Where are you in Howard County, OP? Maybe there are people who have specific experience with the schools in the areas you are considering.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Pretty much: they don't check the elementary homework, or don't enforce it, citing research that says homework is bad, then wonder why their kid doesn't get on the fast track for math in middle school, or why their child's vocabulary isn't as strong as their peers.
They claim all readers level out by 3rd grade (my favorite incorrect utterance), and don't lift a finger when it appears their child may have dyslexia or is showing symptoms of ADHD, despite teacher warnings that their child struggles with reading and math, or is inattentive in class, because, hey, kids should not be forced into anything. They're happy and proud when their kid barely reaches grade level - as if grade level in the US meant something good.

Typical "I think I know best so I'm not going to do the heavy lifting" mentality.

Now of course you're going to say that some kids did squat and went on to be extremely successful. Naturally, otherwise the other parents wouldn't have that hope for their own children. My husband was one of those, actually. His IQ is off the charts, however, so he's not within the average range and was able to compensate and catch up when he needed to. Beware of outliers.

And which neighborhoods? We experienced this in Silver Spring, and left. I'm sure there are many many others.

Ah, you're talking about neighborhoods with middle-class, educated families, where parents have an attitude towards raising children that is different from yours.

Not impressed by your "off the charts" smart husband who slacked off and still did well. My parents taught me to work hard, despite my high IQ (150).

He was a war refugee and his parents struggled to put food on the table. He went hungry and repaired motorbikes after school for money. He was left to his own devices and wised up to the benefits of education in high school. He had never done a lick of work before his last two years of high school, and then went on to get an MD and a PhD. He is now doing cancer research.

You are missing the entire point, PP. I'm saying that such people are rarities. Most people should work diligently to achieve.

Anonymous wrote:I’m still trying to figure this out. For me it goes beyond the test score listed on great schools. What else makes up a good school? We are house shopping and see some with lower scores but the community loves the school, while others say they don’t want anything to do with the school because of the score. I live in Howard County.

Before kids, I always thought good schools are ones where the scores were high, so that was what I was looking for when I house hunted. Now that we had bought in a "good school" area and have kids in the system, my definition of "good school" has definitely changed. For one, good schools is a place where you have a solid admin with caring principals and teachers who communicate often with parents. While some teachers are excellent at our school, the communication is very poor.

Another trait would be a school that is able to meet the needs of all sorts of learners. In our "W" school, my kids are considered higher performers. What that means for them is they barely get any teacher attention during reading and math blocks. The highest reading groups meet about 10 minutes a couple of times a week, if even that, and then are told to go back to their desks to complete worksheets. Most of these worksheets aren't returned to them until a much later time, they never get the proper feedback to improve. My child is also told that he gets "enriched math" but really isn't anything different. So pretty much the good scores that these early elementary school kids get are not due to the school, but due to the parents enriching them outside. There are a couple of "W" schools who do pullouts, but it appears as though it is admin discretion rather than something that is built into part of the system.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Schools where the vast majority of students and teachers are focused on one thing and one thing only: Learning.

Then there aren't any good schools. Kids are kids.

Sorry to hear neither you nor your kids have enjoyed good schools so far.

May I encourage you to try harder.

I think that poster meant that the "good schools" are usually good because the kids are prepared and well supported at home..not because the teachers and curriculum are so superior at some schools.

DP.. I think it's a combo of home and school environment. A good school doesn't have high teacher turnover, and IMO, the #1 indicator of how good a school/staff is how well they educate the lower income students who don't have the support at home for enrichment. If the low income kids do well in school, it tells me that not only do their parents care about their education, but that the teachers and admin are doing something right. That's not to say they should ignore the wealthier kids (we are middle/upper income). Such kids need challenging curriculum too, which leads to, a good school also knows how to address the needs of a diverse student body - and I don't mean ethnicity or SES.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Pretty much: they don't check the elementary homework, or don't enforce it, citing research that says homework is bad, then wonder why their kid doesn't get on the fast track for math in middle school, or why their child's vocabulary isn't as strong as their peers.
They claim all readers level out by 3rd grade (my favorite incorrect utterance), and don't lift a finger when it appears their child may have dyslexia or is showing symptoms of ADHD, despite teacher warnings that their child struggles with reading and math, or is inattentive in class, because, hey, kids should not be forced into anything. They're happy and proud when their kid barely reaches grade level - as if grade level in the US meant something good.

