Anonymous
05/03/2021 22:01
Subject: Re:Which league is more competitive CCL or EDP ?
The fact that 2 pages are in effect tells you how much ignorance runs rampant here. CCL is a scam. A total joke and an insult to paying clients aka parents.
EDP is the standard - with the exclusion of GA and ECNL for obvious reasons.
EDP is the standard - with the exclusion of GA and ECNL for obvious reasons.
Anonymous
05/03/2021 18:05
Subject: Re:Which league is more competitive CCL or EDP ?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:NCSL has more than a few D1 teams that are far better than the top CCL teams
There is an element of truth in some of what you say. But this statement is absolute nonsense. The top CCL teams (Skyline/Legacy/Herndon/Alexandria) are very good - massively better than ALL the NCSL D1 teams.
Take the boys U16 group as an example, which I picked at random.
NCSL Division 1 contains
Loudoun Black which is Loudoun's 3rd team and currently leads NCSL Division 1. The first team plays ECNL, the second team plays CCL1.
SYC White which is SYC's 3rd team. The first team plays CCL1, the second team plays CCL2.
Alexandria White which is Alexandria's 2nd team. The first team plays CCL1 and MLSNext.
Loudoun Black, the division leader, has a YSR rating of 35.32.
CCL1 is currently topped by Legacy with a YSR rating of 39.88, nearly 5 goals better! The worst clubs in CCL1 at this age are NVSC, SYA and LMVSC with YSR ratings of 36.36, 35.25 and 34.99 respectively. These three teams have managed to amass 4 wins between them out of a combined 44 games in CCL1.
So it is true to say that the top teams in NCSL Div 1 are as good as the cellar dwellers in CCL1. But the best teams in CCL are massively better than the top teams in NCSL division 1.
Please dont fool yourself with bias rankings and stats. Rankings are bias based on selected events. Stats can be interpreted anyway the presenter wants. until you play the game its all BS.
1. Much of my analysis was based on the fact that teams from the same club play in different leagues. When a club's third or fourth team sits at the top of NCSL D1 and the same club's second team sits at the bottom of CCL1 - that tells you something.
2. Unlike gotsoccer, YSR rankings are not based on selected events - they are based on every game played whether league or tournament, and take into account both the strength of the opponent and the score. They are actually reasonably accurate although not perfect. and a rating difference of 3 or more goals pretty much always correlates to a very noticeable difference between two teams.
Anonymous
05/03/2021 14:25
Subject: Re:Which league is more competitive CCL or EDP ?
I have a U13 son that plays in EDP and we have been very happy with the level of competition they have faced the past 2 years. They have continually moved up divisions and the games are very competitive. I find the games are much more physical too. There is a lot more aggression which is something my kids did not get in CCL and soccer is a physical game so it should be expected.
I have really seen my kids' team blossom in the 3 years they have been in the league. They do play a lot of Maryland and Prince William teams.
I have really seen my kids' team blossom in the 3 years they have been in the league. They do play a lot of Maryland and Prince William teams.
Anonymous
05/03/2021 14:23
Subject: Which league is more competitive CCL or EDP ?
YSR aside, if you want a girls example look at the 07 girls standings. There are two fill in teams -SCAA and PAC - that have been in division 1 NCSL teams for 3 or 4 years and are playing in CCL for the first time.
With the CCL season almost wrapped up, SCAA has a 2-8-1 which puts them in 14th out of 18 teams. PAC has a 1-6-6 record which has them in 13th place
With the CCL season almost wrapped up, SCAA has a 2-8-1 which puts them in 14th out of 18 teams. PAC has a 1-6-6 record which has them in 13th place
Anonymous
05/03/2021 13:54
Subject: Re:Which league is more competitive CCL or EDP ?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:NCSL has more than a few D1 teams that are far better than the top CCL teams
There is an element of truth in some of what you say. But this statement is absolute nonsense. The top CCL teams (Skyline/Legacy/Herndon/Alexandria) are very good - massively better than ALL the NCSL D1 teams.
Take the boys U16 group as an example, which I picked at random.
NCSL Division 1 contains
Loudoun Black which is Loudoun's 3rd team and currently leads NCSL Division 1. The first team plays ECNL, the second team plays CCL1.
SYC White which is SYC's 3rd team. The first team plays CCL1, the second team plays CCL2.
Alexandria White which is Alexandria's 2nd team. The first team plays CCL1 and MLSNext.
Loudoun Black, the division leader, has a YSR rating of 35.32.
CCL1 is currently topped by Legacy with a YSR rating of 39.88, nearly 5 goals better! The worst clubs in CCL1 at this age are NVSC, SYA and LMVSC with YSR ratings of 36.36, 35.25 and 34.99 respectively. These three teams have managed to amass 4 wins between them out of a combined 44 games in CCL1.
So it is true to say that the top teams in NCSL Div 1 are as good as the cellar dwellers in CCL1. But the best teams in CCL are massively better than the top teams in NCSL division 1.
