Anonymous
02/08/2022 17:33
Subject: Turns out the Falls Church school board guy from the Koch thinktank, Ilya Shapiro, really is toxic
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Bizarrely xenophobic vibe to many comments in this thread . . . .
Agree. Seriously.
Ilya was born in Russia as a Jew.
Do most of you have any clue what that was like back then?
Along with the rest of his family, they were required to carry their “internal passport” whenever they set foot outside their apartment. The police/military could, and often did, demand: “your papers please!” (yeah, Nazi-style).
Only Ilya’s internal passport didn’t list him as “Russian;” only as a “Jew.”
Here: I’m posting this link in light of the obvious ignorance of many of you when it comes to anti-Semitism:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antisemitism_in_the_Soviet_Union
This was a requirement for all in the Soviet Union, and a way for suppressing the rural areas. It was almost impossible for anyone from the rural areas to obtain internal passport or travel papers, and as a result they were effectively prevented from moving outside of the rural poverty. . .
Anti-Semitism in Russia was (and still is) atrocious and commonplace.
When I first met my old friend Vlad, he informed me he was half-Russian. The other half, he explained, was “Jew.” He was not kidding.
His family was banished from Moscow to Novosibirsk. His father was expelled from the university and assigned a mortuary job washing bodies. Vlad’s father was a refusnik and he made Aaliyah the moment he could in late 1989.
You people trying to minimize Russian antiSemitism are deplorable and awful!
You act like the nominees said something racist and he responded. That's not what happened. Why are you defending him? Is it because you agree?
Question is:
- do you agree someone ought to be cancelled, and his career ruined, over a tweet?
Enough is enough.
If I post offensive stuff on the Internet attributable to my name, I will be fired from my job.
How is this not common sense to you?
Our country is founded on freedom of expression.
Do you think it’s common sense to fire someone / destroy their career for exercising their freedom?
How is your view anything but authoritarian, and offensive to freedom of expression?
Anonymous
02/08/2022 17:22
Subject: Re:Turns out the Falls Church school board guy from the Koch thinktank, Ilya Shapiro, really is toxic
Our country is founded on freedom of expression.
Do you think it’s common sense to fire someone / destroy their career for exercising their freedom?
How is your view anything but authoritarian, and offensive to freedom of expression?
Not the PP, but if your "freedom expression" interferes with your ability to do your job, or tarnishes the reputation of your employer, then you can absolutely be fired.
Freedom of expression relates to the GOVERNMENT'S ability to restrict your expression, not your employer's.
In this case, Shapiro's public expression of racism hurt his employer by forcing GULC into a discussion on why they were hiring someone with his history of bigotry. It also suggested that he cannot do his job, insofar as his job includes teaching, mentoring, and supporting students of color.
Anonymous
02/08/2022 17:04
Subject: Turns out the Falls Church school board guy from the Koch thinktank, Ilya Shapiro, really is toxic
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Bizarrely xenophobic vibe to many comments in this thread . . . .
Agree. Seriously.
Ilya was born in Russia as a Jew.
Do most of you have any clue what that was like back then?
Along with the rest of his family, they were required to carry their “internal passport” whenever they set foot outside their apartment. The police/military could, and often did, demand: “your papers please!” (yeah, Nazi-style).
Only Ilya’s internal passport didn’t list him as “Russian;” only as a “Jew.”
Here: I’m posting this link in light of the obvious ignorance of many of you when it comes to anti-Semitism:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antisemitism_in_the_Soviet_Union
This was a requirement for all in the Soviet Union, and a way for suppressing the rural areas. It was almost impossible for anyone from the rural areas to obtain internal passport or travel papers, and as a result they were effectively prevented from moving outside of the rural poverty. . .
Anti-Semitism in Russia was (and still is) atrocious and commonplace.
When I first met my old friend Vlad, he informed me he was half-Russian. The other half, he explained, was “Jew.” He was not kidding.
His family was banished from Moscow to Novosibirsk. His father was expelled from the university and assigned a mortuary job washing bodies. Vlad’s father was a refusnik and he made Aaliyah the moment he could in late 1989.
You people trying to minimize Russian antiSemitism are deplorable and awful!