Typical "I think I know best so I'm not going to do the heavy lifting" mentality.

Now of course you're going to say that some kids did squat and went on to be extremely successful. Naturally, otherwise the other parents wouldn't have that hope for their own children. My husband was one of those, actually. His IQ is off the charts, however, so he's not within the average range and was able to compensate and catch up when he needed to. Beware of outliers.

And which neighborhoods? We experienced this in Silver Spring, and left. I'm sure there are many many others.

Ah, you're talking about neighborhoods with middle-class, educated families, where parents have an attitude towards raising children that is different from yours.

Not impressed by your "off the charts" smart husband who slacked off and still did well. My parents taught me to work hard, despite my high IQ (150).

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Schools where the vast majority of students and teachers are focused on one thing and one thing only: Learning.

Then there aren't any good schools. Kids are kids.

Sorry to hear neither you nor your kids have enjoyed good schools so far.

May I encourage you to try harder.

I think that poster meant that the "good schools" are usually good because the kids are prepared and well supported at home..not because the teachers and curriculum are so superior at some schools.

Anonymous wrote:

Pretty much: they don't check the elementary homework, or don't enforce it, citing research that says homework is bad, then wonder why their kid doesn't get on the fast track for math in middle school, or why their child's vocabulary isn't as strong as their peers.
They claim all readers level out by 3rd grade (my favorite incorrect utterance), and don't lift a finger when it appears their child may have dyslexia or is showing symptoms of ADHD, despite teacher warnings that their child struggles with reading and math, or is inattentive in class, because, hey, kids should not be forced into anything. They're happy and proud when their kid barely reaches grade level - as if grade level in the US meant something good.

Typical "I think I know best so I'm not going to do the heavy lifting" mentality.

Now of course you're going to say that some kids did squat and went on to be extremely successful. Naturally, otherwise the other parents wouldn't have that hope for their own children. My husband was one of those, actually. His IQ is off the charts, however, so he's not within the average range and was able to compensate and catch up when he needed to. Beware of outliers.

And which neighborhoods? We experienced this in Silver Spring, and left. I'm sure there are many many others.

Ah, you're talking about neighborhoods with middle-class, educated families, where parents have an attitude towards raising children that is different from yours.

Anonymous wrote:Most what's mentioned above, but also, I'd like to see the class periods to be shorter. It should be about quality and not quantity. They should work hard for 40 minutes and then play hard.
How can there be so little recess when school is 6 hours in elementary school? That's a long day. That's for high school kids.

+1000

this is one of my biggest criticisms of elementary education in this country. these kids *need* the release.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
A neighborhood where parents care about their children's education and have the money to invest in it.

There's no secret. It's not the school itself, they all follow the same program and have the same teachers. It's the community that changes the nature of the school.

The end.

I have met very few parents who don't care about their children's education.

And I have met plenty, which is why I don't live in those areas.

Really? You've met plenty of parents whose opinion about their kids was, eh, who cares what they do? And they all live in "those areas" -- what areas, exactly?

Pretty much: they don't check the elementary homework, or don't enforce it, citing research that says homework is bad, then wonder why their kid doesn't get on the fast track for math in middle school, or why their child's vocabulary isn't as strong as their peers.
They claim all readers level out by 3rd grade (my favorite incorrect utterance), and don't lift a finger when it appears their child may have dyslexia or is showing symptoms of ADHD, despite teacher warnings that their child struggles with reading and math, or is inattentive in class, because, hey, kids should not be forced into anything. They're happy and proud when their kid barely reaches grade level - as if grade level in the US meant something good.

