Anonymous
07/06/2018 21:26
Subject: Re:Root cause of issues at MOCO schools?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:It is hard to contact someone when the website has not been updated to reflect the new people in the positions.
The new structure has been posted. Someone on the “how to get rid of an ES principal” thread posted it last week.
http://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/15/735985.page
About the middle of the page
Why isn't this posted on the MCPS website for OSSI??? Thank you DCUM.
Should I let them know that is how I found out who is for what school as of July 1st?
http://nebula.wsimg.com/d4573365c8dd4ed04eb1fb64adc7a3ff?AccessKeyId=AB71C8A62DC88BF7171E&disposition=0&alloworigin=1
http://nebula.wsimg.com/74e0a86a005e2fcbeff6d3d90835efb9?AccessKeyId=AB71C8A62DC88BF7171E&disposition=0&alloworigin=1
Anonymous
07/06/2018 19:45
Subject: Re:Root cause of issues at MOCO schools?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:It is hard to contact someone when the website has not been updated to reflect the new people in the positions.
The new structure has been posted. Someone on the “how to get rid of an ES principal” thread posted it last week.
http://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/15/735985.page
About the middle of the page
Anonymous
07/06/2018 19:43
Subject: Re:Root cause of issues at MOCO schools?
Anonymous wrote:It is hard to contact someone when the website has not been updated to reflect the new people in the positions.
The new structure has been posted. Someone on the “how to get rid of an ES principal” thread posted it last week.
Anonymous
07/06/2018 17:36
Subject: Re:Root cause of issues at MOCO schools?
It is hard to contact someone when the website has not been updated to reflect the new people in the positions.
Anonymous
07/06/2018 12:10
Subject: Root cause of issues at MOCO schools?
Anonymous wrote:Actually, MCPS is excellent at creating that divisiveness and does it on purpose. If we are all arguing with each other, we are not working together to get them to change/improve.
Sometimes it's this cluster vs that cluster;
Sometimes its wealthy schools vs title 1 or focus schools;
Sometimes ESOL vs Special Ed;
Sometimes its athletics vs arts;
Etc., etc - the entrenched central office staff know exactly what they are doing.
Everybody was just reshuffled so it’s a good time to reach out to the new person in place if you have concerns abut ethics or safety. Admin is there in the summer and it’s less busy now. So for example the clusters now have new associate superintendents and new directors. I don’t know all of the players but for the most part I think it trended in the right direction. In cases where you get no response, try one of the directors for a different cluster. Ask them for advice on who to contact. There are definitely some good ones who get things done. You may need to poke around to find responsive people. Consider the people one or two rungs down too—they may be the people who would do the legwork or investigation. Like someone in compliance or even an assistant principal who has been there a while But copy the people in charge to hold everyone accountable. No one wants to look lazy or unethical or ineffective.
Anonymous
07/05/2018 20:31
Subject: Root cause of issues at MOCO schools?
Actually, MCPS is excellent at creating that divisiveness and does it on purpose. If we are all arguing with each other, we are not working together to get them to change/improve.
Sometimes it's this cluster vs that cluster;
Sometimes its wealthy schools vs title 1 or focus schools;
Sometimes ESOL vs Special Ed;
Sometimes its athletics vs arts;
Etc., etc - the entrenched central office staff know exactly what they are doing.
Sometimes it's this cluster vs that cluster;
Sometimes its wealthy schools vs title 1 or focus schools;
Sometimes ESOL vs Special Ed;
Sometimes its athletics vs arts;
Etc., etc - the entrenched central office staff know exactly what they are doing.
Anonymous
07/05/2018 19:48
Subject: Re:Root cause of issues at MOCO schools?
Can anyone see the polarity in this thread?
As a parent, I have had an MCPS teacher groomed my disabled child for abuse. So sickening and the IEP meetings after were so frustrating. Sure there are bad students, bad parents, bad administrators, and bad teachers. There are also good people that had horrendous life experiences and horrendous problems MCPS is not addressing as a public school system.
I hope someone in MCPS will read this thread to see the different realities and problems that devide us as a county. MCPS really needs to look in the mirror to say OMG this is how decisive we have become and figure out a plan on how to fix things.
As a parent, I have had an MCPS teacher groomed my disabled child for abuse. So sickening and the IEP meetings after were so frustrating. Sure there are bad students, bad parents, bad administrators, and bad teachers. There are also good people that had horrendous life experiences and horrendous problems MCPS is not addressing as a public school system.
I hope someone in MCPS will read this thread to see the different realities and problems that devide us as a county. MCPS really needs to look in the mirror to say OMG this is how decisive we have become and figure out a plan on how to fix things.
Anonymous
07/05/2018 19:39
Subject: Root cause of issues at MOCO schools?