You act like the nominees said something racist and he responded. That's not what happened. Why are you defending him? Is it because you agree?
Question is:
- do you agree someone ought to be cancelled, and his career ruined, over a tweet?
Enough is enough.
If I post offensive stuff on the Internet attributable to my name, I will be fired from my job.
How is this not common sense to you?
Our country is founded on freedom of expression.
Do you think it’s common sense to fire someone / destroy their career for exercising their freedom?
How is your view anything but authoritarian, and offensive to freedom of expression?
Anonymous
02/08/2022 16:45
Subject: Turns out the Falls Church school board guy from the Koch thinktank, Ilya Shapiro, really is toxic
^^^ The other thing I'd note is that growing up in an authoritarian regime with bad nationality policy should have made Shapiro LESS likely to support authoritarians and bad nationality policy.
Unfortunately, it did not.
Unfortunately, it did not.
Anonymous
02/08/2022 16:44
Subject: Turns out the Falls Church school board guy from the Koch thinktank, Ilya Shapiro, really is toxic
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Bizarrely xenophobic vibe to many comments in this thread . . . .
Agree. Seriously.
Ilya was born in Russia as a Jew.
Do most of you have any clue what that was like back then?
Along with the rest of his family, they were required to carry their “internal passport” whenever they set foot outside their apartment. The police/military could, and often did, demand: “your papers please!” (yeah, Nazi-style).
Only Ilya’s internal passport didn’t list him as “Russian;” only as a “Jew.”
Here: I’m posting this link in light of the obvious ignorance of many of you when it comes to anti-Semitism:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antisemitism_in_the_Soviet_Union
I think you are blurring the line between authoritarianism in general and antisemitism. You are also blurring the line between Soviet antisemitism and Soviet nationality policy.
Everyone had to carry an internal passport, and anyone could be asked to provide it at any time. That's the authoritarianism talking, not the antisemitism. Now, Jews may have been asked to produce their papers more often, but the presence of an internal passport policy is not inherently antisemitic. It's bad and repressive policy, but not antisemitic.
Similarly, everyone had their nationality (ethnicity) listed in their passport. So, I would have a passport that said USSR on the front but was written in both Russian and in the national language of my country. Then, my nationality, address. marital status, military history, etc. are also referenced. So, they could look at my passport and know that I was a married ethnic Kazakh living in Ukraine who served in Afghanistan. That is again not great but it's not on its face evidence of antisemitism.
There were antisemitic policies like quotas on Jews at the best universities and in the Party. There was (and is) overall just generalized cultural antisemitism with a long history of violence. But citing the internal passports and nationality policy as evidence of antisemitism is muddying the issue and not convincing to anyone who grew up in that region or just knows about it.
Anonymous
02/08/2022 16:30
Subject: Turns out the Falls Church school board guy from the Koch thinktank, Ilya Shapiro, really is toxic
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Bizarrely xenophobic vibe to many comments in this thread . . . .
Agree. Seriously.
Ilya was born in Russia as a Jew.
Do most of you have any clue what that was like back then?
Along with the rest of his family, they were required to carry their “internal passport” whenever they set foot outside their apartment. The police/military could, and often did, demand: “your papers please!” (yeah, Nazi-style).
Only Ilya’s internal passport didn’t list him as “Russian;” only as a “Jew.”
Here: I’m posting this link in light of the obvious ignorance of many of you when it comes to anti-Semitism:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antisemitism_in_the_Soviet_Union
This was a requirement for all in the Soviet Union, and a way for suppressing the rural areas. It was almost impossible for anyone from the rural areas to obtain internal passport or travel papers, and as a result they were effectively prevented from moving outside of the rural poverty. . .
Anti-Semitism in Russia was (and still is) atrocious and commonplace.
When I first met my old friend Vlad, he informed me he was half-Russian. The other half, he explained, was “Jew.” He was not kidding.
His family was banished from Moscow to Novosibirsk. His father was expelled from the university and assigned a mortuary job washing bodies. Vlad’s father was a refusnik and he made Aaliyah the moment he could in late 1989.
You people trying to minimize Russian antiSemitism are deplorable and awful!
You act like the nominees said something racist and he responded. That's not what happened. Why are you defending him? Is it because you agree?
