Anonymous
Post 11/25/2020 03:17     Subject: Curricular issues in HS
Grammar stage, logic stage, rhetoric stage is called the Trivium. This is the basis of the Classical Curriculum. The U.S. abandoned it just before WWI because they didn’t think immigrants could handle it! Lol. Interestingly enough the latest cognitive science backs this up. Susan Wise Bauer from a Well Trained Mind gives a cogent argument for its rebirth.

What’s good enough for the Romans, and every American leader prior to 1950s is not good enough for MCPS I guess...yikes.
Anonymous
Post 11/24/2020 23:43     Subject: Curricular issues in HS
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Another vote for a dire lack of teaching critical thinking skills, brought to the general public by the quest for 100% rote memorization of facts as assessed by standardized tests (NCLB).

This gaping hole in 21st century education is how we got into this mess of mis- and disinformation. Well, that and social media.


Rote memorization in a ES (which they no longer do) would free up kids to think critically and learn to argue persuasively in HS.


+1. As an anecdote, my kids attended several elementary schools overseas. In the school that used an American curriculum, "rote learning" was discouraged and it severely delayed my kids' ability to read and do basic math. When we moved to a school with a British curriculum, math facts and phonetic spelling were emphasized, after which my kids zoomed to the top in all subjects because they finally had the basics.


How would a lack of rote learning delay your kids ability to read? Are you confusing it with phonics? And how would it also delay their ability to do basic math? Again, are you confusing rote learning with something else? Are you saying that kids need to learn math facts like 5+4 by rote (i.e memorize) to be able to do basic math? Hopefully you're aware that kids don't memorize things like 5+4, they understand how to get it by counting.
Anonymous
Post 11/24/2020 20:48     Subject: Curricular issues in HS
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Another vote for a dire lack of teaching critical thinking skills, brought to the general public by the quest for 100% rote memorization of facts as assessed by standardized tests (NCLB).

This gaping hole in 21st century education is how we got into this mess of mis- and disinformation. Well, that and social media.


Rote memorization in a ES (which they no longer do) would free up kids to think critically and learn to argue persuasively in HS.


+1. As an anecdote, my kids attended several elementary schools overseas. In the school that used an American curriculum, "rote learning" was discouraged and it severely delayed my kids' ability to read and do basic math. When we moved to a school with a British curriculum, math facts and phonetic spelling were emphasized, after which my kids zoomed to the top in all subjects because they finally had the basics.
Anonymous
Post 11/24/2020 20:35     Subject: Re:Curricular issues in HS
I do wish logic was taught again in schools. Would be a nice elective at least.
Anonymous
Post 11/24/2020 20:32     Subject: Curricular issues in HS
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Another vote for a dire lack of teaching critical thinking skills, brought to the general public by the quest for 100% rote memorization of facts as assessed by standardized tests (NCLB).

This gaping hole in 21st century education is how we got into this mess of mis- and disinformation. Well, that and social media.


Rote memorization in a ES (which they no longer do) would free up kids to think critically and learn to argue persuasively in HS.


+1.

All those people complaining about teaching to the test and rote memorization don't know enough things to think critically about anything.
Anonymous
Post 11/24/2020 09:29     Subject: Curricular issues in HS
pettifogger wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Hi, I’m doing a project and I was wondering if any teachers would like to chime in.

What are key curricular issues you have seen or feel exist nowadays in our area in particular or our country as a whole?

Bonus points if you also include issues that also affect learners with special needs.

I’m supposed to create a presentation to speak to the school board about specific curricular issues. Thank you in advance for your sweet and altruistic collaboration!

The main curricular issue (not just in high school) is the lack of proof and sound logic when forming an argument. This is especially true in math class where formulas are almost exclusively presented as cold hard facts without enough motivation, with derivations/intuitive justification happening very rarely. As one might expect, this leads the students (and teacher) into believing that math is all about math facts (hence the overused term "math facts", "learn your math facts", "we need to drill those math facts", etc.), when it's really about imagination, intuition, patterns, and creativity. Most students follow this line of gospel into adulthood, some decide to become teachers and propagate the "math phobia" to the next generation in an endless cycle.

Pedagogically, math is taught in a very sterile way, again using facts but offering very little key insights and justification for *why* the presented facts are actually true, how they fit together as a whole, and how they are connected to other parts of mathematics. Geometry, a critical and wonderful part of mathematics, is woefully absent from the curriculum; what passes for it in the one year students get to see it, is a dumbed down approach which instead of using the natural free form essay argument structure relies on an artificial "2 column proof" format, pigeonholing kids into believing that coming up with an argument/proof is akin to following a recipe, step by step. None of the delightful geometry proof problems that could be given to students are ever given, mainly because those problems would require too much of them according to the "educators", (or whoever created the silly curriculum), and they wouldn't nicely fit into their 2 column proof format. As a result students spend the bulk of their time unintuitively filling in blanks (in you guessed it, 2 column format), instead of actually learning how to form coherent geometrical arguments.

Calculators are used exclusively as a crutch instead as a tool for further exploration or to even check work. Students end up relying on them for everything, which over a long period of time reduces their natural number sense abilities. This is akin to walking around with a physical crutch all day despite your legs working perfectly fine. After a while of doing that, the gait and posture permanently change for the worse. This wonderful impact of calculators is nicely highlighted in AP calculus class (in high school considered as the highlight of math status and achievement, for some opaque reason), when juniors and seniors are taking the class but can barely do arithmetic at a high school level (and would certainly have no idea how to solve the most elementary problems given in modern middle school math contests).

