What percentage of students are struggling at school (FARMS rate isn't perfect but it is a good proxy for SES which correlates to academic achievement)? If your child is in a school with many needy children your child is going to seem fine or even ahead of other children who haven't been exposed to books, can't even write their name, don't know any letters, etc. The school is going to look at your request and explain that all your concerns are things that are taught in kindergarten and students are NOT expected to enter K already knowing those things. So for example, you are concerned she writes her letters starting from the bottom, they will say "wow, great that she can even write letters". If they are legible no one cares how they are formed (unless you have a rare kindergarten teacher who actually teaches and emphasizes letter formation- most new teachers don't).

You are going to have a big battle with the schools to have any of your concerns addressed in kindergarten. Why not wait a month into Kindergarten and see how she does. Meanwhile in the summer, buy the kindergarten handwriting without tears material -including the teacher's guide and work on handwriting.

Get an educational consultant

Anonymous wrote:We have concerns regarding inattentiveness, memory issues, handwriting issues, reading/letter recognition skills, according to preschool teacher for our 5 year old who will be entering K in the fall. We have a private neuropsych scheduled but not until November. I've gotten the paperwork to start the process with MCPS. Any tips, things I should know, etc would be much appreciated. This is for a school that feeds into Pyle/Whitman.

We are in the same situation right now.
For sure we need speech, and are highly monitoring for dyslexia and ADD inattentive.
She was not in a traditional PK but exhibits inattentiveness, letter/number recog issues, gets frustrated easily even when coloring, etc. Plus our family history of ADHD and sometimes dyslexia.

SHould I call our MCPS ES now about setting up speech tests or getting the process done? She literally will not say certain blended sound words, will sub in a synonym. She shuts down.

Or should we do this under the radar and via private therapy and tests? She was in speech therapy and responded well when 4 yo.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The school can test as part of the IEP process. It’s a long process and they will likely report back that there is either no problem or no educational impact. Once he is there and they see the struggles firsthand, you may find they change their tune but there are no guarantees. Hiring an advocate may up your chances but your description makes it sound like your child may not qualify even then. We know of a number of families denied an IEP for ADHD. Of course a big factor is the particular school. Our school recently had a complete changing of the guard and things are much better than they used to be.

Your child is unlikely to get OT even in a very supportive school. We were told they only provide OT as an add on to speech therapy and the deficit must be very severe. My child could not cut, write or even use a glue stick (he had a documented physical disability that affected his fine motor). We were told if he didn’t qualify for speech he couldn’t have OT. Fortunately he did end up qualifying for speech and his disability was severe enough they agreed to OT. Sadly, the OT provided was worthless. It was group with 3 kids, once a week, and frequently canceled. As DC got older it became clear he had LD and the school fought adding it to the IEP based on their testing. We did private testing and hired an advocate. Success? Not really! They provided pull out and push in but it wasn’t effective. We did private therapy for everything for years. With both disabilities, accommodations were the main benefit of the IEP. With that said, you might find it easier to ask for a 504. Obviously, a good IEP with both effective interventions and accommodations is what you want, but my child had a beautifully written IEP that meant nothing.

My other child with a well documented history of motor planning issues and years of OT under his belt was denied OT completely. He had an existing IEP in place for speech before K. We hired an advocate and met before the year started and got nothing.

Definitely go private for OT. Don’t wait until they deny you because early intervention is really key. Ask to be put on cancellation list for the neuropsych so you can come armed with documentation from the start. And then consider an advocate if you truly believe your child can’t be successful without supports. The system really stinks. Good luck!

Was this DCPS? The OT thing is because of the weird way the DC regulations define special education. OT alone is a "related service" and not special education, so a kid who only needs OT does not qualify for an IEP. That's why you also needed speech, which then pulls OT into the IEP! Pretty dumb when you have a kid who literally can't hold a pencil, as you know.

MCPS.

This is not a DCPS or MCPS thing. It’s the way IDEA is written to define related service.

