Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:she says she wants to at least SEE if she can get in to these places like Princeton and Pomona. I have no idea why. What is the point?

Let he know what you can pay, run the NPC to see the estimate, then let her take her shot. This is her one chance to apply to college, and there's no good reason to keep her from seeing what happens. There's a good chance she won't get in, but then the school has squelched her dreams, not you. If she gets in, there's a small chance that the financial package is better than you feared. But even if she gets in and you can't afford it, she can take pride in being "good enough" for the school, even if it's too expensive to attend.

That said, I'd also make sure she has a robust list of schools of varying costs and selectivity, and including some strong schools known for merit aid. Bonus: some of those have early action, so she can get a response before the rest of her applications are due. It's great to know that college is a sure bet, especially one that is affordable, well before the rest of the schools release their decisions.

I'm sure she'll take great comfort in that when you tell her "sorry" as she clutches her acceptance letter. "You set me up - why did you give me false hope?"

DP. OP’s child is not an imbecile, so she would not act in such a dramatic and ridiculous fashion if admitted to her dream school given that her parents told her up front what they could afford to pay. In the scenario where she is admitted, she will have either found outside scholarships that will allow her to attend, or she will recognize that she can’t pull it off but will have a huge boost of confidence wherever she starts school knowing the dream school found her worthy. She will likely tell herself she’ll attend grad school there instead, and then, four years later, realize the obsession with dream schools are silly and pick her next steps based on fit. But she’ll always take pleasure in knowing that she was once admitted to a top school.

You are hopelessly naive. Top schools don't give merit. OP's kid isn't going to get any. FAFSA financial aid sounds unlikely. So WHY is she applying to schools over $80K a year? That is cruel and a hard fact about today's college admissions. NOw if OP's kid has something to sell (URM, Band instrument; first generation; legacy; etc.) it might be a different story. This (what can you reasonably afford) is the first question any public or private college counselor will ask. Because there are options separate from the 80K+ private but you have to reorient your kid THEN to apply only to what the parents can afford. To dangle something the parents cannot afford in front of DD is parentally irresponsible
+

+1000

None of the T20 schools give significant merit, beyond a very few scholarships. 40-50%+ of students are full pay at most of those schools. The rest get some form of FA. I agree that it would be very hard for most 18yo to have the drive to apply to T20 schools and not be extremely disappointed when they get in but can't afford it.

Agree 100%. The thing is that OP isn't anywhere near being able to afford these schools. She reports being able to pay $30K/yearly and the schools are 80K+. But she makes too much for aid.
So a slight discount from the school or a $1K Rotary Club scholarship isn't going to move the needle. There is a $50K gap per year.

This is not to criticize OP---I'm in a similar position. I am being very, very, very transparent with my kids. "THERE IS NO WAY WE CAN AFFORD $80K SCHOOLS."
They've decided not to waste the time and emotional energy on applying.

Do you guys even know kids who had to turn down a college (or college period) because they couldn't afford it?
I have a feeling that his concept is foreign to most on DCUM.
I do----2 kids this past year. It's not pretty to tell a kid "hey, you got into your dream school but you're not going".
It has fractured a relationship I know.

T20 schools do give merit aid. T50 schools also offer generous scholarships to candidates in addition to aid. Parents also can request additional aid from the college. The timeline to negotiate for more aid can be very tight because some decisions are not released until after April 1st and the deposit is due by May 1st, but private schools have additional funds to offer, but you have to ask. Think of the situation like negotiating a salary for a job or negotiating a price for a car.

What T20 schools give merit aid? Asking for real as I didn’t think many did. Vandy? Duke? Rice? Not many and it is very hard to get.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:she says she wants to at least SEE if she can get in to these places like Princeton and Pomona. I have no idea why. What is the point?

Let he know what you can pay, run the NPC to see the estimate, then let her take her shot. This is her one chance to apply to college, and there's no good reason to keep her from seeing what happens. There's a good chance she won't get in, but then the school has squelched her dreams, not you. If she gets in, there's a small chance that the financial package is better than you feared. But even if she gets in and you can't afford it, she can take pride in being "good enough" for the school, even if it's too expensive to attend.

That said, I'd also make sure she has a robust list of schools of varying costs and selectivity, and including some strong schools known for merit aid. Bonus: some of those have early action, so she can get a response before the rest of her applications are due. It's great to know that college is a sure bet, especially one that is affordable, well before the rest of the schools release their decisions.

I'm sure she'll take great comfort in that when you tell her "sorry" as she clutches her acceptance letter. "You set me up - why did you give me false hope?"

