Anonymous
Post 05/19/2020 08:38     Subject: Business Majors, How much Math?
It depends on what type of business. Just like a biologist does not need as much math as a physicist, someone in marketing (business school) does not need as much as someone in Finance.
Anonymous
Post 05/19/2020 08:35     Subject: Business Majors, How much Math?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:College Algebra isn’t really offered anymore. Many colleges expect students to take either calculus or basic statistics.



In Business schools or in general? I wish that were true. I don’t have the data on hand, but if anything the trend is the opposite. College math readiness has been going downhill for years. Harvard offers precalc (not sure if it’s for credit).


My friend who teaches physics complains that some kids who come into his class having passed BC AP calculus don't understand how to use calc as a tool to solve physics problems. These seem to be kids who were pushed into accelerated math inappropriately. They've created a special remedial course to give these kids a better grounding in basic concepts. It has actually messed up graduation timing for some because they have to take this class before they can take some physics classes. His opinion is that anybody can learn math, many people just need to take it a lot slower than it's usually taught. This has been my son's experience -- he struggled with AP pre-calc, so he took on-level calculus and found it really easy (got 95-100 on tests, as opposed to 70-80 on AP pre-calc). I'm delighted because I don't care about the AP credit or GPA bump, I just want him actually learn math.



Gonna be worse this year, as the AP test is only covering material through early march. I do not think colleges should give credit for Calc 2nd semester because the kids need to understand things like expansion series...which has not been covered. (at least according to DD).
Anonymous
Post 05/19/2020 07:59     Subject: Business Majors, How much Math?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:College Algebra isn’t really offered anymore. Many colleges expect students to take either calculus or basic statistics.



In Business schools or in general? I wish that were true. I don’t have the data on hand, but if anything the trend is the opposite. College math readiness has been going downhill for years. Harvard offers precalc (not sure if it’s for credit).


My friend who teaches physics complains that some kids who come into his class having passed BC AP calculus don't understand how to use calc as a tool to solve physics problems. These seem to be kids who were pushed into accelerated math inappropriately. They've created a special remedial course to give these kids a better grounding in basic concepts. It has actually messed up graduation timing for some because they have to take this class before they can take some physics classes. His opinion is that anybody can learn math, many people just need to take it a lot slower than it's usually taught. This has been my son's experience -- he struggled with AP pre-calc, so he took on-level calculus and found it really easy (got 95-100 on tests, as opposed to 70-80 on AP pre-calc). I'm delighted because I don't care about the AP credit or GPA bump, I just want him actually learn math.




At my dd’s hs, many levels of math were offered (9th-12th grades). Pre Algebra, algebra 1a, Algebra 1b, Algebra 1 honors, reg geom, geometry honors, 2, Alg 2 honors, Reg precalc, honors precalc, reg calc, honors calc, and Ap calc. My son said that the honors precalc course was way more advanced material than regular precalc and regular calc, and somewhat more advanced than honors calc. The high schools are under pressure to put kids in Calc because colleges value the word “Calculus” on the transcript more than actual mastery. If I were a college i’d value a high sat math score and good math grades regardless of what class the kid is in. They let many kids take reg geometry and reg Alg 2 to get to calc if they are “behind” without even vetting the kids. Many of the kids in regular calc probably shouldn’t have been on that track in the first place if the school needs two levels of calculus under Calc AB!!

The IB math track is much better at preparing students for college level math. It requires extensive application and explanation rather than the AP style of just calculation.

I just checked the catalog for my alma matter. They offer a “calculus readiness” course, but it is not for credit. There is no college algebra offering for credit. Math credit starts with calculus or statistics.
Anonymous
Post 05/19/2020 07:39     Subject: Business Majors, How much Math?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:College Algebra isn’t really offered anymore. Many colleges expect students to take either calculus or basic statistics.



In Business schools or in general? I wish that were true. I don’t have the data on hand, but if anything the trend is the opposite. College math readiness has been going downhill for years. Harvard offers precalc (not sure if it’s for credit).


My friend who teaches physics complains that some kids who come into his class having passed BC AP calculus don't understand how to use calc as a tool to solve physics problems. These seem to be kids who were pushed into accelerated math inappropriately. They've created a special remedial course to give these kids a better grounding in basic concepts. It has actually messed up graduation timing for some because they have to take this class before they can take some physics classes. His opinion is that anybody can learn math, many people just need to take it a lot slower than it's usually taught. This has been my son's experience -- he struggled with AP pre-calc, so he took on-level calculus and found it really easy (got 95-100 on tests, as opposed to 70-80 on AP pre-calc). I'm delighted because I don't care about the AP credit or GPA bump, I just want him actually learn math.



The IB math track is much better at preparing students for college level math. It requires extensive application and explanation rather than the AP style of just calculation.

I just checked the catalog for my alma matter. They offer a “calculus readiness” course, but it is not for credit. There is no college algebra offering for credit. Math credit starts with calculus or statistics.
Anonymous
Post 05/19/2020 04:32     Subject: Business Majors, How much Math?
My college had a business major disguised as Management Science, so I took:
College Algebra/PreCalc
Forecasting
Operations Management
Some math in macroeconomics and microeconomics
Accounting I and II
Stats
Management Science I
Marketing Research
Anonymous
Post 05/18/2020 11:55     Subject: Business Majors, How much Math?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I think she should go to the colleges website she is interested in and See what courses are required for business majors.