Oh you're right - I think I was confusing it with the state's ability to define "developmental delay."

But the gist of what I wrote is (I think) correct, right? If the only service you need is OT, then you won't get an IEP because that's not "special education." You have to find a way to link the delay or disability to some modification of in-class instruction. The way we did this with my kid who REALLY needed fine motor support is to argue that the in class instruction needed to be adapted as well (with teacher training and push-in by the special ed generalist). This was in addition to the OT pull outs. We also argued that there were behavioral issues. But really, it was the significant fine motor delay that was the main issue. And I don't mean just not writing well; he could barely scribble on his own when he started K (despite a whole year of private and ISP OT before that). I think my kid was a fairly unique case though; it seems like usually a fine motor delay is not that severe when it's the most prominent "symptom" at the time.

You can also hitch the OT to speech therapy, since that is defined in the statute as "special education."

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The school can test as part of the IEP process. It’s a long process and they will likely report back that there is either no problem or no educational impact. Once he is there and they see the struggles firsthand, you may find they change their tune but there are no guarantees. Hiring an advocate may up your chances but your description makes it sound like your child may not qualify even then. We know of a number of families denied an IEP for ADHD. Of course a big factor is the particular school. Our school recently had a complete changing of the guard and things are much better than they used to be.

Your child is unlikely to get OT even in a very supportive school. We were told they only provide OT as an add on to speech therapy and the deficit must be very severe. My child could not cut, write or even use a glue stick (he had a documented physical disability that affected his fine motor). We were told if he didn’t qualify for speech he couldn’t have OT. Fortunately he did end up qualifying for speech and his disability was severe enough they agreed to OT. Sadly, the OT provided was worthless. It was group with 3 kids, once a week, and frequently canceled. As DC got older it became clear he had LD and the school fought adding it to the IEP based on their testing. We did private testing and hired an advocate. Success? Not really! They provided pull out and push in but it wasn’t effective. We did private therapy for everything for years. With both disabilities, accommodations were the main benefit of the IEP. With that said, you might find it easier to ask for a 504. Obviously, a good IEP with both effective interventions and accommodations is what you want, but my child had a beautifully written IEP that meant nothing.

My other child with a well documented history of motor planning issues and years of OT under his belt was denied OT completely. He had an existing IEP in place for speech before K. We hired an advocate and met before the year started and got nothing.

Definitely go private for OT. Don’t wait until they deny you because early intervention is really key. Ask to be put on cancellation list for the neuropsych so you can come armed with documentation from the start. And then consider an advocate if you truly believe your child can’t be successful without supports. The system really stinks. Good luck!

Was this DCPS? The OT thing is because of the weird way the DC regulations define special education. OT alone is a "related service" and not special education, so a kid who only needs OT does not qualify for an IEP. That's why you also needed speech, which then pulls OT into the IEP! Pretty dumb when you have a kid who literally can't hold a pencil, as you know.

MCPS.

This is not a DCPS or MCPS thing. It’s the way IDEA is written to define related service.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We have concerns regarding inattentiveness, memory issues, handwriting issues, reading/letter recognition skills, according to preschool teacher for our 5 year old who will be entering K in the fall. We have a private neuropsych scheduled but not until November. I've gotten the paperwork to start the process with MCPS. Any tips, things I should know, etc would be much appreciated. This is for a school that feeds into Pyle/Whitman.

OP, it's entirely unclear what you want: 504 plan? IEP? EMT meeting and "intervention" from the teacher. What "paperwork" and what "process" have you started with MCPS.

We can provide better tips if you are more clear about what your endgame is.

I would like an IEP for K and to ensure that he'll get any available and appropriate support for these challenges which I'm guessing may include OT and pull outs for reading. I suppose other accommodations too. I'm not familiar with the process. We were too late for Child Find so need to complete paperwork to request and evaluation by the school. It is called Private/Parochial School Student Referral for Special Education Services.

