Anonymous
Post 05/27/2020 08:38     Subject: Buying without a realtor
You can discuss not having a buyer's agent with the listing agent and see if he/she split the fee with you. They should be happy that the deal is getting done anyway.
Anonymous
Post 05/27/2020 07:32     Subject: Re:Buying without a realtor
OP, you are exactly the type of person that would do well without a buyer agent. You research, you educate yourself and do your homework. You spent years studying the neighborhood. This is telling. I bet you know more about this neighborhood than most realtors.
Most people don’t do this and that’s why they need an agent to hold their hands. They don’t have time for this, are not willing to do things themselves or are simply incapable. That’s fine because not everyone is a DIYer. Some people find it more convenient to pay someone to deliver the service.
Realtors are not indispensable.

Some posters here claim that you cannot get a lower price or a split on commissions. This is laughable. They don’t know the dynamics of business transactions. If the total commissions is 6%, why would the seller agent prefer to pay 3% to a buyer agent rather than paying 1.5% to you? You may not get the full 3% unless the seller agent is desperate to close the deal because there are no other buyer in sight.
From a pure financial perspective, you’ll always get something from seller if you come without a buyer agent. The problem is often that sellers don’t trust buyers that aren’t represented. They fear the buyer wouldn’t be able to handle their side of the transaction. They would rather split the commissions with an agent that will handle the deal or keep all of it to cover the risks.
It’s up to you the buyer to convince the seller agent that you have a plan and are capable of handling the transaction.
Anonymous
Post 05/27/2020 06:42     Subject: Buying without a realtor
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Are you waiving inspection? I think you need a realtor present for inspection, so either you hire one or waive it. If you waive all contingencies, I don’t see an issue. That said, we are getting ready to sell and I would prefer an offer from someone with a realtor, simply bc without senda the message you are more likely to nickel and dime the seller. Can you just use Redfin? I think they are 1%. Also, the commission percentage is written into the selling contract as a total percent, so if you have no realtor the full amount would go to the selling agent. So they are unlikely to lower the selling price, you have to ask for the commission to be refunded to you. Have you bought before? I would make sure you know what you are doing.


No, we are not waiving inspection. We would never buy the house without an inspection. What difference does it make if we don't have a realtor if we find our own inspector? We can get one through referral from others.

The house has sat on the market for a few months and the estate is looking to get rid of the house. We are not in a hot DC suburb but in the Baltimore suburbs. Properties don't move like they do in DC.


I mean most people will require you to have a licensed realtor present for inspection. They won’t just let you in their house with an inspector. Realistically, yo I are first time home buyers who are trying to save a buck. It’s good, in your case, that you aren’t in a hot market. Good luck.


OP here. Getting the 3% back is nice but not a dealbreaker.

If the only function of a realtor is to have someone present in the house during the inspection, then why is that worth 3% of the sale price? The estate would be paying that, not us, so it's not our money. We will be asking for full closing to start with and will probably end up with half the closing costs covered. The 3% back would be part of the negotiation over the closing costs.

I searched this topic in the archives and it seems like others have done this successfully. I'm not opposed to getting a realtor but it seems like we'd be giving the realtor free money for not very much work. I'm more concerned over your implication that we can't have a proper inspection without a realtor? Why would the listing agent refuse a qualified home inspector into the property if she wants to close the deal?





Because a licensed realtor has to be present, and if the listing agent is present then you are essentially asking him/her to dual represent you (which they cannot/should not do) and also work for free. The chance of you negotiating that full 3% back or applying it toward closing costs is slim. Most likely, there is a seller-side contract which says the listing agent will keep all or some of whatever percentage of total commission if there is no buyer’s agent.

You would be MUCH better off using a discount buyer’s agent who will give you back 1-2% of the 3% paid to the buyer side.

-Not a realtor


This is BS. I have never heard that. Maybe this is the law in DC? I doubt it. In any case in MD a realtor doesn’t need to be present for an inspection.

Anonymous
Post 05/26/2020 23:32     Subject: Buying without a realtor
You do know we're also in a pretty unique market right now? And that Redin and zillow estimates are likely incorrect? I think you are being penny wise and pound foolish not to have a buyers' agent. A good agent will save you money and time, and guide you through the process. It's not quite as straightforward as you present. Just knowing you want a certain house is usually the first step...

Agent will help to negotiate, find out motivations of the sellers, get you credits and/or repairs where due, help you figure out appropriate contingencies and timelines, connect you with solid inspectors and lenders, help make a list of repairs/credits after the inspection, negotiate those, ensure you pay your EMD and work with the title company and the appraiser, etc. As a first time buyer, you are likely to make mistakes on something.
Anonymous
Post 05/26/2020 21:08     Subject: Buying without a realtor
A good real estate agent is worth their commission. I just purchased my 3rd home and know the process and even had extra time to devote due to no travel the past couple months. From offer to close, we had 12 days.

