She is pregnant and smoking? WTF that right there should have been a red flag.

Anonymous wrote:Yes, do something. Offer this woman some help. Big ways, small ways, w/ev—she’s your neighbor. Find something that isn’t motivated by judgment or undignified for her to accept and offer it.

DP, and not OP here: I am interested to see the big gulf between approaches on this thread so far. One approach: Be tough on the kids and firmly shoo them away every time. The other: Offer the mom help and have some compassion. I was the earlier poster noting that the kid-in-car thing would be the final straw and the OP could be held liable if something happens to a kid on her property.

I do get the idea that this family may need help but am asking sincerely and without snarkiness:

What could OP offer, and how, that this mother would accept? People are saying for her to try to help but what does that look like in reality?

OP works full-time. She isn't around during the days or late afternoons to offer....what exactly? To babysit the kids?

On weekends, when the kids are suddenly on her patio starting to drag the chairs around, should she pop out and say, "Hi, let's all play"?

Or if she catches the kids dragging her stuff around, does she go to the mom and say nicely, "Hey, let's occupy the kids another way. I'm going to throw some food on the grill in a few minutes. Want to bring them over to eat?" Again -- I am not being snarky in asking this, I am genuinely wondering if this is what PPs mean when they say to befriend or engage this family. What are you PPs specifically suggesting the OP do or say to "offer help" if OP works full time and presumably has her own activiites outside her working hours?

The wise OP who wrote about how social services hotlines are really not going to help in this case also mentioned not ostracizing this mom and her kids. But unless OP has kids of her own to offer playtime with the neighbor kids -- what can OP really do, other than the occasional "come over while I grill" kinds of things?

Anonymous wrote:Honestly, I don't think you should do anything. She's legally allowed to smoke.

She doesn't keep her kids in her yard. I don't always do that either. If you don't want them in your yard and your car, get a fence or let them know you're not okay with them being in your yard. The 18 month old can understand that.

Yelling is not illegal either. Different parents have different loudness meters.

Maybe she doesn't care if the neighbors hear her yell because where she comes from that means good parenting.

You're going to have to learn to live with this or move.

Are you a parent? I'm not clear from this post. If you're not, your ability to reasonably evaluate her responses is probably not great.

You probably want to get a fence. Good fences make good neighbors as they say.

Err no it isn't illegal and I don't think that was the point. A grown adult going under someone else's window to yell is poor manners, at best, and probably something OP would like to stop.

Anonymous wrote:You need to speak VERY FIRMLY to the children. DO NOT etc etc. No nice nice. These children will respond to firm statements

+1000
This response plus the ones about getting whatever fencing is possible are the correct answers. Mom doesn't care and doesn't want to be your friend and bring everyone over to bake cookies and sing kumbayah, promise. Btdt with this exact neighbor. Your immediate concern is liability and securing your property from their trespassing, mom coming over to scream in your yard, etc.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You could also call child services. I know we think of them as removing kids from homes, but they also provide services. The family may need some parenting classes or other support and child services can connect them.

unfortunately there really aren’t funds in most places for these types of intact family services. I wish there were and so does every soul that works at child services, but the reality is funding is tight and most of those services go to families working on reunification. It’s also going to make mom feel really unsafe in her own neighborhood which not be good for the kids since we don’t know what’s going on inside. It’s true that sometimes a worker could provide some referrals to services for the family which wouldn’t be a bad thing, but there’s a lot of risk too. I also highly doubt any hotline would take a call like this. Mom is always outside supervising, she’s just not doing a great job at it. It doesn’t rise to the level of a neglect definition.

If posters are really worried about the kids well being, the 100% best thing would be a neighborhood that engages these kids and mom to support her and be a safe haven and try not to ostracize her. Think about it from the perspective of the kids - if you had an overwhelmed mom, lots of yelling, what would make a difference in your life when you looked back? Things like the kind neighbor who always seeemed to be looking out, didn’t judge our mom (who is likely doing the best she is capable of right now for reasons we don’t know) and even tried to help her can make a big difference in how they see the world.

What a thoughtful response.

These are quite young kids. It's possible the mom is really stressed and having a hard time coping (hence not chasing after them and feeling she really needs to sit there and smoke for a break).

I think the most constructive thing would be to try to engage with her and with the kids in a friendly way. Be clear with the kids on what they are not allowed to do, but then ask the mom if you can engage with them in a productive way - "Hi there! Seems like the kids have a lot of energy. Would it be okay if I got out some sidewalk chalk and we drew some pictures on my driveway?" or "I have a fun toy a friend left here. Would it be okay if I brought it out to show them? They're welcome to play with it in my front yard."

As other PPs have said, offer to help the mom. Ask if you can pick up some diapers or anything else small she needs if you're on your way out to the grocery store anyway, etc. Two kids this young and pregnant with another is exhausting.

The only way you're going to have a hope of improving the situation is if you get to know them and provide some support for the kids and mom.

