Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Today's Upshot in the NYT lays out a plausible scenario where Trump wins the electoral college comfortably even if he loses the popular vote by 5 points.

That is such a nauseating possibility and the opposite of everything having to do with democracy.

In some ways I think this has to happen before there’s ever a serious conversation about the Electoral college. The gore/Bush and Trump/Clinton margins just weren’t big enough.

Anonymous wrote:Today's Upshot in the NYT lays out a plausible scenario where Trump wins the electoral college comfortably even if he loses the popular vote by 5 points.

That is such a nauseating possibility and the opposite of everything having to do with democracy.

Today's Upshot in the NYT lays out a plausible scenario where Trump wins the electoral college comfortably even if he loses the popular vote by 5 points.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am a different PP. I don't think Bernie or Warren are electable. Bernie and his supporters will turn off a lot of the electorate. Warren doesn't really resonate with people and she seems really to prioritize New England (I am in California and I've heard multiple people here talk about how she doesn't know or care about the West, for instance, and I suspect the same is true in the Midwest). Biden has enormous baggage.

The problem is that Democrats need a lot of voter turnout in battleground states to win. And I don't see a single Democratic candidate that is inspiring enough to win that turnout.

It gets me really depressed.

Assuming you are being sincere - I think don't lose this race before we're even in it.

Republicans are weak. They have an incredibly weak candidate who seems to be running on a culture war platform because he doesn't really have anything else; his presidency has been a great circus and otherwise a great failure. Democrats won in 2018 by focusing on what we can do for people - how we can help them.

I think we actually have a pretty good chance in 2020. 2016 still looms large, and I think it's making many of us look for all the reasons we're going to lose again. But these racist rallies Trump has been holding are actually giving me quite a bit of hope that we could win. He's not campaigning on any kind of record - he's not drawing in anyone new. This is not the moment he's going to start acting presidential. He's going bigger, more extreme - and I really do think that a Democrat who can offer hope, and offer a real platform of how we will give people things they need, stands a great chance.

PP here. The problem is that there aren't any candidates who can do the bolded, as far as I can see. There needs to be a candidate who can drive voter turnout in battleground states. Right now, I don't see it.

Yeah this is my concern too. I cannot stand Trump and am pretty liberal so I will vote for whomever gets the nomination. But I’m not the type of voter that needs convincing- regardless of how the popular vote shakes out, unfortunately this election is going to come down to a handful of swing states, mostly in the Midwest. The Dem candidates need to be honest with themselves- do voters in these states want the type of revolutionary change they are advocating for? Are they upset *enough* about Trump’s behavior? Because they may not approve of it, but if they are doing well in this economy and nervous about shakeups to the healthcare system, they may decide not to rock the boat. I think the swing voters tend to be more easily swayed by how things are going in the moment. These are the folks that don’t feel strongly enough about particular issues to always vote along party lines and are more likely to switch sides when a recession hits, etc.

And I don’t know anyone who voted for Trump in 2016 that has regretted their choice, outwardly anyway.

I really like Buttigieg, I’m just not sure he has enough experience yet. Personally a Klobuchar-Buttigieg ticket would be my choice.

Anonymous wrote:I am a different PP. I don't think Bernie or Warren are electable. Bernie and his supporters will turn off a lot of the electorate. Warren doesn't really resonate with people and she seems really to prioritize New England (I am in California and I've heard multiple people here talk about how she doesn't know or care about the West, for instance, and I suspect the same is true in the Midwest). Biden has enormous baggage.

The problem is that Democrats need a lot of voter turnout in battleground states to win. And I don't see a single Democratic candidate that is inspiring enough to win that turnout.

It gets me really depressed.

Agree

Yall need someone that can get black turnout what it was like with Obama

R giving free advice

Smart to think about the electoral college people forget that's what really matters

If the senate is still going to be R I will probably vote third party and maybe D candidate if they are moderate (Biden or Klobuchar only at this point maybe Pete)

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am a different PP. I don't think Bernie or Warren are electable. Bernie and his supporters will turn off a lot of the electorate. Warren doesn't really resonate with people and she seems really to prioritize New England (I am in California and I've heard multiple people here talk about how she doesn't know or care about the West, for instance, and I suspect the same is true in the Midwest). Biden has enormous baggage.

