Anonymous wrote:Another, slightly outside the box, suggestion. Maybe your immediate family and your DH's sibling's immediate family can plan a vacation together where FIL and his GF can drop in. Get a beach house with room for everyone (if that's possible for you all). FIL and GF can stay at a nearby hotel if they prefer. Cousins have bonding time. FIL has grandpa time. GF can check out if she needs/wants to.

Sometimes it's easier when no one is on their home turf.

NP here and that's a great idea.

My guess is faux-MIL just gets stressed hosting kids and/or a lot of people in general. As my grandmother (a widow) got older, we stopped celebrating family events at her house as we always had. First we tried to reduce her (unfounded) stress level by having everyone bring a dish.. but even that got too much for her, so we just celebrated the events at someone else's house and someone came to pick her up and take her there (she couldn't drive). That worked out better for everyone. No stress for her, and she got to see her family.

Anonymous wrote:This post needs a TL;DR. As a general rule, OP, any situation can be summed up in a paragraph, maybe two at the most; if people need more information, they can ask questions. When something gets to be this long, it tends to suggest the poster is steeped in the drama, which further tends to point to the poster as being an active part of the problem.

No, this thread does not "need" anything. And if the OP summed up in a quick paragraph and added information as it was being asked, posters would accuse OP of not fully disclosing everything and therefore must be lying or trolling. STFU and stop trying to control how this thread is being done.

Another, slightly outside the box, suggestion. Maybe your immediate family and your DH's sibling's immediate family can plan a vacation together where FIL and his GF can drop in. Get a beach house with room for everyone (if that's possible for you all). FIL and GF can stay at a nearby hotel if they prefer. Cousins have bonding time. FIL has grandpa time. GF can check out if she needs/wants to.

Sometimes it's easier when no one is on their home turf.

At this point, my dilemma is, how nice do I have to be to GF? She has made it clear in so many ways that she finds my kids and nephews/niece to be a hassle and does not seem to be interested in having a relationship with any of them beyond the most basic pleasantries. At this point my sense is that she doesn't care all that much for me either (not as sure about DH or BIL/SIL as I have not witnessed as many interactions with them). But do I suck it up and treat her like part of one big happy family anyway...? We don't host any holiday gatherings and have included her and her kids in any big events (wedding, etc). Do I keep going to visit and indulge her increasingly extensive demands and chilly behavior towards my kids?

The answer to question one is that you absolutely do need to continue to be pleasant and civil to her. It may be that she finds the kids to be an inconvenience and doesn't want to have a relationship with them, and it may be that you aren't one of her favorites. But you are not going to make it any easier on your husband by being anything but nice to this woman.
That being said, being nice doesn't mean being willing to drive 4-5 hours each way to visit with them for 3-4 hours over a weekend. You can choose to stay at a hotel, and try to arrange to do some activities with FIL outside of the house. You can invite them to visit you at your place - that way, if only FIL wants to come, his girlfriend can stay home.

OP, does FIL expect his girlfriend to do most of the work of hosting these events? If so, that, combined with her not really liking to be around kids at this point, is probably the source of the conflict/behavior at issue, rather than anything personal about you or your family. Just have FIL come visit you more often.

OP, It sounds like you are certain there is no malevolence here. Am I correct? In my case, I noticed an increase in step-mom's hostility that turned out to be coordinated with a meeting with their lawyer about the will (I wasn't present for the estate discussions).

Assuming no malevolence, are there things you could do like play mini golf with grandpa that extend the visit time but give her a break?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:New poster here. My step-mom is much like your 'faux MIL'. She has very specific time limits and very much limits her interactions with all children, not just my dad's grandkids. Unlike you, I know why: children (including her own) just exhaust and stress her. In our case, she truly loves all the kids, but just can't be around them very much w/o falling apart. So, my dad visits solo. We visit and stay elsewhere. We invite them to our home/hotel so they can leave whenever they want. And if there's an all day activity (say, a pool day), grandparents come separately so she can leave when it's good for her.

I don't think she's crazy. I love my stepmom, and while she won't be a grandmother to my young children, I feel that once my kids are college-age, she will be. So I stopped making her into a GM and we all spend time with her that works for her.

OP again. Thank you for this helpful reply. I think one of the things that makes it so hard to deal with GF is that there is no direct conversation. If at some time in the past decade she or FIL had said, "hosting this many people/kids is a lot for me/us, can we suggest you stay in a hotel?" it would have been FINE! Instead, when I suggested to DH that we stay in a hotel I hear about how much this limits FIL's time with grandkids. And FIL's response is very much the same--"I love having the grandkids in the house" in reply to "we can stay in a hotel" or a disappointed "we'll need you to stay in a hotel" during visits when they're hosting GF's kids and don't have space for us. Even GF herself seems to brush off the suggestion and will say things about how much she appreciates having us there (after a visit during which she has made it clear at several moments before and during that she is incredibly inconvenienced by it).

