Anonymous
Post 04/11/2018 09:04     Subject: Re:Middle school FCPS teachers - actual work hours?


Anonymous wrote:



Anonymous wrote:
MS teacher here.

I think a lot of this debate comes back to what you believe about your role as a teacher. For me (and many others), that role extends beyond the bell. If a student needs extra help and is willing to stay after school to seek that help, many of us are happy to provide it. The one-on-one or small group time allows opportunities to better get to know our students and build relationships, and it helps build in our students a sense of responsibility and ownership of their learning.

IMO, those who seem to see teaching as strictly bell-to-bell and feel the need to consult regulations for something like giving an hour of time once a week to support struggling students really make the rest of us look bad and should re-examine why they're still in this profession.

So if you are a teacher with a family you should reconsider teaching? Sorry not everyone can stay an hour every day, even some days. There are plenty of great teachers that teach bell to bell. Don't let Hollywood fool you that you have to put in insane hours to be a good teacher. 1.5 hours is enough for kids to learn in class. Differentiate your lessons so you can help those that need it. When I see teachers staying 2 hours past each night I honestly think they are bad teachers, it doesn't need to be that difficult.

I agree. Since when did leaving on time become a bad thing?

We have found that this happens in elementary school and lessens as students move through MS and HS. In our experience high school teachers provided very little, if any differentiation.


Seriously? What subject do you teach? And why do you assume teaching all subjects would be the same experience?
For English teachers, the amount of reading and grading one must do is considerable. Working late each day to do this, either at school or at home, is a necessity, and any English teacher who doesn't read a considerable amount of student work is not doing their job properly.
Perhaps it is you who is the "bad teacher."

Anonymous
Post 04/10/2018 22:53     Subject: Re:Middle school FCPS teachers - actual work hours?
Anonymous wrote:MS teacher here.

I think a lot of this debate comes back to what you believe about your role as a teacher. For me (and many others), that role extends beyond the bell. If a student needs extra help and is willing to stay after school to seek that help, many of us are happy to provide it. The one-on-one or small group time allows opportunities to better get to know our students and build relationships, and it helps build in our students a sense of responsibility and ownership of their learning.

IMO, those who seem to see teaching as strictly bell-to-bell and feel the need to consult regulations for something like giving an hour of time once a week to support struggling students really make the rest of us look bad and should re-examine why they're still in this profession.


I don't know anybody who consults regulations for giving an hour of time to support struggling students and that hasn't been suggested in this thread. We do however have policies and regulations for a reason. They protect rights as teachers (duty free lunch, planning time, evaluation, etc.). I believe in a a give and take balance, but that's not the case in all schools. Some administrators will take and take and refuse to give. Some will take advantage of staff if people let them. If you haven't worked under that type of admin that's good, but they exist and it's good for teachers to know there are protections in place.
Anonymous
Post 04/10/2018 22:40     Subject: Re:Middle school FCPS teachers - actual work hours?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:MS teacher here.

I think a lot of this debate comes back to what you believe about your role as a teacher. For me (and many others), that role extends beyond the bell. If a student needs extra help and is willing to stay after school to seek that help, many of us are happy to provide it. The one-on-one or small group time allows opportunities to better get to know our students and build relationships, and it helps build in our students a sense of responsibility and ownership of their learning.

IMO, those who seem to see teaching as strictly bell-to-bell and feel the need to consult regulations for something like giving an hour of time once a week to support struggling students really make the rest of us look bad and should re-examine why they're still in this profession.


So if you are a teacher with a family you should reconsider teaching? Sorry not everyone can stay an hour every day, even some days. There are plenty of great teachers that teach bell to bell. Don't let Hollywood fool you that you have to put in insane hours to be a good teacher. 1.5 hours is enough for kids to learn in class. Differentiate your lessons so you can help those that need it. When I see teachers staying 2 hours past each night I honestly think they are bad teachers, it doesn't need to be that difficult.


I agree. Since when did leaving on time become a bad thing?

We have found that this happens in elementary school and lessens as students move through MS and HS. In our experience high school teachers provided very little, if any differentiation.
Anonymous
Post 04/10/2018 21:40     Subject: Re:Middle school FCPS teachers - actual work hours?
Troll, loony, or terrible teacher.

No sane person would voluntarily be trying to switch from HS to MS, unless they only took up teaching for the "convenient" scheduling.
Anonymous
Post 04/10/2018 21:10     Subject: Re:Middle school FCPS teachers - actual work hours?
Anonymous wrote:MS teacher here.

