Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There is a complex history related to obvious unequal treatment of POC by both the police and judiciary systems.
police need more training but for that to be effective we need more research and data.

What the data say about police brutality and racial bias — and which reforms might work
Some interventions could help to reduce racism and rein in the use of unnecessary force in police work, but the evidence base is still evolving.

https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-020-01846-z

Political leaders and activists pushing for change in the United States have widely endorsed body-worn cameras, de-escalation training, implicit-bias training, early intervention systems, the banning of chokeholds, and civilian oversight since the tragedies of 2014. A survey of 47 of the largest US law-enforcement agencies between 2015 and 2017 found that 39% changed their use-of-force policies in 2015–16 and revised their training to incorporate tactics such as de-escalation. Among the agencies surveyed, officer-involved shootings dropped by 21% during the study period1


https://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2021/02/solving-racial-disparities-in-policing/

The history of racialized policing
Like many scholars, Khalil Gibran Muhammad, professor of history, race, and public policy at the Harvard Kennedy School, traces the history of policing in America to “slave patrols” in the antebellum South, in which white citizens were expected to help supervise the movements of enslaved Black people. This legacy, he believes, can still be seen in policing today. “The surveillance, the deputization essentially of all white men to be police officers or, in this case, slave patrollers, and then to dispense corporal punishment on the scene are all baked in from the very beginning,” he told NPR last year.
…
Policing and criminal justice system
Alexandra Natapoff, Lee S. Kreindler Professor of Law, sees policing as inexorably linked to the country’s criminal justice system and its long ties to racism.
“Policing does not stand alone or apart from how we charge people with crimes, or how we convict them, or how we treat them once they’ve been convicted,” she said. “That entire bundle of official practices is a central part of how we govern, and in particular, how we have historically governed Black people and other people of color, and economically and socially disadvantaged populations.”

These problems took a very long time to form and will not go away over night but we need to keep trying

For those with ears to hear … complex problems grown over long time require evidence based approaches to correct.

May Keenan not die in vain, may his death be a catalyst for better and longer police training .

How would you have handled the situation?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There is a complex history related to obvious unequal treatment of POC by both the police and judiciary systems.
police need more training but for that to be effective we need more research and data.

What the data say about police brutality and racial bias — and which reforms might work
Some interventions could help to reduce racism and rein in the use of unnecessary force in police work, but the evidence base is still evolving.

https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-020-01846-z

Political leaders and activists pushing for change in the United States have widely endorsed body-worn cameras, de-escalation training, implicit-bias training, early intervention systems, the banning of chokeholds, and civilian oversight since the tragedies of 2014. A survey of 47 of the largest US law-enforcement agencies between 2015 and 2017 found that 39% changed their use-of-force policies in 2015–16 and revised their training to incorporate tactics such as de-escalation. Among the agencies surveyed, officer-involved shootings dropped by 21% during the study period1


https://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2021/02/solving-racial-disparities-in-policing/

The history of racialized policing
Like many scholars, Khalil Gibran Muhammad, professor of history, race, and public policy at the Harvard Kennedy School, traces the history of policing in America to “slave patrols” in the antebellum South, in which white citizens were expected to help supervise the movements of enslaved Black people. This legacy, he believes, can still be seen in policing today. “The surveillance, the deputization essentially of all white men to be police officers or, in this case, slave patrollers, and then to dispense corporal punishment on the scene are all baked in from the very beginning,” he told NPR last year.
…
Policing and criminal justice system
Alexandra Natapoff, Lee S. Kreindler Professor of Law, sees policing as inexorably linked to the country’s criminal justice system and its long ties to racism.
“Policing does not stand alone or apart from how we charge people with crimes, or how we convict them, or how we treat them once they’ve been convicted,” she said. “That entire bundle of official practices is a central part of how we govern, and in particular, how we have historically governed Black people and other people of color, and economically and socially disadvantaged populations.”