The problem is that Democrats need a lot of voter turnout in battleground states to win. And I don't see a single Democratic candidate that is inspiring enough to win that turnout.

It gets me really depressed.

Assuming you are being sincere - I think don't lose this race before we're even in it.

Republicans are weak. They have an incredibly weak candidate who seems to be running on a culture war platform because he doesn't really have anything else; his presidency has been a great circus and otherwise a great failure. Democrats won in 2018 by focusing on what we can do for people - how we can help them.

I think we actually have a pretty good chance in 2020. 2016 still looms large, and I think it's making many of us look for all the reasons we're going to lose again. But these racist rallies Trump has been holding are actually giving me quite a bit of hope that we could win. He's not campaigning on any kind of record - he's not drawing in anyone new. This is not the moment he's going to start acting presidential. He's going bigger, more extreme - and I really do think that a Democrat who can offer hope, and offer a real platform of how we will give people things they need, stands a great chance.

PP here. The problem is that there aren't any candidates who can do the bolded, as far as I can see. There needs to be a candidate who can drive voter turnout in battleground states. Right now, I don't see it.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am a different PP. I don't think Bernie or Warren are electable. Bernie and his supporters will turn off a lot of the electorate. Warren doesn't really resonate with people and she seems really to prioritize New England (I am in California and I've heard multiple people here talk about how she doesn't know or care about the West, for instance, and I suspect the same is true in the Midwest). Biden has enormous baggage.

The problem is that Democrats need a lot of voter turnout in battleground states to win. And I don't see a single Democratic candidate that is inspiring enough to win that turnout.

It gets me really depressed.

Assuming you are being sincere - I think don't lose this race before we're even in it.

Republicans are weak. They have an incredibly weak candidate who seems to be running on a culture war platform because he doesn't really have anything else; his presidency has been a great circus and otherwise a great failure. Democrats won in 2018 by focusing on what we can do for people - how we can help them.

I think we actually have a pretty good chance in 2020. 2016 still looms large, and I think it's making many of us look for all the reasons we're going to lose again. But these racist rallies Trump has been holding are actually giving me quite a bit of hope that we could win. He's not campaigning on any kind of record - he's not drawing in anyone new. This is not the moment he's going to start acting presidential. He's going bigger, more extreme - and I really do think that a Democrat who can offer hope, and offer a real platform of how we will give people things they need, stands a great chance.

When 20k+ people show up at Trump rallies where ever he goes, I would hardly describe Rs as “weak.” Nice try though

His base loves him. He only holds rallies in places where he's got that many people ready to come to his rallies.

He is historically unpopular outside of his rabid base (no offense to rabies).

All of this may be true but still hardly the definition of “weak.” Is he bearable? Of course, in theory. By anyone the Ds have presented so far? Very doubtful

ok - you obviously have a lot at stake, believing trump is not as weak as he appears to be by every indicator, outside of his rabid base.

we've got a long way to go until 2020 - let's see how things go. i'll just say that my take right now is these rallies of his, with the shouting and the racism, look to me like a bad move.

I don't understand why the author's chin is notable. I looked at his picture and he looks like a normal human.

Sorry meant beatable.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am a different PP. I don't think Bernie or Warren are electable. Bernie and his supporters will turn off a lot of the electorate. Warren doesn't really resonate with people and she seems really to prioritize New England (I am in California and I've heard multiple people here talk about how she doesn't know or care about the West, for instance, and I suspect the same is true in the Midwest). Biden has enormous baggage.

The problem is that Democrats need a lot of voter turnout in battleground states to win. And I don't see a single Democratic candidate that is inspiring enough to win that turnout.

It gets me really depressed.

Assuming you are being sincere - I think don't lose this race before we're even in it.

Republicans are weak. They have an incredibly weak candidate who seems to be running on a culture war platform because he doesn't really have anything else; his presidency has been a great circus and otherwise a great failure. Democrats won in 2018 by focusing on what we can do for people - how we can help them.

I think we actually have a pretty good chance in 2020. 2016 still looms large, and I think it's making many of us look for all the reasons we're going to lose again. But these racist rallies Trump has been holding are actually giving me quite a bit of hope that we could win. He's not campaigning on any kind of record - he's not drawing in anyone new. This is not the moment he's going to start acting presidential. He's going bigger, more extreme - and I really do think that a Democrat who can offer hope, and offer a real platform of how we will give people things they need, stands a great chance.

