Anonymous
Anonymous
12/08/2019 19:05
Subject: MCPS Leadership: Mississippi, yes Mississippi is better than you
Anonymous wrote:No one is saying move to Mississippi! That's the wrong message from the article (although no offense to Mississippi as I've never been there). And if you read the article, it sounds like Mississippi is making an investment in both its kids and its teachers that nobody should scoff at. The point is that schools and teachers can improve how they teach and how well kids learn by paying attention to evidence-based educational methods, just as doctors can improve outcomes by following evidence-based medicine.
Agreed.
If there is a proven way to improve kids’ performance, it’s worth exploring. Especially considering some of the really low performing schools in MCPS.
Anonymous
12/08/2019 19:00
Subject: MCPS Leadership: Mississippi, yes Mississippi is better than you
No one is saying move to Mississippi! That's the wrong message from the article (although no offense to Mississippi as I've never been there). And if you read the article, it sounds like Mississippi is making an investment in both its kids and its teachers that nobody should scoff at. The point is that schools and teachers can improve how they teach and how well kids learn by paying attention to evidence-based educational methods, just as doctors can improve outcomes by following evidence-based medicine.
Anonymous
12/08/2019 18:26
Subject: MCPS Leadership: Mississippi, yes Mississippi is better than you
OMG what a joke. My preschooler was sounding out words at age 3 using flash cards. Thank God we did that because he excelled because of it. I do not give MCPS any credit for my son's educational success. In fact, I would go as far to say that the only reason the W schools have such high test scores has nothing to do with the quality of the teachers or schools. It is the parent intervention.
+1000
+1000
Anonymous
12/08/2019 13:33
Subject: MCPS Leadership: Mississippi, yes Mississippi is better than you
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:OK I knew something was up with this. MS will not promote you beyond 3rd grade, if you don't meet a minimum standard: https://hechingerreport.org/mississippi-made-the-biggest-leap-in-national-test-scores-this-year-is-this-controversial-law-the-reason-why/
That would never work in MCPS.
Why not?
Why do we keep letting kids go on to the next grade when it is clear that they have not mastered grade level work??
There is a large and strong research base demonstrating consistent negative effects on kids who are retained.
I was held back and repeated K. So was my brother. This was a big advantage to us throughout school.
Anonymous
12/07/2019 19:06
Subject: MCPS Leadership: Mississippi, yes Mississippi is better than you
Anonymous wrote:
OMG what a joke. My preschooler was sounding out words at age 3 using flash cards. Thank God we did that because he excelled because of it. I do not give MCPS any credit for my son's educational success. In fact, I would go as far to say that the only reason the W schools have such high test scores has nothing to do with the quality of the teachers or schools. It is the parent intervention.
A grateful county thanks you.
Anonymous
12/07/2019 19:04
Subject: MCPS Leadership: Mississippi, yes Mississippi is better than you
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:OP here. No there is little or no direct instruction in MCPS -- and certainly not phonics based instruction. This is why nearly half of our kids are underperforming in reading in MCPS. Not to mention the kids who have dyslexia are suffering in our schools: phonics is essential for them but good for all. The Friedman's lawsuit plus Decoding Dyslexia's great work at the state level to force change in the county will hopefully change this in the next thirty years. (yeah, it will probably be that slow)
https://wamu.org/story/19/05/20/many-school-districts-hesitate-to-say-students-have-dyslexia-that-can-lead-to-problems/
https://www.decodingdyslexiamd.org/
There absolutely is phonics based reading instruction in MCPS elementary schools.
-MCPS reading specialist
There are different types of phonics instruction:
https://www.readingrockets.org/article/phonics-instruction
https://lincs.ed.gov/publications/html/prfteachers/reading_first1phonics.html
I was on the reading curriculum committee before 2.0. If asked at that time, MCPS claimed that they taught phonics. But they did it backwards. They were having the kids read books that they couldn't sound out. When a word gave them trouble, the kids were given a list of strategies to solve the word. These strategies included things like look at the picture and guess, guess a word that starts with the first letter of the word, if the book rhymes, etc. There were several strategies listed (maybe 5?), but the last strategy on the list that students were supposed to resort to when the others had failed was to actually sound out the word.
The MCPS version of phonics at that time, might have been categorized (according to the descriptions in the above links) as embedded phonics. The teacher and students would go over a text together, focusing on a letter. (Hypothetical example: they might read a passage about frogs, circling all the Fs in the story and talking about the sound the F makes.) While they did teach phonics elements - they emphasized sight words. In the given hypothetical example, students weren't being told to sound out frog - the might not have been taught what sounds Rs, Os, and Gs made. Instead, they learned that the letters F-R-O-G together made the word frog.