DP. OP’s child is not an imbecile, so she would not act in such a dramatic and ridiculous fashion if admitted to her dream school given that her parents told her up front what they could afford to pay. In the scenario where she is admitted, she will have either found outside scholarships that will allow her to attend, or she will recognize that she can’t pull it off but will have a huge boost of confidence wherever she starts school knowing the dream school found her worthy. She will likely tell herself she’ll attend grad school there instead, and then, four years later, realize the obsession with dream schools are silly and pick her next steps based on fit. But she’ll always take pleasure in knowing that she was once admitted to a top school.

You are hopelessly naive. Top schools don't give merit. OP's kid isn't going to get any. FAFSA financial aid sounds unlikely. So WHY is she applying to schools over $80K a year? That is cruel and a hard fact about today's college admissions. NOw if OP's kid has something to sell (URM, Band instrument; first generation; legacy; etc.) it might be a different story. This (what can you reasonably afford) is the first question any public or private college counselor will ask. Because there are options separate from the 80K+ private but you have to reorient your kid THEN to apply only to what the parents can afford. To dangle something the parents cannot afford in front of DD is parentally irresponsible
+

Sticker price isn't the actual price at many schools. You really have to run the finacial aid calculator. Many schools will meet the family's financial need. Colorado College, for example, is $78,000+a year, but my family's estimated contribution at CC is $28,000. Pomona College has a sticker price of $75,000+, but my family's estimated contribution there is $63,000. Davidson College has a sticker price of $78,000, but my family's estimated price is $28,000. Similar types of schools, similar sticker prices, radically different estimated family contributions.
The calculators will give an estimate of what you'll be expected to pay.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:she says she wants to at least SEE if she can get in to these places like Princeton and Pomona. I have no idea why. What is the point?

Let he know what you can pay, run the NPC to see the estimate, then let her take her shot. This is her one chance to apply to college, and there's no good reason to keep her from seeing what happens. There's a good chance she won't get in, but then the school has squelched her dreams, not you. If she gets in, there's a small chance that the financial package is better than you feared. But even if she gets in and you can't afford it, she can take pride in being "good enough" for the school, even if it's too expensive to attend.

That said, I'd also make sure she has a robust list of schools of varying costs and selectivity, and including some strong schools known for merit aid. Bonus: some of those have early action, so she can get a response before the rest of her applications are due. It's great to know that college is a sure bet, especially one that is affordable, well before the rest of the schools release their decisions.

I'm sure she'll take great comfort in that when you tell her "sorry" as she clutches her acceptance letter. "You set me up - why did you give me false hope?"

DP. OP’s child is not an imbecile, so she would not act in such a dramatic and ridiculous fashion if admitted to her dream school given that her parents told her up front what they could afford to pay. In the scenario where she is admitted, she will have either found outside scholarships that will allow her to attend, or she will recognize that she can’t pull it off but will have a huge boost of confidence wherever she starts school knowing the dream school found her worthy. She will likely tell herself she’ll attend grad school there instead, and then, four years later, realize the obsession with dream schools are silly and pick her next steps based on fit. But she’ll always take pleasure in knowing that she was once admitted to a top school.

You are hopelessly naive. Top schools don't give merit. OP's kid isn't going to get any. FAFSA financial aid sounds unlikely. So WHY is she applying to schools over $80K a year? That is cruel and a hard fact about today's college admissions. NOw if OP's kid has something to sell (URM, Band instrument; first generation; legacy; etc.) it might be a different story. This (what can you reasonably afford) is the first question any public or private college counselor will ask. Because there are options separate from the 80K+ private but you have to reorient your kid THEN to apply only to what the parents can afford. To dangle something the parents cannot afford in front of DD is parentally irresponsible
+

The kid isn't applying blindly. Shes running the estimated finanacial aid calculator for each school, and she's getting a response that puts the school within the range. The kid is being more level headed and reasonable than the mom. If the EFC is within range, it's worth it to apply regular decision and see what the financial aid package comes out as. Plenty of schools, including "top schools" have a net price that is substantlally below the sticker price, even for families who are UMC/UC. It's worth it to apply and see what happens.

I would just tell the kid a bottom line and tell her that if the school doesn't come in under the bottom line, then it's a no=go. My friend told his daughter that she could not go to Northwestern because Northwestern could not bring their financial aid package/net price into range for their family. The kid lived. She went to another school and then Wall Street. It was fine.

That's not what OP is saying. Some of these schools are now $85K a year - and that's in after tax dollars. I hear OP saying they cannot afford these schools. period

OP said this in the very first post on this thread: "She keeps using their ‘calculators’ that indicate they will offer her some financial aid, but I think when it comes down to it my husband and I are going to be right over the cutoff with our salaries and won’t qualify for free money." OP is afraid and doesn;t want to try her luck. DC is ambitious and wants to try her luck. OP needs to run the calculators herself. She presumably has a better knowledge of where their money is. IF the calculator puts them in range, OP should let DC try. OP is running on fear, not facts.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:she says she wants to at least SEE if she can get in to these places like Princeton and Pomona. I have no idea why. What is the point?