These problems took a very long time to form and will not go away over night but we need to keep trying

For those with ears to hear … complex problems grown over long time require evidence based approaches to correct.

May Keenan not die in vain, may his death be a catalyst for better and longer police training .

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There is a complex history related to obvious unequal treatment of POC by both the police and judiciary systems.
police need more training but for that to be effective we need more research and data.

What the data say about police brutality and racial bias — and which reforms might work
Some interventions could help to reduce racism and rein in the use of unnecessary force in police work, but the evidence base is still evolving.

https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-020-01846-z

Political leaders and activists pushing for change in the United States have widely endorsed body-worn cameras, de-escalation training, implicit-bias training, early intervention systems, the banning of chokeholds, and civilian oversight since the tragedies of 2014. A survey of 47 of the largest US law-enforcement agencies between 2015 and 2017 found that 39% changed their use-of-force policies in 2015–16 and revised their training to incorporate tactics such as de-escalation. Among the agencies surveyed, officer-involved shootings dropped by 21% during the study period1


https://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2021/02/solving-racial-disparities-in-policing/

The history of racialized policing
Like many scholars, Khalil Gibran Muhammad, professor of history, race, and public policy at the Harvard Kennedy School, traces the history of policing in America to “slave patrols” in the antebellum South, in which white citizens were expected to help supervise the movements of enslaved Black people. This legacy, he believes, can still be seen in policing today. “The surveillance, the deputization essentially of all white men to be police officers or, in this case, slave patrollers, and then to dispense corporal punishment on the scene are all baked in from the very beginning,” he told NPR last year.
…
Policing and criminal justice system
Alexandra Natapoff, Lee S. Kreindler Professor of Law, sees policing as inexorably linked to the country’s criminal justice system and its long ties to racism.
“Policing does not stand alone or apart from how we charge people with crimes, or how we convict them, or how we treat them once they’ve been convicted,” she said. “That entire bundle of official practices is a central part of how we govern, and in particular, how we have historically governed Black people and other people of color, and economically and socially disadvantaged populations.”

These problems took a very long time to form and will not go away over night but we need to keep trying

For those with ears to hear … complex problems grown over long time require evidence based approaches to correct.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm sad by some of the posters here where in 2023 there is no personal responsibility or accountability for any personal actions and this is now acceptable to most of society. This man, a teacher who teaches kids, was high on cocaine, weed, who knows what else, causing car accidents in the middle of the road yet he will somehow be named a hero.

Does he deserve to die for that, you psychopath?

NP

I say frequently that personal responsibility has gone the way of the dodo.
He may not have DESERVED to die, but his death is not shocking considering his actions.

If some idiot runs out in front of a speeding train because he thinks he can beat it, and he dies, did he deserve to die? Nope. But, his death is not at all shocking and there is plenty he could have done to prevent it.

False equivalence

Police are trained to respond to such threats or lack thereof.

Speeding trains are not.

The level of force was way disproportionate to the threat he posed six armed officers.

I’m sure they are trained to tase people who are a danger to themselves or others. Which they did.

Yeah right - six of them on one terrified unarmed man in the ground pleading for his life and not resisting arrest.

Don’t let evidence or reality get in the way of your dogma …

He was resisting. It took multiple officers to hold him down. The officer with the taser warned him at least four times that he was going to taser him if he didn't stop resisting. Clearly he was terrified and irrational, not malevolent, but what would have been a better course of action? Let him just run off? Let him keep fighting back? If he had stopped resisting he wouldn't have been tased. If he had sat down on the sidewalk when asked and not run out into the street there would not have been a physical struggle.

A problem with the "stop resisting" position...is the position. In most video I've seen, the "resisting" individual is being ordered to do something at the same time some portion of their body is being forced into an unnatural position. You'd move (resist) too, if your arm/hand/head was forcibly held at an unnatural and painful angle.

Nobody believes that nonsense. Cops aren't UFC fighters. Comply with verbal commands or get tazed.

