Just because redrawing boundaries won't raise scores doesn't mean the boundaries don't need to be redrawn. Clearly, some of these schools are severely overcrowded, and boundaries need to be redrawn.

Just because redrawing those boundaries such that it evens out the FARMs a bit won't raise test scores, it doesn't mean that evening out FARMs is a bad idea.

There are four factors in drawing boundaries, and unfortunately, they can't all have equal weight. It just doesn't work. Something's gotta give.

OP's point seems to be that some people who are pro-boundary changes seem to present Einstein as a school that needs additional higher income students. As if somehow adding more higher income students will make Einstein 'better'. Even though, the families who are already there, think Einstein is fine just the way it is.

We're not at Einstein, but another lower income school, and many families in our cluster feel the same way.

Sigh I guess we are going to discuss Einstein yet again. I have seen numerous posts from someone about how you should buy in the Einstein cluster because if it gets rezoned to Woodward or somewhere even better you will get a windfall. It certainly seems like more than a few people are hoping to get zoned out of Einstein. This makes absolutely no sense though as why would MCPS move UMC kids out of Einstein and into a higher performing school filled with other UMC kids? If anyone gets moved out of Einstein it will be the low performing kids.

As for more UMC coming into Einstein, where are these kids going to come from? Do you really think that people who bought into Whitman or BCC will send their kids to Einstein? Those are the wealthiest areas in the entire county and you can't swing a cat in Bethesda or Silver Spring without hitting a private school.

You might succeed in shipping some poor students out of Einstein but this won't be enough to raise Einstein's scores without backfilling them with wealthy students. You will still have a low performing school, its just less crowded. You may succeed in dropping the scores of BCC or Whitman but it won't be by that much. Even if you could move enough low income kids to force the scores to drop, they would still be higher than Einstein. The housing prices in Whitman and BCC would soften making those houses more affordable and fewer people would be pushed into buying in the Einstein cluster so you just made Einstein poorer again.

This is all behavioral economics. Things don't work out they way you personally wish they will work out. They work out based on people's economic behaviors. Someone needs to do some modeling and factor in real economic behaviors.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I’m sure that ALL families don’t appreciate hearing negative attitudes about their current schools. For example, every time someone talks about Kensington schools and moving boundaries, they take the opportunity to bad mouth Einstein while at the same time bad mouthing Kensington families who don’t go to Einstein.

The Einstein families and students are proud of their school. Einstein is not “stigmatized.” Future speakers should take care not to openly criticize schools or families who’ve made a choice about where to live.

Good grief, could you please get help for your deep insecurity about being zoned within Einstein and being looked down upon. No one has even brought up Einstein. Even if they did what does it matter? We're you not aware of Einstein's scores, drop out rates and other issues when you moved there? Who moves into Einstein and then freaks out when they see people point out all the low scores? It would be like moving into the agricultural reserve and then freaking out if people said you lived out in the boonies.

DP

Actually, someone specifically called out Einstein when talking about this at the last meeting.

OP's point seems to be that some people who are pro-boundary changes seem to present Einstein as a school that needs additional higher income students. As if somehow adding more higher income students will make Einstein 'better'. Even though, the families who are already there, think Einstein is fine just the way it is.

We're not at Einstein, but another lower income school, and many families in our cluster feel the same way.

Haven't you heard? Rich Whites and Asians are like Pixie Dust - sprinkle a little into any school and instantly the school gets better!

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I’m sure that ALL families don’t appreciate hearing negative attitudes about their current schools. For example, every time someone talks about Kensington schools and moving boundaries, they take the opportunity to bad mouth Einstein while at the same time bad mouthing Kensington families who don’t go to Einstein.

The Einstein families and students are proud of their school. Einstein is not “stigmatized.” Future speakers should take care not to openly criticize schools or families who’ve made a choice about where to live.

Good grief, could you please get help for your deep insecurity about being zoned within Einstein and being looked down upon. No one has even brought up Einstein. Even if they did what does it matter? We're you not aware of Einstein's scores, drop out rates and other issues when you moved there? Who moves into Einstein and then freaks out when they see people point out all the low scores? It would be like moving into the agricultural reserve and then freaking out if people said you lived out in the boonies.

