Anonymous
07/20/2022 15:33
Subject: Re:S/O. What’s the point of potty training so young?
Anonymous wrote:It's so telling that the rudest people on this thread are the early training advocates. Kind of tells you all you need to know.
+1 I wonder if they are also anti-redshirters.
Anonymous
07/20/2022 15:32
Subject: Re:S/O. What’s the point of potty training so young?
It's so telling that the rudest people on this thread are the early training advocates. Kind of tells you all you need to know.
Anonymous
07/20/2022 15:31
Subject: Re:S/O. What’s the point of potty training so young?
Anonymous wrote:This thread too a bad turn but here’s why I trained all three kids before they were two: I wanted my kids to always do what they were capable doing. Since they were all capable of holding and releasing urine at will, they were ready and able. Bowel control happens even younger.
And I didn't train my kid before two because she was not capable of holding and releasing urine at will until later. It was not because I was lazy or because I don't love my kid or because I'm engaged in some kind of conspiracy with the disposable diaper industry (we actually used a combination of disposable and cloth diapers because I hate the waste of disposable diapers).
See how that works?
Anonymous
07/20/2022 15:29
Subject: Re:S/O. What’s the point of potty training so young?
Anonymous wrote:This thread too a bad turn but here’s why I trained all three kids before they were two: I wanted my kids to always do what they were capable doing. Since they were all capable of holding and releasing urine at will, they were ready and able. Bowel control happens even younger.
+1. Same.
Anonymous
07/20/2022 15:25
Subject: Re:S/O. What’s the point of potty training so young?
This thread too a bad turn but here’s why I trained all three kids before they were two: I wanted my kids to always do what they were capable doing. Since they were all capable of holding and releasing urine at will, they were ready and able. Bowel control happens even younger.
Anonymous
07/20/2022 15:23
Subject: Re:S/O. What’s the point of potty training so young?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:From the 2001 Schum study on potty training (the most recent peer reviewed study on the matter):
"Girls demonstrated toilet-training skills at earlier ages than boys. The median ages for "staying dry during the day" were 32.5 months (95% confidence interval: 30.9--33.7) and 35.0 months (95% confidence interval: 33.3--36.7) for girls and boys, respectively. The median ages for readiness skills for girls and boys, respectively, were as follows: "showing an interest in using the potty," 24 and 26 months; "staying dry for 2 hours," 26 and 29 months; "indicating a need to go to the bathroom," 26 and 29 months. There was a marked concordance in the sequences in which girls and boys achieve individual skills. In addition, the interquartile ranges of the toileting skills varied from 6.9 to 11.4 months in girls and from 7.5 to 14.6 months in boys. In this study population, girls achieve nearly all toilet-training skills earlier than boys, including successful completion. Most children do not master the readiness skills until after the second birthday. The range of normalcy for the attainment of individual skills may vary by as much as a year."
So AVERAGE age for girls is 32.5 months and for boys 35 months. And normal variation is as much as a year. Meaning that 2.5-3.5 is very much within the normal range. A child might potty train at 22 or 24 months, but they are an outlier, just as a child who trains at 4 is an outlier.
The study also looked at "readiness skills" including showing an interest in the potty and the ability to indicate that they needed to go to the bathroom, and most do not show these signs of readiness until after 2.
The study also doesn't get into this, but UC Davis Health reports that the average time it takes to potty train is 2-3 months for girls, and 6 months for boys (again, these are averages, meaning that for every child who potty trains in a week, expect to find a child who takes significantly longer than the average). So when people say their kid trained at 3, it might mean they started at 2.5. Which is why it's so common for kids to train right around their 3rd birthday, since most people start training right around 2.5. It is very unusual for a child to train in just a few days of bootcamp-style training, despite what random strangers on DCUM try to convince you.
Here is the Schum study: https://www.researchgate.net/publication/11487825_Sequential_Acquisition_of_Toilet-Training_Skills_A_Descriptive_Study_of_Gender_and_Age_Differences_in_Normal_Children
And the UC Davis resource: https://health.ucdavis.edu/children/patients_family_resources/potty-training-children.html
How do they define “confidence” and what is the criteria for this study? We all know kids have been training later and later due to disposable diapers.
They don't use "confidence" as a metric. They use very clear metrics like "staying dry during the day" (i.e. no accidents) or the ability to recognize they need to go and indicate it before an accident occurs. The portion of the abstract I quoted is very clear about all of this and doesn't mention "confidence." Perhaps read it before commenting?
Regarding disposable diapers, I am sure they do result in later potty training. Maybe partly because diaper companies want to sell more diapers, but I think the main impact they have is that they are very good at wicking moisture away from a child, which means that babies and toddler may not get used to the feeling of wetness. That can impact their interest in potty training, as well as make it take longer because they have less familiarity with the sensation of wetness and it can take time to understand that.