Let he know what you can pay, run the NPC to see the estimate, then let her take her shot. This is her one chance to apply to college, and there's no good reason to keep her from seeing what happens. There's a good chance she won't get in, but then the school has squelched her dreams, not you. If she gets in, there's a small chance that the financial package is better than you feared. But even if she gets in and you can't afford it, she can take pride in being "good enough" for the school, even if it's too expensive to attend.

That said, I'd also make sure she has a robust list of schools of varying costs and selectivity, and including some strong schools known for merit aid. Bonus: some of those have early action, so she can get a response before the rest of her applications are due. It's great to know that college is a sure bet, especially one that is affordable, well before the rest of the schools release their decisions.

I'm sure she'll take great comfort in that when you tell her "sorry" as she clutches her acceptance letter. "You set me up - why did you give me false hope?"

DP. OP’s child is not an imbecile, so she would not act in such a dramatic and ridiculous fashion if admitted to her dream school given that her parents told her up front what they could afford to pay. In the scenario where she is admitted, she will have either found outside scholarships that will allow her to attend, or she will recognize that she can’t pull it off but will have a huge boost of confidence wherever she starts school knowing the dream school found her worthy. She will likely tell herself she’ll attend grad school there instead, and then, four years later, realize the obsession with dream schools are silly and pick her next steps based on fit. But she’ll always take pleasure in knowing that she was once admitted to a top school.

You are hopelessly naive. Top schools don't give merit. OP's kid isn't going to get any. FAFSA financial aid sounds unlikely. So WHY is she applying to schools over $80K a year? That is cruel and a hard fact about today's college admissions. NOw if OP's kid has something to sell (URM, Band instrument; first generation; legacy; etc.) it might be a different story. This (what can you reasonably afford) is the first question any public or private college counselor will ask. Because there are options separate from the 80K+ private but you have to reorient your kid THEN to apply only to what the parents can afford. To dangle something the parents cannot afford in front of DD is parentally irresponsible
+

+1000

None of the T20 schools give significant merit, beyond a very few scholarships. 40-50%+ of students are full pay at most of those schools. The rest get some form of FA. I agree that it would be very hard for most 18yo to have the drive to apply to T20 schools and not be extremely disappointed when they get in but can't afford it.

Agree 100%. The thing is that OP isn't anywhere near being able to afford these schools. She reports being able to pay $30K/yearly and the schools are 80K+. But she makes too much for aid.
So a slight discount from the school or a $1K Rotary Club scholarship isn't going to move the needle. There is a $50K gap per year.

This is not to criticize OP---I'm in a similar position. I am being very, very, very transparent with my kids. "THERE IS NO WAY WE CAN AFFORD $80K SCHOOLS."
They've decided not to waste the time and emotional energy on applying.

Do you guys even know kids who had to turn down a college (or college period) because they couldn't afford it?
I have a feeling that his concept is foreign to most on DCUM.
I do----2 kids this past year. It's not pretty to tell a kid "hey, you got into your dream school but you're not going".
It has fractured a relationship I know.

And your kids will eventually thank you for this and will be just FINE in life. When they are 25-30 and don't have $200k+ in debt to help pay back they will eventually get it.

That is why parents need to prep their kids thruout HS as to what is affordable for their family for college and also find some awesome Safety and Target schools that are also very affordable for your family. And to try and not let your kid have a Dream school that is not affordable.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:she says she wants to at least SEE if she can get in to these places like Princeton and Pomona. I have no idea why. What is the point?

Let he know what you can pay, run the NPC to see the estimate, then let her take her shot. This is her one chance to apply to college, and there's no good reason to keep her from seeing what happens. There's a good chance she won't get in, but then the school has squelched her dreams, not you. If she gets in, there's a small chance that the financial package is better than you feared. But even if she gets in and you can't afford it, she can take pride in being "good enough" for the school, even if it's too expensive to attend.

That said, I'd also make sure she has a robust list of schools of varying costs and selectivity, and including some strong schools known for merit aid. Bonus: some of those have early action, so she can get a response before the rest of her applications are due. It's great to know that college is a sure bet, especially one that is affordable, well before the rest of the schools release their decisions.

I'm sure she'll take great comfort in that when you tell her "sorry" as she clutches her acceptance letter. "You set me up - why did you give me false hope?"

