Anonymous
Post 11/15/2018 12:43     Subject: Why DC is over
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:We live in DC because it’s cheaper than Manhattan and SF. We aren’t young but chose DC for the exact same reason that young people chose to live elsewhere - cost of living. Comparably DC is a bargain compared to NYC and SF.

We used to live in Manhattan but figured out it is cheaper to fly out of Reagan once a month and stay at a five star hotel for a week every month than to buy a nice apt/coop in Manhattan.


I compare DC to NYC all the time. It's 1/5th the cost to buy a absolutely gorgeous new build condo here than doing so in Manhattan with park views. I get the views, the restaurants (not as good as NYC but far better quality than where I was from and DC opens tons of NYC-started restaurants every week - Magnolias is in Union Station now, the parks and greenery, and a relatively cheaper housing situation. Also less people.

Ideal for me.


DC also has very low property taxes. Amazingly low. In DC, we live in a rowhouse, a comparable brownstone in Manhattan will be 10 mil +.


DC is a slam dunk to me. My lifestyle is pretty much the same as it would be in NY. Still walk or take the metro to work. Live in a historic community. Can taxi/Uber our. Benefit is that I own my own home here. In NY if I owned it would be a 2 bedroom if that. I’m building wealth here and doing the same thing I’d do in NY.
Anonymous
Post 11/15/2018 12:39     Subject: Why DC is over
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:We are a young decent/highish earning couple (HHI north of 200k) and never considered DC for reasons in this article. Mainly the price. DC is too expensive, not enough space, and doesnt offer a good commute at all. If our jobs werent central do the DC area we would not live here. I love visiting the city, but would never live there.


We're a young high earning couple and never considered VA or MD because we didn't want to be stuck in traffic for most of our lives. It's very expensive here, but we love our house/neighborhood and walkability/accessibility.

Honestly if you love visiting cities but wouldn't want to live in one it probably wasn't the cost pushing you to the burbs. Everything's not for everybody.

DP. Young (how are we defining young here? Under 30? Under 35?) family. We used to live in DC until our HHI increased to $400k and this line of thinking really bothers me. For the amount of money you pay in taxes in dc you should really get more than walkability and the chance at free pre-k (because depending on where you live it’s not guaranteed at your neighborhood school and most folks don’t want to have to travel far for pre k). And add to that that you don’t get representation at the national level. No thanks.


Like I said, everything's not for everybody. I'm glad you landed somewhere that works for your family. We bought when we were at ~$280k HHI, now we're a little over $400k without bonuses. We love our house, our neighbors, our neighborhood, the city, etc. I am pro-statehood and the lack of political representation is aggravating in the extreme, but it's not enough to push me to a place I'd have to drive to work (or the store, or to visit friends, etc).


This is my primary motivation. Also love the historic DC neighborhoods.

Not convinced congress does much anyway. I’d prefer to not have any involvement with that mess.


Anonymous
Post 11/15/2018 12:39     Subject: Why DC is over
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote: Also, the whole “____ is too conservative/southern” argument is losing steam because secondary cities are all flipping to blue zones.


Yes, but rural votes matter more electorally.

All the cities may be blue, but they do not turn out to vote like rural voters do.


For statewide elections, they don't have to if their numbers are big enough. And, the more people who move there, the more the numbers grow ...
Anonymous
Post 11/15/2018 12:38     Subject: Re:Why DC is over
I moved to DC in 1996 because at that time it was sort of a gay Mecca. It was cheap compared to other East Coast cities (!), and had beautiful architecture and parks.

Now I'm in my fifties, and can't stand it here. Everyone around me is half my age and they (gay or straight) basically look through me. The place is full of Type A personalities, and the lovely historical neighborhoods are getting torn apart for condos and popups. Also the crime situation is starting to worsen again. And the traffic...

So my partner and I are headed for a 2nd tier city - maybe Richmond, Charlottesville, or Providence.
Anonymous
Post 11/15/2018 12:37     Subject: Why DC is over
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:We live in DC because it’s cheaper than Manhattan and SF. We aren’t young but chose DC for the exact same reason that young people chose to live elsewhere - cost of living. Comparably DC is a bargain compared to NYC and SF.

We used to live in Manhattan but figured out it is cheaper to fly out of Reagan once a month and stay at a five star hotel for a week every month than to buy a nice apt/coop in Manhattan.


I compare DC to NYC all the time. It's 1/5th the cost to buy a absolutely gorgeous new build condo here than doing so in Manhattan with park views. I get the views, the restaurants (not as good as NYC but far better quality than where I was from and DC opens tons of NYC-started restaurants every week - Magnolias is in Union Station now, the parks and greenery, and a relatively cheaper housing situation. Also less people.

Ideal for me.


