Anonymous
01/23/2023 11:50
Subject: Accused of racial bias at work by someone, and I feel sick over it
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:OP, don’t be the white lady who weaponizes her tears when accused of racial bias. It’s tiresome.
Use this as an opportunity to reflect. Yes, she misheard you. I’m sure you had no ill intent, but intent is separate from impact. Let’s look at the facts— you prioritized the words of a white man over the LEAD AUTHOR of the paper. The lead author who is 1) a woman and 2) a POC. It’s a bad look, OP. As a marketing professional, if this never occurred to you when writing the piece, then that is a pretty huge blind spot. Stop crying and being defensive. Be a grown up and own up to your mistake here and use it as a growth opportunity.
+1000
Even if the lead author wasn't a woman of color, not representing the LEAD AUTHOR in the piece was a big misstep. Even if the lead author had been a soft spoken white man this would be a problem. Some people (of all races) have different styles - may not be as immediately quotable off the cuff. A follow-up email or interview, or whatever was needed to make it a more balanced pieces seems like it would have been a good idea.
OP should learn from this.
OP said they were described to her as co-authors. I don't know enough about that space to know if OP had a responsibility to figure out who was who, but she didn't know the woman was the lead author.
But I do agree that this is a learning experience. Your mistake was that you let the white man do all the talking and get all the quotes.
Anonymous
01/23/2023 11:28
Subject: Accused of racial bias at work by someone, and I feel sick over it
Anonymous wrote:OP, don’t be the white lady who weaponizes her tears when accused of racial bias. It’s tiresome.
Use this as an opportunity to reflect. Yes, she misheard you. I’m sure you had no ill intent, but intent is separate from impact. Let’s look at the facts— you prioritized the words of a white man over the LEAD AUTHOR of the paper. The lead author who is 1) a woman and 2) a POC. It’s a bad look, OP. As a marketing professional, if this never occurred to you when writing the piece, then that is a pretty huge blind spot. Stop crying and being defensive. Be a grown up and own up to your mistake here and use it as a growth opportunity.
+1000
Even if the lead author wasn't a woman of color, not representing the LEAD AUTHOR in the piece was a big misstep. Even if the lead author had been a soft spoken white man this would be a problem. Some people (of all races) have different styles - may not be as immediately quotable off the cuff. A follow-up email or interview, or whatever was needed to make it a more balanced pieces seems like it would have been a good idea.
OP should learn from this.
Anonymous
01/23/2023 11:05
Subject: Accused of racial bias at work by someone, and I feel sick over it
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:You should’ve shut the co-author down and intentionally solicited comments from the soft-spoken lead author. An apology is warranted and you should feel sick.
+1
I agree with this except for the "you should feel sick" part. This was a learning mistake. Be grateful you can learn from, address it, move on and do better. Surely, most of should know its important to not let the outspoken loud man dominate and be given all credit (which you did by only quoting him and that too is on the record)
+2
Honestly, the article itself is the biggest issue. If you didn't get enough quotes from the other (female) author, you did not give her enough air space during the interview. Or, you could have asked for a follow-up with her alone to make your piece more balanced.
Anonymous
01/23/2023 10:55
Subject: Accused of racial bias at work by someone, and I feel sick over it
Did the university OK the release before it went out? I would think they would flag the lead/co-author issue and ask for revisions.
Anonymous
01/23/2023 09:35
Subject: Re:Accused of racial bias at work by someone, and I feel sick over it
The WHITE MALE co-author was "articulate" but they talk "OVER EACH OTHER". That's can't be true. She was struggling in sharing with you her part of the contribution probably as the lead role in that project. You ignored her during the interview with a seemingly fair request for "hearing you both", and not citing her in your report. Who is the victim? Asian American women are often ignored, and face racial and gender discriminations in America.