You can’t reliably use NCSL spring Standings for HS age groups to draw meaningful conclusions. That division includes NPL teams, including an NPL team (Vienna) that was in the same bracket at Jeff Cup as Loudoun’s ECNL team. Those 2 were a bracket below another team in the NCSL Div 1 (SDor Elite 05), which has beaten Loudoun’s ECNL team, as well as a number of other teams in elite leagues. NPL has ‘NPL State Cup’ on-going, SDor also plays EDP. The reality is that the rosters for these teams can vary drastically from their ‘normal rosters’ since they are in multiple leagues (plus HS) so the results should be taken with a grain of salt. Whether teams that play in NPL, CCL and EDP - in addition to NCSL - should be considered ‘NCSL’ teams is debatable but, either way, I think it is a good thing that clubs are doing multiple leagues since it increases the amount of game play and, in the case of NCSL, it’s typically fairly local travel.
Anonymous
05/03/2021 13:33
Subject: Re:Which league is more competitive CCL or EDP ?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:NCSL has more than a few D1 teams that are far better than the top CCL teams
There is an element of truth in some of what you say. But this statement is absolute nonsense. The top CCL teams (Skyline/Legacy/Herndon/Alexandria) are very good - massively better than ALL the NCSL D1 teams.
Take the boys U16 group as an example, which I picked at random.
NCSL Division 1 contains
Loudoun Black which is Loudoun's 3rd team and currently leads NCSL Division 1. The first team plays ECNL, the second team plays CCL1.
SYC White which is SYC's 3rd team. The first team plays CCL1, the second team plays CCL2.
Alexandria White which is Alexandria's 2nd team. The first team plays CCL1 and MLSNext.
Loudoun Black, the division leader, has a YSR rating of 35.32.
CCL1 is currently topped by Legacy with a YSR rating of 39.88, nearly 5 goals better! The worst clubs in CCL1 at this age are NVSC, SYA and LMVSC with YSR ratings of 36.36, 35.25 and 34.99 respectively. These three teams have managed to amass 4 wins between them out of a combined 44 games in CCL1.
So it is true to say that the top teams in NCSL Div 1 are as good as the cellar dwellers in CCL1. But the best teams in CCL are massively better than the top teams in NCSL division 1.
Please dont fool yourself with bias rankings and stats. Rankings are bias based on selected events. Stats can be interpreted anyway the presenter wants. until you play the game its all BS.
Anonymous
05/03/2021 13:18
Subject: Re:Which league is more competitive CCL or EDP ?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:NCSL has more than a few D1 teams that are far better than the top CCL teams
There is an element of truth in some of what you say. But this statement is absolute nonsense. The top CCL teams (Skyline/Legacy/Herndon/Alexandria) are very good - massively better than ALL the NCSL D1 teams.
Take the boys U16 group as an example, which I picked at random.
NCSL Division 1 contains
Loudoun Black which is Loudoun's 3rd team and currently leads NCSL Division 1. The first team plays ECNL, the second team plays CCL1.
SYC White which is SYC's 3rd team. The first team plays CCL1, the second team plays CCL2.
Alexandria White which is Alexandria's 2nd team. The first team plays CCL1 and MLSNext.
Loudoun Black, the division leader, has a YSR rating of 35.32.
CCL1 is currently topped by Legacy with a YSR rating of 39.88, nearly 5 goals better! The worst clubs in CCL1 at this age are NVSC, SYA and LMVSC with YSR ratings of 36.36, 35.25 and 34.99 respectively. These three teams have managed to amass 4 wins between them out of a combined 44 games in CCL1.
So it is true to say that the top teams in NCSL Div 1 are as good as the cellar dwellers in CCL1. But the best teams in CCL are massively better than the top teams in NCSL division 1.
cool, now do that with the girls side (or will that not fit the narrative?)
No idea if it will fit the narrative. I will type this post as I investigate.
Quick glance at girls U16 group shows NCSL with
Arlington Red (Arlington's second team second team who appear to ALSO play in CCL1) atop NCSL division 1. This same team appears to be 17th/18 in CCL1 and has a rating of 30.33
Loudoun Black (Loudoun's third team) mid table in NCSL division 1 with Loudoun's second team 15th/18 in CCL1
The first place team in CCL1 is VA Legacy with a rating of 33.24 which is about 3 goals better than the first place team in NCSL division 1.
So I think the answer appears to be yes. Obviously I haven't checked every age group - and it may be that things are closer at younger ages - but this seems pretty clear at older ages.
Anonymous
05/03/2021 12:35
Subject: Re:Which league is more competitive CCL or EDP ?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:NCSL has more than a few D1 teams that are far better than the top CCL teams
There is an element of truth in some of what you say. But this statement is absolute nonsense. The top CCL teams (Skyline/Legacy/Herndon/Alexandria) are very good - massively better than ALL the NCSL D1 teams.
Take the boys U16 group as an example, which I picked at random.
