Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My ancestors once owned most of Europe and then got pushed to the edge of the North Atlantic and dominated by England for 1500 years. I seek to know what they did wrong.

That’s probably irrelevant, but if you are a citizen of a country like the UK, which still has colonies, or the US, which is currently violating treaties with tribal governments, you are—as a current citizen of a democratic government—responsible for what *your* country is doing *now* and to address prior wrongs of the country you are a citizen of. You can’t inherit guilt but you do inherit the responsibilities of your country.

I think I have learned that rule number one in human history is don’t lose wars.

OMG your reading comprehension is so poor and your knowledge of US history is apparently non-existent. The US didn't annex most territories by fighting wars. The country signed legal agreements with sovereign nations that believed they were negotiating in good faith. The Senate ratified the treaties and the President signed them. This isn't a "winners vs losers" issue. This is "the United States government is refusing to pay its legal debts and honor its promises" issue. If you are a citizen of the US, this is actually your problem.

You are quite foolish if you do not understand that war is fought in many ways. The winners still win and the losers still lose even if a single shot was never fired.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I would never consider myself Native American.

But I’m not from anywhere else. My most recent ancestor born outside of US was 1859. The oldest people in what is now US were here before it was called that. I can’t trace the records back, farthest back I can try (too time consuming right now to get this exactly right) was 1645. Originally French (so stop assuming all came from UK).

I am not an American Indian or a Native American but I am certainly a native American. I was born in the US, my parents were born in the US, some of my grandparents came here from various countries, and other ancestors came here before that from other countries. One of my cousins is a member of the DAR. I am not native to anywhere else, I am native to the US.

We can discuss colonizers and oppressors, etc., but that doesn't somehow un-native me. If someone asks me to go back to where I came from, it's here. This is where I came from. (Not DC, I'm not a DC native.)

You are clueless. And how sad this comes on the first day back after the federal holiday “Indigenous People’s Day.”

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My ancestors once owned most of Europe and then got pushed to the edge of the North Atlantic and dominated by England for 1500 years. I seek to know what they did wrong.

That’s probably irrelevant, but if you are a citizen of a country like the UK, which still has colonies, or the US, which is currently violating treaties with tribal governments, you are—as a current citizen of a democratic government—responsible for what *your* country is doing *now* and to address prior wrongs of the country you are a citizen of. You can’t inherit guilt but you do inherit the responsibilities of your country.

I think I have learned that rule number one in human history is don’t lose wars.

OMG your reading comprehension is so poor and your knowledge of US history is apparently non-existent. The US didn't annex most territories by fighting wars. The country signed legal agreements with sovereign nations that believed they were negotiating in good faith. The Senate ratified the treaties and the President signed them. This isn't a "winners vs losers" issue. This is "the United States government is refusing to pay its legal debts and honor its promises" issue. If you are a citizen of the US, this is actually your problem.

Well, if the Indian nations thought they could make the US government do what they wanted, they would use their power (military, financial, etc.) to force it. But they can't, because they cannot win a war against the US.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My ancestors once owned most of Europe and then got pushed to the edge of the North Atlantic and dominated by England for 1500 years. I seek to know what they did wrong.

That’s probably irrelevant, but if you are a citizen of a country like the UK, which still has colonies, or the US, which is currently violating treaties with tribal governments, you are—as a current citizen of a democratic government—responsible for what *your* country is doing *now* and to address prior wrongs of the country you are a citizen of. You can’t inherit guilt but you do inherit the responsibilities of your country.

I think I have learned that rule number one in human history is don’t lose wars.

OMG your reading comprehension is so poor and your knowledge of US history is apparently non-existent. The US didn't annex most territories by fighting wars. The country signed legal agreements with sovereign nations that believed they were negotiating in good faith. The Senate ratified the treaties and the President signed them. This isn't a "winners vs losers" issue. This is "the United States government is refusing to pay its legal debts and honor its promises" issue. If you are a citizen of the US, this is actually your problem.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My ancestors once owned most of Europe and then got pushed to the edge of the North Atlantic and dominated by England for 1500 years. I seek to know what they did wrong.

That’s probably irrelevant, but if you are a citizen of a country like the UK, which still has colonies, or the US, which is currently violating treaties with tribal governments, you are—as a current citizen of a democratic government—responsible for what *your* country is doing *now* and to address prior wrongs of the country you are a citizen of. You can’t inherit guilt but you do inherit the responsibilities of your country.

I think I have learned that rule number one in human history is don’t lose wars.

You didn't already know that?

I figured it out when I was 3 or 4 and dealing with siblings and classmates.

To the victor go the spoils. I guess people these days want to enjoy the spoils but just don't want the losers to feel bad about it. But, the former have no intention of ever giving up the spoils.

Anonymous wrote:I would never consider myself Native American.

But I’m not from anywhere else. My most recent ancestor born outside of US was 1859. The oldest people in what is now US were here before it was called that. I can’t trace the records back, farthest back I can try (too time consuming right now to get this exactly right) was 1645. Originally French (so stop assuming all came from UK).