Anonymous
01/23/2023 08:26
Subject: Accused of racial bias at work by someone, and I feel sick over it
Anonymous wrote:It sounds like the Asian woman was victimized by the co-author, not you, If he was speaking over her. If that's what happened, you don't need to own that, and it's not your job to fix him.
Still, I'm not a company owner, so take with a grain of salt, but you could reach out to the woman, I'd be very brief, anything you say could be used against you because she's already making allegations, and simply let her know you were informed she thought you stated "X," but that you stated "Y" because you absolutely wanted to hear her and not miss what she was trying to say. And you apologize if she did not hear it correctly and for any misunderstanding.
The Asian woman was "victimized?" I can see that her co-author was rude and/or obtuse. But let's not overstate things.
Anonymous
01/22/2023 22:21
Subject: Re:Accused of racial bias at work by someone, and I feel sick over it
Let chatGPT do your job.
Anonymous
01/22/2023 22:19
Subject: Accused of racial bias at work by someone, and I feel sick over it
i'm still very curious why the lead author didn't say gender bias only racial bias.
Anonymous
01/22/2023 19:42
Subject: Accused of racial bias at work by someone, and I feel sick over it
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:This is clearly a problem with the Asian female and her male colleague. First, if her English is not native, then they should have known she would need to prepare her remarks instead of doing an off the cuff interview. Second, if he spoke over as much as it sounds like, then that's more on him than you. She misheard you, and probably became even more uncomfortable as a result, but she did not A-ask for clarification of the words she didn't understand or B-let you know you had offended her. She made an assumption and then tried to harm your career because of her mistake.
I find the most disturbing part the fact that your contact and the uni are not supporting you, and she is not calling you to apologize for her mistake.
If her English wasn’t native, OP has a greater responsibility to speak clearly and using correct grammar. Using a double negative to silence her and then making no effort to draw her out in the interview is unprofessional…and maybe even racist, we have no way to know.
So your rec is op should start speaking slooooowly with extremely straightforward grammar when speaking with professionals whose first language isn’t English? Should go great!
No, my recommendation is that she use grammatically accurate English, know the job title and role of the person she’s interviewing, and make an effort when someone is reticent to be sure she hasn’t done something to make it harder for her to be heard like let the loud male colleague take up all the air in the room. All of these are things someone in a college marketing internship would be expected to manage just fine.
But my impression is that OP doesn’t actually care about either the quality of her work or the damage she did to her subject, she only cares that the subject 1. Interpreted that damage in a way that wasn’t favorable to her and 2. Had the nerve to report it.
Anonymous
01/22/2023 19:37
Subject: Accused of racial bias at work by someone, and I feel sick over it
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:This is clearly a problem with the Asian female and her male colleague. First, if her English is not native, then they should have known she would need to prepare her remarks instead of doing an off the cuff interview. Second, if he spoke over as much as it sounds like, then that's more on him than you. She misheard you, and probably became even more uncomfortable as a result, but she did not A-ask for clarification of the words she didn't understand or B-let you know you had offended her. She made an assumption and then tried to harm your career because of her mistake.
I find the most disturbing part the fact that your contact and the uni are not supporting you, and she is not calling you to apologize for her mistake.
If her English wasn’t native, OP has a greater responsibility to speak clearly and using correct grammar. Using a double negative to silence her and then making no effort to draw her out in the interview is unprofessional…and maybe even racist, we have no way to know.
So your rec is op should start speaking slooooowly with extremely straightforward grammar when speaking with professionals whose first language isn’t English? Should go great!
Anonymous
01/22/2023 19:17
Subject: Accused of racial bias at work by someone, and I feel sick over it
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I don’t get why the other person wouldn’t have reached out to op to discuss this before accusing op of racism.
Ridiculous leap to make without giving anyone a modicum of benefit of doubt
It’s not her job to do that. The university hired OP and the university is responsible for the quality of the people they hire for marketing. The researcher did the right thing reporting the piece to the bigger university since she has no way to know how many other people OP has let be pushed out of articles about their own work for the crime of having a soft voice or a loud colleague.