DP

Actually, someone specifically called out Einstein when talking about this at the last meeting.

OP's point seems to be that some people who are pro-boundary changes seem to present Einstein as a school that needs additional higher income students. As if somehow adding more higher income students will make Einstein 'better'. Even though, the families who are already there, think Einstein is fine just the way it is.

We're not at Einstein, but another lower income school, and many families in our cluster feel the same way.

Yes, replace Einstein with Seneca Valley, if you’d like. Same issue.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
I’m sure that ALL families don’t appreciate hearing negative attitudes about their current schools. For example, every time someone talks about Kensington schools and moving boundaries, they take the opportunity to bad mouth Einstein while at the same time bad mouthing Kensington families who don’t go to Einstein.

The Einstein families and students are proud of their school. Einstein is not “stigmatized.” Future speakers should take care not to openly criticize schools or families who’ve made a choice about where to live.


Good grief, could you please get help for your deep insecurity about being zoned within Einstein and being looked down upon. No one has even brought up Einstein. Even if they did what does it matter? We're you not aware of Einstein's scores, drop out rates and other issues when you moved there? Who moves into Einstein and then freaks out when they see people point out all the low scores? It would be like moving into the agricultural reserve and then freaking out if people said you lived out in the boonies.


DP. You have the same comment for the people who complain of "W-bashing" on DCUM, right?

I doubt you are a different poster. You are very likely the insecure Einstein poster and probably the biggest W basher -who knows. Ask yourself this -why is it that you are always defending or deeply disturbed by any perceived slight to Einstein yet you don't see these types of posts about Northwood, Wheaton, Kennedy, GHS, etc etc. You are always bringing up Einstein. Just let it go.

Oh good. Grief. Yes, I am a different poster. No, I don't live anywhere near any of those schools.

Not everything is about test scores. There’s a lot of nice kids and families at Einstein and at all the schools.

My point is that some of the speakers at the meeting seem to think they are advocating for diversity and the boundary study, but really they are criticizing some of our schools. Not necessary to point out how crappy you may think these schools are (for whatever reason) and that’s why we must move boundaries.

A lot of students and families love their schools. It’s what they know. The speakers need to be more careful with their words and don’t need to inform the county about how crappy the schools are.

Anonymous wrote:
I’m sure that ALL families don’t appreciate hearing negative attitudes about their current schools. For example, every time someone talks about Kensington schools and moving boundaries, they take the opportunity to bad mouth Einstein while at the same time bad mouthing Kensington families who don’t go to Einstein.

The Einstein families and students are proud of their school. Einstein is not “stigmatized.” Future speakers should take care not to openly criticize schools or families who’ve made a choice about where to live.


Good grief, could you please get help for your deep insecurity about being zoned within Einstein and being looked down upon. No one has even brought up Einstein. Even if they did what does it matter? We're you not aware of Einstein's scores, drop out rates and other issues when you moved there? Who moves into Einstein and then freaks out when they see people point out all the low scores? It would be like moving into the agricultural reserve and then freaking out if people said you lived out in the boonies.


DP. You have the same comment for the people who complain of "W-bashing" on DCUM, right?

I doubt you are a different poster. You are very likely the insecure Einstein poster and probably the biggest W basher -who knows. Ask yourself this -why is it that you are always defending or deeply disturbed by any perceived slight to Einstein yet you don't see these types of posts about Northwood, Wheaton, Kennedy, GHS, etc etc. You are always bringing up Einstein. Just let it go.

Anonymous wrote:

I’m sure that ALL families don’t appreciate hearing negative attitudes about their current schools. For example, every time someone talks about Kensington schools and moving boundaries, they take the opportunity to bad mouth Einstein while at the same time bad mouthing Kensington families who don’t go to Einstein.

The Einstein families and students are proud of their school. Einstein is not “stigmatized.” Future speakers should take care not to openly criticize schools or families who’ve made a choice about where to live.