DP. OP’s child is not an imbecile, so she would not act in such a dramatic and ridiculous fashion if admitted to her dream school given that her parents told her up front what they could afford to pay. In the scenario where she is admitted, she will have either found outside scholarships that will allow her to attend, or she will recognize that she can’t pull it off but will have a huge boost of confidence wherever she starts school knowing the dream school found her worthy. She will likely tell herself she’ll attend grad school there instead, and then, four years later, realize the obsession with dream schools are silly and pick her next steps based on fit. But she’ll always take pleasure in knowing that she was once admitted to a top school.

You are hopelessly naive. Top schools don't give merit. OP's kid isn't going to get any. FAFSA financial aid sounds unlikely. So WHY is she applying to schools over $80K a year? That is cruel and a hard fact about today's college admissions. NOw if OP's kid has something to sell (URM, Band instrument; first generation; legacy; etc.) it might be a different story. This (what can you reasonably afford) is the first question any public or private college counselor will ask. Because there are options separate from the 80K+ private but you have to reorient your kid THEN to apply only to what the parents can afford. To dangle something the parents cannot afford in front of DD is parentally irresponsible
+

+1000

None of the T20 schools give significant merit, beyond a very few scholarships. 40-50%+ of students are full pay at most of those schools. The rest get some form of FA. I agree that it would be very hard for most 18yo to have the drive to apply to T20 schools and not be extremely disappointed when they get in but can't afford it.

Agree 100%. The thing is that OP isn't anywhere near being able to afford these schools. She reports being able to pay $30K/yearly and the schools are 80K+. But she makes too much for aid.
So a slight discount from the school or a $1K Rotary Club scholarship isn't going to move the needle. There is a $50K gap per year.

This is not to criticize OP---I'm in a similar position. I am being very, very, very transparent with my kids. "THERE IS NO WAY WE CAN AFFORD $80K SCHOOLS."
They've decided not to waste the time and emotional energy on applying.

Do you guys even know kids who had to turn down a college (or college period) because they couldn't afford it?
I have a feeling that his concept is foreign to most on DCUM.
I do----2 kids this past year. It's not pretty to tell a kid "hey, you got into your dream school but you're not going".
It has fractured a relationship I know.

Maybe it fractures the relationship in parts because kids, growing into adults, understand that their parents had lived beyond their means if they wanted the opportunity for their kids to attend colleges that can, in certain areas, make a tremendous difference in professional opportunities. that’s a parental choice, and depending on the family situation may have been a good choice or a bad choice. But nonetheless, kids may correctly feel that their parents made financial decisions that impacted their ability to attend colleges that could really help made a difference. Not always, of course, but in certain majors and for certain professions. I don’t think parents should hide that. If the parents view is that they are responsible for their kids through age 18, and then for paying the equivalent of a state school, many of which are terrific, so be it. But be transparent that you made a choice. It’s not that you can’t afford it, absent unusual circumstances that you could communicate with your children, but that you made choices that are not consistent with your kid being able to attend Princeton if admitted. Based on some of the responses above, there seems to be a minimization or a scarfing at kids for being disappointed or upset. I personally would have been upset to realize that my parents, knowing full well the landscape of college and costs, made financial decisions that preclude me from attending a college that could make a huge difference. In short, I would not ever start a child, about to be an adult, from applying to a school. And many of the responses above seem to be more geared toward parents avoiding their kids responses if they can’t afford it, which is really to say that they have made decisions all along the way, and perhaps for a good ones, that this is not a priority that they had accounted for.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:she says she wants to at least SEE if she can get in to these places like Princeton and Pomona. I have no idea why. What is the point?

Let he know what you can pay, run the NPC to see the estimate, then let her take her shot. This is her one chance to apply to college, and there's no good reason to keep her from seeing what happens. There's a good chance she won't get in, but then the school has squelched her dreams, not you. If she gets in, there's a small chance that the financial package is better than you feared. But even if she gets in and you can't afford it, she can take pride in being "good enough" for the school, even if it's too expensive to attend.

That said, I'd also make sure she has a robust list of schools of varying costs and selectivity, and including some strong schools known for merit aid. Bonus: some of those have early action, so she can get a response before the rest of her applications are due. It's great to know that college is a sure bet, especially one that is affordable, well before the rest of the schools release their decisions.

I'm sure she'll take great comfort in that when you tell her "sorry" as she clutches her acceptance letter. "You set me up - why did you give me false hope?"

DP. OP’s child is not an imbecile, so she would not act in such a dramatic and ridiculous fashion if admitted to her dream school given that her parents told her up front what they could afford to pay. In the scenario where she is admitted, she will have either found outside scholarships that will allow her to attend, or she will recognize that she can’t pull it off but will have a huge boost of confidence wherever she starts school knowing the dream school found her worthy. She will likely tell herself she’ll attend grad school there instead, and then, four years later, realize the obsession with dream schools are silly and pick her next steps based on fit. But she’ll always take pleasure in knowing that she was once admitted to a top school.

