Anonymous wrote:WADR, You folks are part of the pay-to-play lobby.

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Also, read the link. Nothing wrong with doing travel if you have the funds and time but if you don't, there are often other options. https://slate.com/culture/2018/11/youth-sports-income-inequality-child-investment.html?wpsrc=sh_all_dt_tw_ru

Lots of words here, but better to just cut to the chase. Seems most discussions these days are distilling down to capitalism vs socialism these days in general. I, for one, hate bringing politics into youth sports, but it seems like a common tactic here. Sure, there are poor kids who do well in soccer (and other sports!). They are not the rule....there is no correlation between being poor and excelling at sports, certainly no causation. Those who are exceptional and determined find a way. The football field and basketball courts are filled with them. Soccer, in this country, does not reward financially, thus you will find fewer of these kinds of stories here.

But, to claim that people who observe how things work through their experiences are somehow lobbying for “pay to play” is missing the point. You need data to prove that making elite soccer teams is easy from a classic environment (it isn’t, unless the player is very talented and has found these unicorn environments to develop them). The way to change the situation is to make the sport as valued and lucrative in this country as it is in Europe. Then, there will be incentive for the poorer, athletic kids to play soccer instead of basketball and football, and the wealthy academies will recruit them from early ages and pay for their development. An “even” playing field. But no need for a socialistic program to try to doctor the situation.

The exception is not the rule.

Andy Najar got an offer to play for DCU academy even though he did not play travel soccer at all. He only played high school soccer and pick up games with his friends.

WADR, You folks are part of the pay-to-play lobby. All I have done is say that travel is not the end-all, be-all. There are other alternatives to paying $3,000+ and traveling to Richmond or Baltimore for meaningless u9, u10, or u11 games when you can join a strong select or classic team and get a similar or better experience if you do your homework. There is zero data but just my own experience and those of other parents, some of who coached their kids in classic/select. Again, we are comparing the C and D team experience. I had a neighbor

If you are at Bethesda, McLean or FCV and the technical director or boy/girls director is coaching the u9 D team then go for it. I would. That $3,000+ might be worth it but if you have multiple kids and limited time and don't have $3,000+ to throw around for a sub par experience because the best coaches are never coaching those younger teams, there are other options.

Regarding the ease at making an ECNL/DA team, I don't know what world you folks live in. Granted, not all ECNL/DA teams are created equal and ECNL/DA teams are not always the elite teams in a state, or tournament. The point is that you can go from the D team to a clubs elite team but there are cheaper and less stressful ways to do so.

Also, read the link. Nothing wrong with doing travel if you have the funds and time but if you don't, there are often other options. https://slate.com/culture/2018/11/youth-sports-income-inequality-child-investment.html?wpsrc=sh_all_dt_tw_ru

Anonymous wrote:making an ECNL or DA roster is not the hardest thing in the world.

From a decent travel team, not as hard. From classic...hahahahaha. Show us your data, I’d love to see it.

Anonymous wrote:making an ECNL or DA roster is not the hardest thing in the world.

Exactly

making an ECNL or DA roster is not the hardest thing in the world.

In my experience, that scenario classic/challenge—>elite level is very rare for the same reason the poster mentioned two posts above. Assuming we are talking about big club C teams, not a small club’s last team, what was said is true about the teams as a whole being more competent. And also the competition, because those teams typically play the B teams of smaller clubs and the A teams of really small clubs. It can actually be a bargain to pay the typical $2k or less in these cases vs some of the other options. That said, the additional private training happens at all levels, and in fact I see the A team players the most with private training at these ages. It has almost as much to do with the parent resources and competitiveness. And sometimes, but definitely not always, that attitude transfers down to the kid as well. When it does, the combination of physical ability plus attitude/ambition seems to propel those kids to the top.

^^^^ Yes! DD played up a year in classic/select and the team was solid across the board. Some girls were more talented than others but half the team was strong enough to play for their respective middle-school team over travel players. Four of the girls played travel the next season for strong clubs.

My only point is don't get caught in the trap of believing that you have to play travel at u9 to play ECNL. You don.t.

