Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To the OP, this thread illustrates the fact that vast majority people have little to no actual knowledge of what they talk about. They simply repeat what they've heard, or hold on to notions that are no longer true.

In general, vehicle reliability gap between different brands have narrowed significantly since the 80's and 90's, when there was a sizable gulf between Honda/Toyota and "the rest". With just a handful of notable exceptions, current selection of vehicles fall into a fairly small range of reliability. Note that Consumer Reports places BMW higher on their average reliability rating than Honda. I am sure either a new BMW or Honda would be similarly reliable, and any issues you encounter would be the exception rather than the rule.

That said, the cost of ownership for an older BMW will typically be higher due to more expensive repairs when they do happen. There are fewer budget oriented independent shops that work on BMWs versus those that fix Honda/Toyota.

As for why BMW typically has worse resale value, there are a multitude of reasons. The most significant of which is the incorrect perception that Hondas are such reliable cars. This perception is the reason why a used 2-3 year old Honda are usually sold with just a modest discount from an all-new price. People are so set in their thinking that a used Honda is a great deal that they pay entirely too much for one. Another reason is that BMWs are often purchased as status vehicles and as such people tend to want to drive late models with newer body styles.

Nope sorry. My wife and I have a 3 series, FIL has a 5 series, my brother has the X5 and NONE of us plans to buy another BMW. Do we like driving them, of course. But we've spent many recent family gatherings commiserating about the recurring repairs and costs. We also just had this same exact conversation with a group of neighbors at our 4th of July BBQ. It seems in my experience that this is what people keep saying because ACTUAL BMW owners will tell you they are costly vehicles to maintain. My extended family has been slowly switching to Audi's and Lexus. But several of us still have older Honda's, MDX's, and Toyota's that we rely on or let our kids drive.

Your anecdotes are just that, anecdotes - they are inconsequential in the face of broad statistics, which is what's used by Consumer Reports to give BMW a higher reliability rating than Honda. It's not just Consumer Reports either: JD Powers also ranks BMW higher in dependability than Honda: http://www.jdpower.com/press-releases/jd-power-2018-us-vehicle-dependability-study. With regards to maintenance costs, I am not sure where the disagreement is: I acknowledged that BMWs cost more to repair and therefore has a higher cost of ownership. Did you actually read my post or just had an uncontrollable self-righteous urge to pound out a post because you think you know better.

So thank you for illustrating perfectly how personal bias is causing people to significantly over estimate the reliability of Hondas, leading to their irrationally high resale value.

Anonymous wrote:Thanks. We have one of each and considering getting a newer version of one of them. I will admit that the driving experience of a BMW is really enjoyable, but the Odyssey is far more functional for the family and provides serious leg room. I'm ok with one of each (one for trips and hauling cargo, carpooling), and one for easier parking around town. But, at the end of the day, maybe our sedan of choice really should be an Accord...

Why don't BMWs hold their value better?

Anonymous wrote:Used BMW’s are a dime a dozen and you can get them super cheap on Craigslist. Honda’s are a different story, hold value much better and you can resell them almost instantly. Everyone knows Honda’s and Toyota’s are the best used vehicle.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To the OP, this thread illustrates the fact that vast majority people have little to no actual knowledge of what they talk about. They simply repeat what they've heard, or hold on to notions that are no longer true.

In general, vehicle reliability gap between different brands have narrowed significantly since the 80's and 90's, when there was a sizable gulf between Honda/Toyota and "the rest". With just a handful of notable exceptions, current selection of vehicles fall into a fairly small range of reliability. Note that Consumer Reports places BMW higher on their average reliability rating than Honda. I am sure either a new BMW or Honda would be similarly reliable, and any issues you encounter would be the exception rather than the rule.

That said, the cost of ownership for an older BMW will typically be higher due to more expensive repairs when they do happen. There are fewer budget oriented independent shops that work on BMWs versus those that fix Honda/Toyota.

As for why BMW typically has worse resale value, there are a multitude of reasons. The most significant of which is the incorrect perception that Hondas are such reliable cars. This perception is the reason why a used 2-3 year old Honda are usually sold with just a modest discount from an all-new price. People are so set in their thinking that a used Honda is a great deal that they pay entirely too much for one. Another reason is that BMWs are often purchased as status vehicles and as such people tend to want to drive late models with newer body styles.

Nope sorry. My wife and I have a 3 series, FIL has a 5 series, my brother has the X5 and NONE of us plans to buy another BMW. Do we like driving them, of course. But we've spent many recent family gatherings commiserating about the recurring repairs and costs. We also just had this same exact conversation with a group of neighbors at our 4th of July BBQ. It seems in my experience that this is what people keep saying because ACTUAL BMW owners will tell you they are costly vehicles to maintain. My extended family has been slowly switching to Audi's and Lexus. But several of us still have older Honda's, MDX's, and Toyota's that we rely on or let our kids drive.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To the OP, this thread illustrates the fact that vast majority people have little to no actual knowledge of what they talk about. They simply repeat what they've heard, or hold on to notions that are no longer true.