We have also structured much of our lives around the convenience of disposable diapers. Two parent households, lives that take children outside their home regularly, more travel, etc., make cloth diapers incredibly inconvenient, which is why so few families choose them now. It's also become more common for new moms to get little to no support from family or community, so it is unsurprising that they are more likely to choose the easier option.
If you don't like this trend, my suggestion is to advocate for more cloth diaper use (also much more environmentally friendly) and find ways to provide greater support to parents who want to train earlier. Often daycares will fight against parents who want to train early. Some parents wind up delaying training until their lives will accommodate it (until they can take some time off, until summer when they can spend time outside, etc.) all of which delays training. If you really want people to train their kids earlier, why not do something productive about it instead of just yelling at people online about how old their kids were when they trained?
Anonymous
07/20/2022 15:22
Subject: Re:S/O. What’s the point of potty training so young?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:My training in pediatrics says averages are 50% of toddlers are trained by 36 months of age. Standard advice is not to start till after 28 months of age.
+1, fully half of all kids train after turning 3. And the percent of kids not trained by kindergarten is quite small. So those 3 year olds are successful.
It's parental preference and yes, you can absolutely do harm by training too early.
+2, 3 is average the average age in a developed society.
Now that’s a lie.
Pp not lying. I was recently told by my pediatrician that three is on point. And a little later for boys.
Lol what. That’s absurd. Any later than 2.5 is weird, but earlier than that is easier
As stupid as you are, we all know you need “easy.”
I’m sorry, it sounds like this is a really emotional topic for you. But, why on earth would you want to intentionally make something fundamental like that harder (…for yourself, your kid, their teachers, any sitters….?) Does not make sense.
Anonymous
07/20/2022 15:20
Subject: Re:S/O. What’s the point of potty training so young?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:My training in pediatrics says averages are 50% of toddlers are trained by 36 months of age. Standard advice is not to start till after 28 months of age.
+1, fully half of all kids train after turning 3. And the percent of kids not trained by kindergarten is quite small. So those 3 year olds are successful.
It's parental preference and yes, you can absolutely do harm by training too early.
20 months isn’t too early. It’s been done for centuries. You’re just silly.
For centuries people didn't have modern plumbing or underwear. Kids ran around naked and learned to go behind a tree. People had lower standards of cleanliness and hygiene. Learning to use a modern toilet is a totally different deal and it actually makes sense that most kids take a bit longer because going to the bathroom sitting down is a weird modern convenience that we force on them, which is why doing so very early is entirely about parental preference and can cause issues. Toilet put kids in an unnatural position to eliminate.
You really are twisting yourself into knots because you're ashamed you waited until 3.5 years old to potty train.
You want a cookie? I bet you tag about how much smarter your kid is than everyone other kid on this planet.
Yes, please. I love having my two year old able to use the big toilet by himself but I’ll definitely take the cookie too!
Anonymous
07/20/2022 15:19
Subject: Re:S/O. What’s the point of potty training so young?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:My training in pediatrics says averages are 50% of toddlers are trained by 36 months of age. Standard advice is not to start till after 28 months of age.
+1, fully half of all kids train after turning 3. And the percent of kids not trained by kindergarten is quite small. So those 3 year olds are successful.
It's parental preference and yes, you can absolutely do harm by training too early.
+2, 3 is average the average age in a developed society.
Now that’s a lie.
Pp not lying. I was recently told by my pediatrician that three is on point. And a little later for boys.
Lol what. That’s absurd. Any later than 2.5 is weird, but earlier than that is easier
As stupid as you are, we all know you need “easy.”
Anonymous
07/20/2022 15:17
Subject: Re:S/O. What’s the point of potty training so young?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:My training in pediatrics says averages are 50% of toddlers are trained by 36 months of age. Standard advice is not to start till after 28 months of age.
+1, fully half of all kids train after turning 3. And the percent of kids not trained by kindergarten is quite small. So those 3 year olds are successful.
It's parental preference and yes, you can absolutely do harm by training too early.
20 months isn’t too early. It’s been done for centuries. You’re just silly.
For centuries people didn't have modern plumbing or underwear. Kids ran around naked and learned to go behind a tree. People had lower standards of cleanliness and hygiene. Learning to use a modern toilet is a totally different deal and it actually makes sense that most kids take a bit longer because going to the bathroom sitting down is a weird modern convenience that we force on them, which is why doing so very early is entirely about parental preference and can cause issues. Toilet put kids in an unnatural position to eliminate.
You really are twisting yourself into knots because you're ashamed you waited until 3.5 years old to potty train.
You want a cookie? I bet you tag about how much smarter your kid is than everyone other kid on this planet.
