My mother retired at 55 and died at 65. She had 10 years to do what she liked before dying unexpectedly, but imagine if she had retired at 65? Tomorrow is not promised to any of us, I save and I live.

Anonymous wrote:Not me personally, but a tale of two great aunts. Neither ever married. The older one died at 95 after working close to 60 years. She was notoriously frugal to the point of martyrdom. After a series of strokes in her early 90s, she went into an excellent private nursing home that she paid forentirely out of pocket. Within two years, she was dead. Her sister (13 mos younger) worked until 60 but always wore gorgeous clothes, threw great parties, and spent the last 30 years of her life traveling. She ended up in a publicly funded nursing home. It was just okay, but she died about two years later as well.

This is the life I am aiming for. Just OK for two years after a life of fun, laughter and joy sounds right to me

I’m 54- divorced-I Max out my 401-k and contribute 15k to a 529 plan. I’ve done this for over 15 years (when salary increases). I realized at 50 years old that the market gives and takes away, so I use any excess wages to take amazing vacations with my child and enjoy life. I also designate 5 charities to work with and donate to those that are well run. Money is not for us, but to help others.

Here's a story:
My dad lived frugally his whole life. Saved like crazy. But he also went on vacations to Europe when he wanted. Ate out when he wanted. Kept the same modest house and paid off the mortgage early.

He died suddenly at 73. He never retired and got to spend the money.

I don't know for sure, but I think he would still have been happy that he lived how he did. He didn't have to be anxious about the future. He has now provided for my mother for what will hopefully be a long life. His grandchildren will go to college because of his savings.

I hope I live longer but he is a model for me in many ways. I don't want to work to 73, but he did. In a job he loved. Careful spending and saving is key. Not knee-jerk in either direction.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I like having enough money that i do not need to worry about being able to afford important things. I would YOLO if I lived in Scandinavia or some other civilized country. U feel that USA is pretty brutal to its poorer citizens so I save enough to be able to live relatively worry free here. Money removes a lot of stress and unless one is born rich being frugal is the most straightforward way of generating some safety buffer.

Do you know that Scandinavians have some of the highest personal debt amounts in the entire world? They are debt slaves. They also have way less freedom to retire early or do anything remotely different from their peers. You do what the system tells you to do. The way the tax system works you have to take it as large of a mortgage as you can possibly obtain. It’s hardly a perfect place since almost all women have to work to pay for their huge mortgage. They have a much lower disposable income amount as well. The fact you think there is less stress about money in a Scandinavian country is laughable.

The government forces people to take a mortgage and to do so in an amount they can barely afford? That doesn’t make any sense.

I think PP is confused. You are not required to buy or take a loan in a certain amount. Sweden has income requirements for loans like we do here. Real estate is expensive there, that’s all. Also, I believe women work there because the country makes it easy to do so—women want to work. The maternity leave and paternity leave policies make having a balanced life easier. Yes, taxes are brutal, but you won’t lose your home because you get cancer. I have a German friend whose parents can use their money for what they want because their retirement is taken care of. Can you even imagine? I know they are taxed at a higher rate, but the rate of elderly poverty in this country precisely because retirement is so impossible to save for is disturbing.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I like having enough money that i do not need to worry about being able to afford important things. I would YOLO if I lived in Scandinavia or some other civilized country. U feel that USA is pretty brutal to its poorer citizens so I save enough to be able to live relatively worry free here. Money removes a lot of stress and unless one is born rich being frugal is the most straightforward way of generating some safety buffer.

Do you know that Scandinavians have some of the highest personal debt amounts in the entire world? They are debt slaves. They also have way less freedom to retire early or do anything remotely different from their peers. You do what the system tells you to do. The way the tax system works you have to take it as large of a mortgage as you can possibly obtain. It’s hardly a perfect place since almost all women have to work to pay for their huge mortgage. They have a much lower disposable income amount as well. The fact you think there is less stress about money in a Scandinavian country is laughable.

The government forces people to take a mortgage and to do so in an amount they can barely afford? That doesn’t make any sense.

Anonymous wrote:Why not both?

Travel but frugally.
Spend where it matters and save where it doesn't

Skip the super-stressful 60 hour a week job.
Skip most of the Target runs.

Spend on travel and therapy and housekeeper every few weeks.

Don't spend like there's no tomorrow. But don't save like now doesn't matter at all.