I am not an American Indian or a Native American but I am certainly a native American. I was born in the US, my parents were born in the US, some of my grandparents came here from various countries, and other ancestors came here before that from other countries. One of my cousins is a member of the DAR. I am not native to anywhere else, I am native to the US.

We can discuss colonizers and oppressors, etc., but that doesn't somehow un-native me. If someone asks me to go back to where I came from, it's here. This is where I came from. (Not DC, I'm not a DC native.)

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My ancestors once owned most of Europe and then got pushed to the edge of the North Atlantic and dominated by England for 1500 years. I seek to know what they did wrong.

That’s probably irrelevant, but if you are a citizen of a country like the UK, which still has colonies, or the US, which is currently violating treaties with tribal governments, you are—as a current citizen of a democratic government—responsible for what *your* country is doing *now* and to address prior wrongs of the country you are a citizen of. You can’t inherit guilt but you do inherit the responsibilities of your country.

I think I have learned that rule number one in human history is don’t lose wars.

You didn't already know that?

I figured it out when I was 3 or 4 and dealing with siblings and classmates.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My ancestors once owned most of Europe and then got pushed to the edge of the North Atlantic and dominated by England for 1500 years. I seek to know what they did wrong.

That’s probably irrelevant, but if you are a citizen of a country like the UK, which still has colonies, or the US, which is currently violating treaties with tribal governments, you are—as a current citizen of a democratic government—responsible for what *your* country is doing *now* and to address prior wrongs of the country you are a citizen of. You can’t inherit guilt but you do inherit the responsibilities of your country.

I think I have learned that rule number one in human history is don’t lose wars.

You didn't already know that?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My ancestors once owned most of Europe and then got pushed to the edge of the North Atlantic and dominated by England for 1500 years. I seek to know what they did wrong.

That’s probably irrelevant, but if you are a citizen of a country like the UK, which still has colonies, or the US, which is currently violating treaties with tribal governments, you are—as a current citizen of a democratic government—responsible for what *your* country is doing *now* and to address prior wrongs of the country you are a citizen of. You can’t inherit guilt but you do inherit the responsibilities of your country.

I think I have learned that rule number one in human history is don’t lose wars.

Anonymous wrote:The Native Americans were a civilization still in the Stone Age... The Spanish and English and other Europeans were more advanced technologically and used it to their advantage. Was it right or moral thing to do ??? Definitely not according to modern day standards, but to the mindset of the time, who knows. It went down, and there is nothing we can do by feeling sorry for dead people or mad at other dead people.

Exact same argument used then to justify slavery and now to avoid dealing with any of the after effects. Hand wave. Nothing we can do. Not my problem....I'm apparently just a bystander in my own country.

I would never consider myself Native American.

But I’m not from anywhere else. My most recent ancestor born outside of US was 1859. The oldest people in what is now US were here before it was called that. I can’t trace the records back, farthest back I can try (too time consuming right now to get this exactly right) was 1645. Originally French (so stop assuming all came from UK).

Anonymous wrote:The Native Americans were a civilization still in the Stone Age... The Spanish and English and other Europeans were more advanced technologically and used it to their advantage. Was it right or moral thing to do ??? Definitely not according to modern day standards, but to the mindset of the time, who knows. It went down, and there is nothing we can do by feeling sorry for dead people or mad at other dead people.

What? Before they even went on the Trail of Tears the Cherokee had a written language, schools, churches, a newspaper, and sent diplomats to DC. They successfully sued the State of Georgia in the US Supreme Court for illegally allowing white encroachment on Cherokee (aka foreign) territory, but President Jackson refused to enforce the court order.

It was definitively not the right thing to do by todays standards because we were under the Constitution then and we are under the Constitution now. It is the same country and the same laws and the same treaties.

And what do you mean “there is nothing we can do”? There are literally Senate-ratified treaties the US government is in violation of that it could come into compliance with immediately.

The Native Americans were a civilization still in the Stone Age... The Spanish and English and other Europeans were more advanced technologically and used it to their advantage. Was it right or moral thing to do ??? Definitely not according to modern day standards, but to the mindset of the time, who knows. It went down, and there is nothing we can do by feeling sorry for dead people or mad at other dead people.

Anonymous wrote:My ancestors once owned most of Europe and then got pushed to the edge of the North Atlantic and dominated by England for 1500 years. I seek to know what they did wrong.

That’s probably irrelevant, but if you are a citizen of a country like the UK, which still has colonies, or the US, which is currently violating treaties with tribal governments, you are—as a current citizen of a democratic government—responsible for what *your* country is doing *now* and to address prior wrongs of the country you are a citizen of. You can’t inherit guilt but you do inherit the responsibilities of your country.

My ancestors once owned most of Europe and then got pushed to the edge of the North Atlantic and dominated by England for 1500 years. I seek to know what they did wrong.