Anonymous wrote:Lots of varied incidents from individuals. My perception is that over the past decade that I've been involved one way or another with MCPS, is that:
1 - there is no discipline. Partly because of the racial disparities that had occurred, so the pendulum has swung the other way and there's none. Teachers don't bother because they know the administration won't support them. Administration doesn't bother because they don't want the school numbers to look bad. Central office is all about the data, so no or fewer incidents = good, even if that's not reality.
2- pendulum has also swung away from discrete classrooms for all kinds of special ed. That's good, because many of these kids, many of whom were mis-diagnosed used to be locked in basement rooms and taught nothing. However, with mail streaming being the new normal, there are now kids in gen ed classrooms who clearly don't belong there, and the schools don't know how and/or don't have the resources to handle these kids. Throwing an uneducated para in a class with a violent ED kid is not going to make it work.
3- so much less respect for teachers today. Parents complain all the time about the teachers having it easy. The same teacher with 5 sections of 35 kids, many with behavior issues not being dealt with. They support their kid against the teacher, instead of working as a team to solve whatever the issue is. Not sure why this is, but there's a multi page thread about teachers being whiny. I think it's the parents who are whiny.
4- pay isn't great in the beginning, not for our high cost of living area.
5- professional development? That's all been cut, because parents don't like random days off (see many threads about that). Many professionals go to conferences and other continuing education classes to stay on top of their game, but we no longer afford teachers that opportunity. Instead they are told to do it on the summer. In the summer, when they don't get paid, and may have children of their own to care for.
I could go on and on, but teachers get into teaching because they want to work with kids. To see that spark when a kid understands a new concept. To teach. Instead, there's tons of paperwork, administrators and parents who don't support them, little money and no respect. There are already teacher shortages. I predict it will only get worse.
There is very little to no teaming at our school with parents. We don't have any idea what is going on in the classroom - good or bad. We get very little worksheets home, nothing on their google accounts so what is really going on? We offer to volunteer and help and are told no. We email the teacher asking what she needs in terms of supplies and cannot even get a response.
Anonymous
07/05/2018 19:23
Subject: Re:Root cause of issues at MOCO schools?
Anonymous wrote:I set the tone in my classroom but there are so many undisciplined students and the admin wants nothing to do with discipline. Neither do the parents for that matter. The last week of school, I had a student throw a chair at me. Luckily, he didn't hit anyone. Class was over so I took him to the office while the admin called his parent. His mother screamed so loudly on the phone that others in the office could hear and then she hung up. She wants no part of being bothered about her child's behavior at school. Many parents have the mentality (and have voiced it) that what happens at school is the school's problem. Admin can't do much so back to class he went. He's no dummy. Lather, rinse, repeat.
This was our experience in DD's 4th grade class last year. A kid tried to throw a desk at the teacher. Plus, multiple other incidents. Kid went to the office but was back in class the next day.
To say that 'teachers set the tone' is not telling the whole story. The teacher can set the tone, but the kids are not stupid. They recognize that there is no disciplinary action taken by the school/by the principal. What exactly is the teacher supposed to do when the parents don't care and the admin wants to sweep issues under the rug. Seriously.
Anonymous
07/05/2018 19:20
Subject: Root cause of issues at MOCO schools?
Anonymous wrote:Lots of varied incidents from individuals. My perception is that over the past decade that I've been involved one way or another with MCPS, is that:
1 - there is no discipline. Partly because of the racial disparities that had occurred, so the pendulum has swung the other way and there's none. Teachers don't bother because they know the administration won't support them. Administration doesn't bother because they don't want the school numbers to look bad. Central office is all about the data, so no or fewer incidents = good, even if that's not reality.
2- pendulum has also swung away from discrete classrooms for all kinds of special ed. That's good, because many of these kids, many of whom were mis-diagnosed used to be locked in basement rooms and taught nothing. However, with mail streaming being the new normal, there are now kids in gen ed classrooms who clearly don't belong there, and the schools don't know how and/or don't have the resources to handle these kids. Throwing an uneducated para in a class with a violent ED kid is not going to make it work.
3- so much less respect for teachers today. Parents complain all the time about the teachers having it easy. The same teacher with 5 sections of 35 kids, many with behavior issues not being dealt with. They support their kid against the teacher, instead of working as a team to solve whatever the issue is. Not sure why this is, but there's a multi page thread about teachers being whiny. I think it's the parents who are whiny.
4- pay isn't great in the beginning, not for our high cost of living area.
5- professional development? That's all been cut, because parents don't like random days off (see many threads about that). Many professionals go to conferences and other continuing education classes to stay on top of their game, but we no longer afford teachers that opportunity. Instead they are told to do it on the summer. In the summer, when they don't get paid, and may have children of their own to care for.