+1000

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm sad by some of the posters here where in 2023 there is no personal responsibility or accountability for any personal actions and this is now acceptable to most of society. This man, a teacher who teaches kids, was high on cocaine, weed, who knows what else, causing car accidents in the middle of the road yet he will somehow be named a hero.

Does he deserve to die for that, you psychopath?

NP

I say frequently that personal responsibility has gone the way of the dodo.
He may not have DESERVED to die, but his death is not shocking considering his actions.

If some idiot runs out in front of a speeding train because he thinks he can beat it, and he dies, did he deserve to die? Nope. But, his death is not at all shocking and there is plenty he could have done to prevent it.

False equivalence

Police are trained to respond to such threats or lack thereof.

Speeding trains are not.

The level of force was way disproportionate to the threat he posed six armed officers.

I’m sure they are trained to tase people who are a danger to themselves or others. Which they did.

Yeah right - six of them on one terrified unarmed man in the ground pleading for his life and not resisting arrest.

Don’t let evidence or reality get in the way of your dogma …

He was resisting. It took multiple officers to hold him down. The officer with the taser warned him at least four times that he was going to taser him if he didn't stop resisting. Clearly he was terrified and irrational, not malevolent, but what would have been a better course of action? Let him just run off? Let him keep fighting back? If he had stopped resisting he wouldn't have been tased. If he had sat down on the sidewalk when asked and not run out into the street there would not have been a physical struggle.

A problem with the "stop resisting" position...is the position. In most video I've seen, the "resisting" individual is being ordered to do something at the same time some portion of their body is being forced into an unnatural position. You'd move (resist) too, if your arm/hand/head was forcibly held at an unnatural and painful angle.

Nobody believes that nonsense. Cops aren't UFC fighters. Comply with verbal commands or get tazed.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There is a complex history related to obvious unequal treatment of POC by both the police and judiciary systems.
police need more training but for that to be effective we need more research and data.

What the data say about police brutality and racial bias — and which reforms might work
Some interventions could help to reduce racism and rein in the use of unnecessary force in police work, but the evidence base is still evolving.

https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-020-01846-z

Political leaders and activists pushing for change in the United States have widely endorsed body-worn cameras, de-escalation training, implicit-bias training, early intervention systems, the banning of chokeholds, and civilian oversight since the tragedies of 2014. A survey of 47 of the largest US law-enforcement agencies between 2015 and 2017 found that 39% changed their use-of-force policies in 2015–16 and revised their training to incorporate tactics such as de-escalation. Among the agencies surveyed, officer-involved shootings dropped by 21% during the study period1


https://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2021/02/solving-racial-disparities-in-policing/

The history of racialized policing
Like many scholars, Khalil Gibran Muhammad, professor of history, race, and public policy at the Harvard Kennedy School, traces the history of policing in America to “slave patrols” in the antebellum South, in which white citizens were expected to help supervise the movements of enslaved Black people. This legacy, he believes, can still be seen in policing today. “The surveillance, the deputization essentially of all white men to be police officers or, in this case, slave patrollers, and then to dispense corporal punishment on the scene are all baked in from the very beginning,” he told NPR last year.
…
Policing and criminal justice system
Alexandra Natapoff, Lee S. Kreindler Professor of Law, sees policing as inexorably linked to the country’s criminal justice system and its long ties to racism.
“Policing does not stand alone or apart from how we charge people with crimes, or how we convict them, or how we treat them once they’ve been convicted,” she said. “That entire bundle of official practices is a central part of how we govern, and in particular, how we have historically governed Black people and other people of color, and economically and socially disadvantaged populations.”

These problems took a very long time to form and will not go away over night but we need to keep trying

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is awful and hard to watch. My heart breaks for that poor man who was terrified that he was going to die at the hands of the police and actually did. Why did they cuff him when it was just a car accident? And he flagged them down? I don't understand any of this. That poor man.

