Anonymous wrote:Is it wrong to baptize a baby if the parents aren't believers? Or is it justified if it will give peace to grandparents and promote family harmony?

Yes, it is wrong. Grow a back bone.

It's hypocritical and if they are butting in to your decisions now just wait.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So, you went into a religious ritual that was important to your spouse intending to stop the ritual and walk out when they got to the most sacred part? You would have done that? And they just happened to not follow the standard liturgy, so your spouse got lucky?

I can not imagine doing that to someone I wanted to have a respectful relationship with.

No, I intended to walk out of the pre-baptismal event after answering honestly. That didn't happen. The priest came in - he'd been at a wedding ceremony earlier and was in a good mood - and told us what was going to happen.

All I remember is him asking the godparents the name at the altar, saying I baptise thee, and moving on to the next family. If I had been asked the question during the ceremony - which I wasn't - I would have said "no".

What is your problem? Why would I lie about this? And why do you care?

Because you're making a mockery of something that's sacred to me?

If it wasn't important to either parent, why did you do it?

Do you really need that question answered? Other family and keeping the peace with them, particularly FIL.

I didn't make a mockery of anything, either. I kept my mouth shut.

I think it's more important what the godparents believe. They are the ones being asked to promise something.

Anonymous wrote:Is it wrong to baptize a baby if the parents aren't believers? Or is it justified if it will give peace to grandparents and promote family harmony?

In wife's family. Niece's husband is not a believer, she is not particularly religious. Yet each of their three kids were baptized to keep peace with the grandparents.

Anonymous wrote:Don't do it. Just put it off and then if asked point blank tell people the truth.

My aunt almost pleaded with me to get my son baptized. "Even if it's not true, the alternative that it is true and you didn't get him baptized is too great."

I responded that a religion and parishioners who believe my innocent, sinless, infant would go to hell if he dies unbaptized is not a religion I would chose to follow. My son is free to chose religion/baptism for himself when he is old enough to make that decision. She dropped it.

+10000000

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So, you went into a religious ritual that was important to your spouse intending to stop the ritual and walk out when they got to the most sacred part? You would have done that? And they just happened to not follow the standard liturgy, so your spouse got lucky?

I can not imagine doing that to someone I wanted to have a respectful relationship with.

No, I intended to walk out of the pre-baptismal event after answering honestly. That didn't happen. The priest came in - he'd been at a wedding ceremony earlier and was in a good mood - and told us what was going to happen.

All I remember is him asking the godparents the name at the altar, saying I baptise thee, and moving on to the next family. If I had been asked the question during the ceremony - which I wasn't - I would have said "no".

What is your problem? Why would I lie about this? And why do you care?

Because you're making a mockery of something that's sacred to me?

If it wasn't important to either parent, why did you do it?

Anonymous wrote:So, you went into a religious ritual that was important to your spouse intending to stop the ritual and walk out when they got to the most sacred part? You would have done that? And they just happened to not follow the standard liturgy, so your spouse got lucky?

I can not imagine doing that to someone I wanted to have a respectful relationship with.

Oh and for the record it was NOT important to my spouse, either.

Anonymous wrote:So, you went into a religious ritual that was important to your spouse intending to stop the ritual and walk out when they got to the most sacred part? You would have done that? And they just happened to not follow the standard liturgy, so your spouse got lucky?

I can not imagine doing that to someone I wanted to have a respectful relationship with.

No, I intended to walk out of the pre-baptismal event after answering honestly. That didn't happen. The priest came in - he'd been at a wedding ceremony earlier and was in a good mood - and told us what was going to happen.

All I remember is him asking the godparents the name at the altar, saying I baptise thee, and moving on to the next family. If I had been asked the question during the ceremony - which I wasn't - I would have said "no".

What is your problem? Why would I lie about this? And why do you care?

So, you went into a religious ritual that was important to your spouse intending to stop the ritual and walk out when they got to the most sacred part? You would have done that? And they just happened to not follow the standard liturgy, so your spouse got lucky?

I can not imagine doing that to someone I wanted to have a respectful relationship with.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you're baptizing in a Catholic church, you will actively have to lie throughout the ceremony. Awkward....

This is not true at every catholic church. I was not asked that question, ever, at the ceremony or before.

