Anonymous
Post 09/30/2020 10:44     Subject: How can society measure our academic abilities?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I've come to the point of view that this is one area where the UK gets it right: it isn't about the little tests, homework grades, attendance and participation grades along the way. What matters is mastery at the end of the line. (Though I disagree with their urge to specialize too soon and at the expense of a broader education in the more mature academic years).


I'm not familiar with the British system. What does this end of the line mastery look like? Are they allowed to prepare for it, or would that be cheating?


everybody preps because everybody knows what's coming and how important it is- more like the SAT than the quant q so no real advantage to people who know about the importance of the test early because everybody knows. The A levels are massive make or break tests (think college admission that didn't give a damn about the holistic student or gpa) and they are standardized so that the worst public school gives the same test as the best private school


Is it only the Asians in the UK who prep for the A levels, or the Whites too? Is there a problem with too many Asians in UK schools like there is here?


Not sure about the UK, but I imagine the Asians are cheating just as much over there. We need to keep this under control on a global basis because the next generation of the educated class will be all Asians, and we know what that means....
Anonymous
Post 09/30/2020 10:42     Subject: Re:How can society measure our academic abilities?
The school, and school alone, should be adequate in preparing students for any exam. No need for any outside assistance unless you are learning disabled and in special education.
Anonymous
Post 09/30/2020 10:36     Subject: How can society measure our academic abilities?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:" Prepping for an aptitude test is an oxymoron. "

Worst than that, aptitude-test-prepping is a character flaw. It reveals an inferiority complex.


How does one show an aptitude for math, then, if we can't test people for it because someone might prep for it? Do we just throw our arms up and say aptitude for math doesn't matter in and advanced stem school?

Aptitude tests should consist of material taught by the ES/MS school teacher. The student can study independently or with other students.


That is the crux of the problem right there. The kids that master the content taught in school are being outgunned by the kids taking additional content or seeing the content before it is taught in school outside of school in all these prep and in some cases self enrichment centers.

I don't support the reforms but they did get one thing right. The test should measure through Algebra 1 only because that is what is taught in school and no further.

People keep ignoring this blatant fact. This could be viewed by some as cheating.
Anonymous
Post 09/30/2020 10:35     Subject: How can society measure our academic abilities?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:" Prepping for an aptitude test is an oxymoron. "

Worst than that, aptitude-test-prepping is a character flaw. It reveals an inferiority complex.


How does one show an aptitude for math, then, if we can't test people for it because someone might prep for it? Do we just throw our arms up and say aptitude for math doesn't matter in and advanced stem school?

Aptitude tests should consist of material taught by the ES/MS school teacher. The student can study independently or with other students.


That is the crux of the problem right there. The kids that master the content taught in school are being outgunned by the kids taking additional content or seeing the content before it is taught in school outside of school in all these prep and in some cases self enrichment centers.

I don't support the reforms but they did get one thing right. The test should measure through Algebra 1 only because that is what is taught in school and no further.


That would go along way. If the test is limited to the curriculum that is available in any county public middle school, I think a lot of the argument around prepping falls away
Anonymous
Post 09/30/2020 10:33     Subject: How can society measure our academic abilities?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I've come to the point of view that this is one area where the UK gets it right: it isn't about the little tests, homework grades, attendance and participation grades along the way. What matters is mastery at the end of the line. (Though I disagree with their urge to specialize too soon and at the expense of a broader education in the more mature academic years).


I'm not familiar with the British system. What does this end of the line mastery look like? Are they allowed to prepare for it, or would that be cheating?


everybody preps because everybody knows what's coming and how important it is- more like the SAT than the quant q so no real advantage to people who know about the importance of the test early because everybody knows. The A levels are massive make or break tests (think college admission that didn't give a damn about the holistic student or gpa) and they are standardized so that the worst public school gives the same test as the best private school


Is it only the Asians in the UK who prep for the A levels, or the Whites too? Is there a problem with too many Asians in UK schools like there is here?
Anonymous
Post 09/30/2020 10:30     Subject: How can society measure our academic abilities?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:" Prepping for an aptitude test is an oxymoron. "

Worst than that, aptitude-test-prepping is a character flaw. It reveals an inferiority complex.


How does one show an aptitude for math, then, if we can't test people for it because someone might prep for it? Do we just throw our arms up and say aptitude for math doesn't matter in and advanced stem school?