By "starting the process" for an IEP with MCPS you are essentially asking them to do an assessment, yet you say you have a neuropsych scheduled? Here is how it works for MCPS -- you ask for an IEP in writing and they have 30 days to set the initial IEP eligibility screening meeting. Then, if the IEP team (which includes YOU and anyone you want to invite) decides if there is enough evidence to show that there might (not definitely but might) be a need for an IEP. If so, at the screening meeting, the IEP team decides what kind of assessment is need to make a final determination of eligibility. What the school tries to get away with as an "assessment" can vary widely from nothing more than informal classroom observation and teacher reports (which would not be a legally adequate assessment) to proper psychoeducational assessment with IQ and full range of achievement testing. MCPS has 60 days to do the assessment and schedule the final determination meeting. MCPS must share all materials for the IEP meeting (including the assessment) with you 5 days before the meeting. If an IEP is determined to be necessary, then the IEP team has another 30 days to write the IEP and meet to finalize it.

The thing is, if you have already scheduled a private neuropsych, then you might want to wait for that to come back and wait to have the IEP meeting until after you can share the neuropsych report. Often, a team will decide to just take the neuropsych report and use that rather than do their own assessment. (They have a heavy caseload and this makes it easier for them, plus it's usually more comprehensive than what they would do and your neuropsych may do some testing that can't be duplicated for another 6 mos.) Sometimes, if you present the neuropsych, the eligibility screening and determination meeting can be collapsed into one meeting, because the "assessment" is already done (provided by you).

If your neuropsych isn't scheduled until Nov., it usually takes about 6 weeks to get the written report back, add on the timeline for all the IEP meetings to screen, determine eligibility, write the IEP, etc. and you won't have an IEP until Feb. at the earliest probably.

Overall, this isn't bad if it helps you get what you want in the end. You can use the time that DC is in school but doesn't have the IEP yet to document the ways in which her problems are impacting her education, which will help with the IEP.

IME, MCPS is terrible at teaching reading and writing, so if you see problems with letter recognition and other reading or writing related skills, I would plan on finding a private tutor to start with your DD in the spring of K if she doesn't respond well to K instruction. Better to remediate early, IMO. Look for people skilled in OG or other explicit phonics-based instruction and handwriting instruction.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The school can test as part of the IEP process. It’s a long process and they will likely report back that there is either no problem or no educational impact. Once he is there and they see the struggles firsthand, you may find they change their tune but there are no guarantees. Hiring an advocate may up your chances but your description makes it sound like your child may not qualify even then. We know of a number of families denied an IEP for ADHD. Of course a big factor is the particular school. Our school recently had a complete changing of the guard and things are much better than they used to be.

Your child is unlikely to get OT even in a very supportive school. We were told they only provide OT as an add on to speech therapy and the deficit must be very severe. My child could not cut, write or even use a glue stick (he had a documented physical disability that affected his fine motor). We were told if he didn’t qualify for speech he couldn’t have OT. Fortunately he did end up qualifying for speech and his disability was severe enough they agreed to OT. Sadly, the OT provided was worthless. It was group with 3 kids, once a week, and frequently canceled. As DC got older it became clear he had LD and the school fought adding it to the IEP based on their testing. We did private testing and hired an advocate. Success? Not really! They provided pull out and push in but it wasn’t effective. We did private therapy for everything for years. With both disabilities, accommodations were the main benefit of the IEP. With that said, you might find it easier to ask for a 504. Obviously, a good IEP with both effective interventions and accommodations is what you want, but my child had a beautifully written IEP that meant nothing.

My other child with a well documented history of motor planning issues and years of OT under his belt was denied OT completely. He had an existing IEP in place for speech before K. We hired an advocate and met before the year started and got nothing.

Definitely go private for OT. Don’t wait until they deny you because early intervention is really key. Ask to be put on cancellation list for the neuropsych so you can come armed with documentation from the start. And then consider an advocate if you truly believe your child can’t be successful without supports. The system really stinks. Good luck!