I could go on and on, but if you really want a full picture said in an infinitely more elegant way than I could muster writing, you may want to consider spending two hours reading Lockhart's Lament. It is probably the most spot on summary assessment of the state of math education in the U.S that I have had the pleasure (and sorrow) of reading:

https://www.maa.org/external_archive/devlin/LockhartsLament.pdf

P.S: A whole essay could be written just on the ills of geometry class. This is even alluded to in a well known problem solving book with a chapter aptly titled "Geometry for Americans". https://ibb.co/KFRPZtP


I'm the "rote memorization in ES" poster from above. I learned for a few years as a kid via a curriculum model where it was memorization in ES, learn formal logic in MS, then hone that and do rhetoric in HS. The formal logic I learned in 7th grade was formative for my entire adult life, to include making college computer science classes MUCH easier. Middle schoolers really should be required to take a course in formal logic.
Anonymous
Post 11/24/2020 08:53     Subject: Curricular issues in HS
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I would also study the work of Jon White in Louisiana who influenced HOW districts select their curriculum. If they chose science based - Tier 1 - then state paid. If they chose a less than stellar curriculum then local boards paid. With just this small change high school students raised ACT scores in statistically significant way during his 7 year tenor. Would not be surprised to see him soon picked as Secretary of Education under Biden. Process of rating is very transparent: https://www.louisianabelieves.com/academics/curriculum


I just want Biden to make college free so I don’t have to sell a kidney to provide an education for my teens and legalize cannabis so I can enjoy life without fear of being thrown in a cage and become a legal slave to the capitalistic and for-profit prison systems.


The wall street journal just ran an article on how the government is out hundreds of billions right now for it's current policies on colleges. Making college more affordable is still going to cost.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/student-loan-losses-seen-costing-u-s-more-than-400-billion-11605963600
Anonymous
Post 11/24/2020 08:51     Subject: Curricular issues in HS
Anonymous wrote:Another vote for a dire lack of teaching critical thinking skills, brought to the general public by the quest for 100% rote memorization of facts as assessed by standardized tests (NCLB).

This gaping hole in 21st century education is how we got into this mess of mis- and disinformation. Well, that and social media.


Does someone have a school system and class they are referring to? Are these remedial classes or something? As a product of FCPS schools, any non honors course was as basic as could possibly be 30 years ago, so I wouldn't be surprised if it continued that way but honestly haven't seen it all the way from K-12. At the upper levels of school at least, there is nothing but critical thinking to the detriment of actual skills. Kids who still don't know basic grammar and so forth. We are in FCPS and knowledge is not a criteria they measure students by.
Anonymous
Post 11/24/2020 08:13     Subject: Curricular issues in HS
+1. Couldn’t have said it better myself.
Anonymous
Post 11/24/2020 06:31     Subject: Curricular issues in HS
The lack of a science-based reading curriculum. We are not teaching our kids phonics, so many of them can’t read or spell/write. At least 20 percent of students are dyslexic and the current language arts curriculum is inaccessible to those students. Moreover, there are students who aren’t dyslexic but still need explicit phonics instruction. We are failing those students as well. So many of the problems that others post about stem from this basic issue — we need string phonics instruction in K - 3. We need to teach kids how to read, spell, and write.
Anonymous
Post 11/24/2020 06:15     Subject: Re:Curricular issues in HS
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Teaching to the test, rather than teaching to encourage critical thinking.


That is pedagogy not curriculum


This.
Anonymous
Post 11/24/2020 04:59     Subject: Curricular issues in HS
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Another vote for a dire lack of teaching critical thinking skills, brought to the general public by the quest for 100% rote memorization of facts as assessed by standardized tests (NCLB).

This gaping hole in 21st century education is how we got into this mess of mis- and disinformation. Well, that and social media.


Rote memorization in a ES (which they no longer do) would free up kids to think critically and learn to argue persuasively in HS.


Yuo.

I homeschool my 5th grader and we've hammered American history for years now.

We had a whole discussion where HE Came to the conclusion that had the French and Indian War not happened than its possible that the American Revolution would not have happened. This is a 10yr old telling me, without any prompting the connection of debt, over expansion and George Washington learning guerrilla warfare and that impact on us even today.

His very strong grip and understanding of the facts enabeled him to make connections that I highly doubt his peers in public school are doing. He then wrote a short critical response about what could have happened minus the French and Indian War.

Fact are very important, and fact are not a current skill Americans are capable of understanding, and when taught the right way they are engaging and interesting.
Anonymous
Post 11/24/2020 01:24     Subject: Curricular issues in HS
Anonymous wrote:I would also study the work of Jon White in Louisiana who influenced HOW districts select their curriculum. If they chose science based - Tier 1 - then state paid. If they chose a less than stellar curriculum then local boards paid. With just this small change high school students raised ACT scores in statistically significant way during his 7 year tenor. Would not be surprised to see him soon picked as Secretary of Education under Biden. Process of rating is very transparent: https://www.louisianabelieves.com/academics/curriculum


I just want Biden to make college free so I don’t have to sell a kidney to provide an education for my teens and legalize cannabis so I can enjoy life without fear of being thrown in a cage and become a legal slave to the capitalistic and for-profit prison systems.
Anonymous
Post 11/24/2020 00:33     Subject: Curricular issues in HS
I would also study the work of Jon White in Louisiana who influenced HOW districts select their curriculum. If they chose science based - Tier 1 - then state paid. If they chose a less than stellar curriculum then local boards paid. With just this small change high school students raised ACT scores in statistically significant way during his 7 year tenor. Would not be surprised to see him soon picked as Secretary of Education under Biden. Process of rating is very transparent: https://www.louisianabelieves.com/academics/curriculum