Anonymous
09/24/2020 14:57
Subject: Re:How Did Your MCPS Student Do In Math After Switching To Private?
Anonymous wrote:Mine has just transferred from MCPS to private this year (7th). Early days but . . .
generally agree that relatively speaking Math is more advanced in MCPS, and English is way, way, way behind in MCPS. Actually, scratch that. Not "behind" because it never catches up. MCPS does not seem to believe in teaching grammar, spelling, or really (sadly) writing outside of AP and IB courses.
Also re Math: clearly faster acceleration in MCPS but I really question whether student get sufficient grounding in basics as they move up. Have an older child in MCPS and the number of fellow students who dropped down from Honors Pre-Calc to on-level after the start of the year was surprisingly high. They didn't have the needed grounding. So I worry that MCPS math covers math too superficially.
One other area I've noticed where MCPS is ahead is foreign language. Perhaps because MS foreign language is offered at different levels including HS level.
sometimes it's not about not having the solid foundation but about the student not being able to grasp more difficult math concepts quickly. That's why they drop down as they go up in the grades. Advanced math goes pretty fast, so if you require more time to understand more difficult math concepts, you probably don't belong in advanced math.
Anonymous
09/24/2020 14:56
Subject: How Did Your MCPS Student Do In Math After Switching To Private?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:FCPS do not teach grammar, sentence structure either. So it is pretty normal in public schools. It is a shame too because so many young people cannot write. Let's be honest if you cannot write your marketability is in the toilet.
Met plenty of developers and engineers who can't write at all. This obsession with writing is misplaced and just leads to kids choosing ridiculous humanities majors in college.
DP.. both spouse and I are in tech, non humanity degree - knowing how to write a coherent sentence is important for most jobs. I can't tell you how many times I have had to go back/forth with someone who could not write a coherent sentence.
Having stated that, however, focusing on spelling is pointless now. Grammar, yes, but not spelling. IMO, the thing that most people seem to struggle with is organizing their thoughts and having critical thinking skills.
People don't need to know the definition of an adverb (ie, they don't need to know how to diagram a sentence), but they should know how it is used. IMO, reading complex text and expository writing helps with grammar.
Do you think understanding how a computer works is useful background for a programmer? I think so, and I think knowing something about spelling and grammar are pretty important for anyone who writes (which means pretty much everyone).
False analogy. You should ask whether understanding how a computer works is useful background for an English major. It is not. And the opposite is true.
No one interviewing for a STEM job is asking my kid to provide a writing sample. As long as they have a functioning literacy, I'd rather they focus on the STEM subjects that matter. Don't want them serving coffee their entire lives.
+1 exactly. This is the problem with people who are hung up on diagramming sentences... they lack critical thinking skills.
Oh, really? You don't think anyone in any scientific field has to write anything? Depending on what field you go in, there can be a ton of writing. Maybe not as much in certain fields, but if you are in any kind of research, you definitely have to write. One of my first jobs in DC was working for an organization that paid scientists for studies for public comments on different regulations impacting chemicals in industry. I had to take their writing and meld it into a coherent public comment narrative. It helped that I had a strong writing background and a working understanding in the sciences (at least enough to understand their research papers, not enough to be a professional in the field).
I do agree that you don't really need to know how to focus a ton on spelling or sentence diagrams after you grasp the basics, however. More than anything, you need to read a lot and practice writing to organize your thoughts and present arguments. In a similar fashion, you don't need to learn how to physically work out a lot of math problems by hand anymore when you have software to do it. It is still important to understand the concepts of how it is derived and understand when something is correct and incorrect. Unlike math, however, grammar is to a large extent innate and intuitive.
You people need better critical thinking skills and comprehension. I did state earlier that reading complex text was important because it helps with grammar and comprehension, and that writing coherent paragraphs was also really important.
I don't need to know the definition of what an adverb is to use it correctly. People are too hung up on knowing the parts of grammar. Focus should be on writing coherently and organizing their thoughts well.
Re-read the this thread.