Has your child actually played on a Classic team? DD played on the top team for her age group last year and the level of ability was all over the place. No one would make the "right" play because chances were that if you passed to all but a few of the kids they would lose the ball right away. It was like playing soccer with only a third of the players or less and with some obstacles in the way.

DD is now on a C team for a well known travel club and it is really different. Every girl on the team is competent enough to keep the ball away from an opponent and pass it off to a teammate or shoot. There was maybe one individual player on Classic who is probably better than most of the girls on the travel team. But that's one girl, plus DD and one other girl who was okay. You can't make a soccer team by having only three girls passing to each other the whole time.

I argued above that kids can do select/classic plus extra training instead of doing travel. I will say it again, if you are not on the A team and maybe B team at some clubs you are doing yourself and your kid a disservice. I do know girls who went from the D team to the star of the ECNL team but that development happened between U12 and U14. Again, if you have $3,000+ to spend on travel and have time to drive to WV or Southern MD or Richmond for a game then by all means, enroll your kid in travel at u9 but if you have multiple kids involved in multiple activities and have your own interests then there are alternatives and I would argue that if your kid is not ready for the A team, the alternatives are better than C or D travel teams.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I guess we can disagree, but from what I have seen if you have a kid that has A team potential, you are hurting them by not having them in travel early. If they are good enough, they can overcome, but they would be farther along in their development if they had done travel.

What team charges $3,000 for travel for C and D teams? Our club charges between $1,500 and $1,800 depending on age. That includes tournament fees, winter training, etc.

I agree that starting travel from the earliest possible age is an advantage. If you want to know how good your daughter ultimately will be ask yourself how athletic were you and your spouse in high school.

I've heard this said before but I have often seen kids of two parents who didn't play sports in HS succeed and also seen children of two HS athletes fail. As long as the genetics aren't completely terrible, most kids have a shot at being a serviceable travel player with effort, grit, and smarts. In terms of athleticism, having a parent who was a D1 college player or higher probably correlates with child success, at least in what I've seen, but I'm not sure it goes far beyond that.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I guess we can disagree, but from what I have seen if you have a kid that has A team potential, you are hurting them by not having them in travel early. If they are good enough, they can overcome, but they would be farther along in their development if they had done travel.

What team charges $3,000 for travel for C and D teams? Our club charges between $1,500 and $1,800 depending on age. That includes tournament fees, winter training, etc.

The Barcelona Escola charges $3k+ for any level of play. I haven't seen any other clubs charge more than $2k for C or below teams, but there may be one or two out there.

You have to know what total cost is for travel, uniforms, etc. The team fee is only the beginning. Realize that at older ages cost for top teams DA/ECNL including all expenses approaches 10k per year.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I guess we can disagree, but from what I have seen if you have a kid that has A team potential, you are hurting them by not having them in travel early. If they are good enough, they can overcome, but they would be farther along in their development if they had done travel.

What team charges $3,000 for travel for C and D teams? Our club charges between $1,500 and $1,800 depending on age. That includes tournament fees, winter training, etc.

I agree that starting travel from the earliest possible age is an advantage. If you want to know how good your daughter ultimately will be ask yourself how athletic were you and your spouse in high school.

I've heard this said before but I have often seen kids of two parents who didn't play sports in HS succeed and also seen children of two HS athletes fail. As long as the genetics aren't completely terrible, most kids have a shot at being a serviceable travel player with effort, grit, and smarts. In terms of athleticism, having a parent who was a D1 college player or higher probably correlates with child success, at least in what I've seen, but I'm not sure it goes far beyond that.

Anonymous wrote:I guess we can disagree, but from what I have seen if you have a kid that has A team potential, you are hurting them by not having them in travel early. If they are good enough, they can overcome, but they would be farther along in their development if they had done travel.

What team charges $3,000 for travel for C and D teams? Our club charges between $1,500 and $1,800 depending on age. That includes tournament fees, winter training, etc.

The Barcelona Escola charges $3k+ for any level of play. I haven't seen any other clubs charge more than $2k for C or below teams, but there may be one or two out there.