I haven't heard details, yet, about how the new curriculum teaches phonics. I hope they explicitly teach synethetic phonics and use decodable readers. I think that would more accurately reflect what most parents expect from a phonics program.
OMG what a joke. My preschooler was sounding out words at age 3 using flash cards. Thank God we did that because he excelled because of it. I do not give MCPS any credit for my son's educational success. In fact, I would go as far to say that the only reason the W schools have such high test scores has nothing to do with the quality of the teachers or schools. It is the parent intervention.
Anonymous
12/07/2019 18:58
Subject: Re:MCPS Leadership: Mississippi, yes Mississippi is better than you
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I’m from Mississippi. And I don’t really have any desire to move back despite my entire family still living there. But most people have a really skewed view of the state. There are some truly horrible schools, especially in the Delta. But there are also some fantastic schools. Madison, for example, has outstanding schools. The same is true in Oxford and on the coast.
Racism is a problem in some areas, but certainly not state wide. My kids’ schools were much less segregated than anything up here. Race relations have improved dramatically in many parts of the state.
My youngest child (now 18) is openly gay. He experienced no bullying at all when he came out at his Mississippi high school. I cannot say the same for his Fairfax County school.
It’s easy to make stereotypical judgements about Mississippi. But like Maryland and Virginia, there are huge differences throughout the state.
I also have family in Mississippi and agree with all this. My cousins who attended Madison and Hattiesburg area schools went to elite colleges (as did many of their friends). There are racists, but there are a lot of people who are just plain nice, at least to your face.
Where DH grew up, there was a renowned local politician who was as nice as he could be to faces of the AA community, but made his careeer defunding the schools and other public services on the side of town where AAs lived. When he died, many of the older generation turned out for his funeral and spoke about him in glowing terms because he used courtesy terms like Mister and Missus and gave his workers a ham at Christmas. But he set back their kids’ and grandkids’ education.
Anonymous
12/07/2019 18:52
Subject: Re:MCPS Leadership: Mississippi, yes Mississippi is better than you
Anonymous wrote:I’m from Mississippi. And I don’t really have any desire to move back despite my entire family still living there. But most people have a really skewed view of the state. There are some truly horrible schools, especially in the Delta. But there are also some fantastic schools. Madison, for example, has outstanding schools. The same is true in Oxford and on the coast.
Racism is a problem in some areas, but certainly not state wide. My kids’ schools were much less segregated than anything up here. Race relations have improved dramatically in many parts of the state.
My youngest child (now 18) is openly gay. He experienced no bullying at all when he came out at his Mississippi high school. I cannot say the same for his Fairfax County school.
It’s easy to make stereotypical judgements about Mississippi. But like Maryland and Virginia, there are huge differences throughout the state.
I also have family in Mississippi and agree with all this. My cousins who attended Madison and Hattiesburg area schools went to elite colleges (as did many of their friends). There are racists, but there are a lot of people who are just plain nice, at least to your face.
Anonymous
12/07/2019 18:44
Subject: MCPS Leadership: Mississippi, yes Mississippi is better than you
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:OK I knew something was up with this. MS will not promote you beyond 3rd grade, if you don't meet a minimum standard: https://hechingerreport.org/mississippi-made-the-biggest-leap-in-national-test-scores-this-year-is-this-controversial-law-the-reason-why/
That would never work in MCPS.
Why not?
Why do we keep letting kids go on to the next grade when it is clear that they have not mastered grade level work??
There is a large and strong research base demonstrating consistent negative effects on kids who are retained.
Well, I know one 1%er who built a fortune 500 business but was retained (failed) and had to repeat one grade.
I know of a very, very, very, very, very, very rich man who didn't finish college. That doesn't invalidate the large and strong research base demonstrating consistent positive effects on income for people who finish college.
Anonymous
12/07/2019 17:29
Subject: MCPS Leadership: Mississippi, yes Mississippi is better than you
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:OP here. No there is little or no direct instruction in MCPS -- and certainly not phonics based instruction. This is why nearly half of our kids are underperforming in reading in MCPS. Not to mention the kids who have dyslexia are suffering in our schools: phonics is essential for them but good for all. The Friedman's lawsuit plus Decoding Dyslexia's great work at the state level to force change in the county will hopefully change this in the next thirty years. (yeah, it will probably be that slow)
https://wamu.org/story/19/05/20/many-school-districts-hesitate-to-say-students-have-dyslexia-that-can-lead-to-problems/
https://www.decodingdyslexiamd.org/
There absolutely is phonics based reading instruction in MCPS elementary schools.