I am going to guess his very erratic behavior, which the officer initially thought might be DUI-related but it turns out was more likely the result of the cocaine and marijuana shown to be in his system. I tend to judge against the police very quickly on these things and wonder why they had to tase him what seemed like 4 times, but I guess the drugs could explain that?

This video from the LAPD and timeline is interesting.

I do feel awful for him, his family and his students.

But he was unarmed and not a threat. There were also 4-5 armed cops vs. 1 unarmed man. He clearly needed help. I don't understand why he had to be tased. It makes no sense in most civilized countries that don't regularly kill people for traffic incidents

he may not have had a gun but a car can be a deadly weapon when you are under the influence of drugs or alcohol. I tho k we can see that from the accident he caused. He’s an adult and should have known better. Did he deserve to die? No. But his decisions got him here.

He was not a threat. AT no time were the officers in danger. They spoke with him and he was non-threatening. Police officers lack training to deal with someone in crisis. There is NO reason that man should've died for this.

Just stop this right now. He was in the wrong and people like you will never see that.

DP. He should most likely be in jail. Alive. I hope you can see the difference between the two

I hope YOU can see the difference between someone following the rules and this guy. Why can’t people just sit down when requested? He ran into the middle of the road and didn’t follow instructions. I guess if he got hit by a car you’d blame that on police as well. Just and fyi the rest of us are TIRED of fake racism. I’m the LA poster and at the protest location in my neighborhood) where there is always someone protesting (and often I will honk in agreement) there was one person there yesterday with their police brutality sign. One. The rest of us understand this is NOT George Floyd. Stop trying to make fetch happen. You’re not going to spread lies about my city. Gtfo.

So if your loved one gets killed by police for a traffic stop, you're fine with it? Because he didn't follow the rules? The punishment is death if you don't listen.

I have a feeling that you don't think the punishment is death when it's you and yours. That's not fake racism.

Do I think this is okay? No, obviously. But I would also be able to see, after watching the video, the part my loved one played in this situation. But you only see racism and police brutality in everything. You can’t see what other people see, and maybe that’s because of your own lives experience. The rest of us don’t see what you are seeing.

That is because you are a white woman, and you sit comfortably in the fact that this will likely never happen to you and yours. So you can sit in your bubble and make judgements knowing that you will suffer nothing near the same.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is awful and hard to watch. My heart breaks for that poor man who was terrified that he was going to die at the hands of the police and actually did. Why did they cuff him when it was just a car accident? And he flagged them down? I don't understand any of this. That poor man.

I am going to guess his very erratic behavior, which the officer initially thought might be DUI-related but it turns out was more likely the result of the cocaine and marijuana shown to be in his system. I tend to judge against the police very quickly on these things and wonder why they had to tase him what seemed like 4 times, but I guess the drugs could explain that?

This video from the LAPD and timeline is interesting.

I do feel awful for him, his family and his students.

But he was unarmed and not a threat. There were also 4-5 armed cops vs. 1 unarmed man. He clearly needed help. I don't understand why he had to be tased. It makes no sense in most civilized countries that don't regularly kill people for traffic incidents

he may not have had a gun but a car can be a deadly weapon when you are under the influence of drugs or alcohol. I tho k we can see that from the accident he caused. He’s an adult and should have known better. Did he deserve to die? No. But his decisions got him here.

How many children did he put at risk, driving around in that condition before he crashed his vehicle?

If we're talking about actions prior to the arrival of the police, then you're fine with them deciding he was a danger 15 minutes ago and executing him?

No one "executed him." He died 5 hours later, after being transported (by the authorities) to the hospital. That doesn’t mean every aspect of this encounter was handled correctly but we have to get the facts right.

"Executed" is false and not helpful.

Neither is minimizing his death, and effectively shrugging your shoulders at this.
He died due to a cardiac arrest which was clearly caused by the tasing. It may have been 5 hrs later but there is clear cause and effect. It was not necessary to tase him for as long as he did. He was out of the car, he was on the ground and subdued by multiple officers. IF 5 trained police officers do not know what to do with an unarmed, frightened man then the police have a HUGE training issue - which we have seen repeatedly.