Good grief, could you please get help for your deep insecurity about being zoned within Einstein and being looked down upon. No one has even brought up Einstein. Even if they did what does it matter? We're you not aware of Einstein's scores, drop out rates and other issues when you moved there? Who moves into Einstein and then freaks out when they see people point out all the low scores? It would be like moving into the agricultural reserve and then freaking out if people said you lived out in the boonies.

DP

Actually, someone specifically called out Einstein when talking about this at the last meeting.

OP's point seems to be that some people who are pro-boundary changes seem to present Einstein as a school that needs additional higher income students. As if somehow adding more higher income students will make Einstein 'better'. Even though, the families who are already there, think Einstein is fine just the way it is.

We're not at Einstein, but another lower income school, and many families in our cluster feel the same way.

Anonymous wrote:

I’m sure that ALL families don’t appreciate hearing negative attitudes about their current schools. For example, every time someone talks about Kensington schools and moving boundaries, they take the opportunity to bad mouth Einstein while at the same time bad mouthing Kensington families who don’t go to Einstein.

The Einstein families and students are proud of their school. Einstein is not “stigmatized.” Future speakers should take care not to openly criticize schools or families who’ve made a choice about where to live.

Good grief, could you please get help for your deep insecurity about being zoned within Einstein and being looked down upon. No one has even brought up Einstein. Even if they did what does it matter? We're you not aware of Einstein's scores, drop out rates and other issues when you moved there? Who moves into Einstein and then freaks out when they see people point out all the low scores? It would be like moving into the agricultural reserve and then freaking out if people said you lived out in the boonies.

DP. You have the same comment for the people who complain of "W-bashing" on DCUM, right?

I’m sure that ALL families don’t appreciate hearing negative attitudes about their current schools. For example, every time someone talks about Kensington schools and moving boundaries, they take the opportunity to bad mouth Einstein while at the same time bad mouthing Kensington families who don’t go to Einstein.

The Einstein families and students are proud of their school. Einstein is not “stigmatized.” Future speakers should take care not to openly criticize schools or families who’ve made a choice about where to live.

Good grief, could you please get help for your deep insecurity about being zoned within Einstein and being looked down upon. No one has even brought up Einstein. Even if they did what does it matter? We're you not aware of Einstein's scores, drop out rates and other issues when you moved there? Who moves into Einstein and then freaks out when they see people point out all the low scores? It would be like moving into the agricultural reserve and then freaking out if people said you lived out in the boonies.

I’m sure that ALL families don’t appreciate hearing negative attitudes about their current schools. For example, every time someone talks about Kensington schools and moving boundaries, they take the opportunity to bad mouth Einstein while at the same time bad mouthing Kensington families who don’t go to Einstein.

The Einstein families and students are proud of their school. Einstein is not “stigmatized.” Future speakers should take care not to openly criticize schools or families who’ve made a choice about where to live.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Rezoning that occurs based on overcrowding and geography usually has less of impact on housing values because its clear to people when buying that they are on the edge of an area likely to be rezoned. The discount is built into the housing market. Areas that have better planning and financial management also forecast ahead and new developments are sold with clear future boundaries disclosed. Its frankly bizarre to me here that new developments pop up with no hard plan as to where kids will go and then it ends up being a crap shoot which one will get rezoned to the lower school.

Property values is a tangible thing to home owners and it should be to the county as well. The type of redistricting that MCPS is pursuing will destabilize the real estate market and at a time when MOCO is not doing very well. Someone in the county needs to be forecasting what this will cost the county in the long run and how they will make up the shortfall.

The other bizarre thing about all this is that the advocates seem to be white people living in lower performing schools and AA MCPS administrators and BOE members. The opposition is white people in high performing schools and asians. The hispanics who make up the largest demographic group in the system are no where to be seen or heard in any of these discussions. If you look at the county demographics, the hispanic residents are overwhelming younger and have more kids while the majority of white and AA residents are aging out of child bearing years so MCPS in the next 5-10 years is likely to reach 60% hispanic. Someone should ask the hispanic community what they want since they will be the primary population in the future.