This has been the easiest transaction I've ever done. She did a great job negotiating, took care of scheduling my inspector and additional visits to the home, communicated with my mortgage broker, attorney, title company, and appraiser. She knew pricing for some of the home renovations I had in mind and communicated with the sellers to confirm things before close (paint colors, size of closet doors, placement of cable jacks). She was consistent and provided some much needed stability during the mad dash we were in. I'm very appreciative.
Anonymous
Post 05/26/2020 21:07     Subject: Re:Buying without a realtor
We used Rob Spicer in a similar situation and it was great. He charges you an hourly rate, but if you close, he will collect the total commission subtract what you owe him from the hourly rate calculation and write you a check for the difference. It was a win win. He wasn’t a neighborhood expert where we bought, but we were so we didn’t need that.
Anonymous
Post 05/26/2020 20:58     Subject: Buying without a realtor
Anonymous wrote:believe OP stated that this is an estate sale, he just needs someone to do the paper work. we all know that high % of real estate agent's commission around these neck of the woods are unjustifiable. nothing against those buyer/sellers that leverages their agents to their best leverage but OP is literally just asking how to get the other 1/2 of the commission back. lets move along


Actually OP asked what they would need a RA for, which is what people are answering. I would say, for an estate sale, either buy as is for a low price or get someone in there who knows the neighborhood, can tell you the state of the house. Likely it had older owners who let it go and now has been sitting empty. OP’s questions suggest this is their first transaction, so they would benefit from someone to guide them, but their responses also indicate they are the type to go without an agent and probably irritate all involved. Good luck OP. Give us an update on how it goes.
Anonymous
Post 05/26/2020 20:11     Subject: Buying without a realtor
believe OP stated that this is an estate sale, he just needs someone to do the paper work. we all know that high % of real estate agent's commission around these neck of the woods are unjustifiable. nothing against those buyer/sellers that leverages their agents to their best leverage but OP is literally just asking how to get the other 1/2 of the commission back. lets move along
Anonymous
Post 05/26/2020 18:41     Subject: Buying without a realtor
Anonymous wrote:OP, you asked what people thought and they gave you their opinions. It sounds like you are looking for someone to tell you to go ahead without an agent. You can, you just might not get the best deal. We have bought and sold 4 houses, both in DC and less hot markets. In 2 cases (one dc, one outside) the realtors have closed the deal using their commission - in one case the sellers realtor wrote us a $500 check bc a stove knob didn’t work during the final walkthrough, in the other, our agent gave the sellers $5k to make up the difference in sales price and close the deal.

Particularly for a first time buyer, realtors will help you with the process. If you don’t get your 1-2% worth that means you chose a crappy agent. Good agents should have intel on the neighborhood/street issue, common house issues, particularly if the house is sitting empty, and pricing, not just based on area but the basic features of the house, lot characteristics, etc. They should be able to help you strategize the components of your offer to make it competitive. The purpose is also bc both buyers and sellers are emotional about houses and realtors are not so they can smooth the deal. You will probably be fine without a realtor, assuming the sellers agent is competent and assuming (since. Sounds like you have been talking to them?) that you dint have any obligations to the sellers agent, and that there are no hiccups in the sale. And assuming you can identify why this house, in a desirable area, is sitting. It’s either mispriced or has a problem.


Especially first time would never buy or sell without a realtor, I know the ones I've used have done a lot of back and forth between all parties to ensure everything goes smoothly at closing, especially if you have a full time job!
Anonymous
Post 05/26/2020 18:34     Subject: Buying without a realtor
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:OP, you asked what people thought and they gave you their opinions. It sounds like you are looking for someone to tell you to go ahead without an agent. You can, you just might not get the best deal. We have bought and sold 4 houses, both in DC and less hot markets. In 2 cases (one dc, one outside) the realtors have closed the deal using their commission - in one case the sellers realtor wrote us a $500 check bc a stove knob didn’t work during the final walkthrough, in the other, our agent gave the sellers $5k to make up the difference in sales price and close the deal.

Particularly for a first time buyer, realtors will help you with the process. If you don’t get your 1-2% worth that means you chose a crappy agent. Good agents should have intel on the neighborhood/street issue, common house issues, particularly if the house is sitting empty, and pricing, not just based on area but the basic features of the house, lot characteristics, etc. They should be able to help you strategize the components of your offer to make it competitive. The purpose is also bc both buyers and sellers are emotional about houses and realtors are not so they can smooth the deal. You will probably be fine without a realtor, assuming the sellers agent is competent and assuming (since. Sounds like you have been talking to them?) that you dint have any obligations to the sellers agent, and that there are no hiccups in the sale. And assuming you can identify why this house, in a desirable area, is sitting. It’s either mispriced or has a problem.