You are hopelessly naive. Top schools don't give merit. OP's kid isn't going to get any. FAFSA financial aid sounds unlikely. So WHY is she applying to schools over $80K a year? That is cruel and a hard fact about today's college admissions. NOw if OP's kid has something to sell (URM, Band instrument; first generation; legacy; etc.) it might be a different story. This (what can you reasonably afford) is the first question any public or private college counselor will ask. Because there are options separate from the 80K+ private but you have to reorient your kid THEN to apply only to what the parents can afford. To dangle something the parents cannot afford in front of DD is parentally irresponsible
+

+1000

None of the T20 schools give significant merit, beyond a very few scholarships. 40-50%+ of students are full pay at most of those schools. The rest get some form of FA. I agree that it would be very hard for most 18yo to have the drive to apply to T20 schools and not be extremely disappointed when they get in but can't afford it.

Agree 100%. The thing is that OP isn't anywhere near being able to afford these schools. She reports being able to pay $30K/yearly and the schools are 80K+. But she makes too much for aid.
So a slight discount from the school or a $1K Rotary Club scholarship isn't going to move the needle. There is a $50K gap per year.

This is not to criticize OP---I'm in a similar position. I am being very, very, very transparent with my kids. "THERE IS NO WAY WE CAN AFFORD $80K SCHOOLS."
They've decided not to waste the time and emotional energy on applying.

Do you guys even know kids who had to turn down a college (or college period) because they couldn't afford it?
I have a feeling that his concept is foreign to most on DCUM.
I do----2 kids this past year. It's not pretty to tell a kid "hey, you got into your dream school but you're not going".
It has fractured a relationship I know.

T20 schools do give merit aid. T50 schools also offer generous scholarships to candidates in addition to aid. Parents also can request additional aid from the college. The timeline to negotiate for more aid can be very tight because some decisions are not released until after April 1st and the deposit is due by May 1st, but private schools have additional funds to offer, but you have to ask. Think of the situation like negotiating a salary for a job or negotiating a price for a car.

Do you guys even know kids who had to turn down a college (or college period) because they couldn't afford it?
I have a feeling that his concept is foreign to most on DCUM.

People on DCUM who are sending two kids to private schools at $50k/year can indeed afford those $80k schools but they clearly don't understand they are in the 1% - and more importantly, don't understand that it's out of reach for people in the "top 5%" of income (many of whom are also in DCUM).

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Can you get need based aid at $250k?

Yes. Our DC got need based aid.

Where was this? That's almost unheard of at that HHI level, particularly anything over a nominal amount. No one should think they might get need based aid with that income unless there are unusual circumstances at play (e.g. 3 kids in college at the same time). We don't even make $200K and we still get an EFC of more than $60K.

Yes, 3 tuitions. We aren’t expecting this in two or three years.

Sorry but this bothers me. Why should you get a break because you had multiple kids? But we don't get a break for living in a high COLA area and made the decision to forego more kids, more expensive purchases in life to save for the kids we have?
This is the BS unfairness of this process.

Having more kids and raising them successfully is a great benefit to society.

You living in a high COLA area and refusing to have more kids is a detriment to society.

It is not at all unfair that the former should be rewarded and the latter punished.

Certainly one opinion. Another opinion is that for sustainability purposes, it is certainly not. More kids = greater use of depleting resources of the earth, eating food, buying so many things, large vehicles that run on energy--even EVs are not magical.

The correct opinion is that more people are necessary because they will provide the genius necessary to solve those problems.

DP: I have a hard time anyone taking seriously anyone who is assured there is a "correct opinion" on something as complex and unpredictable as this.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:she says she wants to at least SEE if she can get in to these places like Princeton and Pomona. I have no idea why. What is the point?

Let he know what you can pay, run the NPC to see the estimate, then let her take her shot. This is her one chance to apply to college, and there's no good reason to keep her from seeing what happens. There's a good chance she won't get in, but then the school has squelched her dreams, not you. If she gets in, there's a small chance that the financial package is better than you feared. But even if she gets in and you can't afford it, she can take pride in being "good enough" for the school, even if it's too expensive to attend.

That said, I'd also make sure she has a robust list of schools of varying costs and selectivity, and including some strong schools known for merit aid. Bonus: some of those have early action, so she can get a response before the rest of her applications are due. It's great to know that college is a sure bet, especially one that is affordable, well before the rest of the schools release their decisions.

I'm sure she'll take great comfort in that when you tell her "sorry" as she clutches her acceptance letter. "You set me up - why did you give me false hope?"