This is a leap. And to tie it to racism?
It is your job not to assume racism before you accuse someone of something life altering.
To go from ‘you didn’t represent my voice in your article enough’ to you’re a racist is insane leap. That’s some powerful cancelling right there. Like sure you could assume the absolute worst of someone but she could also call her and be like - can you adjust your story I have more to say.
Insane next level bs
The OP is very clear doesn’t care that she silenced the woman she only cares that she was accused of racism. Why on earth would we think she would make any changes to her story because a researcher, who has a whole job to do other than fix OPs mistakes, called her and asked for the courtesy of being credited with being the lead on her own project.
OP the university isn’t going to use what you wrote if they’re smart. Since a complaint has already been made and since your work is going to reflect your lack of interest and respect for the lead researcher, they’re going to have to pay someone else to do it over. Call your contact and tell them you don’t want to bill for this work given your mistakes (specifically not knowing who the lead was) and offer to write a letter of apology to the lead researcher for not doing your due diligence.
How is asking someone to speak up more silencing them?
She didn’t— she told her “I don’t want to not hear you”.
Say that quickly in your second language a few times and see how obvious the meaning is to you.
The silencing came when she left most of what the researcher DID say out of the finished article in favor of her junior colleague.
Saying "I don't want to not hear you" makes sense--I don't want our connection to be bad, I don't want to miss what you're saying, etc. This seems straightforward.
It makes sense to you. A native speaker. Would it be equally clear in your second language? It wouldn’t be in mine, and it’s not grammatically correct in English.
Anonymous
01/22/2023 19:09
Subject: Accused of racial bias at work by someone, and I feel sick over it
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I don’t get why the other person wouldn’t have reached out to op to discuss this before accusing op of racism.
Ridiculous leap to make without giving anyone a modicum of benefit of doubt
It’s not her job to do that. The university hired OP and the university is responsible for the quality of the people they hire for marketing. The researcher did the right thing reporting the piece to the bigger university since she has no way to know how many other people OP has let be pushed out of articles about their own work for the crime of having a soft voice or a loud colleague.
This is a leap. And to tie it to racism?
It is your job not to assume racism before you accuse someone of something life altering.
To go from ‘you didn’t represent my voice in your article enough’ to you’re a racist is insane leap. That’s some powerful cancelling right there. Like sure you could assume the absolute worst of someone but she could also call her and be like - can you adjust your story I have more to say.
Insane next level bs
The OP is very clear doesn’t care that she silenced the woman she only cares that she was accused of racism. Why on earth would we think she would make any changes to her story because a researcher, who has a whole job to do other than fix OPs mistakes, called her and asked for the courtesy of being credited with being the lead on her own project.
OP the university isn’t going to use what you wrote if they’re smart. Since a complaint has already been made and since your work is going to reflect your lack of interest and respect for the lead researcher, they’re going to have to pay someone else to do it over. Call your contact and tell them you don’t want to bill for this work given your mistakes (specifically not knowing who the lead was) and offer to write a letter of apology to the lead researcher for not doing your due diligence.
How is asking someone to speak up more silencing them?
She didn’t— she told her “I don’t want to not hear you”.
Say that quickly in your second language a few times and see how obvious the meaning is to you.
The silencing came when she left most of what the researcher DID say out of the finished article in favor of her junior colleague.
Saying "I don't want to not hear you" makes sense--I don't want our connection to be bad, I don't want to miss what you're saying, etc. This seems straightforward.
Anonymous
01/22/2023 19:05
Subject: Accused of racial bias at work by someone, and I feel sick over it
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I don’t get why the other person wouldn’t have reached out to op to discuss this before accusing op of racism.