I have suggested to DH and also SIL, with whom I am close, that maybe we need to adopt a model more similar to what you describe. Over the past 1-2 years BIL and DH will call each other just to complain about GF and it makes me feel badly that she gets trashed in these conversations but then all of the same behaviors continue, by all parties.

I think this provides some insights. It sounds like FIL and GF are not on the same page as a couple as to how to structure these visits, and maybe GF does not want to disappoint FIL. Maybe the visits are more of a fantasy type thing for FIL, with children running to "grandparents" and everyone gathering and grandparenting it up. GF just can't take that (and that's just her personality, my parents can't take that either). Wherever you stay, build breaks into your day. And I don't recommend having everyone (both sets of grandkids, BIL's kids too) descend on them. It's just too much.

Totally agreed. Perhaps if FIL were more help with the entertaining but it doesn't sound like that is his thing so it is all falling on the GF. It clearly isn't her thing and pushing her to do more of it isn't going to help.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:New poster here. My step-mom is much like your 'faux MIL'. She has very specific time limits and very much limits her interactions with all children, not just my dad's grandkids. Unlike you, I know why: children (including her own) just exhaust and stress her. In our case, she truly loves all the kids, but just can't be around them very much w/o falling apart. So, my dad visits solo. We visit and stay elsewhere. We invite them to our home/hotel so they can leave whenever they want. And if there's an all day activity (say, a pool day), grandparents come separately so she can leave when it's good for her.

I don't think she's crazy. I love my stepmom, and while she won't be a grandmother to my young children, I feel that once my kids are college-age, she will be. So I stopped making her into a GM and we all spend time with her that works for her.

OP again. Thank you for this helpful reply. I think one of the things that makes it so hard to deal with GF is that there is no direct conversation. If at some time in the past decade she or FIL had said, "hosting this many people/kids is a lot for me/us, can we suggest you stay in a hotel?" it would have been FINE! Instead, when I suggested to DH that we stay in a hotel I hear about how much this limits FIL's time with grandkids. And FIL's response is very much the same--"I love having the grandkids in the house" in reply to "we can stay in a hotel" or a disappointed "we'll need you to stay in a hotel" during visits when they're hosting GF's kids and don't have space for us. Even GF herself seems to brush off the suggestion and will say things about how much she appreciates having us there (after a visit during which she has made it clear at several moments before and during that she is incredibly inconvenienced by it).

I have suggested to DH and also SIL, with whom I am close, that maybe we need to adopt a model more similar to what you describe. Over the past 1-2 years BIL and DH will call each other just to complain about GF and it makes me feel badly that she gets trashed in these conversations but then all of the same behaviors continue, by all parties.

I think this provides some insights. It sounds like FIL and GF are not on the same page as a couple as to how to structure these visits, and maybe GF does not want to disappoint FIL. Maybe the visits are more of a fantasy type thing for FIL, with children running to "grandparents" and everyone gathering and grandparenting it up. GF just can't take that (and that's just her personality, my parents can't take that either). Wherever you stay, build breaks into your day. And I don't recommend having everyone (both sets of grandkids, BIL's kids too) descend on them. It's just too much.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It sounds to me like there already are a plentiful amount of boundaries in place and that perhaps you need fewer, not more. What further boundaries do you envision other than those already set by your FIL's GF?

If it is so stressful to your FIL's GF to host you then he should begin visiting you more often, either with or without his GF. Perhaps if she is socializing with your children when she doesn't have the burden of entertaining, she might find it easier. It does sound like she bears most of the load when they issue invitations to their home.

In the meantime, begin doing more of the asking and hosting. Your FIL can decide if he wants to take you up on your offer or not. But don't close the door on him just because you're chafing at his GF's boundary setting.

Good points. I very much want my kids to have a strong relationship with my FIL. Generally speaking we have gone to him/them 2-4 times a year since my oldest DC was born. We have also extended many invitations for FIL to come and in the past he came to visit quite a bit. My issue with the GF is not that we need better or clearer boundaries from her but rather that I feel my DH, BIL/SIL and I have generally tried to accommodate her every request, to the extent that I think it is beyond reasonable, without setting any boundaries in response. For example, driving 10+ hours round trip to be told we can’t visit in their home for more than 2-3 hours and sometimes not at all, meaning our only time with FIL is hosting him in our hotel room or meeting at a restaurant.