I think a lot of this debate comes back to what you believe about your role as a teacher. For me (and many others), that role extends beyond the bell. If a student needs extra help and is willing to stay after school to seek that help, many of us are happy to provide it. The one-on-one or small group time allows opportunities to better get to know our students and build relationships, and it helps build in our students a sense of responsibility and ownership of their learning.

IMO, those who seem to see teaching as strictly bell-to-bell and feel the need to consult regulations for something like giving an hour of time once a week to support struggling students really make the rest of us look bad and should re-examine why they're still in this profession.


So if you are a teacher with a family you should reconsider teaching? Sorry not everyone can stay an hour every day, even some days. There are plenty of great teachers that teach bell to bell. Don't let Hollywood fool you that you have to put in insane hours to be a good teacher. 1.5 hours is enough for kids to learn in class. Differentiate your lessons so you can help those that need it. When I see teachers staying 2 hours past each night I honestly think they are bad teachers, it doesn't need to be that difficult.
Anonymous
Post 04/10/2018 20:19     Subject: Middle school FCPS teachers - actual work hours?
OP, it may not be totally impossible for you to switch. We have teachers that have SACC dropoff at 7 and get to school by 7:30. They have cleared it with admin and their classroom neighbor either opens their door and they start the warmup the teacher has left out the afternoon before OR they get 1st and 2nd block planning off. Wheb the MS bell schedule changed, our principal didn’t want to lose a bunch of teachers (we happen to have a lot of mid-career staff with school-aged kids), so she worJed it out. We all stay past contract hours most days, so it isn’t a big deal.
Anonymous
Post 04/10/2018 17:58     Subject: Re:Middle school FCPS teachers - actual work hours?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:MS teacher here.

I think a lot of this debate comes back to what you believe about your role as a teacher. For me (and many others), that role extends beyond the bell. If a student needs extra help and is willing to stay after school to seek that help, many of us are happy to provide it. The one-on-one or small group time allows opportunities to better get to know our students and build relationships, and it helps build in our students a sense of responsibility and ownership of their learning.

IMO, those who seem to see teaching as strictly bell-to-bell and feel the need to consult regulations for something like giving an hour of time once a week to support struggling students really make the rest of us look bad and should re-examine why they're still in this profession.


What you describe, being willing to stay after school and tutor, sounds like a choice not a requirement. Few teachers I know go bell to bell. Many of us put in “extra hours”. I teach in an elementary school and left st 5:00 today. That was nine hours of being busy, take away lunch. Usually I leave around 4:00. I go in for the occasional morning meeting, help with an after school event, etc. I met with a parent after school yesterday. My role extends beyond the bell, but I am choosing to do what I do. I’m not being required to do things after school on a regular basis. That’s different. Some people have their own children to pick up from daycare after work. Are they making us look bad because they have to leave at 3:45 to pick their kid up from daycare?


When the day ends at 2:15 and they're unwilling to stay once a week to help struggling students? Yes, yes it does make the rest of us look bad.

There is a different culture in middle and high school vs. elementary schools. I had a hard time understanding this when my own child was struggling in ES and needed extra help, but there was no time embedded for him to receive it. In middle and high schools, we have study hall-esque time for students to seek help during the day, and after school activities allow for students to take part in clubs and activities (MS) as well as sports (HS only). When you sign up to teach in a middle or high school, part of the expectation is being willing to work with students -- whether for remediation, extension, or activity -- after school every so often. An every day requirement would be excessive; once a week is not.

That being said, I do know of some teachers who had outside obligations that did not allow them to stay after school, so they offered their lunch time twice a week to work with students instead. It's not ideal, as students and teachers might eat at different times and thus not be free at the same time, but it was a compromise to be available to help students who need and are seeking it. I mentioned this in my previous post, but that's a big part of the mentality -- if kids are seeking help, if they want to own their learning and develop their responsibility, it's important for educators to support them.

Anonymous
Post 04/10/2018 17:50     Subject: Re:Middle school FCPS teachers - actual work hours?
Anonymous wrote:MS teacher here.

I think a lot of this debate comes back to what you believe about your role as a teacher. For me (and many others), that role extends beyond the bell. If a student needs extra help and is willing to stay after school to seek that help, many of us are happy to provide it. The one-on-one or small group time allows opportunities to better get to know our students and build relationships, and it helps build in our students a sense of responsibility and ownership of their learning.