Anonymous
09/24/2020 14:50
Subject: Re:How Did Your MCPS Student Do In Math After Switching To Private?
Mine has just transferred from MCPS to private this year (7th). Early days but . . .
generally agree that relatively speaking Math is more advanced in MCPS, and English is way, way, way behind in MCPS. Actually, scratch that. Not "behind" because it never catches up. MCPS does not seem to believe in teaching grammar, spelling, or really (sadly) writing outside of AP and IB courses.
Also re Math: clearly faster acceleration in MCPS but I really question whether student get sufficient grounding in basics as they move up. Have an older child in MCPS and the number of fellow students who dropped down from Honors Pre-Calc to on-level after the start of the year was surprisingly high. They didn't have the needed grounding. So I worry that MCPS math covers math too superficially.
One other area I've noticed where MCPS is ahead is foreign language. Perhaps because MS foreign language is offered at different levels including HS level.
generally agree that relatively speaking Math is more advanced in MCPS, and English is way, way, way behind in MCPS. Actually, scratch that. Not "behind" because it never catches up. MCPS does not seem to believe in teaching grammar, spelling, or really (sadly) writing outside of AP and IB courses.
Also re Math: clearly faster acceleration in MCPS but I really question whether student get sufficient grounding in basics as they move up. Have an older child in MCPS and the number of fellow students who dropped down from Honors Pre-Calc to on-level after the start of the year was surprisingly high. They didn't have the needed grounding. So I worry that MCPS math covers math too superficially.
One other area I've noticed where MCPS is ahead is foreign language. Perhaps because MS foreign language is offered at different levels including HS level.
Anonymous
09/24/2020 14:50
Subject: How Did Your MCPS Student Do In Math After Switching To Private?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:FCPS do not teach grammar, sentence structure either. So it is pretty normal in public schools. It is a shame too because so many young people cannot write. Let's be honest if you cannot write your marketability is in the toilet.
Met plenty of developers and engineers who can't write at all. This obsession with writing is misplaced and just leads to kids choosing ridiculous humanities majors in college.
DP.. both spouse and I are in tech, non humanity degree - knowing how to write a coherent sentence is important for most jobs. I can't tell you how many times I have had to go back/forth with someone who could not write a coherent sentence.
Having stated that, however, focusing on spelling is pointless now. Grammar, yes, but not spelling. IMO, the thing that most people seem to struggle with is organizing their thoughts and having critical thinking skills.
People don't need to know the definition of an adverb (ie, they don't need to know how to diagram a sentence), but they should know how it is used. IMO, reading complex text and expository writing helps with grammar.
Do you think understanding how a computer works is useful background for a programmer? I think so, and I think knowing something about spelling and grammar are pretty important for anyone who writes (which means pretty much everyone).
False analogy. You should ask whether understanding how a computer works is useful background for an English major. It is not. And the opposite is true.
No one interviewing for a STEM job is asking my kid to provide a writing sample. As long as they have a functioning literacy, I'd rather they focus on the STEM subjects that matter. Don't want them serving coffee their entire lives.
+1 exactly. This is the problem with people who are hung up on diagramming sentences... they lack critical thinking skills.
NP. What do people have against grammar? I don’t understand it. I’m continuously surprised at what adults are willing to throw away. Yesterday, I read a mom say schools shouldn’t teach history!
If you re-read my post, I stated that grammar was important, but sentence diagramming and knowing what a past participle vs an adverb is by definition is not that important. It's important that the writing is coherent, but a person doesn't need to know how to diagram a sentence to write a coherent paragraph.
As far as spelling is concerned, again, that is only important to a point. Even my MS kids do all their writing on their computer, but DC has had spelling tests in ES. But at this point, it's more important for MS/HS kids to write a coherent essay using critical thinking skills than focusing on their spelling.
I did not say we should not teach history or English. The question is - what content should be taught in history or English? In the 21st century, we don't need sentence diagramming or focusing on spelling in the later grades.
Again, lacking critical thinking skills.
Anonymous
09/24/2020 14:49
Subject: How Did Your MCPS Student Do In Math After Switching To Private?