When 20k+ people show up at Trump rallies where ever he goes, I would hardly describe Rs as “weak.” Nice try though

His base loves him. He only holds rallies in places where he's got that many people ready to come to his rallies.

He is historically unpopular outside of his rabid base (no offense to rabies).

All of this may be true but still hardly the definition of “weak.” Is he bearable? Of course, in theory. By anyone the Ds have presented so far? Very doubtful

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am a different PP. I don't think Bernie or Warren are electable. Bernie and his supporters will turn off a lot of the electorate. Warren doesn't really resonate with people and she seems really to prioritize New England (I am in California and I've heard multiple people here talk about how she doesn't know or care about the West, for instance, and I suspect the same is true in the Midwest). Biden has enormous baggage.

The problem is that Democrats need a lot of voter turnout in battleground states to win. And I don't see a single Democratic candidate that is inspiring enough to win that turnout.

It gets me really depressed.

Assuming you are being sincere - I think don't lose this race before we're even in it.

Republicans are weak. They have an incredibly weak candidate who seems to be running on a culture war platform because he doesn't really have anything else; his presidency has been a great circus and otherwise a great failure. Democrats won in 2018 by focusing on what we can do for people - how we can help them.

I think we actually have a pretty good chance in 2020. 2016 still looms large, and I think it's making many of us look for all the reasons we're going to lose again. But these racist rallies Trump has been holding are actually giving me quite a bit of hope that we could win. He's not campaigning on any kind of record - he's not drawing in anyone new. This is not the moment he's going to start acting presidential. He's going bigger, more extreme - and I really do think that a Democrat who can offer hope, and offer a real platform of how we will give people things they need, stands a great chance.

When 20k+ people show up at Trump rallies where ever he goes, I would hardly describe Rs as “weak.” Nice try though

His base loves him. He only holds rallies in places where he's got that many people ready to come to his rallies.

He is historically unpopular outside of his rabid base (no offense to rabies).

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am a different PP. I don't think Bernie or Warren are electable. Bernie and his supporters will turn off a lot of the electorate. Warren doesn't really resonate with people and she seems really to prioritize New England (I am in California and I've heard multiple people here talk about how she doesn't know or care about the West, for instance, and I suspect the same is true in the Midwest). Biden has enormous baggage.

The problem is that Democrats need a lot of voter turnout in battleground states to win. And I don't see a single Democratic candidate that is inspiring enough to win that turnout.

It gets me really depressed.

Assuming you are being sincere - I think don't lose this race before we're even in it.

Republicans are weak. They have an incredibly weak candidate who seems to be running on a culture war platform because he doesn't really have anything else; his presidency has been a great circus and otherwise a great failure. Democrats won in 2018 by focusing on what we can do for people - how we can help them.

I think we actually have a pretty good chance in 2020. 2016 still looms large, and I think it's making many of us look for all the reasons we're going to lose again. But these racist rallies Trump has been holding are actually giving me quite a bit of hope that we could win. He's not campaigning on any kind of record - he's not drawing in anyone new. This is not the moment he's going to start acting presidential. He's going bigger, more extreme - and I really do think that a Democrat who can offer hope, and offer a real platform of how we will give people things they need, stands a great chance.

When 20k+ people show up at Trump rallies where ever he goes, I would hardly describe Rs as “weak.” Nice try though

Whoopie - a bunch of angry old retirees and burnouts with nothing better to do than attend a klan rally, plus a couple hundred people desperate enough to go to a Klan rally for $20. That’s not really strength and pp is right - he won with surgical precision in three states (and I and millions of others would say those votes weren’t legitimate). He’s not going on strong. He commit treason, campaign fraud and more. The economy is beginning to falter. He’s not in a great place.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am a different PP. I don't think Bernie or Warren are electable. Bernie and his supporters will turn off a lot of the electorate. Warren doesn't really resonate with people and she seems really to prioritize New England (I am in California and I've heard multiple people here talk about how she doesn't know or care about the West, for instance, and I suspect the same is true in the Midwest). Biden has enormous baggage.

