Your child is not going to get into a highly selective college. He does not have to get straight As in the top math classes, but he has to be taking those classes at least. Which he isn’t. Trust me on this. The top 50 is out of his reach.

Can you graduate without math? I don't think they will give you a degree without a math class.

Anonymous wrote:JFC what are we supposed to do? NP here and my incoming freshman kid is a pretty solid B math student with tutoring. And not advanced classes. I know the selective college thing is tough but I didn't think he would literally have zero chance from the get-go unless he has As in advanced math. Do we just give up and send him to plumbing school?

Need to define selective college, and a lot depends on your child's high school and if he/she has any hooks (gifted athlete perhaps?). Is he/she going to wind up in the top 5-10% of their graduating class? Public or private?

Anonymous wrote:"UVA, UNC, Vanderbilt, Carnegie Mellon"

You don't need AP math to get into these schools for non-math intensive majors.

But exactly what math class is she taking as a freshman and what state are you in?

There are two types of tutoring. The first kind gets you through a class and the second goes looking for where the gaps are in your background.

Which has DD done?

It might also be useful to get her tested for learning disabilities.

Based on my child who sounds a lot like yours, no, your child will not get into these schools. DD got rejected from schools a tier below these - Wisconsin and Ohio State.

I never took either Calc (or Chemistry for that matter ...) in high school, so now I struggle in BigLaw making seven figures. But it is nice to have UVA grads serving me coffee at Starbucks. Coming soon, Pumpkin Spice!

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:JFC what are we supposed to do? NP here and my incoming freshman kid is a pretty solid B math student with tutoring. And not advanced classes. I know the selective college thing is tough but I didn't think he would literally have zero chance from the get-go unless he has As in advanced math. Do we just give up and send him to plumbing school?

There are many, many of colleges where a B math student will have no problem with admission. You are asking about the very top ranked, most selective schools in the country. Without some hook, yes, you need well above a 4.0 in the most rigorous classes and even then it's a crap shoot.

The options are not top-20 school vs. trade school

My solid B math student got into UVA & Michigan, and several others, but that was in the highest math track starting with Algebra honors in 7th and a full IB diploma. I think the context of the Bs plays a role.

Anonymous wrote:JFC what are we supposed to do? NP here and my incoming freshman kid is a pretty solid B math student with tutoring. And not advanced classes. I know the selective college thing is tough but I didn't think he would literally have zero chance from the get-go unless he has As in advanced math. Do we just give up and send him to plumbing school?

There are many, many of colleges where a B math student will have no problem with admission. You are asking about the very top ranked, most selective schools in the country. Without some hook, yes, you need well above a 4.0 in the most rigorous classes and even then it's a crap shoot.

The options are not top-20 school vs. trade school

JFC what are we supposed to do? NP here and my incoming freshman kid is a pretty solid B math student with tutoring. And not advanced classes. I know the selective college thing is tough but I didn't think he would literally have zero chance from the get-go unless he has As in advanced math. Do we just give up and send him to plumbing school?

Anonymous wrote:It really depends on her SAT scores, grades, and ECs OP. It is too early to be able to honestly answer your question. She just has to do as well as she can do.

This is the answer OP. But realize It is very hard to get into UVA, UNC, CMU, etc., even with AP BC Calc.


If she can take 4 full years of high school math and make it through Pre-Calc (not the standard diploma track where you take Algebra II over 2 years), and get over a 1400-1450 on the SAT (which is going to require a 650 in Math, even with perfect verbal scores), and get above a 4.3-4.4 WGPA in a FCPS base school and take full APs in science, history and English and language, then she might be able to overcome the poor math tracking for UVA.

UNC is nearly impossible to get into out of state and CMU is a STEM strong school.

Reality check: I have a kid at TJ, and most kids with 4.3s at TJ (where they must pass AP Calc to graduate) and with a 1500 on the SAT get rejected by CMU and UNC. And these schools will take TJ kids with lower GPAs than base schools.

You are probably not being realistic.

Anonymous wrote:OP here- I guess I mean Top 50 or so.

Are any of these schools possible?