Our daughter moved from public to private for 6th. She has always been in the highest math class available since then. There was definitely a weird vibe from her math teacher that she might not be on par with the top students who had already been in the private. Then, she had the highest score in the grade on a national math competition the school did, and that all stopped.
Anonymous
09/24/2020 14:41
Subject: Re:How Did Your MCPS Student Do In Math After Switching To Private?
Mine transferred to private for 7th grade and was fine all around. Definitely in top third of class.
Anonymous
09/24/2020 14:32
Subject: How Did Your MCPS Student Do In Math After Switching To Private?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:FCPS do not teach grammar, sentence structure either. So it is pretty normal in public schools. It is a shame too because so many young people cannot write. Let's be honest if you cannot write your marketability is in the toilet.
Met plenty of developers and engineers who can't write at all. This obsession with writing is misplaced and just leads to kids choosing ridiculous humanities majors in college.
DP.. both spouse and I are in tech, non humanity degree - knowing how to write a coherent sentence is important for most jobs. I can't tell you how many times I have had to go back/forth with someone who could not write a coherent sentence.
Having stated that, however, focusing on spelling is pointless now. Grammar, yes, but not spelling. IMO, the thing that most people seem to struggle with is organizing their thoughts and having critical thinking skills.
People don't need to know the definition of an adverb (ie, they don't need to know how to diagram a sentence), but they should know how it is used. IMO, reading complex text and expository writing helps with grammar.
Do you think understanding how a computer works is useful background for a programmer? I think so, and I think knowing something about spelling and grammar are pretty important for anyone who writes (which means pretty much everyone).
False analogy. You should ask whether understanding how a computer works is useful background for an English major. It is not. And the opposite is true.
No one interviewing for a STEM job is asking my kid to provide a writing sample. As long as they have a functioning literacy, I'd rather they focus on the STEM subjects that matter. Don't want them serving coffee their entire lives.
+1 exactly. This is the problem with people who are hung up on diagramming sentences... they lack critical thinking skills.
NP. What do people have against grammar? I don’t understand it. I’m continuously surprised at what adults are willing to throw away. Yesterday, I read a mom say schools shouldn’t teach history!
Anonymous
09/24/2020 14:26
Subject: How Did Your MCPS Student Do In Math After Switching To Private?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:FCPS do not teach grammar, sentence structure either. So it is pretty normal in public schools. It is a shame too because so many young people cannot write. Let's be honest if you cannot write your marketability is in the toilet.
Met plenty of developers and engineers who can't write at all. This obsession with writing is misplaced and just leads to kids choosing ridiculous humanities majors in college.
DP.. both spouse and I are in tech, non humanity degree - knowing how to write a coherent sentence is important for most jobs. I can't tell you how many times I have had to go back/forth with someone who could not write a coherent sentence.
Having stated that, however, focusing on spelling is pointless now. Grammar, yes, but not spelling. IMO, the thing that most people seem to struggle with is organizing their thoughts and having critical thinking skills.
People don't need to know the definition of an adverb (ie, they don't need to know how to diagram a sentence), but they should know how it is used. IMO, reading complex text and expository writing helps with grammar.
Do you think understanding how a computer works is useful background for a programmer? I think so, and I think knowing something about spelling and grammar are pretty important for anyone who writes (which means pretty much everyone).
False analogy. You should ask whether understanding how a computer works is useful background for an English major. It is not. And the opposite is true.
No one interviewing for a STEM job is asking my kid to provide a writing sample. As long as they have a functioning literacy, I'd rather they focus on the STEM subjects that matter. Don't want them serving coffee their entire lives.
+1 exactly. This is the problem with people who are hung up on diagramming sentences... they lack critical thinking skills.
Oh, really? You don't think anyone in any scientific field has to write anything? Depending on what field you go in, there can be a ton of writing. Maybe not as much in certain fields, but if you are in any kind of research, you definitely have to write. One of my first jobs in DC was working for an organization that paid scientists for studies for public comments on different regulations impacting chemicals in industry. I had to take their writing and meld it into a coherent public comment narrative. It helped that I had a strong writing background and a working understanding in the sciences (at least enough to understand their research papers, not enough to be a professional in the field).