This is the best answer. OP still hasn’t answered what major she means by business ( Business Administration/management?) of just any major in the business school.

+1. And OP hasn't indicated anything about the selectivity of the schools that might be of interest. Top undergrad business schools typically require calc at some point in time.
Anonymous
Post 05/18/2020 11:44     Subject: Business Majors, How much Math?
Anonymous wrote:I think she should go to the colleges website she is interested in and See what courses are required for business majors.



This is the best answer. OP still hasn’t answered what major she means by business ( Business Administration/management?) of just any major in the business school.
Anonymous
Post 05/18/2020 11:25     Subject: Re:Business Majors, How much Math?
Anonymous wrote:College algebra
Econ 1 (micro)
Econ 2 (Macro)
Acct 1
Acct 2
Business finance
Statistics

That’s all I can remember. Maybe one more?


After this discussion, I looked up the requirements. PP's are correct, College Algebra has been replaced with Pre-Cal (if needed), and Calculus, as the first two courses. Which equates to a math course per semester.

The only one I struggled with was statistics, but some people love that course.
Anonymous
Post 05/18/2020 11:23     Subject: Business Majors, How much Math?
I think she should go to the colleges website she is interested in and See what courses are required for business majors.
Anonymous
Post 05/18/2020 10:54     Subject: Business Majors, How much Math?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:College Algebra isn’t really offered anymore. Many colleges expect students to take either calculus or basic statistics.



In Business schools or in general? I wish that were true. I don’t have the data on hand, but if anything the trend is the opposite. College math readiness has been going downhill for years. Harvard offers precalc (not sure if it’s for credit).


My friend who teaches physics complains that some kids who come into his class having passed BC AP calculus don't understand how to use calc as a tool to solve physics problems. These seem to be kids who were pushed into accelerated math inappropriately. They've created a special remedial course to give these kids a better grounding in basic concepts. It has actually messed up graduation timing for some because they have to take this class before they can take some physics classes. His opinion is that anybody can learn math, many people just need to take it a lot slower than it's usually taught. This has been my son's experience -- he struggled with AP pre-calc, so he took on-level calculus and found it really easy (got 95-100 on tests, as opposed to 70-80 on AP pre-calc). I'm delighted because I don't care about the AP credit or GPA bump, I just want him actually learn math.

Anonymous
Post 05/18/2020 10:45     Subject: Business Majors, How much Math?
In my MBA program, there was a clear distinction between those who had a practical, working knowledge of calculus and those who didn't (including me). There were entire chapters of finance where I was reduced to learning and regurgitating formulas because I had no real idea what the profs were trying to convey through the long tedious lectures that I was sitting through without understanding. I still got As, but it was by virtue of rote memorization.

Later in life, I picked up and worked my way through a conceptual book about calculus (originally written in like 1911 and still in print), and I finally got an approximate understanding of basic calculus, which helped me better understand a lot of things that I've tried to learn since (algorithm design, AI and machine learning).

I'd encourage your daughter, if at all possible, to seek out less rigorous, less formal, more conceptual books on math to get an intuitive understanding to back up the formal math learned in school. I wish I'd done that 25 years earlier than I did.
Anonymous
Post 05/18/2020 10:44     Subject: Business Majors, How much Math?
Anonymous wrote:College Algebra isn’t really offered anymore. Many colleges expect students to take either calculus or basic statistics.



In Business schools or in general? I wish that were true. I don’t have the data on hand, but if anything the trend is the opposite. College math readiness has been going downhill for years. Harvard offers precalc (not sure if it’s for credit).
Anonymous
Post 05/18/2020 09:45     Subject: Business Majors, How much Math?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Thanks. So another question. Should she study real estate as a major? I see some schools have it as a major like Penn, NYU, etc.


Why, land is the only thing that matters. It’s the only thing that lasts.



There’s no getting away from it if your Irish.


Enjoying the GWTW references!
Anonymous
Post 05/18/2020 09:32     Subject: Business Majors, How much Math?
College Algebra isn’t really offered anymore. Many colleges expect students to take either calculus or basic statistics.
Anonymous
Post 05/18/2020 09:20     Subject: Re:Business Majors, How much Math?
If she is aiming for highly-selective business schools, many state explicitly on their website that they look for calc on the high school transcript. This is true for Wharton and on down the ranking list, even for Santa Clara's Leavey school of business. (one ranking: https://poetsandquantsforundergrads.com/2019/12/20/wharton-again-tops-pqs-best-undergraduate-b-schools-of-2020/4/ )

Accordingly, the student should take calc in 12th grade, assuming they are on track to do so. For those not on that track, then take precalc in 12th, to be able to take a semester of calc in college.

As real estate is not a field which requires a specific college degree (or actually any college degree), I'd be inclined to major in something else in college, taking some real estate courses on the side if they are offered. Perhaps a minor. Many colleges don't offer any real estate courses. Majoring in something else would give her much more flexibility down the road, which ought to be a significant consideration.