Aptitude tests should consist of material taught by the ES/MS school teacher. The student can study independently or with other students.


That is the crux of the problem right there. The kids that master the content taught in school are being outgunned by the kids taking additional content or seeing the content before it is taught in school outside of school in all these prep and in some cases self enrichment centers.

I don't support the reforms but they did get one thing right. The test should measure through Algebra 1 only because that is what is taught in school and no further.
Anonymous
Post 09/30/2020 10:27     Subject: How can society measure our academic abilities?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I've come to the point of view that this is one area where the UK gets it right: it isn't about the little tests, homework grades, attendance and participation grades along the way. What matters is mastery at the end of the line. (Though I disagree with their urge to specialize too soon and at the expense of a broader education in the more mature academic years).


I'm not familiar with the British system. What does this end of the line mastery look like? Are they allowed to prepare for it, or would that be cheating?


everybody preps because everybody knows what's coming and how important it is- more like the SAT than the quant q so no real advantage to people who know about the importance of the test early because everybody knows. The A levels are massive make or break tests (think college admission that didn't give a damn about the holistic student or gpa) and they are standardized so that the worst public school gives the same test as the best private school
Anonymous
Post 09/30/2020 10:26     Subject: How can society measure our academic abilities?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:" Prepping for an aptitude test is an oxymoron. "

Worst than that, aptitude-test-prepping is a character flaw. It reveals an inferiority complex.


How does one show an aptitude for math, then, if we can't test people for it because someone might prep for it? Do we just throw our arms up and say aptitude for math doesn't matter in and advanced stem school?

Aptitude tests should consist of material taught by the ES/MS school teacher. The student can study independently or with other students.
Anonymous
Post 09/30/2020 10:23     Subject: Re:How can society measure our academic abilities?
Anonymous wrote:" It’s not that hard to measure academic abilities. "

Academic achievement you can readily measure . . . not ability. Curie Leaning ought to awards its own degrees. Public schools should beware of "up-lift bras." Test-preppers ought to be schooled online. Schools like TJ and Stuyvesant ought to owned and operated by Big Tech. Every slot in TJ is a six-figure subsidy to the likes of Google.

+10000 If students want to attend their own special second school time after school, they may as well just homeschool. Why are they even attending in person school at all?
Anonymous
Post 09/30/2020 10:21     Subject: How can society measure our academic abilities?
Anonymous wrote:" Prepping for an aptitude test is an oxymoron. "

Worst than that, aptitude-test-prepping is a character flaw. It reveals an inferiority complex.


How does one show an aptitude for math, then, if we can't test people for it because someone might prep for it? Do we just throw our arms up and say aptitude for math doesn't matter in and advanced stem school?
Anonymous
Post 09/30/2020 10:16     Subject: How can society measure our academic abilities?
The British system in tutor-taught and akin to homeschooling.
Anonymous
Post 09/30/2020 10:16     Subject: How can society measure our academic abilities?
Anonymous wrote:" Prepping for an aptitude test is an oxymoron. "

Worst than that, aptitude-test-prepping is a character flaw. It reveals an inferiority complex.

Exactly, it’s okay to fail once in a while, it’s character building and human.
Anonymous
Post 09/30/2020 10:14     Subject: How can society measure our academic abilities?
Anonymous wrote:I've come to the point of view that this is one area where the UK gets it right: it isn't about the little tests, homework grades, attendance and participation grades along the way. What matters is mastery at the end of the line. (Though I disagree with their urge to specialize too soon and at the expense of a broader education in the more mature academic years).


I'm not familiar with the British system. What does this end of the line mastery look like? Are they allowed to prepare for it, or would that be cheating?
Anonymous
Post 09/30/2020 10:13     Subject: How can society measure our academic abilities?
" Prepping for an aptitude test is an oxymoron. "

Worst than that, aptitude-test-prepping is a character flaw. It reveals an inferiority complex.
Anonymous
Post 09/30/2020 10:12     Subject: How can society measure our academic abilities?
I've come to the point of view that this is one area where the UK gets it right: it isn't about the little tests, homework grades, attendance and participation grades along the way. What matters is mastery at the end of the line. (Though I disagree with their urge to specialize too soon and at the expense of a broader education in the more mature academic years).