I do agree that you don't really need to know how to focus a ton on spelling or sentence diagrams after you grasp the basics, however. More than anything, you need to read a lot and practice writing to organize your thoughts and present arguments. In a similar fashion, you don't need to learn how to physically work out a lot of math problems by hand anymore when you have software to do it. It is still important to understand the concepts of how it is derived and understand when something is correct and incorrect. Unlike math, however, grammar is to a large extent innate and intuitive.
Anonymous
09/24/2020 14:13
Subject: How Did Your MCPS Student Do In Math After Switching To Private?
Anonymous wrote:FCPS do not teach grammar, sentence structure either. So it is pretty normal in public schools. It is a shame too because so many young people cannot write. Let's be honest if you cannot write your marketability is in the toilet.
Yep. I know we are all focusing so much on STEM, which is great, but when did we decide that that even more important skills (that are also valuable in STEM fields and in just being an adult, generally) aren't important? Like critically thinking and being able to effectively communicate your thoughts or articulate arguments? Not everyone is going to be able to go into coding nor do many people want to...
Anonymous
09/24/2020 12:41
Subject: How Did Your MCPS Student Do In Math After Switching To Private?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:FCPS do not teach grammar, sentence structure either. So it is pretty normal in public schools. It is a shame too because so many young people cannot write. Let's be honest if you cannot write your marketability is in the toilet.
Met plenty of developers and engineers who can't write at all. This obsession with writing is misplaced and just leads to kids choosing ridiculous humanities majors in college.
DP.. both spouse and I are in tech, non humanity degree - knowing how to write a coherent sentence is important for most jobs. I can't tell you how many times I have had to go back/forth with someone who could not write a coherent sentence.
Having stated that, however, focusing on spelling is pointless now. Grammar, yes, but not spelling. IMO, the thing that most people seem to struggle with is organizing their thoughts and having critical thinking skills.
People don't need to know the definition of an adverb (ie, they don't need to know how to diagram a sentence), but they should know how it is used. IMO, reading complex text and expository writing helps with grammar.
Do you think understanding how a computer works is useful background for a programmer? I think so, and I think knowing something about spelling and grammar are pretty important for anyone who writes (which means pretty much everyone).
False analogy. You should ask whether understanding how a computer works is useful background for an English major. It is not. And the opposite is true.
No one interviewing for a STEM job is asking my kid to provide a writing sample. As long as they have a functioning literacy, I'd rather they focus on the STEM subjects that matter. Don't want them serving coffee their entire lives.
+1 exactly. This is the problem with people who are hung up on diagramming sentences... they lack critical thinking skills.
Anonymous
09/24/2020 12:40
Subject: How Did Your MCPS Student Do In Math After Switching To Private?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:FCPS do not teach grammar, sentence structure either. So it is pretty normal in public schools. It is a shame too because so many young people cannot write. Let's be honest if you cannot write your marketability is in the toilet.
Met plenty of developers and engineers who can't write at all. This obsession with writing is misplaced and just leads to kids choosing ridiculous humanities majors in college.
DP.. both spouse and I are in tech, non humanity degree - knowing how to write a coherent sentence is important for most jobs. I can't tell you how many times I have had to go back/forth with someone who could not write a coherent sentence.
Having stated that, however, focusing on spelling is pointless now. Grammar, yes, but not spelling. IMO, the thing that most people seem to struggle with is organizing their thoughts and having critical thinking skills.
People don't need to know the definition of an adverb (ie, they don't need to know how to diagram a sentence), but they should know how it is used. IMO, reading complex text and expository writing helps with grammar.
Do you think understanding how a computer works is useful background for a programmer? I think so, and I think knowing something about spelling and grammar are pretty important for anyone who writes (which means pretty much everyone).
You don't need to know the ins/outs of a computer to use it. You do know the ins/outs if that is part of your profession.