Question is:
- do you agree someone ought to be cancelled, and his career ruined, over a tweet?
Enough is enough.
Got it. You don't think people should face any consequences for their bad actions.
Anonymous
02/08/2022 16:14
Subject: Turns out the Falls Church school board guy from the Koch thinktank, Ilya Shapiro, really is toxic
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Bizarrely xenophobic vibe to many comments in this thread . . . .
Agree. Seriously.
Ilya was born in Russia as a Jew.
Do most of you have any clue what that was like back then?
Along with the rest of his family, they were required to carry their “internal passport” whenever they set foot outside their apartment. The police/military could, and often did, demand: “your papers please!” (yeah, Nazi-style).
Only Ilya’s internal passport didn’t list him as “Russian;” only as a “Jew.”
Here: I’m posting this link in light of the obvious ignorance of many of you when it comes to anti-Semitism:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antisemitism_in_the_Soviet_Union
This was a requirement for all in the Soviet Union, and a way for suppressing the rural areas. It was almost impossible for anyone from the rural areas to obtain internal passport or travel papers, and as a result they were effectively prevented from moving outside of the rural poverty. . .
Anti-Semitism in Russia was (and still is) atrocious and commonplace.
When I first met my old friend Vlad, he informed me he was half-Russian. The other half, he explained, was “Jew.” He was not kidding.
His family was banished from Moscow to Novosibirsk. His father was expelled from the university and assigned a mortuary job washing bodies. Vlad’s father was a refusnik and he made Aaliyah the moment he could in late 1989.
You people trying to minimize Russian antiSemitism are deplorable and awful!
You act like the nominees said something racist and he responded. That's not what happened. Why are you defending him? Is it because you agree?
Question is:
- do you agree someone ought to be cancelled, and his career ruined, over a tweet?
Enough is enough.
If I post offensive stuff on the Internet attributable to my name, I will be fired from my job.
How is this not common sense to you?
Anonymous
02/08/2022 15:53
Subject: Turns out the Falls Church school board guy from the Koch thinktank, Ilya Shapiro, really is toxic
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Bizarrely xenophobic vibe to many comments in this thread . . . .
Agree. Seriously.
Ilya was born in Russia as a Jew.
Do most of you have any clue what that was like back then?
Along with the rest of his family, they were required to carry their “internal passport” whenever they set foot outside their apartment. The police/military could, and often did, demand: “your papers please!” (yeah, Nazi-style).
Only Ilya’s internal passport didn’t list him as “Russian;” only as a “Jew.”
Here: I’m posting this link in light of the obvious ignorance of many of you when it comes to anti-Semitism:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antisemitism_in_the_Soviet_Union
This was a requirement for all in the Soviet Union, and a way for suppressing the rural areas. It was almost impossible for anyone from the rural areas to obtain internal passport or travel papers, and as a result they were effectively prevented from moving outside of the rural poverty. . .
Anti-Semitism in Russia was (and still is) atrocious and commonplace.
When I first met my old friend Vlad, he informed me he was half-Russian. The other half, he explained, was “Jew.” He was not kidding.
His family was banished from Moscow to Novosibirsk. His father was expelled from the university and assigned a mortuary job washing bodies. Vlad’s father was a refusnik and he made Aaliyah the moment he could in late 1989.
You people trying to minimize Russian antiSemitism are deplorable and awful!
You act like the nominees said something racist and he responded. That's not what happened. Why are you defending him? Is it because you agree?
Question is:
- do you agree someone ought to be cancelled, and his career ruined, over a tweet?
Enough is enough.
Anonymous
02/08/2022 14:09
Subject: Re:Turns out the Falls Church school board guy from the Koch thinktank, Ilya Shapiro, really is toxic
Anonymous wrote:Has Ilya explained why ACB wasn't a 'lesser woman' nominee (as there were clearly more "qualified" candidates available). I keep waiting for him to do that.
As noted above, Shapiro himself suggested that ACB be added to Trump's short list even before the Ginsburg vacancy, so it's not surprising that he didn't take issue with her nomination.
Anonymous
02/08/2022 14:08
Subject: Turns out the Falls Church school board guy from the Koch thinktank, Ilya Shapiro, really is toxic
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Bizarrely xenophobic vibe to many comments in this thread . . . .