DC also has very low property taxes. Amazingly low. In DC, we live in a rowhouse, a comparable brownstone in Manhattan will be 10 mil +.
Anonymous
Post 11/15/2018 12:37     Subject: Why DC is over
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:We are a young decent/highish earning couple (HHI north of 200k) and never considered DC for reasons in this article. Mainly the price. DC is too expensive, not enough space, and doesnt offer a good commute at all. If our jobs werent central do the DC area we would not live here. I love visiting the city, but would never live there.


We're a young high earning couple and never considered VA or MD because we didn't want to be stuck in traffic for most of our lives. It's very expensive here, but we love our house/neighborhood and walkability/accessibility.

Honestly if you love visiting cities but wouldn't want to live in one it probably wasn't the cost pushing you to the burbs. Everything's not for everybody.

DP. Young (how are we defining young here? Under 30? Under 35?) family. We used to live in DC until our HHI increased to $400k and this line of thinking really bothers me. For the amount of money you pay in taxes in dc you should really get more than walkability and the chance at free pre-k (because depending on where you live it’s not guaranteed at your neighborhood school and most folks don’t want to have to travel far for pre k). And add to that that you don’t get representation at the national level. No thanks.


Like I said, everything's not for everybody. I'm glad you landed somewhere that works for your family. We bought when we were at ~$280k HHI, now we're a little over $400k without bonuses. We love our house, our neighbors, our neighborhood, the city, etc. I am pro-statehood and the lack of political representation is aggravating in the extreme, but it's not enough to push me to a place I'd have to drive to work (or the store, or to visit friends, etc).
Anonymous
Post 11/15/2018 12:37     Subject: Why DC is over
It's interesting--in my NW DC neighborhood, I only know a few homeowners who've left since we moved here 5 years ago. One moved back to their NC hometown. The others all moved to either the Bay area or NYC.
Anonymous
Post 11/15/2018 12:33     Subject: Why DC is over
Anonymous wrote:We live in DC because it’s cheaper than Manhattan and SF. We aren’t young but chose DC for the exact same reason that young people chose to live elsewhere - cost of living. Comparably DC is a bargain compared to NYC and SF.

We used to live in Manhattan but figured out it is cheaper to fly out of Reagan once a month and stay at a five star hotel for a week every month than to buy a nice apt/coop in Manhattan.


I compare DC to NYC all the time. It's 1/5th the cost to buy a absolutely gorgeous new build condo here than doing so in Manhattan with park views. I get the views, the restaurants (not as good as NYC but far better quality than where I was from and DC opens tons of NYC-started restaurants every week - Magnolias is in Union Station now, the parks and greenery, and a relatively cheaper housing situation. Also less people.

Ideal for me.
Anonymous
Post 11/15/2018 12:27     Subject: Why DC is over
We live in DC because it’s cheaper than Manhattan and SF. We aren’t young but chose DC for the exact same reason that young people chose to live elsewhere - cost of living. Comparably DC is a bargain compared to NYC and SF.

We used to live in Manhattan but figured out it is cheaper to fly out of Reagan once a month and stay at a five star hotel for a week every month than to buy a nice apt/coop in Manhattan.
Anonymous
Post 11/15/2018 11:43     Subject: Why DC is over
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:We are a young decent/highish earning couple (HHI north of 200k) and never considered DC for reasons in this article. Mainly the price. DC is too expensive, not enough space, and doesnt offer a good commute at all. If our jobs werent central do the DC area we would not live here. I love visiting the city, but would never live there.


We're a young high earning couple and never considered VA or MD because we didn't want to be stuck in traffic for most of our lives. It's very expensive here, but we love our house/neighborhood and walkability/accessibility.

Honestly if you love visiting cities but wouldn't want to live in one it probably wasn't the cost pushing you to the burbs. Everything's not for everybody.

DP. Young (how are we defining young here? Under 30? Under 35?) family. We used to live in DC until our HHI increased to $400k and this line of thinking really bothers me. For the amount of money you pay in taxes in dc you should really get more than walkability and the chance at free pre-k (because depending on where you live it’s not guaranteed at your neighborhood school and most folks don’t want to have to travel far for pre k). And add to that that you don’t get representation at the national level. No thanks.
Anonymous
Post 11/15/2018 11:30     Subject: Why DC is over
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:https://www.washingtonpost.com/amphtml/realestate/the-new-boomtowns-why-more-people-are-relocating-to-secondary-cities/2018/11/07/f55f96f4-d618-11e8-aeb7-ddcad4a0a54e_story.html

Just one in a long line of recent articles pointing to a mass exodus of young people from cities like DC. Despite the groupthink here, I think it’s safe to say that prices can only go so high when young families have more options than they once did (you can move anywhere with telework and good jobs can be had basically anywhere). Also, the whole “____ is too conservative/southern” argument is losing steam because secondary cities are all flipping to blue zones.