I don't believe you.

This is the standard Baptism Rite:

http://www.catholicliturgy.com/index.cfm/fuseaction/Textcontents/index/4/subindex/67/textindex/7

The celebrant speaks to the parents in these or similar words:

You have asked to have your child baptized. In doing so you are accepting the responsibility of training him (her) in the practice of the faith. It will be your duty to bring him (her) up to keep God's commandments as Christ taught us, by loving God and our neighbor. Do you clearly understand what you are undertaking?

Parents: We do.

...Renunciation of Sin and Profession of Faith

The celebrant speaks to the parents and godparents in these words:

Dear parents and godparents: You have come here to present this child for baptism. By water and the Holy Spirit he (she) is to receive the gift of new life from God, who is love.

On your part, you must make it your constant care to bring him (her) up in the practice of the faith. See that the divine life which God gives him (her) is kept safe from the poison of sin, to grow always stronger in his (her) heart.

If your faith makes you ready to accept this responsibility, renew now the vows of your own baptism. Reject sin; profess your faith in Christ Jesus. This is the faith of the Church. This is the faith in which this child is about to be baptized.

The celebrant questions the parents and godparents:

A. Celebrant: Do you reject Satan?

Parents and Godparents: I do.

Celebrant: And all his works?

Parents and Godparents: I do.

B. Celebrant: Do you reject sin, so as to live in the freedom of God's children?

Parents and Godparents: I do.

Celebrant: Do you reject the glamor of evil, and refuse to be mastered by sin?

Parents and Godparents: I do.

Celebranto you reject Satan, father of sin and prince of darkness?

Parents and Godparents: I do.

According to circumstances, this second form may be expressed with greater precision by the conferences of bishops, especially in places where it is necessary for the parents and godparents to reject superstitious and magical practices used with children.

Next the celebrant asks for the threefold profession of faith from the parents and godparents:

Celebrant: Do you believe in God, the Father almighty, creator of heaven and earth?

Parents and Godparents: I do.

Celebrant: Do you believe in Jesus Christ, his only Son, our Lord, who was born of the Virgin Mary, was crucified, died, and was buried, rose from the dead, and is now seated at the right hand of the Father?

Parents and Godparents: I do.

Celebrant: Do you believe in the Holy Spirit, the holy catholic Church, the communion of saints, the forgiveness of sins, the resurrection of the body, and life everlasting?

Parents and Godparents: I do.

The celebrant and the congregation give their assent to this profession of faith:

Celebrant: This is our faith. This is the faith of the Church. We are proud to profess it, in Christ Jesus our Lord.

All: Amen.

If desired, some other formula may be used instead, or a suitable song by which the community expresses its faith with a single voice.

I couldn’t care less what you believe. I am telling you this did not occur and I had 2 kids baptized two years apart. About 20 years ago.

I was hyper-sensitive to this because I did not want to do this so I said “I’ll do it until they ask me if I believe or if I promise to raise them in the faith”. I thought that would be my out. I got tricked because it did not happen. I have no reason to lie about this! This is a well-regarded Catholic Church at a mid sized town in the northeast. There were multiple baptisms that day each time and it included a pre-baptism session at someone’s house (we did not go to the pre-session for my second child).

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you're baptizing in a Catholic church, you will actively have to lie throughout the ceremony. Awkward....

This is not true at every catholic church. I was not asked that question, ever, at the ceremony or before.

In the Liturgy, they specifically ask the parents and godparents

"Do you believe in God, the father almighty, creator of heaven and earth"

and

"Do you believe in Jesus Christ . . . "

and

"Do you believe in the Holy Spirit . . . "

and each time the parents and godparents say "I do".

Did they really not include that in your child's baptism? That's an enormous thing to leave out.

http://www.ibreviary.com/m/preghiere.php?tipo=Rito&id=103#renunprof

Anonymous wrote:We struggled with this for years. I was raised Catholic but I’m a closet atheist now. Still, I just sort of liked the idea of baptizing my kids. I’m not even sure why. I knew it would make my family happy, and I wanted them to go to a catholic school.

In the end we didn’t baptize them because I felt like it would be kind of disrespectful somehow, especially since many in my family know that DH and I don’t believe in God.

I still kind of wish we had done it. There’s something sweet about a baptism and it’s part of our culture.