I certainly don’t feel we can dictate how or when we are at their home but feel like it’s reasonable to say at some point that we don’t feel welcome, rather than just not going anymore at all.

Why do you have to say that? Why can't you just begin asking your FIL to your house? My point is that you don't have to make this into a fight or a tug-of-war. Just begin changing the parameters by asking your FIL to your home more often. Hey, Dad, why don't you come to Laslo's soccer game on Saturday, stay the night, have breakfast with us and then either head home or go to the pool? or It is Laslo's birthday on Sunday and we're going to have a little family celebration. Do you want to come? You're more than welcome to spend the night Sunday if you don't want to drive home in the dark. or We haven't seen you in a while. Would you like to come for the weekend? The kids would love to take you to the park and we can grab dinner at xxx Saturday night. Not everything has to be a fight and not everything has to be you laying down the law. Just start upping your game by issuing more invitations.

The good news is that this is a faux-MIL and not an actual MIL. If/when your FIL needs caregiving, unless he's given her power of attorney for health/finances, it will be your DH and his sibling that make the decisions. I suggest you have your DH and his sibling have a frank discussion with their father about ALL of this. It will take some delicacy but you have a legitimate concern that with POA (or a marriage), she could exclude you from your FIL's life if he is incapacitated.

Instead of a hotel, could you get an AirBnB? when you visit? If so, you could get a bed/room for your FIL and you could hang out to your heart's content in a 'home-like' environment.

Anonymous wrote:New poster here. My step-mom is much like your 'faux MIL'. She has very specific time limits and very much limits her interactions with all children, not just my dad's grandkids. Unlike you, I know why: children (including her own) just exhaust and stress her. In our case, she truly loves all the kids, but just can't be around them very much w/o falling apart. So, my dad visits solo. We visit and stay elsewhere. We invite them to our home/hotel so they can leave whenever they want. And if there's an all day activity (say, a pool day), grandparents come separately so she can leave when it's good for her.

I don't think she's crazy. I love my stepmom, and while she won't be a grandmother to my young children, I feel that once my kids are college-age, she will be. So I stopped making her into a GM and we all spend time with her that works for her.

OP again. Thank you for this helpful reply. I think one of the things that makes it so hard to deal with GF is that there is no direct conversation. If at some time in the past decade she or FIL had said, "hosting this many people/kids is a lot for me/us, can we suggest you stay in a hotel?" it would have been FINE! Instead, when I suggested to DH that we stay in a hotel I hear about how much this limits FIL's time with grandkids. And FIL's response is very much the same--"I love having the grandkids in the house" in reply to "we can stay in a hotel" or a disappointed "we'll need you to stay in a hotel" during visits when they're hosting GF's kids and don't have space for us. Even GF herself seems to brush off the suggestion and will say things about how much she appreciates having us there (after a visit during which she has made it clear at several moments before and during that she is incredibly inconvenienced by it).

I have suggested to DH and also SIL, with whom I am close, that maybe we need to adopt a model more similar to what you describe. Over the past 1-2 years BIL and DH will call each other just to complain about GF and it makes me feel badly that she gets trashed in these conversations but then all of the same behaviors continue, by all parties.

Anonymous wrote:Has your husband spoken directly to his father about the faux MIL? What is his response?

OP again. I have to say, first, that I am genuinely appreciating having a forum to vent and consider all of this anonymously!

Up until about a month ago, no. I honestly think this is one of the big issues because at this point we are dealing with patterns that go back for a decade. DH and FIL have had 2 brief conversations in the past couple months in which DH has expressed our feeling unwelcome and FIL has expressed at least mild surprise. Most recently, DH pointed out that GF does not seem to enjoy having our kids around and FIL replied along the lines of "in her defense, your kids don't run to greet her when she walks in the room."

New poster here. My step-mom is much like your 'faux MIL'. She has very specific time limits and very much limits her interactions with all children, not just my dad's grandkids. Unlike you, I know why: children (including her own) just exhaust and stress her. In our case, she truly loves all the kids, but just can't be around them very much w/o falling apart. So, my dad visits solo. We visit and stay elsewhere. We invite them to our home/hotel so they can leave whenever they want. And if there's an all day activity (say, a pool day), grandparents come separately so she can leave when it's good for her.

I don't think she's crazy. I love my stepmom, and while she won't be a grandmother to my young children, I feel that once my kids are college-age, she will be. So I stopped making her into a GM and we all spend time with her that works for her.

Has your husband spoken directly to his father about the faux MIL? What is his response?

In a nutshell, she is crazy AF