Very interesting observation about the Hispanic representation at the meetings. I realize that the main issue is language barrier (which is also the issue in the classroom I am sure), however, surely there are fluent Hispanic families who would want to make a statement. Perhaps they don't care, or don't even realize what's happening.

Um. Yes, there are plenty of Hispanic/Latino families who speak English. Including the ones whose native language is English.

Anonymous wrote:

The other bizarre thing about all this is that the advocates seem to be white people living in lower performing schools and AA MCPS administrators and BOE members. The opposition is white people in high performing schools and asians. The hispanics who make up the largest demographic group in the system are no where to be seen or heard in any of these discussions. If you look at the county demographics, the hispanic residents are overwhelming younger and have more kids while the majority of white and AA residents are aging out of child bearing years so MCPS in the next 5-10 years is likely to reach 60% hispanic. Someone should ask the hispanic community what they want since they will be the primary population in the future.


Very interesting observation about the Hispanic representation at the meetings. I realize that the main issue is language barrier (which is also the issue in the classroom I am sure), however, surely there are fluent Hispanic families who would want to make a statement. Perhaps they don't care, or don't even realize what's happening.


This is a good observation. I’m Hispanic and I absolutely cannot speak for everybody but there’s a whole lot more than a language barrier. It’s a transportation issue, it is A time issue, it is a fear of going to a public meeting and speaking out (for or against), A general feeling of your voice doesn’t matter so why are you gonna bother speaking up? I also don’t believe this has been reported in the Latin news as much as it has been in American English speaking news outlets. However, I don’t watch so maybe somebody who does can fill me in.

The Hispanic community is not well received within MCPS because they often do not align with what MCPS thinks is best. The community members who do speak up were actually outspoken against 2.0 which really bothered MCPS staffers. They could dismiss white or asian parents as being whiny and rich but when the hispanic parents were complaining it just made MCPS look bad. The hispanic community has tended to be the most community focused wanting more resources, programs and support for their neighborhood schools with little interest or desire to get sent to what MCPS perceives is a better school. Their message is more why don't you fix my school not how can I get bussed to Whitman.

I'm the quoted PP and agree with you.

Anonymous wrote:https://www.washingtonpost.com/education/2019/11/15/what-happened-when-brooklyn-tried-integrate-its-middle-schools/?arc404=true

Here's one more

Was that supposed to scare people about mixing things up, because most of the kids' stories were pretty positive.

The other bizarre thing about all this is that the advocates seem to be white people living in lower performing schools and AA MCPS administrators and BOE members. The opposition is white people in high performing schools and asians. The hispanics who make up the largest demographic group in the system are no where to be seen or heard in any of these discussions. If you look at the county demographics, the hispanic residents are overwhelming younger and have more kids while the majority of white and AA residents are aging out of child bearing years so MCPS in the next 5-10 years is likely to reach 60% hispanic. Someone should ask the hispanic community what they want since they will be the primary population in the future.


Very interesting observation about the Hispanic representation at the meetings. I realize that the main issue is language barrier (which is also the issue in the classroom I am sure), however, surely there are fluent Hispanic families who would want to make a statement. Perhaps they don't care, or don't even realize what's happening.


This is a good observation. I’m Hispanic and I absolutely cannot speak for everybody but there’s a whole lot more than a language barrier. It’s a transportation issue, it is A time issue, it is a fear of going to a public meeting and speaking out (for or against), A general feeling of your voice doesn’t matter so why are you gonna bother speaking up? I also don’t believe this has been reported in the Latin news as much as it has been in American English speaking news outlets. However, I don’t watch so maybe somebody who does can fill me in.

The Hispanic community is not well received within MCPS because they often do not align with what MCPS thinks is best. The community members who do speak up were actually outspoken against 2.0 which really bothered MCPS staffers. They could dismiss white or asian parents as being whiny and rich but when the hispanic parents were complaining it just made MCPS look bad. The hispanic community has tended to be the most community focused wanting more resources, programs and support for their neighborhood schools with little interest or desire to get sent to what MCPS perceives is a better school. Their message is more why don't you fix my school not how can I get bussed to Whitman.