NP: I am a big believer in moderation and appreciate your advice. But I will also say that if you have student loans - as I do - it significantly changes how you think about all this. I'm hoping mine will be paid off at 50. Assuming things go well, that's when hopefully I will save more in earnest.

My husband and I both spent most of our 20s in grad school, earning $25k a year, so in a way I feel like that was YOLO because we had neat opportunities, engaging and independent work, and overall had a great quality of life, but obviously even saving 20% of gross income (which I was very proud of) didn't get us very far.

Now we try to be frugal by basically maintaining our grad student standard of living as our incomes go up, BUT we didn't want to push having a kid until we had a lot more stability, house, etc. In our mid-30$ since many of our friends who did had fertility issues, so we spend much of that additional income and our PTO on childcare.

My point is that YOLO can take a lot of forms other than consumption, like choosing low paying but rewarding work, or having a family when you "can't afford it" by insane upper class DCUM standards. In some ways I'd rather be able to make those big life choices than have more in savings.

Anonymous wrote:I glad the feds now have guaranteed backpay PP. Still hard I know.

My parents were going to travel the world when my Dad retired and my Mom got sick instead. Happens a lot I suspect.

Anyway now we travel a bit more and DH goes on destination fishing trips about every other year.

NP. We keep making plans to travel once law school debt is paid off in 7 more years. Then, I had my second baby and had major complications with my heart. I now have a cardiologist and we suspect it’s permanent with lasting effects. I’m 31 years old.

Anonymous wrote:Public nursing homes are awful. You wait and wait for care. Walk in one and you’ll see how unkempt everyone is. You’ll hear people moaning bc they have to wait for meds until the overworked and understaffed nurses can help you. It’s not an either or. You need to balance it out. Be thrifty but spend some as well on things that you really enjoy.

My grandpa has pressure sores that he did not go into the nursing home with. They’re trying to say it’s a result of his condition. No, it’s terrible care. A law firm I used to work at represents a huge nursing home chain so I already know how this plays out! He worked in factories for 50 years. He had a 2nd grade education so very little pay and had 11 kids so he was neither YOLING or saving much.

Anonymous wrote:I like having enough money that i do not need to worry about being able to afford important things. I would YOLO if I lived in Scandinavia or some other civilized country. U feel that USA is pretty brutal to its poorer citizens so I save enough to be able to live relatively worry free here. Money removes a lot of stress and unless one is born rich being frugal is the most straightforward way of generating some safety buffer.

Do you know that Scandinavians have some of the highest personal debt amounts in the entire world? They are debt slaves. They also have way less freedom to retire early or do anything remotely different from their peers. You do what the system tells you to do. The way the tax system works you have to take it as large of a mortgage as you can possibly obtain. It’s hardly a perfect place since almost all women have to work to pay for their huge mortgage. They have a much lower disposable income amount as well. The fact you think there is less stress about money in a Scandinavian country is laughable.

I glad the feds now have guaranteed backpay PP. Still hard I know.

My parents were going to travel the world when my Dad retired and my Mom got sick instead. Happens a lot I suspect.

Anyway now we travel a bit more and DH goes on destination fishing trips about every other year.

Anonymous wrote:I like having enough money that i do not need to worry about being able to afford important things. I would YOLO if I lived in Scandinavia or some other civilized country. U feel that USA is pretty brutal to its poorer citizens so I save enough to be able to live relatively worry free here. Money removes a lot of stress and unless one is born rich being frugal is the most straightforward way of generating some safety buffer.

Yep. I think the best strategy is to move to a better country where you don’t have to work like a dog in order to not be homeless and to even have a shot at retirement. God forbid you have a big health issue because then you get to not retire and forget enjoying anything in life because of the constant stress.

What is YOLO? In response to the question, used to keep about 1-3 mos of liquid cash on hand for emergencies. Even though feds now have guaranteed backpay, DH and I are spending way less (so not contributing to local economy) and saving way more because furloughs are so common now. Basically waiting for Sept 30 for this to start all over again, and when DH will still report to work since job duties are essential.

Public nursing homes are awful. You wait and wait for care. Walk in one and you’ll see how unkempt everyone is. You’ll hear people moaning bc they have to wait for meds until the overworked and understaffed nurses can help you. It’s not an either or. You need to balance it out. Be thrifty but spend some as well on things that you really enjoy.