As a Catholic (with 13 years of catholic school) turned agnostic, I do not see how you still want your kids to go to a Catholic school. Other than religion, it was a good education, but religion is engrained in nearly every aspect of catholic education. There are parts of the church that I vehemently oppose, and I won't expose my kids to those beliefs and Catholic guilt.

My parents were agnostic but I was baptised in the Lutheran church. I had a close relationship with my godmother, and was very devout as a kid. My parents encouraged this.

When I left the church, it was over Martin Luther's anti-Semitism more than anything else. My godmother was disappointed that I left the church, but understood my reasoning.

My parents wanted us to know about religion and later make an informed decision.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We had both kids baptized because it was important to grandparents. Not sure what would be wrong with it if everyone’s on board.

The point of baptism is swearing that you will raise the child in faith.

So?
What does the parents beliefs have to do with that? It is not like you are raising your child to be Muslim or Hindu or Buddhist
You celebrate Easter and Christmas, get married in church, have burial services there

Non believers are going to church on Christmas and Easter? Get married in church? No. Stand up to your parents.

What? We never go to church. The grandparents vowed to serve as a spiritual example. They go to church, and on the rare occasions that they go to church while we are visiting, the kids are welcome to tag along. There was no vow that the parents would take them to church, ever, or that the kids would get married in church.

There’s nothing to “stand up to my parents” about.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you're baptizing in a Catholic church, you will actively have to lie throughout the ceremony. Awkward....

This is not true at every catholic church. I was not asked that question, ever, at the ceremony or before.

I don't believe you.

This is the standard Baptism Rite:

http://www.catholicliturgy.com/index.cfm/fuseaction/Textcontents/index/4/subindex/67/textindex/7

The celebrant speaks to the parents in these or similar words:

You have asked to have your child baptized. In doing so you are accepting the responsibility of training him (her) in the practice of the faith. It will be your duty to bring him (her) up to keep God's commandments as Christ taught us, by loving God and our neighbor. Do you clearly understand what you are undertaking?

Parents: We do.

...Renunciation of Sin and Profession of Faith

The celebrant speaks to the parents and godparents in these words:

Dear parents and godparents: You have come here to present this child for baptism. By water and the Holy Spirit he (she) is to receive the gift of new life from God, who is love.

On your part, you must make it your constant care to bring him (her) up in the practice of the faith. See that the divine life which God gives him (her) is kept safe from the poison of sin, to grow always stronger in his (her) heart.

If your faith makes you ready to accept this responsibility, renew now the vows of your own baptism. Reject sin; profess your faith in Christ Jesus. This is the faith of the Church. This is the faith in which this child is about to be baptized.

The celebrant questions the parents and godparents:

A. Celebrant: Do you reject Satan?

Parents and Godparents: I do.

Celebrant: And all his works?

Parents and Godparents: I do.

B. Celebrant: Do you reject sin, so as to live in the freedom of God's children?

Parents and Godparents: I do.

Celebrant: Do you reject the glamor of evil, and refuse to be mastered by sin?

Parents and Godparents: I do.

Celebranto you reject Satan, father of sin and prince of darkness?

Parents and Godparents: I do.

According to circumstances, this second form may be expressed with greater precision by the conferences of bishops, especially in places where it is necessary for the parents and godparents to reject superstitious and magical practices used with children.

Next the celebrant asks for the threefold profession of faith from the parents and godparents:

Celebrant: Do you believe in God, the Father almighty, creator of heaven and earth?

Parents and Godparents: I do.

Celebrant: Do you believe in Jesus Christ, his only Son, our Lord, who was born of the Virgin Mary, was crucified, died, and was buried, rose from the dead, and is now seated at the right hand of the Father?

Parents and Godparents: I do.

Celebrant: Do you believe in the Holy Spirit, the holy catholic Church, the communion of saints, the forgiveness of sins, the resurrection of the body, and life everlasting?

Parents and Godparents: I do.

The celebrant and the congregation give their assent to this profession of faith:

Celebrant: This is our faith. This is the faith of the Church. We are proud to profess it, in Christ Jesus our Lord.

All: Amen.

If desired, some other formula may be used instead, or a suitable song by which the community expresses its faith with a single voice.