Was this DCPS? The OT thing is because of the weird way the DC regulations define special education. OT alone is a "related service" and not special education, so a kid who only needs OT does not qualify for an IEP. That's why you also needed speech, which then pulls OT into the IEP! Pretty dumb when you have a kid who literally can't hold a pencil, as you know.

MCPS.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We have concerns regarding inattentiveness, memory issues, handwriting issues, reading/letter recognition skills, according to preschool teacher for our 5 year old who will be entering K in the fall. We have a private neuropsych scheduled but not until November. I've gotten the paperwork to start the process with MCPS. Any tips, things I should know, etc would be much appreciated. This is for a school that feeds into Pyle/Whitman.

OP, it's entirely unclear what you want: 504 plan? IEP? EMT meeting and "intervention" from the teacher. What "paperwork" and what "process" have you started with MCPS.

We can provide better tips if you are more clear about what your endgame is.

I would like an IEP for K and to ensure that he'll get any available and appropriate support for these challenges which I'm guessing may include OT and pull outs for reading. I suppose other accommodations too. I'm not familiar with the process. We were too late for Child Find so need to complete paperwork to request and evaluation by the school. It is called Private/Parochial School Student Referral for Special Education Services.

I just don't see how you think you'll get pullouts for reading. At least half the class won't even be reading at all yet! Give it a few months in K to see what happpens and do private OT in the meantime.

Can she draw or write her name now? Sit during circle time?

Don't forget you have a whole 6 months before K even starts.

Good point about the reading. She had write her name though R backwards and writes from the bottom up. She is fine sitting during circle time but just is not retaining information and sometimes refuses to do tasks that are difficult for her.

If she can write her name at all, and can sit during circle time, she's going to be able to participate in K. Reversing letters is normal at this age, and she's able to pay attention/follow rules in an age appropriate way.

By way of comparison, we did get an IEP for my incoming Kindergartener (not MCPS). This was because he had a history of being severely disruptive in preschool and had a severe fine motor delay. He tested as a 1 yr old in fine motor skills as a 4 year old. At 4.5 he could barely even make a mark on paper, much less write his name at all! The other kids I know of who got IEPs before Kindergarten or right after after starting has ASD diagnoses or a history of disruptive behavior and other delays.

Honestly your child doesn't sound delayed, or only very slightly. I think private OT would be a good step for you to get her fine motor skills assessed.

This is not to say there's nothing going on - especially if you have a family history of inattentive adhd. Just that I don't think she sounds delayed academically right now.

Thanks for this. It is really the preschool teacher's concern that has me worried and trying to take action now. She felt we should look into the McLean school and is worried that because DD is not disruptive, she will get lost with a 24 to 1 ratio. Private is just so expensive that I'm hoping the school will be able to do some things and I can supplement. She really thinks it is dyslexia and adhd. While some say it is too early to diagnose dyslexia, she will be one of the oldest in the class as she will be 6 in September.

I would take what the preschool teacher says with a big grain of salt. they aren't supposed to diagnose like that, and dyslexia would be hard even for a professional to diagnose! Some preschool teachers are like that.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We have concerns regarding inattentiveness, memory issues, handwriting issues, reading/letter recognition skills, according to preschool teacher for our 5 year old who will be entering K in the fall. We have a private neuropsych scheduled but not until November. I've gotten the paperwork to start the process with MCPS. Any tips, things I should know, etc would be much appreciated. This is for a school that feeds into Pyle/Whitman.

OP, it's entirely unclear what you want: 504 plan? IEP? EMT meeting and "intervention" from the teacher. What "paperwork" and what "process" have you started with MCPS.

We can provide better tips if you are more clear about what your endgame is.

I would like an IEP for K and to ensure that he'll get any available and appropriate support for these challenges which I'm guessing may include OT and pull outs for reading. I suppose other accommodations too. I'm not familiar with the process. We were too late for Child Find so need to complete paperwork to request and evaluation by the school. It is called Private/Parochial School Student Referral for Special Education Services.