Ridiculous leap to make without giving anyone a modicum of benefit of doubt
It’s not her job to do that. The university hired OP and the university is responsible for the quality of the people they hire for marketing. The researcher did the right thing reporting the piece to the bigger university since she has no way to know how many other people OP has let be pushed out of articles about their own work for the crime of having a soft voice or a loud colleague.
This is a leap. And to tie it to racism?
It is your job not to assume racism before you accuse someone of something life altering.
To go from ‘you didn’t represent my voice in your article enough’ to you’re a racist is insane leap. That’s some powerful cancelling right there. Like sure you could assume the absolute worst of someone but she could also call her and be like - can you adjust your story I have more to say.
Insane next level bs
The OP is very clear doesn’t care that she silenced the woman she only cares that she was accused of racism. Why on earth would we think she would make any changes to her story because a researcher, who has a whole job to do other than fix OPs mistakes, called her and asked for the courtesy of being credited with being the lead on her own project.
OP the university isn’t going to use what you wrote if they’re smart. Since a complaint has already been made and since your work is going to reflect your lack of interest and respect for the lead researcher, they’re going to have to pay someone else to do it over. Call your contact and tell them you don’t want to bill for this work given your mistakes (specifically not knowing who the lead was) and offer to write a letter of apology to the lead researcher for not doing your due diligence.
How is asking someone to speak up more silencing them?
She didn’t— she told her “I don’t want to not hear you”.
Say that quickly in your second language a few times and see how obvious the meaning is to you.
The silencing came when she left most of what the researcher DID say out of the finished article in favor of her junior colleague.
Anonymous
01/22/2023 19:04
Subject: Accused of racial bias at work by someone, and I feel sick over it
Anonymous wrote:This is clearly a problem with the Asian female and her male colleague. First, if her English is not native, then they should have known she would need to prepare her remarks instead of doing an off the cuff interview. Second, if he spoke over as much as it sounds like, then that's more on him than you. She misheard you, and probably became even more uncomfortable as a result, but she did not A-ask for clarification of the words she didn't understand or B-let you know you had offended her. She made an assumption and then tried to harm your career because of her mistake.
I find the most disturbing part the fact that your contact and the uni are not supporting you, and she is not calling you to apologize for her mistake.
If her English wasn’t native, OP has a greater responsibility to speak clearly and using correct grammar. Using a double negative to silence her and then making no effort to draw her out in the interview is unprofessional…and maybe even racist, we have no way to know.
Anonymous
01/22/2023 19:02
Subject: Accused of racial bias at work by someone, and I feel sick over it
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I don’t get why the other person wouldn’t have reached out to op to discuss this before accusing op of racism.
Ridiculous leap to make without giving anyone a modicum of benefit of doubt
It’s not her job to do that. The university hired OP and the university is responsible for the quality of the people they hire for marketing. The researcher did the right thing reporting the piece to the bigger university since she has no way to know how many other people OP has let be pushed out of articles about their own work for the crime of having a soft voice or a loud colleague.
This is a leap. And to tie it to racism?
It is your job not to assume racism before you accuse someone of something life altering.
To go from ‘you didn’t represent my voice in your article enough’ to you’re a racist is insane leap. That’s some powerful cancelling right there. Like sure you could assume the absolute worst of someone but she could also call her and be like - can you adjust your story I have more to say.
Insane next level bs
The OP is very clear doesn’t care that she silenced the woman she only cares that she was accused of racism. Why on earth would we think she would make any changes to her story because a researcher, who has a whole job to do other than fix OPs mistakes, called her and asked for the courtesy of being credited with being the lead on her own project.
OP the university isn’t going to use what you wrote if they’re smart. Since a complaint has already been made and since your work is going to reflect your lack of interest and respect for the lead researcher, they’re going to have to pay someone else to do it over. Call your contact and tell them you don’t want to bill for this work given your mistakes (specifically not knowing who the lead was) and offer to write a letter of apology to the lead researcher for not doing your due diligence.
How is asking someone to speak up more silencing them?