I could go on and on, but teachers get into teaching because they want to work with kids. To see that spark when a kid understands a new concept. To teach. Instead, there's tons of paperwork, administrators and parents who don't support them, little money and no respect. There are already teacher shortages. I predict it will only get worse.
Agree completely with all of your points
Anonymous
07/05/2018 18:30
Subject: Root cause of issues at MOCO schools?
Lots of varied incidents from individuals. My perception is that over the past decade that I've been involved one way or another with MCPS, is that:
1 - there is no discipline. Partly because of the racial disparities that had occurred, so the pendulum has swung the other way and there's none. Teachers don't bother because they know the administration won't support them. Administration doesn't bother because they don't want the school numbers to look bad. Central office is all about the data, so no or fewer incidents = good, even if that's not reality.
2- pendulum has also swung away from discrete classrooms for all kinds of special ed. That's good, because many of these kids, many of whom were mis-diagnosed used to be locked in basement rooms and taught nothing. However, with mail streaming being the new normal, there are now kids in gen ed classrooms who clearly don't belong there, and the schools don't know how and/or don't have the resources to handle these kids. Throwing an uneducated para in a class with a violent ED kid is not going to make it work.
3- so much less respect for teachers today. Parents complain all the time about the teachers having it easy. The same teacher with 5 sections of 35 kids, many with behavior issues not being dealt with. They support their kid against the teacher, instead of working as a team to solve whatever the issue is. Not sure why this is, but there's a multi page thread about teachers being whiny. I think it's the parents who are whiny.
4- pay isn't great in the beginning, not for our high cost of living area.
5- professional development? That's all been cut, because parents don't like random days off (see many threads about that). Many professionals go to conferences and other continuing education classes to stay on top of their game, but we no longer afford teachers that opportunity. Instead they are told to do it on the summer. In the summer, when they don't get paid, and may have children of their own to care for.
I could go on and on, but teachers get into teaching because they want to work with kids. To see that spark when a kid understands a new concept. To teach. Instead, there's tons of paperwork, administrators and parents who don't support them, little money and no respect. There are already teacher shortages. I predict it will only get worse.
1 - there is no discipline. Partly because of the racial disparities that had occurred, so the pendulum has swung the other way and there's none. Teachers don't bother because they know the administration won't support them. Administration doesn't bother because they don't want the school numbers to look bad. Central office is all about the data, so no or fewer incidents = good, even if that's not reality.
2- pendulum has also swung away from discrete classrooms for all kinds of special ed. That's good, because many of these kids, many of whom were mis-diagnosed used to be locked in basement rooms and taught nothing. However, with mail streaming being the new normal, there are now kids in gen ed classrooms who clearly don't belong there, and the schools don't know how and/or don't have the resources to handle these kids. Throwing an uneducated para in a class with a violent ED kid is not going to make it work.
3- so much less respect for teachers today. Parents complain all the time about the teachers having it easy. The same teacher with 5 sections of 35 kids, many with behavior issues not being dealt with. They support their kid against the teacher, instead of working as a team to solve whatever the issue is. Not sure why this is, but there's a multi page thread about teachers being whiny. I think it's the parents who are whiny.
4- pay isn't great in the beginning, not for our high cost of living area.
5- professional development? That's all been cut, because parents don't like random days off (see many threads about that). Many professionals go to conferences and other continuing education classes to stay on top of their game, but we no longer afford teachers that opportunity. Instead they are told to do it on the summer. In the summer, when they don't get paid, and may have children of their own to care for.
I could go on and on, but teachers get into teaching because they want to work with kids. To see that spark when a kid understands a new concept. To teach. Instead, there's tons of paperwork, administrators and parents who don't support them, little money and no respect. There are already teacher shortages. I predict it will only get worse.
Anonymous
07/05/2018 17:39
Subject: Re:Root cause of issues at MOCO schools?
Anonymous wrote:Teachers can’t talk to you about other kids’ disciplinary issues—they can only talk to you about YOUR kid.
But, they don't talk to us about our child and IF our child was bullied or injured and cannot tell us due to their SN, a teacher should be telling the parent XXX happened. I am not saying name the child but if a parent says child is scared to go to school and what happened, you tell them.
Anonymous
07/05/2018 17:38
Subject: Re:Root cause of issues at MOCO schools?
Anonymous wrote:I set the tone in my classroom but there are so many undisciplined students and the admin wants nothing to do with discipline. Neither do the parents for that matter. The last week of school, I had a student throw a chair at me. Luckily, he didn't hit anyone. Class was over so I took him to the office while the admin called his parent. His mother screamed so loudly on the phone that others in the office could hear and then she hung up. She wants no part of being bothered about her child's behavior at school. Many parents have the mentality (and have voiced it) that what happens at school is the school's problem. Admin can't do much so back to class he went. He's no dummy. Lather, rinse, repeat.
