Anonymous
Post 01/13/2023 17:34     Subject: Should Biden even continue as POTUS?
Or have they had the classified documents illegally in their possession for 6+ years (since Obama era)?

Hmmmm
Anonymous
Post 01/13/2023 17:30     Subject: Should Biden even continue as POTUS?
Anonymous wrote:I voted for Biden and was happy he won. Except for Border issue, he has done a great job so far. But I am appalled to read that a second set of highly classified documents were located in Biden’s garage in his Delaware home. In my opinion, Trump should be charged and prosecuted for his criminal behavior with classified documents. Likewise, Biden should be investigated to get to the bottom of his mishandling of classified documents. In the meantime, in my opinion, the honorable thing for Biden to do is to step aside and let Kamala Harris be acting POTUS. Any ordinary citizen would have been in handcuffs by now


That's funny, because ordinary citizens accidentally mishandle and misplace classified documents all the time, and they are almost never prosecuted. Presidents included. What matters is what happens when they locate the document - like, did they just give it back to the appropriate agency, or did they hide it and lie about having it for two years until the govt had to raid their home to get it back?
Anonymous
Post 01/13/2023 17:27     Subject: Should Biden even continue as POTUS?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
That makes sense with the documents found in his office. This is much less plausible for the top secret documents found in his garage, next to his corvette, in an envelope labeled "personal and confidential." Classified documents are required to be double wrapped and the outer wrapping (envelope or whatever) has to be labeled with the classification. So someone went out of their way to conceal the documents as personal effects and then in his garage. Either there is a vast right wing conspiracy against Biden, as a pp suggested, or Biden or someone in Biden's camp essentially concealed and smugggled out of a SCIF and into Biden's garage.

I've never been to a West Wing office, but I have a feeling that people like POTUS or VP don't head downstairs to the Situation Room every time they need to read something classified. So it seems inevitable that there would be some improper mixing of classified documents and personal effects, and improper storage leads to improper packing, which leads to the even more improper storage in the garage.

Hanlon's Razor, really.


Tell us more about this “feeling” you have. Do you also hear “voices” in your head?

Not PP but a close family member used to be the daily briefer for the then-SecDef. Portions of the daily brief are certainly classified and you don’t brief the principal in a SCIF every time.
Anonymous
Post 01/13/2023 17:25     Subject: Should Biden even continue as POTUS?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I voted for Biden and was happy he won. Except for Border issue, he has done a great job so far. But I am appalled to read that a second set of highly classified documents were located in Biden’s garage in his Delaware home. In my opinion, Trump should be charged and prosecuted for his criminal behavior with classified documents. Likewise, Biden should be investigated to get to the bottom of his mishandling of classified documents. In the meantime, in my opinion, the honorable thing for Biden to do is to step aside and let Kamala Harris be acting POTUS. Any ordinary citizen would have been in handcuffs by now


If you really believe this than you're a fool. "Any ordinary citizen" would not be in handcuffs now (e.g. A, Trump is not and he willfully obstructed the attempts to get those documents back).

Biden and team are cooperating, as he should.


Biden had no power to declassify when he took the documents. Trump did


Trump may have had the power, but he didn't actually declassify them


Didn't he declassify by simply thinking to himself "all papers declassified.

His lawyers never said they were declassified in court.
Anonymous
Post 01/13/2023 17:11     Subject: Re:Should Biden even continue as POTUS?
Hanlon's razor: Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity
Anonymous
Post 01/13/2023 16:46     Subject: Should Biden even continue as POTUS?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I believe this is a Democratic setup. Kamala (or someone in her camp) planted the documents in order to push Biden out.


That makes ZERO sense, simply from the perspective of access. Look at the facts as we know them:

1) Kamala had NO access to these places. None. Zero. Therefore she couldn’t have been responsible for planting them.

2) The secret service is heavily infiltrated with trumpers.

3) The secret service has access to every one of these places, even when the president is not there.



With just those three FACTS - and they are absolute FACTS - in mind, the most obvious scenario here is that the documents were planted by members of the secret service who are trumpers.

Someone earlier mentioned Hakim’s Razor. Well the simplest explanation according to that is that the documents were planted by trump operatives within the secret service. Any other scenario would call for more unsupported assumptions and is therefore less likely.

It really IS just this simple.


LOL Hakim's razor? The simplest explanation is that Trump masterminded this plan in 2017? You may want to look up the word fact.

Definition and explanation
Occam's razor (also known as the 'law of parsimony') is a philosophical tool for 'shaving off' unlikely explanations. Essentially, when faced with competing explanations for the same phenomenon, the simplest is likely the correct one.
Anonymous
Post 01/13/2023 16:43     Subject: Should Biden even continue as POTUS?
Anonymous wrote:I haven't read all posts but a new book coming out says that Biden is suspicious that Secret Service is still loyal to Trump. Apparently, one of the dog bites was in private quarters where SS do not go so how could it have happened.

I wonder if these papers were not planted by SS who are still loyal to Trump.


Yes, a lot of people are coming to that realization

https://www.nationalreview.com/news/house-democrat-suggests-classified-documents-may-have-been-planted-in-bidens-garage/


When even rightwing nutter publications are discussing this, it’s a thing. Where there’s smoke there’s fire.

Anonymous
Post 01/13/2023 16:39     Subject: Should Biden even continue as POTUS?
Anonymous wrote:What did Biden know? And when did he know it?