Anonymous wrote:There is a complex history related to obvious unequal treatment of POC by both the police and judiciary systems.
police need more training but for that to be effective we need more research and data.

What the data say about police brutality and racial bias — and which reforms might work
Some interventions could help to reduce racism and rein in the use of unnecessary force in police work, but the evidence base is still evolving.

https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-020-01846-z

Political leaders and activists pushing for change in the United States have widely endorsed body-worn cameras, de-escalation training, implicit-bias training, early intervention systems, the banning of chokeholds, and civilian oversight since the tragedies of 2014. A survey of 47 of the largest US law-enforcement agencies between 2015 and 2017 found that 39% changed their use-of-force policies in 2015–16 and revised their training to incorporate tactics such as de-escalation. Among the agencies surveyed, officer-involved shootings dropped by 21% during the study period1


https://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2021/02/solving-racial-disparities-in-policing/

The history of racialized policing
Like many scholars, Khalil Gibran Muhammad, professor of history, race, and public policy at the Harvard Kennedy School, traces the history of policing in America to “slave patrols” in the antebellum South, in which white citizens were expected to help supervise the movements of enslaved Black people. This legacy, he believes, can still be seen in policing today. “The surveillance, the deputization essentially of all white men to be police officers or, in this case, slave patrollers, and then to dispense corporal punishment on the scene are all baked in from the very beginning,” he told NPR last year.
…
Policing and criminal justice system
Alexandra Natapoff, Lee S. Kreindler Professor of Law, sees policing as inexorably linked to the country’s criminal justice system and its long ties to racism.
“Policing does not stand alone or apart from how we charge people with crimes, or how we convict them, or how we treat them once they’ve been convicted,” she said. “That entire bundle of official practices is a central part of how we govern, and in particular, how we have historically governed Black people and other people of color, and economically and socially disadvantaged populations.”

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:TLDR

THIS WOULD NEVER HAVE HAPPENED TO A WHITE BOY.

AND YOU ALL KNOW THAT.

False. It has happened to white people. And you know that.

What we know is that it is much more likely to happen to people of color
- and the historic reasons and practical solutions are complex but important to work on.

"Much more likely to happen" is not the same thing as "always."

Are you the pp that said in all caps "WOULD NEVER HAVE HAPPENED TO A WHITE BOY?"

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is awful and hard to watch. My heart breaks for that poor man who was terrified that he was going to die at the hands of the police and actually did. Why did they cuff him when it was just a car accident? And he flagged them down? I don't understand any of this. That poor man.

I am going to guess his very erratic behavior, which the officer initially thought might be DUI-related but it turns out was more likely the result of the cocaine and marijuana shown to be in his system. I tend to judge against the police very quickly on these things and wonder why they had to tase him what seemed like 4 times, but I guess the drugs could explain that?

This video from the LAPD and timeline is interesting.

I do feel awful for him, his family and his students.

But he was unarmed and not a threat. There were also 4-5 armed cops vs. 1 unarmed man. He clearly needed help. I don't understand why he had to be tased. It makes no sense in most civilized countries that don't regularly kill people for traffic incidents

LE are 100% aware that Tasing doesn't work on people who are high on drugs. Also, pepper spray doesn't work on people who are high on drugs. Hospital ER's are well aware of this as well, because they have to deal with these people ALL THE TIME.

The more interesting question here is why a school teacher was high on drugs. I'd be concerned if my kid's teacher had a drug habit.

Good point why was a teacher, in the middle of the school day high on coke and week, causing DUI accidents and running in the middle of the street during school hours? There is more to this story here.

Anonymous wrote:Moral of this story for young black men:

-don't do enough cocaine that you're high as a kite and paranoid
-don't drive while high
-don't resist police arrest

Anonymous wrote:[/url]https://wtop.com/dc/2023/01/dc-teacher-dies-after-los-angeles-police-encounter/[url]

Another senseless death.