UVA, UNC, Vanderbilt, Carnegie Mellon, etc?

No, no, no, and no

"They can if they have a reason to be admitted and work hard. DD has the opposite academic problem as OP, excellent in math and science but has issues stemming from a learning disability that left her unable to read through 6th grade. She got lots of help since the pblm was identified but she has always been in grade level (not honors) English and usually ekes out a b+, sometimes by rewriting papers or getting help on outlines or pre-reads. She is a rising senior and an athlete and has offers from two ivies. You have to have a hook, you have to distinguish yourself in the other academic areas and you have to work hard in the deficit area and show improvement."

I agree they can. Our DC had a similar experience. DC isn't as much of an athlete as your DD but DC's hook got them into their reach school.
Then we actually though about what it would mean to attend the reach school.
We would be betting $70k per year that reach academics wouldn't burn DC out and would still allow DC to participate in the hook that they love.
DC just started at a school where they got a pile of merit aid and will be much more comfortable academically, even in their weak area.

Anonymous wrote:All these posters saying “I was terrible at math but still got into Yale” are kidding themselves if they think things are the same now. They are definitely not and unless your kid is in the highest or AP math course at school they aren’t getting into Yale or Northwestern or even places like Williams or Bowdoin.

They can if they have a reason to be admitted and work hard. DD has the opposite academic problem as OP, excellent in math and science but has issues stemming from a learning disability that left her unable to read through 6th grade. She got lots of help since the pblm was identified but she has always been in grade level (not honors) English and usually ekes out a b+, sometimes by rewriting papers or getting help on outlines or pre-reads. She is a rising senior and an athlete and has offers from two ivies. You have to have a hook, you have to distinguish yourself in the other academic areas and you have to work hard in the deficit area and show improvement.

Anonymous wrote:I’m terrible at math, like still do addition and subtraction on my fingers bad. My high school allowed you to enroll in honors classes if you really wanted to. My middle school teachers didn’t recommend me, but my parents asked the guidance office to give me a chance. My test scores didn’t automatically let me in either. I took 4 years of advanced math and calculus senior year. I honestly had very little idea what was going on, but high school is largerly about effort and with tutoring I was always able to keep an A- average in math. I had near perfect grades in everything else, played 4 sports, and had tons of extracurriculars, and great references.

I got into Yale. My math SAT was on the low end of what they accept, but everything else was on the high end. I did well there and never took another math class. I can still barely balance my check book, but I have a PhD in another field and a lot of professional success.

So, it’s not impossible, but if you have a deficit in one area you have to work harder than everyone else to minimize the impact and you still have to take the hardest level in that area.

The low end of what that accept is ostensibly the 25th percentile, or over 700. So, sorry, you don’t suck at math. Not even close.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m terrible at math, like still do addition and subtraction on my fingers bad. My high school allowed you to enroll in honors classes if you really wanted to. My middle school teachers didn’t recommend me, but my parents asked the guidance office to give me a chance. My test scores didn’t automatically let me in either. I took 4 years of advanced math and calculus senior year. I honestly had very little idea what was going on, but high school is largerly about effort and with tutoring I was always able to keep an A- average in math. I had near perfect grades in everything else, played 4 sports, and had tons of extracurriculars, and great references.

I got into Yale. My math SAT was on the low end of what they accept, but everything else was on the high end. I did well there and never took another math class. I can still barely balance my check book, but I have a PhD in another field and a lot of professional success.

So, it’s not impossible, but if you have a deficit in one area you have to work harder than everyone else to minimize the impact and you still have to take the hardest level in that area.

You got into Yale a long, long time ago. You would not get in today.

Exactly. I got into Penn with a 1220 SAT. Not exactly happening today.

Anonymous wrote:In the info session for Pomona, the admission officer was asked this and said that they not admit students who didn't take AP Calc if their school offered it; furthermore, they wanted grades of A's and could make a case for the occasional B, but not a C. Students had to have 4 years of math and they preferred five years (BC or added stats). Kind of surprised us for a liberal arts college - we thought they'd care less about math.

This is a misperception about liberal arts. At a top SLAC like Pomona, you need to be pretty strong in everything.