DP. OP’s child is not an imbecile, so she would not act in such a dramatic and ridiculous fashion if admitted to her dream school given that her parents told her up front what they could afford to pay. In the scenario where she is admitted, she will have either found outside scholarships that will allow her to attend, or she will recognize that she can’t pull it off but will have a huge boost of confidence wherever she starts school knowing the dream school found her worthy. She will likely tell herself she’ll attend grad school there instead, and then, four years later, realize the obsession with dream schools are silly and pick her next steps based on fit. But she’ll always take pleasure in knowing that she was once admitted to a top school.

You are hopelessly naive. Top schools don't give merit. OP's kid isn't going to get any. FAFSA financial aid sounds unlikely. So WHY is she applying to schools over $80K a year? That is cruel and a hard fact about today's college admissions. NOw if OP's kid has something to sell (URM, Band instrument; first generation; legacy; etc.) it might be a different story. This (what can you reasonably afford) is the first question any public or private college counselor will ask. Because there are options separate from the 80K+ private but you have to reorient your kid THEN to apply only to what the parents can afford. To dangle something the parents cannot afford in front of DD is parentally irresponsible
+

+1000

None of the T20 schools give significant merit, beyond a very few scholarships. 40-50%+ of students are full pay at most of those schools. The rest get some form of FA. I agree that it would be very hard for most 18yo to have the drive to apply to T20 schools and not be extremely disappointed when they get in but can't afford it.

Agree 100%. The thing is that OP isn't anywhere near being able to afford these schools. She reports being able to pay $30K/yearly and the schools are 80K+. But she makes too much for aid.
So a slight discount from the school or a $1K Rotary Club scholarship isn't going to move the needle. There is a $50K gap per year.

This is not to criticize OP---I'm in a similar position. I am being very, very, very transparent with my kids. "THERE IS NO WAY WE CAN AFFORD $80K SCHOOLS."
They've decided not to waste the time and emotional energy on applying.

Do you guys even know kids who had to turn down a college (or college period) because they couldn't afford it?
I have a feeling that his concept is foreign to most on DCUM.
I do----2 kids this past year. It's not pretty to tell a kid "hey, you got into your dream school but you're not going".
It has fractured a relationship I know.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The mom says the family can’t afford these schools. The schools say the family can. The kid is trying to play the schools against her parents: she’ll get in and go to her parents saying “Princeton says I’m smart, and they also say you can afford it. If you don’t believe you can afford it, you must not believe I’m smart!” And she’ll have a point. Why would you care so much about what a college admissions office thinks, and not care at all about what the financial aid office thinks? If you’re going to carry that acceptance in your heart forever, wouldn’t you also carry forever the same school’s assessment that your parents could actually have paid for it, if only they were willing?

Honestly, it's probably true that the parents could actually have paid for it, if only they were willing. Schools make the calculation that if parents save over the 18 years before college, and then pay more out of pocket, the kid can go to the school. Of course it's entirely fair for the parents to have different priorities for their money. But it wouldn't be wrong for the kid to feel that her parents prioritized other things over her chance to go to Princeton.

I completely agree with this. Your child is going to grow up and possibly start a family of her own, including children. In the very long run, I think it is good for her to understand the potential consequences of various choices. Your family is a choice in terms of where you live, Responding and receiving. And I have no reason to doubt that you made those choices with yourselves, and your family in mind. And making those choices, though, you have also precluded your daughter from being able to attend Princeton if she is admitted. That is one Datapoint among many, many data points and how a family chooses to use And say finances. My parents made different choices. They started saving for college before I was born, I would never have even thought of living in DC as it was far too expensive, and instead I grew up in a nondescript suburb that people generally make fun of. And there were some limitations in my experiences as a result I am sure. But, my parents had my and my siblings education, through professional school, completely covered. College has gotten far more expensive, always exceeding the rate of inflation, my parents also had saved for our weddings, and to assist with down payments on houses. Fortunately, I never needed the wedding or house savings, but as parents that had been their priority and they spent and saved accordingly. I don’t think that that is better or worse necessarily then living closer in if jobs require, providing growing kids with experiences I may have never had, or other choices. But these are choices, it’s not about affordability. It’s about what high earning parents have chosen to do. In conversations with your daughter, I would simply on that. Because she will definitely hear from others whose parents make less than you, but who don’t get it, that the family is making Princeton or similar schools happen. Again, there is not a right answer, but your daughter is about to be an adult, and if she feels she wasn’t even able to apply to Princeton, which for certain majors provides for truly extraordinary access to professional opportunities, she should understand why. And if she’s going into a major where Princeton or similar does not matter much in terms of professional choices later on, she should understand that as well. In short, I think the key for me would be complete transparency about family choices, competing interests and necessities, and the value of Princeton or similar in particular areas of interest. Especially for a kid who might even be in the running for that really healthy set of learning opportunities and also a very respectful conversation.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:she says she wants to at least SEE if she can get in to these places like Princeton and Pomona. I have no idea why. What is the point?