Agree. Seriously.
Ilya was born in Russia as a Jew.
Do most of you have any clue what that was like back then?
Along with the rest of his family, they were required to carry their “internal passport” whenever they set foot outside their apartment. The police/military could, and often did, demand: “your papers please!” (yeah, Nazi-style).
Only Ilya’s internal passport didn’t list him as “Russian;” only as a “Jew.”
Here: I’m posting this link in light of the obvious ignorance of many of you when it comes to anti-Semitism:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antisemitism_in_the_Soviet_Union
This was a requirement for all in the Soviet Union, and a way for suppressing the rural areas. It was almost impossible for anyone from the rural areas to obtain internal passport or travel papers, and as a result they were effectively prevented from moving outside of the rural poverty. . .
Anti-Semitism in Russia was (and still is) atrocious and commonplace.
When I first met my old friend Vlad, he informed me he was half-Russian. The other half, he explained, was “Jew.” He was not kidding.
His family was banished from Moscow to Novosibirsk. His father was expelled from the university and assigned a mortuary job washing bodies. Vlad’s father was a refusnik and he made Aaliyah the moment he could in late 1989.
You people trying to minimize Russian antiSemitism are deplorable and awful!
You act like the nominees said something racist and he responded. That's not what happened. Why are you defending him? Is it because you agree?
Anonymous
02/08/2022 14:08
Subject: Turns out the Falls Church school board guy from the Koch thinktank, Ilya Shapiro, really is toxic
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Bizarrely xenophobic vibe to many comments in this thread . . . .
Agree. Seriously.
Ilya was born in Russia as a Jew.
Do most of you have any clue what that was like back then?
Along with the rest of his family, they were required to carry their “internal passport” whenever they set foot outside their apartment. The police/military could, and often did, demand: “your papers please!” (yeah, Nazi-style).
Only Ilya’s internal passport didn’t list him as “Russian;” only as a “Jew.”
Here: I’m posting this link in light of the obvious ignorance of many of you when it comes to anti-Semitism:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antisemitism_in_the_Soviet_Union
This was a requirement for all in the Soviet Union, and a way for suppressing the rural areas. It was almost impossible for anyone from the rural areas to obtain internal passport or travel papers, and as a result they were effectively prevented from moving outside of the rural poverty. . .
Anti-Semitism in Russia was (and still is) atrocious and commonplace.
When I first met my old friend Vlad, he informed me he was half-Russian. The other half, he explained, was “Jew.” He was not kidding.
His family was banished from Moscow to Novosibirsk. His father was expelled from the university and assigned a mortuary job washing bodies. Vlad’s father was a refusnik and he made Aaliyah the moment he could in late 1989.
You people trying to minimize Russian antiSemitism are deplorable and awful!
We just don’t see how it’s relevant to the discussion. A Russian Jewish male can be a racist against someone he perceived as inferior, like a black woman. Oppression in one context does not make you an ally for the oppressed in another. As PPs have stated, it may even make you more likely to be an oppressor and to revel in the power it gives you.
Not every comment raised this, but there were several comments stating something to the effect of "immigrants from former communist countries are the worst" or insulting Shapiro because, heaven forbid, he really wanted to immigrate to America. This sort of xenophobia is just really bizarre given the supposedly pro-inclusive viewpoint of those attacking Shapiro.
Anonymous
02/08/2022 14:06
Subject: Turns out the Falls Church school board guy from the Koch thinktank, Ilya Shapiro, really is toxic
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Bizarrely xenophobic vibe to many comments in this thread . . . .
Agree. Seriously.
Ilya was born in Russia as a Jew.
Do most of you have any clue what that was like back then?
Along with the rest of his family, they were required to carry their “internal passport” whenever they set foot outside their apartment. The police/military could, and often did, demand: “your papers please!” (yeah, Nazi-style).
Only Ilya’s internal passport didn’t list him as “Russian;” only as a “Jew.”
Here: I’m posting this link in light of the obvious ignorance of many of you when it comes to anti-Semitism:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antisemitism_in_the_Soviet_Union
I don't care anything about him being a Russian Jew. What he said was racist. Full stop.
