get admitted with most of the URM scores and GPAs. It is not good or bad, it just is.

Not all T25 It's easier to get into some schools if you're white than black like Emory and Georgetown. And some of you don't realize that the top 1% of black test takers is a 1390 if I remember correctly so a 1350 for a black child is great compared to a 1450 for a white child.

This isn’t the brag you think it is.

What isn't the brag? both statements are true. The schools can't accept students that don't exist. POC are vital to the college ecosystem as they will soon make up the majority of Americans. If POC test scores were higher colleges would accept those students instead, and with glee.

DS has had a similar experience. He looks white, but has a URM last name. When he has performed well at school, he’s had both teachers and fellow students say “I didn’t know you were smart.” He’s also been called a “fake” minority. It’s the worst of both worlds. Minorities don’t think he’s ethnic enough and whites automatically think he’s dumb.

It’s been an eye opener since college acceptances have been rolling in. People assume he’s been accepted to his schools bc of his ethnicity. When you look at naviance for his school, he’s in the green. The whole issue makes him incredibly self conscious and he doesn’t say anything.

I’m white and I 100% support preference for URM. DC’s in a world where people first assume he’s dumb just because of his name. And he doesn’t even “look” like a minority.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:That's terrible people say rude things. Your daughter sounds amazing. Congrats on her acceptances!

I sincerely doubt that anyone says what OP is claiming, and I’ve been active in both private and public high schools. No one says that

Sure they say that. Maybe not as much to their face. Kid in my high school got accepted to an Ivy, was ranked somewhere around 5 in the class. No one else in the class attended an Ivy or anything close.

When my daughter was applying to colleges we used to go over the Naviance graphs. The one ivy acceptance (Yale) in my kids school in the previous 3-4 years was from a kid of African immigrants. Had excellent grades (very close to a 4.0 UW) but a 1090 on the SAT (before TO). All of the other kids with a 4.0 and 1500+ SAT scores were rejected.

Similar situation at my kid's HS.

No one is getting admitted to Yale with a 1090 SAT.

Stop it.

DP here. URMs absolutely have lower test scores and GPAs for admittance to T25. You have to be really, really, really out of the loop not to know that. White kids and Asian kids would never get admitted with most of the URM scores and GPAs. It is not good or bad, it just is.

Not all T25 It's easier to get into some schools if you're white than black like Emory and Georgetown. And some of you don't realize that the top 1% of black test takers is a 1390 if I remember correctly so a 1350 for a black child is great compared to a 1450 for a white child.

This isn’t the brag you think it is.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:That's terrible people say rude things. Your daughter sounds amazing. Congrats on her acceptances!

I sincerely doubt that anyone says what OP is claiming, and I’ve been active in both private and public high schools. No one says that

Sure they say that. Maybe not as much to their face. Kid in my high school got accepted to an Ivy, was ranked somewhere around 5 in the class. No one else in the class attended an Ivy or anything close.

When my daughter was applying to colleges we used to go over the Naviance graphs. The one ivy acceptance (Yale) in my kids school in the previous 3-4 years was from a kid of African immigrants. Had excellent grades (very close to a 4.0 UW) but a 1090 on the SAT (before TO). All of the other kids with a 4.0 and 1500+ SAT scores were rejected.

Similar situation at my kid's HS.

No one is getting admitted to Yale with a 1090 SAT.

Stop it.

DP here. URMs absolutely have lower test scores and GPAs for admittance to T25. You have to be really, really, really out of the loop not to know that. White kids and Asian kids would never get admitted with most of the URM scores and GPAs. It is not good or bad, it just is.

Not all T25 It's easier to get into some schools if you're white than black like Emory and Georgetown. And some of you don't realize that the top 1% of black test takers is a 1390 if I remember correctly so a 1350 for a black child is great compared to a 1450 for a white child.