Great! Goodbye!

The reason people are leaving isn't because they wouldn't prefer to be in NYC, SF, or DC. Its because they can't afford it. Or at least not at the level they prefer. Cities are back in vogue and there is only so much space to go around. I don't see this an article saying that DC is over. To the contrary, I see it as a confirmation that the DC market is too hot. Honestly, DC would probably be better off with a lull in population growth.



NP. Why the eye roll? It's true.

True, DC proper offers some incentives to young families (namely, universal PK and lots of free/low-cost activities for children). On the other hand, it's not cheap to live here, and I don't see it becoming less expensive anytime soon given the HQ2 hysteria.

I often ask myself why we stay, since we're only here for work.

Do we have family here? No.
Do we have meaningful friendships? No.
Is it easy to meet like-minded, laid-back parents who aren't working all the time? No. (Although I realize this could be related to our neighborhood.)
Does DC offer the same "big city" things as NYC, SF, Chicago, etc.? No.


None of what you said about your specific situation necessarily negates the general observations of the PP about DC and a return to cities for younger people.


I suspect the eye roll was about daring to suggest that DC is a desirable place to be instead of the worst hellhole ever. Folks on DCUM seem obsessed with talking about how horrible it is here. How it can never, ever live up to the perfection that is SF or NYC. But of course, anywhere else (besides NYC and SF) is completely controlled by xenophobic, inbred racists and Nazis.
Anonymous
Post 11/15/2018 11:05     Subject: Why DC is over
Anonymous wrote:We are a young decent/highish earning couple (HHI north of 200k) and never considered DC for reasons in this article. Mainly the price. DC is too expensive, not enough space, and doesnt offer a good commute at all. If our jobs werent central do the DC area we would not live here. I love visiting the city, but would never live there.


I can totally understand this. We're older--one of us just turning 40 and other mid-40s--with a HHI around $360. One youngish elem. kid. We budget carefully, even at our income. If we were still at $200-250, we would likely have bought in close-in Silver Spring (still decent commute to our jobs, and lower prices).
Anonymous
Post 11/15/2018 10:59     Subject: Why DC is over
Anonymous wrote:We are a young decent/highish earning couple (HHI north of 200k) and never considered DC for reasons in this article. Mainly the price. DC is too expensive, not enough space, and doesnt offer a good commute at all. If our jobs werent central do the DC area we would not live here. I love visiting the city, but would never live there.


We're a young high earning couple and never considered VA or MD because we didn't want to be stuck in traffic for most of our lives. It's very expensive here, but we love our house/neighborhood and walkability/accessibility.

Honestly if you love visiting cities but wouldn't want to live in one it probably wasn't the cost pushing you to the burbs. Everything's not for everybody.
Anonymous
Post 11/15/2018 10:58     Subject: Why DC is over
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:https://www.washingtonpost.com/amphtml/realestate/the-new-boomtowns-why-more-people-are-relocating-to-secondary-cities/2018/11/07/f55f96f4-d618-11e8-aeb7-ddcad4a0a54e_story.html

Just one in a long line of recent articles pointing to a mass exodus of young people from cities like DC. Despite the groupthink here, I think it’s safe to say that prices can only go so high when young families have more options than they once did (you can move anywhere with telework and good jobs can be had basically anywhere). Also, the whole “____ is too conservative/southern” argument is losing steam because secondary cities are all flipping to blue zones.


Great! Goodbye!

The reason people are leaving isn't because they wouldn't prefer to be in NYC, SF, or DC. Its because they can't afford it. Or at least not at the level they prefer. Cities are back in vogue and there is only so much space to go around. I don't see this an article saying that DC is over. To the contrary, I see it as a confirmation that the DC market is too hot. Honestly, DC would probably be better off with a lull in population growth.



NP. Why the eye roll? It's true.

True, DC proper offers some incentives to young families (namely, universal PK and lots of free/low-cost activities for children). On the other hand, it's not cheap to live here, and I don't see it becoming less expensive anytime soon given the HQ2 hysteria.

I often ask myself why we stay, since we're only here for work.

Do we have family here? No.
Do we have meaningful friendships? No.
Is it easy to meet like-minded, laid-back parents who aren't working all the time? No. (Although I realize this could be related to our neighborhood.)
Does DC offer the same "big city" things as NYC, SF, Chicago, etc.? No.


None of what you said about your specific situation necessarily negates the general observations of the PP about DC and a return to cities for younger people.
Anonymous
Post 11/15/2018 10:57     Subject: Why DC is over
DC is so expensive due to demand and low inventory that a lot of people can't afford to live there, so they buy where they can afford to live. That's pretty much the opposite of "over." What a strange argument.