He certainly knew he had trump supporters within the secret service. And he worried about it. That’s what he knew. And he was worried for good reason.

https://www.vox.com/2023/1/13/23553350/joe-biden-chris-whipple-book


I fear for his actual personal safety from an insider threat within secret service. If they’ll plant documents, then nothing else is beyond suspicion as well.
Anonymous
Post 01/13/2023 16:35     Subject: Should Biden even continue as POTUS?
Anonymous wrote:I believe this is a Democratic setup. Kamala (or someone in her camp) planted the documents in order to push Biden out.


That makes ZERO sense, simply from the perspective of access. Look at the facts as we know them:

1) Kamala had NO access to these places. None. Zero. Therefore she couldn’t have been responsible for planting them.

2) The secret service is heavily infiltrated with trumpers.

3) The secret service has access to every one of these places, even when the president is not there.



With just those three FACTS - and they are absolute FACTS - in mind, the most obvious scenario here is that the documents were planted by members of the secret service who are trumpers.

Someone earlier mentioned Hakim’s Razor. Well the simplest explanation according to that is that the documents were planted by trump operatives within the secret service. Any other scenario would call for more unsupported assumptions and is therefore less likely.

It really IS just this simple.
Anonymous
Post 01/13/2023 16:20     Subject: Should Biden even continue as POTUS?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I voted for Biden and was happy he won. Except for Border issue, he has done a great job so far. But I am appalled to read that a second set of highly classified documents were located in Biden’s garage in his Delaware home. In my opinion, Trump should be charged and prosecuted for his criminal behavior with classified documents. Likewise, Biden should be investigated to get to the bottom of his mishandling of classified documents. In the meantime, in my opinion, the honorable thing for Biden to do is to step aside and let Kamala Harris be acting POTUS. Any ordinary citizen would have been in handcuffs by now


Are you just beyond stupid? Trump had multiple opportunities to return HUNDREDS of classified documents and refused. Then he received a subpoena and still refused!

OTOH, Biden's lawyers contacted appropriate agencies immediately and returned them. Can you understand the difference?

I often think there should be a minimum IQ to post on DCUM. particularly in the Politics forum.



It's possible that Trump committed a crime and then committed more crimes covering up that crime. It's also possible the Biden committed the same crime, but didn't commit and additional crime covering it up


It's possible that the sky will fall tomorrow but highly unlikely if not impossible
One of the major differences is that Trump has larceny in his soul and Biden doesn't. I bet it comes out that Trump tried to sell some of the classified document.
Anonymous
Post 01/13/2023 16:15     Subject: Should Biden even continue as POTUS?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
If we go with that-- that the West Wing is an exclusion zone for normal handling procedures-- then the case against Trump doesnt make sense.

I agree, the initial part of the case against Trump doesn't make sense. But everything Trump did since initially learning that NARA wanted the documents? That part of the case still makes sense.


No one involved disputes that Trump's attorney was in the process of arranging for the return of the documents at the time of the raid.

So, the behavior of Biden and Trump are the same. The actions of the DOJ are different.

Perhaps politics may be at play?


Are we just making s—— up as we go now?
No. Trump’s lawyers weren’t arranging anything. And there shouldn’t have been any back and forth.
Please see Biden as an example of how it’s supposed to go down.
Documents found or requested?
They are immediately handed over.
Anonymous
Post 01/13/2023 16:08     Subject: Should Biden even continue as POTUS?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I voted for Biden and was happy he won. Except for Border issue, he has done a great job so far. But I am appalled to read that a second set of highly classified documents were located in Biden’s garage in his Delaware home. In my opinion, Trump should be charged and prosecuted for his criminal behavior with classified documents. Likewise, Biden should be investigated to get to the bottom of his mishandling of classified documents. In the meantime, in my opinion, the honorable thing for Biden to do is to step aside and let Kamala Harris be acting POTUS. Any ordinary citizen would have been in handcuffs by now


If you really believe this than you're a fool. "Any ordinary citizen" would not be in handcuffs now (e.g. A, Trump is not and he willfully obstructed the attempts to get those documents back).

Biden and team are cooperating, as he should.


Biden had no power to declassify when he took the documents. Trump did


Trump may have had the power, but he didn't actually declassify them


Didn't he declassify by simply thinking to himself "all papers declassified.
Anonymous
Post 01/13/2023 16:04     Subject: Should Biden even continue as POTUS?
I haven't read all posts but a new book coming out says that Biden is suspicious that Secret Service is still loyal to Trump. Apparently, one of the dog bites was in private quarters where SS do not go so how could it have happened.

I wonder if these papers were not planted by SS who are still loyal to Trump.
Anonymous
Post 01/13/2023 15:59     Subject: Should Biden even continue as POTUS?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I believe this is a Democratic setup. Kamala (or someone in her camp) planted the documents in order to push Biden out.

And we thought all the crazy was on the R side.


Pp is a Republican troll.
Anonymous
Post 01/13/2023 15:50     Subject: Should Biden even continue as POTUS?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
If we go with that-- that the West Wing is an exclusion zone for normal handling procedures-- then the case against Trump doesnt make sense.

I agree, the initial part of the case against Trump doesn't make sense. But everything Trump did since initially learning that NARA wanted the documents? That part of the case still makes sense.


No one involved disputes that Trump's attorney was in the process of arranging for the return of the documents at the time of the raid.

So, the behavior of Biden and Trump are the same. The actions of the DOJ are different.

Perhaps politics may be at play?


You are gaslighting. Trump's attorneys lied and said they had personally searched and found no more documents when they had not searched. No one on Trump's team had searched MAL for more documents. No one.