Yes, do something. Offer this woman some help. Big ways, small ways, w/ev—she’s your neighbor. Find something that isn’t motivated by judgment or undignified for her to accept and offer it.

Wait, is she pregnant and smoking?

Honestly, I don't think you should do anything. She's legally allowed to smoke.

She doesn't keep her kids in her yard. I don't always do that either. If you don't want them in your yard and your car, get a fence or let them know you're not okay with them being in your yard. The 18 month old can understand that.

Yelling is not illegal either. Different parents have different loudness meters.

Maybe she doesn't care if the neighbors hear her yell because where she comes from that means good parenting.

You're going to have to learn to live with this or move.

Are you a parent? I'm not clear from this post. If you're not, your ability to reasonably evaluate her responses is probably not great.

You probably want to get a fence. Good fences make good neighbors as they say.

Anonymous wrote:Where do you live on a cul de sac that you don’t have a garage?

I can't stand posts like this. What is your point? Do you really want to know because you're interested in real estate? Are you trying to imply OP is lying?

FWIW - I am not the OP and I live in a SFH on a cul-dec-sac in Alexandria, zip code 22310. I have NO garage.

Happy?

Anonymous wrote:Op here.

It isn't really about the chairs. Of course I can tell them to leave the chairs alone. This happens 3-5 times a day on weekends.

Two hours before the chairs, her kids had run across my lawn and when she chased after them they kept going and she was right outside my front window hollering at them. She eventually had to go get them as they just kept running.

Last week they were playing in my recycle bins that I had put out beside the house to take to the burb. One day I was unloading a carload from Costco, I had left my car door open as I was carrying heavy things in and came out to find one of the kids in my car.

It is just going to be a summer of yelling, hollering and the kids getting into mischief. They are very young kids so other than trying to scare them away from my house, I think they are going to be around.

There is a dad. He doesn't smoke and he works long hours so I don't see him much. I work too so I only really have to deal with this on weekends and the occasional evening.

I have no idea if there is any abuse beyond the yelling and cursing. The kids run away laughing from her and don't seem phased at all by her yelling at them. They pay no attention to her at all when she is hollering at them.

Bless you for caring. It’s so tragic. I’d try to help somehow. Maybe chat with other trusted concerned neighbors. I’m wondering if the mother may have additional addictions, beyond the cigarettes...

Anonymous wrote:You could also call child services. I know we think of them as removing kids from homes, but they also provide services. The family may need some parenting classes or other support and child services can connect them.

unfortunately there really aren’t funds in most places for these types of intact family services. I wish there were and so does every soul that works at child services, but the reality is funding is tight and most of those services go to families working on reunification. It’s also going to make mom feel really unsafe in her own neighborhood which not be good for the kids since we don’t know what’s going on inside. It’s true that sometimes a worker could provide some referrals to services for the family which wouldn’t be a bad thing, but there’s a lot of risk too. I also highly doubt any hotline would take a call like this. Mom is always outside supervising, she’s just not doing a great job at it. It doesn’t rise to the level of a neglect definition.

If posters are really worried about the kids well being, the 100% best thing would be a neighborhood that engages these kids and mom to support her and be a safe haven and try not to ostracize her. Think about it from the perspective of the kids - if you had an overwhelmed mom, lots of yelling, what would make a difference in your life when you looked back? Things like the kind neighbor who always seeemed to be looking out, didn’t judge our mom (who is likely doing the best she is capable of right now for reasons we don’t know) and even tried to help her can make a big difference in how they see the world.

Anonymous wrote:You need to speak VERY FIRMLY to the children. DO NOT etc etc. No nice nice. These children will respond to firm statements

People keep saying for her to tell the kids, the youngest she said could be as young as 18 months. It’s just not developmentally appropriate to put this all on the kids and likely won’t work. This is a really unfortunate situation. It sounds like the mom might be overwhelmed (and also likely doesn’t have the skills to manage the behavior, for whatever reason and I’m sure there is one), could you try to get to know the mom a little? I know she’s very frustrating, but most of the time in these situations it’s not just a terrible person trying to be terrible but someone over their capacity or without the skills they need. Maybe you’d be able to troubleshoot with her somewhere with a fence the kids could go run around if you approach her with empathy telling her you know how tough it is with two little ones on your own, maybe asking a little about their life.

Before others say it, op I know this isn’t your responsibility, but it’s also what is most likely to work. Being angry, yelling at the kids, etc is unlikely to lead to the result you want (not that you were proposing this at all but a lot of posters are). Not to be all kumbayah because I doubt this situation will ever be like that but a little genuine empathy, interest in others and collaboration is probably most likely to get you at least closer to the results you want.

Their mom seems at the end of the rope. Any chance you could help them engaging a bit with the kids in a constructive way?(I don’t know, teaching them a game, inviting them to listen to a story or have a snack etc).

You could also call child services. I know we think of them as removing kids from homes, but they also provide services. The family may need some parenting classes or other support and child services can connect them.