I just don't see how you think you'll get pullouts for reading. At least half the class won't even be reading at all yet! Give it a few months in K to see what happpens and do private OT in the meantime.

Can she draw or write her name now? Sit during circle time?

Don't forget you have a whole 6 months before K even starts.

Good point about the reading. She had write her name though R backwards and writes from the bottom up. She is fine sitting during circle time but just is not retaining information and sometimes refuses to do tasks that are difficult for her.

If she can write her name at all, and can sit during circle time, she's going to be able to participate in K. Reversing letters is normal at this age, and she's able to pay attention/follow rules in an age appropriate way.

By way of comparison, we did get an IEP for my incoming Kindergartener (not MCPS). This was because he had a history of being severely disruptive in preschool and had a severe fine motor delay. He tested as a 1 yr old in fine motor skills as a 4 year old. At 4.5 he could barely even make a mark on paper, much less write his name at all! The other kids I know of who got IEPs before Kindergarten or right after after starting has ASD diagnoses or a history of disruptive behavior and other delays.

Honestly your child doesn't sound delayed, or only very slightly. I think private OT would be a good step for you to get her fine motor skills assessed.

This is not to say there's nothing going on - especially if you have a family history of inattentive adhd. Just that I don't think she sounds delayed academically right now.

Thanks for this. It is really the preschool teacher's concern that has me worried and trying to take action now. She felt we should look into the McLean school and is worried that because DD is not disruptive, she will get lost with a 24 to 1 ratio. Private is just so expensive that I'm hoping the school will be able to do some things and I can supplement. She really thinks it is dyslexia and adhd. While some say it is too early to diagnose dyslexia, she will be one of the oldest in the class as she will be 6 in September.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We have concerns regarding inattentiveness, memory issues, handwriting issues, reading/letter recognition skills, according to preschool teacher for our 5 year old who will be entering K in the fall. We have a private neuropsych scheduled but not until November. I've gotten the paperwork to start the process with MCPS. Any tips, things I should know, etc would be much appreciated. This is for a school that feeds into Pyle/Whitman.

OP, it's entirely unclear what you want: 504 plan? IEP? EMT meeting and "intervention" from the teacher. What "paperwork" and what "process" have you started with MCPS.

We can provide better tips if you are more clear about what your endgame is.

I would like an IEP for K and to ensure that he'll get any available and appropriate support for these challenges which I'm guessing may include OT and pull outs for reading. I suppose other accommodations too. I'm not familiar with the process. We were too late for Child Find so need to complete paperwork to request and evaluation by the school. It is called Private/Parochial School Student Referral for Special Education Services.

I just don't see how you think you'll get pullouts for reading. At least half the class won't even be reading at all yet! Give it a few months in K to see what happpens and do private OT in the meantime.

Can she draw or write her name now? Sit during circle time?

Don't forget you have a whole 6 months before K even starts.

Good point about the reading. She had write her name though R backwards and writes from the bottom up. She is fine sitting during circle time but just is not retaining information and sometimes refuses to do tasks that are difficult for her.

If she can write her name at all, and can sit during circle time, she's going to be able to participate in K. Reversing letters is normal at this age, and she's able to pay attention/follow rules in an age appropriate way.

By way of comparison, we did get an IEP for my incoming Kindergartener (not MCPS). This was because he had a history of being severely disruptive in preschool and had a severe fine motor delay. He tested as a 1 yr old in fine motor skills as a 4 year old. At 4.5 he could barely even make a mark on paper, much less write his name at all! The other kids I know of who got IEPs before Kindergarten or right after after starting has ASD diagnoses or a history of disruptive behavior and other delays.

Honestly your child doesn't sound delayed, or only very slightly. I think private OT would be a good step for you to get her fine motor skills assessed.

This is not to say there's nothing going on - especially if you have a family history of inattentive adhd. Just that I don't think she sounds delayed academically right now.

forgot to add: private OT is great for working on difficult tasks as well.