-MCPS reading specialist
There are different types of phonics instruction:
https://www.readingrockets.org/article/phonics-instruction
https://lincs.ed.gov/publications/html/prfteachers/reading_first1phonics.html
I was on the reading curriculum committee before 2.0. If asked at that time, MCPS claimed that they taught phonics. But they did it backwards. They were having the kids read books that they couldn't sound out. When a word gave them trouble, the kids were given a list of strategies to solve the word. These strategies included things like look at the picture and guess, guess a word that starts with the first letter of the word, if the book rhymes, etc. There were several strategies listed (maybe 5?), but the last strategy on the list that students were supposed to resort to when the others had failed was to actually sound out the word.
The MCPS version of phonics at that time, might have been categorized (according to the descriptions in the above links) as embedded phonics. The teacher and students would go over a text together, focusing on a letter. (Hypothetical example: they might read a passage about frogs, circling all the Fs in the story and talking about the sound the F makes.) While they did teach phonics elements - they emphasized sight words. In the given hypothetical example, students weren't being told to sound out frog - the might not have been taught what sounds Rs, Os, and Gs made. Instead, they learned that the letters F-R-O-G together made the word frog.
I haven't heard details, yet, about how the new curriculum teaches phonics. I hope they explicitly teach synethetic phonics and use decodable readers. I think that would more accurately reflect what most parents expect from a phonics program.
Anonymous
12/07/2019 16:44
Subject: Re:MCPS Leadership: Mississippi, yes Mississippi is better than you
I’m from Mississippi. And I don’t really have any desire to move back despite my entire family still living there. But most people have a really skewed view of the state. There are some truly horrible schools, especially in the Delta. But there are also some fantastic schools. Madison, for example, has outstanding schools. The same is true in Oxford and on the coast.
Racism is a problem in some areas, but certainly not state wide. My kids’ schools were much less segregated than anything up here. Race relations have improved dramatically in many parts of the state.
My youngest child (now 18) is openly gay. He experienced no bullying at all when he came out at his Mississippi high school. I cannot say the same for his Fairfax County school.
It’s easy to make stereotypical judgements about Mississippi. But like Maryland and Virginia, there are huge differences throughout the state.
Racism is a problem in some areas, but certainly not state wide. My kids’ schools were much less segregated than anything up here. Race relations have improved dramatically in many parts of the state.
My youngest child (now 18) is openly gay. He experienced no bullying at all when he came out at his Mississippi high school. I cannot say the same for his Fairfax County school.
It’s easy to make stereotypical judgements about Mississippi. But like Maryland and Virginia, there are huge differences throughout the state.
Anonymous
12/07/2019 16:39
Subject: MCPS Leadership: Mississippi, yes Mississippi is better than you
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I don't care what the report says. As a non white person and immigrant, I would NEVER EVER live in Mississippi. Hell to the no.
And my kids are doing great in MCPS.
Why? Because everyone in Mississippi is racist?
I’m not White either, but you’re ridiculous.
DP. Everyone isnNt racist there, but too many of the people in power are and they are the ones shaping educational policy. We have family ties to public schools in Mississippi, Alabama and Louisiana going back decades to the 1960s. Not much has changed, tragically.
Anonymous
12/07/2019 16:35
Subject: MCPS Leadership: Mississippi, yes Mississippi is better than you
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:OK I knew something was up with this. MS will not promote you beyond 3rd grade, if you don't meet a minimum standard: https://hechingerreport.org/mississippi-made-the-biggest-leap-in-national-test-scores-this-year-is-this-controversial-law-the-reason-why/
That would never work in MCPS.
Why not?
Why do we keep letting kids go on to the next grade when it is clear that they have not mastered grade level work??
There is a large and strong research base demonstrating consistent negative effects on kids who are retained.
Well, I know one 1%er who built a fortune 500 business but was retained (failed) and had to repeat one grade.
Anonymous
12/07/2019 16:32
Subject: MCPS Leadership: Mississippi, yes Mississippi is better than you
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I don't care what the report says. As a non white person and immigrant, I would NEVER EVER live in Mississippi. Hell to the no.
And my kids are doing great in MCPS.
Why? Because everyone in Mississippi is racist?
I’m not White either, but you’re ridiculous.
Nope, but they have a lot of them; and they are the least healthiest, educated state in the nation. No thank you. I want my kids to be around a lot of educated people, and a state that values healthy living.