I am OP. You are right that part of me is looking for assurance to go ahead without a realtor, but part of me is also looking to see where the value of a realtor comes into play. For example, some of advantages of a realtor you mentioned are not really advantages to me. I know the neighborhood extremely well, we have been tracking sales of comparables for a few years and we have a very good idea of sale prices versus house condition. We are going in for a second viewing and bringing a reputable remodeler with us, who will also help identify any issues we might not have noticed. We have cost sheets set up to strategize various offers. I can see a realtor helping us with the negotations but the seller is an estate looking to offload a sitting house sooner rather than later. Part of me thinks we've stumbled into a lucky situation as it's a lovely neighborhood we've always wanted to live in - which may be the emotional part, but we're also dispassionate people in a sluggish market (so we think!). I'm not saying I don't want a realtor but I'm asking this question to find out what advantages a realtor brings to the deal based on our situation, especially if we can use the absence of a realtor to negotiate a lower price or closing cost contributions in lieu of their fees.

But I will say the one thing I've learned is that the realtor commission is a separate topic from the offer on the house and the realtor split/pay back needs to be handled separately.


Huh? No, you cannot handle the realtor commission outside of the purchase transaction. Realtors get paid from sale proceeds, and a contract that tries to go around that will not be accepted because they will presume you are planning to stiff the seller's agent on their fee.
Anonymous
Post 05/26/2020 18:31     Subject: Buying without a realtor
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Are you waiving inspection? I think you need a realtor present for inspection, so either you hire one or waive it. If you waive all contingencies, I don’t see an issue. That said, we are getting ready to sell and I would prefer an offer from someone with a realtor, simply bc without senda the message you are more likely to nickel and dime the seller. Can you just use Redfin? I think they are 1%. Also, the commission percentage is written into the selling contract as a total percent, so if you have no realtor the full amount would go to the selling agent. So they are unlikely to lower the selling price, you have to ask for the commission to be refunded to you. Have you bought before? I would make sure you know what you are doing.


No, we are not waiving inspection. We would never buy the house without an inspection. What difference does it make if we don't have a realtor if we find our own inspector? We can get one through referral from others.

The house has sat on the market for a few months and the estate is looking to get rid of the house. We are not in a hot DC suburb but in the Baltimore suburbs. Properties don't move like they do in DC.


I mean most people will require you to have a licensed realtor present for inspection. They won’t just let you in their house with an inspector. Realistically, yo I are first time home buyers who are trying to save a buck. It’s good, in your case, that you aren’t in a hot market. Good luck.


OP here. Getting the 3% back is nice but not a dealbreaker.

If the only function of a realtor is to have someone present in the house during the inspection, then why is that worth 3% of the sale price? The estate would be paying that, not us, so it's not our money. We will be asking for full closing to start with and will probably end up with half the closing costs covered. The 3% back would be part of the negotiation over the closing costs.

I searched this topic in the archives and it seems like others have done this successfully. I'm not opposed to getting a realtor but it seems like we'd be giving the realtor free money for not very much work. I'm more concerned over your implication that we can't have a proper inspection without a realtor? Why would the listing agent refuse a qualified home inspector into the property if she wants to close the deal?


So you’d rather see the 3% that would have gone to a buyer’s agent instead go to the seller *and* pay an attorney on top of that to review the contract *and* do all of the legwork yourself rather than having that 3% go to a buyer’s agent who will manage the logistics of closing for you? That’s, um, a position you could take.
Anonymous
Post 05/26/2020 18:22     Subject: Buying without a realtor
Search for "Rob Spicer," he is a real estate agent so you get the 3% back without any negotiations (selling agent doesn't even have to know about your arrangement) , and pay Spicer an hourly rate for his time. Tremendous savings. Must be other agents who do this, but he's the only one I've come across.
Anonymous
Post 05/26/2020 17:39     Subject: Buying without a realtor
Who is showing you the house? Is it the listing agent? What is the RE law in MD? In many states if the listing agent shows you the property they will expect to get the commission; I also believe in some states the first agent to show you the property retains claim to the commission.
Anonymous
Post 05/26/2020 15:27     Subject: Buying without a realtor
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:OP, you asked what people thought and they gave you their opinions. It sounds like you are looking for someone to tell you to go ahead without an agent. You can, you just might not get the best deal. We have bought and sold 4 houses, both in DC and less hot markets. In 2 cases (one dc, one outside) the realtors have closed the deal using their commission - in one case the sellers realtor wrote us a $500 check bc a stove knob didn’t work during the final walkthrough, in the other, our agent gave the sellers $5k to make up the difference in sales price and close the deal.