The problem is that Democrats need a lot of voter turnout in battleground states to win. And I don't see a single Democratic candidate that is inspiring enough to win that turnout.

It gets me really depressed.

Assuming you are being sincere - I think don't lose this race before we're even in it.

Republicans are weak. They have an incredibly weak candidate who seems to be running on a culture war platform because he doesn't really have anything else; his presidency has been a great circus and otherwise a great failure. Democrats won in 2018 by focusing on what we can do for people - how we can help them.

I think we actually have a pretty good chance in 2020. 2016 still looms large, and I think it's making many of us look for all the reasons we're going to lose again. But these racist rallies Trump has been holding are actually giving me quite a bit of hope that we could win. He's not campaigning on any kind of record - he's not drawing in anyone new. This is not the moment he's going to start acting presidential. He's going bigger, more extreme - and I really do think that a Democrat who can offer hope, and offer a real platform of how we will give people things they need, stands a great chance.

When 20k+ people show up at Trump rallies where ever he goes, I would hardly describe Rs as “weak.” Nice try though

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I hate Trump but I think he is going to win because Bernie is unelectable and his supporters are vile. Warren is similarly unelectable, though her supporters aren't as awful.

It's really depressing.

?

Bernie is not going to win the nomination. Warren has more appeal than you think, I think. And Biden is still the frontrunner.

A few months ago, as an R, I thought I’d be able to vote for Biden, but he looks a wreck. He is flubbing and floundering like a fish out of water. He is in over his head. I’m thinking he was a figurehead as VP. And fact that Obama has not spoken out on the accusations of racism is surprising and disappointing.

Look man - if your position is that you are either voting for the world's most perfect Democrat or Trump, and there is no perfect Democrat, then I think you've made your decision. No one is going to be perfect - I'd say even Marianne Williamson would be better than Trump.

You'd be wrong.

OK - well if you feel that's wrong, then there's really no one we're going to nominate who will get your vote. You are a Trump voter. You're one of the base.

Nope.

But I recognize stupidity when I see it.

Imagine some of those Tea Party folks who hated Obama saying something like "any Republican would be better that this traitorous lying President. Any Republican, including Sarah Palin or David Duke"

What you're saying is equally dumb.

They voted for Trump. So - yeah, I'd say that's exactly what they did. And have you forgotten that Palin was your party's VP nominee? They picked her, too!

And I don't need to win you over. You are unwinnable. Your default is Trump, you are telling me - unless some impossibly perfect Democrat demands you change your mind.

+1
I really hope we as Democrats nominate someone intelligent, principled, and regular-human kind, but after that, it’s really up to fence sitters to suck it up and vote straight Democratic ticket. The GOP has no interest in governing, only an interest in dismantling government and weakening every protection (environmental, financial, work-related, insurance-related, WMD, terrorism, etc) the Democrats have tried to create. Suck it up, fence sitters. You’ve got the party of treason or the Democrats. That’s your choice.

Anonymous wrote:I am a different PP. I don't think Bernie or Warren are electable. Bernie and his supporters will turn off a lot of the electorate. Warren doesn't really resonate with people and she seems really to prioritize New England (I am in California and I've heard multiple people here talk about how she doesn't know or care about the West, for instance, and I suspect the same is true in the Midwest). Biden has enormous baggage.

The problem is that Democrats need a lot of voter turnout in battleground states to win. And I don't see a single Democratic candidate that is inspiring enough to win that turnout.

It gets me really depressed.

Assuming you are being sincere - I think don't lose this race before we're even in it.

Republicans are weak. They have an incredibly weak candidate who seems to be running on a culture war platform because he doesn't really have anything else; his presidency has been a great circus and otherwise a great failure. Democrats won in 2018 by focusing on what we can do for people - how we can help them.

I think we actually have a pretty good chance in 2020. 2016 still looms large, and I think it's making many of us look for all the reasons we're going to lose again. But these racist rallies Trump has been holding are actually giving me quite a bit of hope that we could win. He's not campaigning on any kind of record - he's not drawing in anyone new. This is not the moment he's going to start acting presidential. He's going bigger, more extreme - and I really do think that a Democrat who can offer hope, and offer a real platform of how we will give people things they need, stands a great chance.