IMO, those who seem to see teaching as strictly bell-to-bell and feel the need to consult regulations for something like giving an hour of time once a week to support struggling students really make the rest of us look bad and should re-examine why they're still in this profession.


What you describe, being willing to stay after school and tutor, sounds like a choice not a requirement. Few teachers I know go bell to bell. Many of us put in “extra hours”. I teach in an elementary school and left st 5:00 today. That was nine hours of being busy, take away lunch. Usually I leave around 4:00. I go in for the occasional morning meeting, help with an after school event, etc. I met with a parent after school yesterday. My role extends beyond the bell, but I am choosing to do what I do. I’m not being required to do things after school on a regular basis. That’s different. Some people have their own children to pick up from daycare after work. Are they making us look bad because they have to leave at 3:45 to pick their kid up from daycare?
Anonymous
Post 04/10/2018 15:48     Subject: Middle school FCPS teachers - actual work hours?
This is OP. There is no way I could work in a middle school. Sometimes I need to do the morning drop off and I could not make it work with SACC. Thank you for making the decision to stay working in a high school an easy one. While the afternoons may be easier, the mornings would be too rushed or impossible.

To everyone else, I don't know of a teacher that minds giving help after school to students. Most are very dedicated and I suspect the ones suggesting we check school regs are not actual teachers.
Anonymous
Post 04/10/2018 15:36     Subject: Middle school FCPS teachers - actual work hours?
I get to work around 7, and leave by 4 most days. I bring work home 1-2 days a week. Some years it's easy when I only have 2 preps--this year I have 3, so it's rougher.

We are required to stay after school until 3:45 one day per week for after school tutoring. Twice a month there are after school meetings until 3:30. If you have 1st or last block off, you have morning duty or bus duty and have to be monitoring students from 7:10-7:20 or 2:15-2:25.

You will not be able to do 7 am SACC drop off and 7:10 arrival unless the schools are literally right next to each other. By 7:05 the parking lot is filled with buses and it takes me a good 5-10 minutes to get past them and get a parking spot. Then I'm rushing to have my room opened by 7:20 when the kids start filing in.

I love that I can pick up my son from daycare by 4 almost every day. It only works because my husband does morning drop off though. No way I could do both.
Anonymous
Post 04/10/2018 15:28     Subject: Re:Middle school FCPS teachers - actual work hours?
MS teacher here.

I think a lot of this debate comes back to what you believe about your role as a teacher. For me (and many others), that role extends beyond the bell. If a student needs extra help and is willing to stay after school to seek that help, many of us are happy to provide it. The one-on-one or small group time allows opportunities to better get to know our students and build relationships, and it helps build in our students a sense of responsibility and ownership of their learning.

IMO, those who seem to see teaching as strictly bell-to-bell and feel the need to consult regulations for something like giving an hour of time once a week to support struggling students really make the rest of us look bad and should re-examine why they're still in this profession.
Anonymous
Post 04/10/2018 14:54     Subject: Re:Middle school FCPS teachers - actual work hours?
Anonymous wrote:Our former principal tried to guilt us into doing after school clubs at our Title One school. I told her that at my son's school, 90% of the clubs were run by parents. My principal said that the poor children never have any chance to do extracurricular activities. I am sick of people expecting teachers to be the saviors all of the time.


Right. They can’t “make” you do it.
Anonymous
Post 04/10/2018 11:57     Subject: Re:Middle school FCPS teachers - actual work hours?
Our school doesn't have a PTA and the after-school program is mostly babysitting so the principal wanted specific clubs. I later found out this came from a state audit which mentioned the lack of after school enrichment.
Anonymous
Post 04/10/2018 11:52     Subject: Middle school FCPS teachers - actual work hours?
Don't kids on FARMs get free SACC? That is the same as an afterschool club.
Anonymous
Post 04/10/2018 11:49     Subject: Re:Middle school FCPS teachers - actual work hours?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Our former principal tried to guilt us into doing after school clubs at our Title One school. I told her that at my son's school, 90% of the clubs were run by parents. My principal said that the poor children never have any chance to do extracurricular activities. I am sick of people expecting teachers to be the saviors all of the time.


most FCPS elementaries contract out clubs to vendors and the students pay the vendors directly. The PTA might run a lego club or something similar.


This doesn't work in high FARMs schools. Not enough kids can pay.