Let he know what you can pay, run the NPC to see the estimate, then let her take her shot. This is her one chance to apply to college, and there's no good reason to keep her from seeing what happens. There's a good chance she won't get in, but then the school has squelched her dreams, not you. If she gets in, there's a small chance that the financial package is better than you feared. But even if she gets in and you can't afford it, she can take pride in being "good enough" for the school, even if it's too expensive to attend.

That said, I'd also make sure she has a robust list of schools of varying costs and selectivity, and including some strong schools known for merit aid. Bonus: some of those have early action, so she can get a response before the rest of her applications are due. It's great to know that college is a sure bet, especially one that is affordable, well before the rest of the schools release their decisions.

I'm sure she'll take great comfort in that when you tell her "sorry" as she clutches her acceptance letter. "You set me up - why did you give me false hope?"

DP. OP’s child is not an imbecile, so she would not act in such a dramatic and ridiculous fashion if admitted to her dream school given that her parents told her up front what they could afford to pay. In the scenario where she is admitted, she will have either found outside scholarships that will allow her to attend, or she will recognize that she can’t pull it off but will have a huge boost of confidence wherever she starts school knowing the dream school found her worthy. She will likely tell herself she’ll attend grad school there instead, and then, four years later, realize the obsession with dream schools are silly and pick her next steps based on fit. But she’ll always take pleasure in knowing that she was once admitted to a top school.

You are hopelessly naive. Top schools don't give merit. OP's kid isn't going to get any. FAFSA financial aid sounds unlikely. So WHY is she applying to schools over $80K a year? That is cruel and a hard fact about today's college admissions. NOw if OP's kid has something to sell (URM, Band instrument; first generation; legacy; etc.) it might be a different story. This (what can you reasonably afford) is the first question any public or private college counselor will ask. Because there are options separate from the 80K+ private but you have to reorient your kid THEN to apply only to what the parents can afford. To dangle something the parents cannot afford in front of DD is parentally irresponsible
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The kid isn't applying blindly. Shes running the estimated finanacial aid calculator for each school, and she's getting a response that puts the school within the range. The kid is being more level headed and reasonable than the mom. If the EFC is within range, it's worth it to apply regular decision and see what the financial aid package comes out as. Plenty of schools, including "top schools" have a net price that is substantlally below the sticker price, even for families who are UMC/UC. It's worth it to apply and see what happens.

I would just tell the kid a bottom line and tell her that if the school doesn't come in under the bottom line, then it's a no=go. My friend told his daughter that she could not go to Northwestern because Northwestern could not bring their financial aid package/net price into range for their family. The kid lived. She went to another school and then Wall Street. It was fine.

That's not what OP is saying. Some of these schools are now $85K a year - and that's in after tax dollars. I hear OP saying they cannot afford these schools. period

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:she says she wants to at least SEE if she can get in to these places like Princeton and Pomona. I have no idea why. What is the point?

Let he know what you can pay, run the NPC to see the estimate, then let her take her shot. This is her one chance to apply to college, and there's no good reason to keep her from seeing what happens. There's a good chance she won't get in, but then the school has squelched her dreams, not you. If she gets in, there's a small chance that the financial package is better than you feared. But even if she gets in and you can't afford it, she can take pride in being "good enough" for the school, even if it's too expensive to attend.

That said, I'd also make sure she has a robust list of schools of varying costs and selectivity, and including some strong schools known for merit aid. Bonus: some of those have early action, so she can get a response before the rest of her applications are due. It's great to know that college is a sure bet, especially one that is affordable, well before the rest of the schools release their decisions.

I'm sure she'll take great comfort in that when you tell her "sorry" as she clutches her acceptance letter. "You set me up - why did you give me false hope?"

DP. OP’s child is not an imbecile, so she would not act in such a dramatic and ridiculous fashion if admitted to her dream school given that her parents told her up front what they could afford to pay. In the scenario where she is admitted, she will have either found outside scholarships that will allow her to attend, or she will recognize that she can’t pull it off but will have a huge boost of confidence wherever she starts school knowing the dream school found her worthy. She will likely tell herself she’ll attend grad school there instead, and then, four years later, realize the obsession with dream schools are silly and pick her next steps based on fit. But she’ll always take pleasure in knowing that she was once admitted to a top school.