Anonymous
07/20/2022 15:16
Subject: Re:S/O. What’s the point of potty training so young?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:My training in pediatrics says averages are 50% of toddlers are trained by 36 months of age. Standard advice is not to start till after 28 months of age.
+1, fully half of all kids train after turning 3. And the percent of kids not trained by kindergarten is quite small. So those 3 year olds are successful.
It's parental preference and yes, you can absolutely do harm by training too early.
+2, 3 is average the average age in a developed society.
Now that’s a lie.
Pp not lying. I was recently told by my pediatrician that three is on point. And a little later for boys.
Lol what. That’s absurd. Any later than 2.5 is weird, but earlier than that is easier
Yeah, because you know more than a medically trained physician.
Anonymous
07/20/2022 15:10
Subject: Re:S/O. What’s the point of potty training so young?
Anonymous wrote:From the 2001 Schum study on potty training (the most recent peer reviewed study on the matter):
"Girls demonstrated toilet-training skills at earlier ages than boys. The median ages for "staying dry during the day" were 32.5 months (95% confidence interval: 30.9--33.7) and 35.0 months (95% confidence interval: 33.3--36.7) for girls and boys, respectively. The median ages for readiness skills for girls and boys, respectively, were as follows: "showing an interest in using the potty," 24 and 26 months; "staying dry for 2 hours," 26 and 29 months; "indicating a need to go to the bathroom," 26 and 29 months. There was a marked concordance in the sequences in which girls and boys achieve individual skills. In addition, the interquartile ranges of the toileting skills varied from 6.9 to 11.4 months in girls and from 7.5 to 14.6 months in boys. In this study population, girls achieve nearly all toilet-training skills earlier than boys, including successful completion. Most children do not master the readiness skills until after the second birthday. The range of normalcy for the attainment of individual skills may vary by as much as a year."
So AVERAGE age for girls is 32.5 months and for boys 35 months. And normal variation is as much as a year. Meaning that 2.5-3.5 is very much within the normal range. A child might potty train at 22 or 24 months, but they are an outlier, just as a child who trains at 4 is an outlier.
The study also looked at "readiness skills" including showing an interest in the potty and the ability to indicate that they needed to go to the bathroom, and most do not show these signs of readiness until after 2.
The study also doesn't get into this, but UC Davis Health reports that the average time it takes to potty train is 2-3 months for girls, and 6 months for boys (again, these are averages, meaning that for every child who potty trains in a week, expect to find a child who takes significantly longer than the average). So when people say their kid trained at 3, it might mean they started at 2.5. Which is why it's so common for kids to train right around their 3rd birthday, since most people start training right around 2.5. It is very unusual for a child to train in just a few days of bootcamp-style training, despite what random strangers on DCUM try to convince you.
Here is the Schum study: https://www.researchgate.net/publication/11487825_Sequential_Acquisition_of_Toilet-Training_Skills_A_Descriptive_Study_of_Gender_and_Age_Differences_in_Normal_Children
And the UC Davis resource: https://health.ucdavis.edu/children/patients_family_resources/potty-training-children.html
How do they define “confidence” and what is the criteria for this study? We all know kids have been training later and later due to disposable diapers.
Anonymous
07/20/2022 15:08
Subject: Re:S/O. What’s the point of potty training so young?
From the 2001 Schum study on potty training (the most recent peer reviewed study on the matter):
"Girls demonstrated toilet-training skills at earlier ages than boys. The median ages for "staying dry during the day" were 32.5 months (95% confidence interval: 30.9--33.7) and 35.0 months (95% confidence interval: 33.3--36.7) for girls and boys, respectively. The median ages for readiness skills for girls and boys, respectively, were as follows: "showing an interest in using the potty," 24 and 26 months; "staying dry for 2 hours," 26 and 29 months; "indicating a need to go to the bathroom," 26 and 29 months. There was a marked concordance in the sequences in which girls and boys achieve individual skills. In addition, the interquartile ranges of the toileting skills varied from 6.9 to 11.4 months in girls and from 7.5 to 14.6 months in boys. In this study population, girls achieve nearly all toilet-training skills earlier than boys, including successful completion. Most children do not master the readiness skills until after the second birthday. The range of normalcy for the attainment of individual skills may vary by as much as a year."
So AVERAGE age for girls is 32.5 months and for boys 35 months. And normal variation is as much as a year. Meaning that 2.5-3.5 is very much within the normal range. A child might potty train at 22 or 24 months, but they are an outlier, just as a child who trains at 4 is an outlier.
The study also looked at "readiness skills" including showing an interest in the potty and the ability to indicate that they needed to go to the bathroom, and most do not show these signs of readiness until after 2.