Anonymous
02/08/2022 12:15
Subject: Turns out the Falls Church school board guy from the Koch thinktank, Ilya Shapiro, really is toxic
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Bizarrely xenophobic vibe to many comments in this thread . . . .
Agree. Seriously.
Ilya was born in Russia as a Jew.
Do most of you have any clue what that was like back then?
Along with the rest of his family, they were required to carry their “internal passport” whenever they set foot outside their apartment. The police/military could, and often did, demand: “your papers please!” (yeah, Nazi-style).
Only Ilya’s internal passport didn’t list him as “Russian;” only as a “Jew.”
Here: I’m posting this link in light of the obvious ignorance of many of you when it comes to anti-Semitism:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antisemitism_in_the_Soviet_Union
This was a requirement for all in the Soviet Union, and a way for suppressing the rural areas. It was almost impossible for anyone from the rural areas to obtain internal passport or travel papers, and as a result they were effectively prevented from moving outside of the rural poverty. . .
Anti-Semitism in Russia was (and still is) atrocious and commonplace.
When I first met my old friend Vlad, he informed me he was half-Russian. The other half, he explained, was “Jew.” He was not kidding.
His family was banished from Moscow to Novosibirsk. His father was expelled from the university and assigned a mortuary job washing bodies. Vlad’s father was a refusnik and he made Aaliyah the moment he could in late 1989.
You people trying to minimize Russian antiSemitism are deplorable and awful!
We just don’t see how it’s relevant to the discussion. A Russian Jewish male can be a racist against someone he perceived as inferior, like a black woman. Oppression in one context does not make you an ally for the oppressed in another. As PPs have stated, it may even make you more likely to be an oppressor and to revel in the power it gives you.
Anonymous
02/08/2022 10:54
Subject: Turns out the Falls Church school board guy from the Koch thinktank, Ilya Shapiro, really is toxic
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Bizarrely xenophobic vibe to many comments in this thread . . . .
Agree. Seriously.
Ilya was born in Russia as a Jew.
Do most of you have any clue what that was like back then?
Along with the rest of his family, they were required to carry their “internal passport” whenever they set foot outside their apartment. The police/military could, and often did, demand: “your papers please!” (yeah, Nazi-style).
Only Ilya’s internal passport didn’t list him as “Russian;” only as a “Jew.”
Here: I’m posting this link in light of the obvious ignorance of many of you when it comes to anti-Semitism:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antisemitism_in_the_Soviet_Union
This was a requirement for all in the Soviet Union, and a way for suppressing the rural areas. It was almost impossible for anyone from the rural areas to obtain internal passport or travel papers, and as a result they were effectively prevented from moving outside of the rural poverty. . .
Anti-Semitism in Russia was (and still is) atrocious and commonplace.
When I first met my old friend Vlad, he informed me he was half-Russian. The other half, he explained, was “Jew.” He was not kidding.
His family was banished from Moscow to Novosibirsk. His father was expelled from the university and assigned a mortuary job washing bodies. Vlad’s father was a refusnik and he made Aaliyah the moment he could in late 1989.
You people trying to minimize Russian antiSemitism are deplorable and awful!
Anonymous
02/08/2022 10:22
Subject: Turns out the Falls Church school board guy from the Koch thinktank, Ilya Shapiro, really is toxic
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Bizarrely xenophobic vibe to many comments in this thread . . . .
Agree. Seriously.
Ilya was born in Russia as a Jew.
Do most of you have any clue what that was like back then?
Along with the rest of his family, they were required to carry their “internal passport” whenever they set foot outside their apartment. The police/military could, and often did, demand: “your papers please!” (yeah, Nazi-style).
Only Ilya’s internal passport didn’t list him as “Russian;” only as a “Jew.”
Here: I’m posting this link in light of the obvious ignorance of many of you when it comes to anti-Semitism:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antisemitism_in_the_Soviet_Union
This was a requirement for all in the Soviet Union, and a way for suppressing the rural areas. It was almost impossible for anyone from the rural areas to obtain internal passport or travel papers, and as a result they were effectively prevented from moving outside of the rural poverty. I really doubt that Ilya given his age ever experienced this.
He was already in Canada by middle school.