In general, vehicle reliability gap between different brands have narrowed significantly since the 80's and 90's, when there was a sizable gulf between Honda/Toyota and "the rest". With just a handful of notable exceptions, current selection of vehicles fall into a fairly small range of reliability. Note that Consumer Reports places BMW higher on their average reliability rating than Honda. I am sure either a new BMW or Honda would be similarly reliable, and any issues you encounter would be the exception rather than the rule.

That said, the cost of ownership for an older BMW will typically be higher due to more expensive repairs when they do happen. There are fewer budget oriented independent shops that work on BMWs versus those that fix Honda/Toyota.

As for why BMW typically has worse resale value, there are a multitude of reasons. The most significant of which is the incorrect perception that Hondas are such reliable cars. This perception is the reason why a used 2-3 year old Honda are usually sold with just a modest discount from an all-new price. People are so set in their thinking that a used Honda is a great deal that they pay entirely too much for one. Another reason is that BMWs are often purchased as status vehicles and as such people tend to want to drive late models with newer body styles.

This sounds like a BMW dealer's sales pitch.

Anonymous wrote:To the OP, this thread illustrates the fact that vast majority people have little to no actual knowledge of what they talk about. They simply repeat what they've heard, or hold on to notions that are no longer true.

In general, vehicle reliability gap between different brands have narrowed significantly since the 80's and 90's, when there was a sizable gulf between Honda/Toyota and "the rest". With just a handful of notable exceptions, current selection of vehicles fall into a fairly small range of reliability. Note that Consumer Reports places BMW higher on their average reliability rating than Honda. I am sure either a new BMW or Honda would be similarly reliable, and any issues you encounter would be the exception rather than the rule.

That said, the cost of ownership for an older BMW will typically be higher due to more expensive repairs when they do happen. There are fewer budget oriented independent shops that work on BMWs versus those that fix Honda/Toyota.

As for why BMW typically has worse resale value, there are a multitude of reasons. The most significant of which is the incorrect perception that Hondas are such reliable cars. This perception is the reason why a used 2-3 year old Honda are usually sold with just a modest discount from an all-new price. People are so set in their thinking that a used Honda is a great deal that they pay entirely too much for one. Another reason is that BMWs are often purchased as status vehicles and as such people tend to want to drive late models with newer body styles.

Anonymous wrote:To the OP, this thread illustrates the fact that vast majority people have little to no actual knowledge of what they talk about. They simply repeat what they've heard, or hold on to notions that are no longer true.

In general, vehicle reliability gap between different brands have narrowed significantly since the 80's and 90's, when there was a sizable gulf between Honda/Toyota and "the rest". With just a handful of notable exceptions, current selection of vehicles fall into a fairly small range of reliability. Note that Consumer Reports places BMW higher on their average reliability rating than Honda. I am sure either a new BMW or Honda would be similarly reliable, and any issues you encounter would be the exception rather than the rule.

That said, the cost of ownership for an older BMW will typically be higher due to more expensive repairs when they do happen. There are fewer budget oriented independent shops that work on BMWs versus those that fix Honda/Toyota.

As for why BMW typically has worse resale value, there are a multitude of reasons. The most significant of which is the incorrect perception that Hondas are such reliable cars. This perception is the reason why a used 2-3 year old Honda are usually sold with just a modest discount from an all-new price. People are so set in their thinking that a used Honda is a great deal that they pay entirely too much for one. Another reason is that BMWs are often purchased as status vehicles and as such people tend to want to drive late models with newer body styles.

Anonymous wrote:Thanks, this is all very helpful.

DH's BMW is reaching end of warranty and he was contemplating what to do next. I can't recall if he's already had to take it in or not, but I don't like what I'm hearing...

Our Odyssey is 2011 and no real issues. One of the sliding doors sometimes doesn't want to close, but it rarely happens and we have figured out a way to push it shut.

Couldn't agree more with PP about the different feel of driving these vehicles.

Seems like the bottom line is that all cars are pretty darned expensive, one way or another, but Honda's reliability and resale value make it a better value. And if you want a BMW, the pleasure of driving it must be worth the cost of upkeep.

Anonymous wrote:Used BMW’s are a dime a dozen and you can get them super cheap on Craigslist. Honda’s are a different story, hold value much better and you can resell them almost instantly. Everyone knows Honda’s and Toyota’s are the best used vehicle.