Then, you gather the documentation you need and force an IEP/get the child to a more appropriate placement. Honestly, I have given up and as of next year I have no interest in anything school related. We've tried for several years and we get a nice brick wall. So, you deal with it now.
Anonymous
07/05/2018 17:38
Subject: Re:Root cause of issues at MOCO schools?
Teachers can’t talk to you about other kids’ disciplinary issues—they can only talk to you about YOUR kid.
Anonymous
07/05/2018 17:36
Subject: Root cause of issues at MOCO schools?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:
Don't get me started on the student code of conduct....the inmates are running the asylum and they know they hold the power....
[b]Your analogy is offensive. Students are not criminals.
Students have rights that MCPS teachers and administrators violate all the time. The MCPS Employee Code of Conduct is worthless because nothing happens to employees who violate it.
Teachers have rights as well that administrators violate. The whole system is broken and Central Office keeps shuffling chairs, promoting dead weight, but does nothing to cure the discord in the school climates.
If you are teacher, your experiences are limited.
I suppose the kid with the ankle bracelet (rapist) isn't a criminal. I found that out months into the school year, by the way.
And what about the gang-related funeral I attended? There were no criminals involved in that one, eh?
How about the three gang-related fights that occurred in front of my classroom? I had to lock students inside my classroom.
So apparently, you'd be just fine with your own child seated next to the rapist, I guess . . .
And I love how it's a blame game. You're not the only one, PP, who points the finger. But those of you who place blame are part of the problem, as complaining w/o acting is useless.
What are YOU doing to help?
I’m a fellow teacher in MCPS. Mid-career. Third generation in my family and married to a teacher. So I think I know a bit about schools, students, and teachers. I think it is time for you to move on from MCPS or at least your current position.
Your emotions are valid, but you’re nearing that point where you’re either going to quit in the middle of a class or you will go off on a student and say/do something that will get you fired.
I get it. I was where you seem to be when I taught in an MCPS HS about 10 years ago. Switching to a middle school in a different part of the county helped me enormously. You also need to greatly up your self-care game: more exercise, more sleep, less DCUM. If changing schools/districts and making lifestyle changes doesn’t help, it’s okay to switch professions.
We all face burnout. Teaching demands more of people than any other role in life except parenting. Even cops are allowed to at least yell at the worst behaved people they work with. You got a rough crowd, it seems. Some teachers thrive on working with the most at risk students. But honestly, the majority of teachers don’t. It’s ok. Most people in the military aren’t fighter jet pilots or Navy Seals, but their jobs are vital to the system as a whole and we thank them for their service.
You can go into public school advocacy. We need all the passionate people with real school experience up on the Hill as we can get.
Either way, I wish you the best.
DP
So instead of saying that we should support teachers more, your answer is that the PP should leave teaching and go into advocacy?
Sounds like that teacher does like to teach, but just is not getting enough support from administration and from parents. I think that’s a valid issue that needs to be addressed in MCPS.
It sounds like the teacher does not like to teach the population of students that he/she currently has. I thought the PP's suggestions were very compassionate and realistic. MCPS is not going to just kick troubled kids out of school. There are a variety of reasons that they can't and shouldn't do that. If the teacher is getting to the point of being frustrated, bitter, and angry a lot of the time, he/she should really look for a change - which the PP gave an example of having done her/himself.
It may be true that the teacher PP should look for a change, but what about the next teacher that comes into that same situation?
Would you be happy working in an environment where your boss is a bully, you're not supported by management, and your clients (students) don't appreciate you and/or abuse you on a daily basis? Because that is what the environment is like in many MCPS schools currently.
It sounds an awful lot like both of you are blaming the teacher for her unhappiness with the system. Rather than acknowledging that there are some systemic problems in the system causing MANY teachers to feel the same way.
Agree admin is a huge issue but the teachers set the tone in the classroom and they can do more to manage the kids.
Yes, teachers set the tone in the classroom, but it incredibly difficult to 'set the tone' and enforce disciplinary actions when you have zero support from admin/the principal. The kids are not stupid and recognize that they can get away with all sorts of behavior with no negative consequences. This is a system wide problem, in all schools, across all SES levels, but incredibly challenging in the type of school that the PP teacher is describing.
Again, you're putting the responsibility on the teacher, when it really should be a team effort - parent/teacher/administration/society.
As parents we are not part of the "team" and when I have reached out to the teacher out of concern as something happened at school my child didn't want to say her response was she was taking care of it and refused to tell me what happened. I had to reach out to other parents to find out. If you don't include parents, you cannot complain they are part of the problem. We had huge behavioral and other issues in our classroom last year and the school didn't speak to any of the parents even though several of us reached out multiple times. I have no empathy for teachers like that and if they want to handle it, then handle it but don't complain about lack of support and parents have a right to know if their child is being picked on/teased or something else.