The study also doesn't get into this, but UC Davis Health reports that the average time it takes to potty train is 2-3 months for girls, and 6 months for boys (again, these are averages, meaning that for every child who potty trains in a week, expect to find a child who takes significantly longer than the average). So when people say their kid trained at 3, it might mean they started at 2.5. Which is why it's so common for kids to train right around their 3rd birthday, since most people start training right around 2.5. It is very unusual for a child to train in just a few days of bootcamp-style training, despite what random strangers on DCUM try to convince you.
Here is the Schum study: https://www.researchgate.net/publication/11487825_Sequential_Acquisition_of_Toilet-Training_Skills_A_Descriptive_Study_of_Gender_and_Age_Differences_in_Normal_Children
And the UC Davis resource: https://health.ucdavis.edu/children/patients_family_resources/potty-training-children.html
"Girls demonstrated toilet-training skills at earlier ages than boys. The median ages for "staying dry during the day" were 32.5 months (95% confidence interval: 30.9--33.7) and 35.0 months (95% confidence interval: 33.3--36.7) for girls and boys, respectively. The median ages for readiness skills for girls and boys, respectively, were as follows: "showing an interest in using the potty," 24 and 26 months; "staying dry for 2 hours," 26 and 29 months; "indicating a need to go to the bathroom," 26 and 29 months. There was a marked concordance in the sequences in which girls and boys achieve individual skills. In addition, the interquartile ranges of the toileting skills varied from 6.9 to 11.4 months in girls and from 7.5 to 14.6 months in boys. In this study population, girls achieve nearly all toilet-training skills earlier than boys, including successful completion. Most children do not master the readiness skills until after the second birthday. The range of normalcy for the attainment of individual skills may vary by as much as a year."
So AVERAGE age for girls is 32.5 months and for boys 35 months. And normal variation is as much as a year. Meaning that 2.5-3.5 is very much within the normal range. A child might potty train at 22 or 24 months, but they are an outlier, just as a child who trains at 4 is an outlier.
The study also looked at "readiness skills" including showing an interest in the potty and the ability to indicate that they needed to go to the bathroom, and most do not show these signs of readiness until after 2.
The study also doesn't get into this, but UC Davis Health reports that the average time it takes to potty train is 2-3 months for girls, and 6 months for boys (again, these are averages, meaning that for every child who potty trains in a week, expect to find a child who takes significantly longer than the average). So when people say their kid trained at 3, it might mean they started at 2.5. Which is why it's so common for kids to train right around their 3rd birthday, since most people start training right around 2.5. It is very unusual for a child to train in just a few days of bootcamp-style training, despite what random strangers on DCUM try to convince you.
Here is the Schum study: https://www.researchgate.net/publication/11487825_Sequential_Acquisition_of_Toilet-Training_Skills_A_Descriptive_Study_of_Gender_and_Age_Differences_in_Normal_Children
And the UC Davis resource: https://health.ucdavis.edu/children/patients_family_resources/potty-training-children.html
Anonymous
07/20/2022 14:55
Subject: Re:S/O. What’s the point of potty training so young?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:My training in pediatrics says averages are 50% of toddlers are trained by 36 months of age. Standard advice is not to start till after 28 months of age.
+1, fully half of all kids train after turning 3. And the percent of kids not trained by kindergarten is quite small. So those 3 year olds are successful.
It's parental preference and yes, you can absolutely do harm by training too early.
+2, 3 is average the average age in a developed society.
Now that’s a lie.
Pp not lying. I was recently told by my pediatrician that three is on point. And a little later for boys.
Lol what. That’s absurd. Any later than 2.5 is weird, but earlier than that is easier
Anonymous
07/20/2022 14:52
Subject: Re:S/O. What’s the point of potty training so young?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:My training in pediatrics says averages are 50% of toddlers are trained by 36 months of age. Standard advice is not to start till after 28 months of age.
+1, fully half of all kids train after turning 3. And the percent of kids not trained by kindergarten is quite small. So those 3 year olds are successful.
It's parental preference and yes, you can absolutely do harm by training too early.
20 months isn’t too early. It’s been done for centuries. You’re just silly.
For centuries people didn't have modern plumbing or underwear. Kids ran around naked and learned to go behind a tree. People had lower standards of cleanliness and hygiene. Learning to use a modern toilet is a totally different deal and it actually makes sense that most kids take a bit longer because going to the bathroom sitting down is a weird modern convenience that we force on them, which is why doing so very early is entirely about parental preference and can cause issues. Toilet put kids in an unnatural position to eliminate.
You really are twisting yourself into knots because you're ashamed you waited until 3.5 years old to potty train.
+1. The difference is disposable diapers and nothing else. The disposable diaper industry has paid a few doctors to write articles about keeping a child in diapers until they were three (which turns into four for some) and idiot parents fell for it.
Tiresome.