In general we found that design build firms estimate 40-60% more than GCs for the same job. Plus given the shortages of material, throw in another 10-20%, so you're looking at a 50-80% difference over what you'd likely pay in normal times.

They are throwing S at the wall and hoping it sticks. The SOW without any detailed scope/itemization is meaningless.

OP, I’m curious about why you were shocked? Did you have a $/sq ft figure in mind? Or some other experience?

Anonymous wrote:You should knock down and rebuild. I’m serious. I mean is your basement tall enough? So many things you can change with a rebuild.

This. You will have a lot more equity and it will be faster.

You paid for a design and a general estimate. It's high but probably not wildly off, especially if it includes all fittings and fixtures (tile, lighting, cabinets, counters, plumbing and glass for bathrooms.) If you own the design, you can try to get other contractors to give you a ballpark cost estimate. If you're doing structural work, you will probably need detailed construction drawings to get accurate bids from contractors - so an architect and/or structural engineer. You'll definitely need those plans to get permits.

I sympathize OP - it's so hard to understand how to proceed without having a good sense of what this kind of work costs (and what it *should* cost.) We talked to a bunch of design-build firms and then eventually went with an architect and a contractor for a big project. I think that's generally the less expensive approach. Still found the costs surreal.

Anonymous wrote:OP- have you signed a contract with this firm or they are just giving you an estimate of costs? The challenge with deign build (at least when we spoke with them) is they won’t give you any detailed estimate until they do the design, which you have to pay for. I am guessing they are just estimating the cost. If your house is 2100 sq ft and they assume $200/sq for Reno cost, that puts you at $420k and possibly they added in fees for permitting and structural engineers, etc. In reality, the actual estimate could be lower, depending on how much of the work is floor space v walls or bedrooms v bathroom/kitchen. But if you haven’t signed a contract, I would assume they are making assumptions about high end finishes and worst case scenario discoveries.

We haven’t signed a contract but we did pay $3k for design fees. The estimate included our design.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Hi- we just got a bid from a design build firm for a renovation of our home and are in absolute shock. Here’s what we are doing:
-gutting the house down to the studs on the first and second floor
-replumbing, upgrading electrical, installing hvac,
- adding a powder room on the first floor, a second bath on the second floor
-gutting kitchen
-adding laundry room to the first floor
- replacing floors that cannot be salvaged refinishing the wooden floors so they match
We are not: finishing our basement or changing the existing footprint of the house, or touching the exterior.

We were not prepared for the number they suggested-$599k. The structural elements before any fixtures or cabinets alone was $475k. The SOW did not include a price breakdown of any of these items, just a grand total at the end. Is that normal?

Why did you buy a house that was in such bad shape? Did you get a major discount for the poor condition? Unless you bought it for way under market due to conditions, it’s hard to see how that reno makes financial sense.

Just want to say that this is a very irritating, presumptuous, unhelpful, and rude post.

Truth hurts?

OP here- the house is structurally in very good condition and is historic. We bought in a highly desirable neighborhood. Also, if you buy DC itself and don’t want to live in SE, you don’t get a “deal.” Maybe that flies in the far out burbs but not close in.

OP- have you signed a contract with this firm or they are just giving you an estimate of costs? The challenge with deign build (at least when we spoke with them) is they won’t give you any detailed estimate until they do the design, which you have to pay for. I am guessing they are just estimating the cost. If your house is 2100 sq ft and they assume $200/sq for Reno cost, that puts you at $420k and possibly they added in fees for permitting and structural engineers, etc. In reality, the actual estimate could be lower, depending on how much of the work is floor space v walls or bedrooms v bathroom/kitchen. But if you haven’t signed a contract, I would assume they are making assumptions about high end finishes and worst case scenario discoveries.

Anonymous wrote:You should knock down and rebuild. I’m serious. I mean is your basement tall enough? So many things you can change with a rebuild.

it is not easy to rebuild nowadays, most builders are tied up till winter ...the ones who are remodeling now are in such rush to move to the next project -super sloppy and eager to cut corners at every opportunity

You should knock down and rebuild. I’m serious. I mean is your basement tall enough? So many things you can change with a rebuild.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We are in a similar situation. Got the estimate in a range though 380-480K , for the detailed split with the plans, the contractor asked 2.5K.

$2500 to justify the estimate??? Or would that include drawings?

itemized detailed plan with measurements and drawings, otherwise we get a free guessetimate - a ballpark range, what about you?

Anonymous wrote:We are in a similar situation. Got the estimate in a range though 380-480K , for the detailed split with the plans, the contractor asked 2.5K.

$2500 to justify the estimate??? Or would that include drawings?

We are in a similar situation. Got the estimate in a range though 380-480K , for the detailed split with the plans, the contractor asked 2.5K.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Hi- we just got a bid from a design build firm for a renovation of our home and are in absolute shock. Here’s what we are doing:
-gutting the house down to the studs on the first and second floor
-replumbing, upgrading electrical, installing hvac,
- adding a powder room on the first floor, a second bath on the second floor
-gutting kitchen
-adding laundry room to the first floor
- replacing floors that cannot be salvaged refinishing the wooden floors so they match
We are not: finishing our basement or changing the existing footprint of the house, or touching the exterior.

We were not prepared for the number they suggested-$599k. The structural elements before any fixtures or cabinets alone was $475k. The SOW did not include a price breakdown of any of these items, just a grand total at the end. Is that normal?

Why did you buy a house that was in such bad shape? Did you get a major discount for the poor condition? Unless you bought it for way under market due to conditions, it’s hard to see how that reno makes financial sense.

Just want to say that this is a very irritating, presumptuous, unhelpful, and rude post.

Truth hurts?

That seems high to me. I would think more around 400k. Prices are extremely high right now, though. Material prices have doubled because of COVID.