Particularly for a first time buyer, realtors will help you with the process. If you don’t get your 1-2% worth that means you chose a crappy agent. Good agents should have intel on the neighborhood/street issue, common house issues, particularly if the house is sitting empty, and pricing, not just based on area but the basic features of the house, lot characteristics, etc. They should be able to help you strategize the components of your offer to make it competitive. The purpose is also bc both buyers and sellers are emotional about houses and realtors are not so they can smooth the deal. You will probably be fine without a realtor, assuming the sellers agent is competent and assuming (since. Sounds like you have been talking to them?) that you dint have any obligations to the sellers agent, and that there are no hiccups in the sale. And assuming you can identify why this house, in a desirable area, is sitting. It’s either mispriced or has a problem.


I am OP. You are right that part of me is looking for assurance to go ahead without a realtor, but part of me is also looking to see where the value of a realtor comes into play. For example, some of advantages of a realtor you mentioned are not really advantages to me. I know the neighborhood extremely well, we have been tracking sales of comparables for a few years and we have a very good idea of sale prices versus house condition. We are going in for a second viewing and bringing a reputable remodeler with us, who will also help identify any issues we might not have noticed. We have cost sheets set up to strategize various offers. I can see a realtor helping us with the negotations but the seller is an estate looking to offload a sitting house sooner rather than later. Part of me thinks we've stumbled into a lucky situation as it's a lovely neighborhood we've always wanted to live in - which may be the emotional part, but we're also dispassionate people in a sluggish market (so we think!). I'm not saying I don't want a realtor but I'm asking this question to find out what advantages a realtor brings to the deal based on our situation, especially if we can use the absence of a realtor to negotiate a lower price or closing cost contributions in lieu of their fees.

But I will say the one thing I've learned is that the realtor commission is a separate topic from the offer on the house and the realtor split/pay back needs to be handled separately.


to me the main thing seems to be this: is the agent of the estate going to pocket the entire commission if you don't have an agent? if so, what is your advantage in not having your own agent? the seller pays for it and if you get a discount agent like Redfin you do get something back.
Anonymous
Post 05/26/2020 14:48     Subject: Buying without a realtor
Anonymous wrote:OP, you asked what people thought and they gave you their opinions. It sounds like you are looking for someone to tell you to go ahead without an agent. You can, you just might not get the best deal. We have bought and sold 4 houses, both in DC and less hot markets. In 2 cases (one dc, one outside) the realtors have closed the deal using their commission - in one case the sellers realtor wrote us a $500 check bc a stove knob didn’t work during the final walkthrough, in the other, our agent gave the sellers $5k to make up the difference in sales price and close the deal.

Particularly for a first time buyer, realtors will help you with the process. If you don’t get your 1-2% worth that means you chose a crappy agent. Good agents should have intel on the neighborhood/street issue, common house issues, particularly if the house is sitting empty, and pricing, not just based on area but the basic features of the house, lot characteristics, etc. They should be able to help you strategize the components of your offer to make it competitive. The purpose is also bc both buyers and sellers are emotional about houses and realtors are not so they can smooth the deal. You will probably be fine without a realtor, assuming the sellers agent is competent and assuming (since. Sounds like you have been talking to them?) that you dint have any obligations to the sellers agent, and that there are no hiccups in the sale. And assuming you can identify why this house, in a desirable area, is sitting. It’s either mispriced or has a problem.


I am OP. You are right that part of me is looking for assurance to go ahead without a realtor, but part of me is also looking to see where the value of a realtor comes into play. For example, some of advantages of a realtor you mentioned are not really advantages to me. I know the neighborhood extremely well, we have been tracking sales of comparables for a few years and we have a very good idea of sale prices versus house condition. We are going in for a second viewing and bringing a reputable remodeler with us, who will also help identify any issues we might not have noticed. We have cost sheets set up to strategize various offers. I can see a realtor helping us with the negotations but the seller is an estate looking to offload a sitting house sooner rather than later. Part of me thinks we've stumbled into a lucky situation as it's a lovely neighborhood we've always wanted to live in - which may be the emotional part, but we're also dispassionate people in a sluggish market (so we think!). I'm not saying I don't want a realtor but I'm asking this question to find out what advantages a realtor brings to the deal based on our situation, especially if we can use the absence of a realtor to negotiate a lower price or closing cost contributions in lieu of their fees.

But I will say the one thing I've learned is that the realtor commission is a separate topic from the offer on the house and the realtor split/pay back needs to be handled separately.