NCSL Division 1 contains
Loudoun Black which is Loudoun's 3rd team and currently leads NCSL Division 1. The first team plays ECNL, the second team plays CCL1.
SYC White which is SYC's 3rd team. The first team plays CCL1, the second team plays CCL2.
Alexandria White which is Alexandria's 2nd team. The first team plays CCL1 and MLSNext.
Loudoun Black, the division leader, has a YSR rating of 35.32.
CCL1 is currently topped by Legacy with a YSR rating of 39.88, nearly 5 goals better! The worst clubs in CCL1 at this age are NVSC, SYA and LMVSC with YSR ratings of 36.36, 35.25 and 34.99 respectively. These three teams have managed to amass 4 wins between them out of a combined 44 games in CCL1.
So it is true to say that the top teams in NCSL Div 1 are as good as the cellar dwellers in CCL1. But the best teams in CCL are massively better than the top teams in NCSL division 1.
cool, now do that with the girls side (or will that not fit the narrative?)
Anonymous
05/03/2021 12:32
Subject: Re:Which league is more competitive CCL or EDP ?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:CCL is a poor way to measure strength or quality. No clubs are not strong teams A thru D. They're are more small clubs with much better A teams not in CCL because of pure numbers in the club. NCSL has more than a few D1 teams that are far better than the top CCL teams. They dont have a big enough club to fill out a CCL schedule. I think club size is wrongfully used to measure talent and success way to much. You have too look at it like this. There are many big chain pizza places that get all of the sales, publicity, locations etc. They have a bigger customer pool. However you have many local pizza shops with one single location thats is much better. Many times this is the same with all travel/club sports.
Great point. CCL wholistic club approach was a nice idea but in reality only catered to the super clubs with thousands of players. On the boys side we've played in the old Midwest Regional League, a couple different midwest state leagues, CCL1, EDP 3 and now EDP Premier "national league"... lower level EDP is akin to those state leagues in quality. CCL1 (a few years ago) was decent at the time. Now in EDP1 there's a few one-off teams that don't seem to belong...
likely those teams have had to fight for promotions and are probably pretty good
Anonymous
05/03/2021 12:26
Subject: Re:Which league is more competitive CCL or EDP ?
Anonymous wrote:NCSL has more than a few D1 teams that are far better than the top CCL teams
There is an element of truth in some of what you say. But this statement is absolute nonsense. The top CCL teams (Skyline/Legacy/Herndon/Alexandria) are very good - massively better than ALL the NCSL D1 teams.
Take the boys U16 group as an example, which I picked at random.
NCSL Division 1 contains
Loudoun Black which is Loudoun's 3rd team and currently leads NCSL Division 1. The first team plays ECNL, the second team plays CCL1.
SYC White which is SYC's 3rd team. The first team plays CCL1, the second team plays CCL2.
Alexandria White which is Alexandria's 2nd team. The first team plays CCL1 and MLSNext.
Loudoun Black, the division leader, has a YSR rating of 35.32.
CCL1 is currently topped by Legacy with a YSR rating of 39.88, nearly 5 goals better! The worst clubs in CCL1 at this age are NVSC, SYA and LMVSC with YSR ratings of 36.36, 35.25 and 34.99 respectively. These three teams have managed to amass 4 wins between them out of a combined 44 games in CCL1.
So it is true to say that the top teams in NCSL Div 1 are as good as the cellar dwellers in CCL1. But the best teams in CCL are massively better than the top teams in NCSL division 1.
Anonymous
05/03/2021 11:37
Subject: Re:Which league is more competitive CCL or EDP ?
Anonymous wrote:CCL is a poor way to measure strength or quality. No clubs are not strong teams A thru D. They're are more small clubs with much better A teams not in CCL because of pure numbers in the club. NCSL has more than a few D1 teams that are far better than the top CCL teams. They dont have a big enough club to fill out a CCL schedule. I think club size is wrongfully used to measure talent and success way to much. You have too look at it like this. There are many big chain pizza places that get all of the sales, publicity, locations etc. They have a bigger customer pool. However you have many local pizza shops with one single location thats is much better. Many times this is the same with all travel/club sports.
Great point. CCL wholistic club approach was a nice idea but in reality only catered to the super clubs with thousands of players. On the boys side we've played in the old Midwest Regional League, a couple different midwest state leagues, CCL1, EDP 3 and now EDP Premier "national league"... lower level EDP is akin to those state leagues in quality. CCL1 (a few years ago) was decent at the time. Now in EDP1 there's a few one-off teams that don't seem to belong...
Anonymous
05/03/2021 09:40
Subject: Which league is more competitive CCL or EDP ?
CCL2 is just not strong, especially as you get older and top teams leave for ECNL
Anonymous
05/03/2021 09:29
Subject: Which league is more competitive CCL or EDP ?
What about CCL2 v. NCSL Div 1 at U12 boys? Considering a move to another club, but wouldn't make that club's top team. Would be on the second team at best. Just not sure it is worth moving if they don't play in the top grouping of CCL.