As an English teacher/professor or writer, yes, you should know the ins/outs of grammar, but I don't need to know it as a programmer, and I don't expect a user whom I am helping or explaining a technical concept to to understand the ins/outs of a computer.
Anonymous
09/24/2020 12:39
Subject: How Did Your MCPS Student Do In Math After Switching To Private?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:FCPS do not teach grammar, sentence structure either. So it is pretty normal in public schools. It is a shame too because so many young people cannot write. Let's be honest if you cannot write your marketability is in the toilet.
Met plenty of developers and engineers who can't write at all. This obsession with writing is misplaced and just leads to kids choosing ridiculous humanities majors in college.
DP.. both spouse and I are in tech, non humanity degree - knowing how to write a coherent sentence is important for most jobs. I can't tell you how many times I have had to go back/forth with someone who could not write a coherent sentence.
Having stated that, however, focusing on spelling is pointless now. Grammar, yes, but not spelling. IMO, the thing that most people seem to struggle with is organizing their thoughts and having critical thinking skills.
People don't need to know the definition of an adverb (ie, they don't need to know how to diagram a sentence), but they should know how it is used. IMO, reading complex text and expository writing helps with grammar.
Do you think understanding how a computer works is useful background for a programmer? I think so, and I think knowing something about spelling and grammar are pretty important for anyone who writes (which means pretty much everyone).
False analogy. You should ask whether understanding how a computer works is useful background for an English major. It is not. And the opposite is true.
No one interviewing for a STEM job is asking my kid to provide a writing sample. As long as they have a functioning literacy, I'd rather they focus on the STEM subjects that matter. Don't want them serving coffee their entire lives.
Anonymous
09/24/2020 12:37
Subject: How Did Your MCPS Student Do In Math After Switching To Private?
DD transferred from MCPS to private in 4th grade and was on par with the other students for both math and reading/writing. That said, as high school student, she's now a grade ahead in math. No doubt it varies from school to school and, I think, depends when students make the switch.
Anonymous
09/24/2020 12:28
Subject: How Did Your MCPS Student Do In Math After Switching To Private?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:FCPS do not teach grammar, sentence structure either. So it is pretty normal in public schools. It is a shame too because so many young people cannot write. Let's be honest if you cannot write your marketability is in the toilet.
Met plenty of developers and engineers who can't write at all. This obsession with writing is misplaced and just leads to kids choosing ridiculous humanities majors in college.
DP.. both spouse and I are in tech, non humanity degree - knowing how to write a coherent sentence is important for most jobs. I can't tell you how many times I have had to go back/forth with someone who could not write a coherent sentence.
Having stated that, however, focusing on spelling is pointless now. Grammar, yes, but not spelling. IMO, the thing that most people seem to struggle with is organizing their thoughts and having critical thinking skills.
People don't need to know the definition of an adverb (ie, they don't need to know how to diagram a sentence), but they should know how it is used. IMO, reading complex text and expository writing helps with grammar.
Do you think understanding how a computer works is useful background for a programmer? I think so, and I think knowing something about spelling and grammar are pretty important for anyone who writes (which means pretty much everyone).
Anonymous
09/24/2020 12:12
Subject: How Did Your MCPS Student Do In Math After Switching To Private?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:FCPS do not teach grammar, sentence structure either. So it is pretty normal in public schools. It is a shame too because so many young people cannot write. Let's be honest if you cannot write your marketability is in the toilet.
Met plenty of developers and engineers who can't write at all. This obsession with writing is misplaced and just leads to kids choosing ridiculous humanities majors in college.
DP.. both spouse and I are in tech, non humanity degree - knowing how to write a coherent sentence is important for most jobs. I can't tell you how many times I have had to go back/forth with someone who could not write a coherent sentence.
Having stated that, however, focusing on spelling is pointless now. Grammar, yes, but not spelling. IMO, the thing that most people seem to struggle with is organizing their thoughts and having critical thinking skills.
People don't need to know the definition of an adverb (ie, they don't need to know how to diagram a sentence), but they should know how it is used. IMO, reading complex text and expository writing helps with grammar.