You are hopelessly naive. Top schools don't give merit. OP's kid isn't going to get any. FAFSA financial aid sounds unlikely. So WHY is she applying to schools over $80K a year? That is cruel and a hard fact about today's college admissions. NOw if OP's kid has something to sell (URM, Band instrument; first generation; legacy; etc.) it might be a different story. This (what can you reasonably afford) is the first question any public or private college counselor will ask. Because there are options separate from the 80K+ private but you have to reorient your kid THEN to apply only to what the parents can afford. To dangle something the parents cannot afford in front of DD is parentally irresponsible
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+1000

None of the T20 schools give significant merit, beyond a very few scholarships. 40-50%+ of students are full pay at most of those schools. The rest get some form of FA. I agree that it would be very hard for most 18yo to have the drive to apply to T20 schools and not be extremely disappointed when they get in but can't afford it.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:she says she wants to at least SEE if she can get in to these places like Princeton and Pomona. I have no idea why. What is the point?

Let he know what you can pay, run the NPC to see the estimate, then let her take her shot. This is her one chance to apply to college, and there's no good reason to keep her from seeing what happens. There's a good chance she won't get in, but then the school has squelched her dreams, not you. If she gets in, there's a small chance that the financial package is better than you feared. But even if she gets in and you can't afford it, she can take pride in being "good enough" for the school, even if it's too expensive to attend.

That said, I'd also make sure she has a robust list of schools of varying costs and selectivity, and including some strong schools known for merit aid. Bonus: some of those have early action, so she can get a response before the rest of her applications are due. It's great to know that college is a sure bet, especially one that is affordable, well before the rest of the schools release their decisions.

I'm sure she'll take great comfort in that when you tell her "sorry" as she clutches her acceptance letter. "You set me up - why did you give me false hope?"

DP. OP’s child is not an imbecile, so she would not act in such a dramatic and ridiculous fashion if admitted to her dream school given that her parents told her up front what they could afford to pay. In the scenario where she is admitted, she will have either found outside scholarships that will allow her to attend, or she will recognize that she can’t pull it off but will have a huge boost of confidence wherever she starts school knowing the dream school found her worthy. She will likely tell herself she’ll attend grad school there instead, and then, four years later, realize the obsession with dream schools are silly and pick her next steps based on fit. But she’ll always take pleasure in knowing that she was once admitted to a top school.

You are hopelessly naive. Top schools don't give merit. OP's kid isn't going to get any. FAFSA financial aid sounds unlikely. So WHY is she applying to schools over $80K a year? That is cruel and a hard fact about today's college admissions. NOw if OP's kid has something to sell (URM, Band instrument; first generation; legacy; etc.) it might be a different story. This (what can you reasonably afford) is the first question any public or private college counselor will ask. Because there are options separate from the 80K+ private but you have to reorient your kid THEN to apply only to what the parents can afford. To dangle something the parents cannot afford in front of DD is parentally irresponsible
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I’m not naive in the slightest, and I never mentioned merit scholarships. I understand that outside scholarships are hard to get if you are not willing to go the ROTC route a PP mentioned (many of my family members have gone that route FWIW). And no one is dangling anything in front of this kid. She knows what the dollar limits are, and she wants to apply anyway, presumably to see if she can get in. She will not get in, and then she will not be left wondering if she could have. On the minuscule chance she gets in, she’ll face the reality she was told by all to expect. She’ll live and move on with her life. This is not some high stakes game, just an ambitious kid wondering what her level is.

The
I agree with this. An 18 year old should be able to live with this result if educated about the possibilities before applying.

Anonymous wrote:The mom says the family can’t afford these schools. The schools say the family can. The kid is trying to play the schools against her parents: she’ll get in and go to her parents saying “Princeton says I’m smart, and they also say you can afford it. If you don’t believe you can afford it, you must not believe I’m smart!” And she’ll have a point. Why would you care so much about what a college admissions office thinks, and not care at all about what the financial aid office thinks? If you’re going to carry that acceptance in your heart forever, wouldn’t you also carry forever the same school’s assessment that your parents could actually have paid for it, if only they were willing?

Honestly, it's probably true that the parents could actually have paid for it, if only they were willing. Schools make the calculation that if parents save over the 18 years before college, and then pay more out of pocket, the kid can go to the school. Of course it's entirely fair for the parents to have different priorities for their money. But it wouldn't be wrong for the kid to feel that her parents prioritized other things over her chance to go to Princeton.

The mom says the family can’t afford these schools. The schools say the family can. The kid is trying to play the schools against her parents: she’ll get in and go to her parents saying “Princeton says I’m smart, and they also say you can afford it. If you don’t believe you can afford it, you must not believe I’m smart!” And she’ll have a point. Why would you care so much about what a college admissions office thinks, and not care at all about what the financial aid office thinks? If you’re going to carry that acceptance in your heart forever, wouldn’t you also carry forever the same school’s assessment that your parents could actually have paid for it, if only they were willing?