Typical "I think I know best so I'm not going to do the heavy lifting" mentality.

Now of course you're going to say that some kids did squat and went on to be extremely successful. Naturally, otherwise the other parents wouldn't have that hope for their own children. My husband was one of those, actually. His IQ is off the charts, however, so he's not within the average range and was able to compensate and catch up when he needed to. Beware of outliers.

And which neighborhoods? We experienced this in Silver Spring, and left. I'm sure there are many many others.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Schools where the vast majority of students and teachers are focused on one thing and one thing only: Learning.

Then there aren't any good schools. Kids are kids.

Sorry to hear neither you nor your kids have enjoyed good schools so far.

May I encourage you to try harder.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
A neighborhood where parents care about their children's education and have the money to invest in it.

There's no secret. It's not the school itself, they all follow the same program and have the same teachers. It's the community that changes the nature of the school.

The end.

I have met very few parents who don't care about their children's education.

Right, but I think the second part of PP's answer is critical. Everyone wants what's best for their kids, but unfortunately if they don't have the money to invest in their kid's educations, the outcomes won't necessarily be all that great. You need both.

I don’t live in a W cluster and we supplement heavily (tutoring, Mathnasium, academic camps, etc). So how do you know what people in a neighborhood are doing without asking them?

Of course. I'm talking about parents who can't afford tutoring, Mathnasium, and academic camps. I would never say non-W cluster parents can't supplement or invest in their kids' educations. I'm talking about parents who have no disposable income and who work multiple jobs, and so don't have the time to do anything but send their kid to school and hope for the best.

Edited to add: We're not in a W cluster, and absolutely supplement.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
A neighborhood where parents care about their children's education and have the money to invest in it.

There's no secret. It's not the school itself, they all follow the same program and have the same teachers. It's the community that changes the nature of the school.

The end.

I have met very few parents who don't care about their children's education.

Right, but I think the second part of PP's answer is critical. Everyone wants what's best for their kids, but unfortunately if they don't have the money to invest in their kid's educations, the outcomes won't necessarily be all that great. You need both.

I don’t live in a W cluster and we supplement heavily (tutoring, Mathnasium, academic camps, etc). So how do you know what people in a neighborhood are doing without asking them?

Of course. I'm talking about parents who can't afford tutoring, Mathnasium, and academic camps. I would never say non-W cluster parents can't supplement or invest in their kids' educations. I'm talking about parents who have no disposable income and who work multiple jobs, and so don't have the time to do anything but send their kid to school and hope for the best.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
A neighborhood where parents care about their children's education and have the money to invest in it.

There's no secret. It's not the school itself, they all follow the same program and have the same teachers. It's the community that changes the nature of the school.

The end.

I have met very few parents who don't care about their children's education.

Right, but I think the second part of PP's answer is critical. Everyone wants what's best for their kids, but unfortunately if they don't have the money to invest in their kid's educations, the outcomes won't necessarily be all that great. You need both.

I don’t live in a W cluster and we supplement heavily (tutoring, Mathnasium, academic camps, etc). So how do you know what people in a neighborhood are doing without asking them?

Most what's mentioned above, but also, I'd like to see the class periods to be shorter. It should be about quality and not quantity. They should work hard for 40 minutes and then play hard.
How can there be so little recess when school is 6 hours in elementary school? That's a long day. That's for high school kids.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
A neighborhood where parents care about their children's education and have the money to invest in it.

There's no secret. It's not the school itself, they all follow the same program and have the same teachers. It's the community that changes the nature of the school.

The end.

I have met very few parents who don't care about their children's education.

Right, but I think the second part of PP's answer is critical. Everyone wants what's best for their kids, but unfortunately if they don't have the money to invest in their kid's educations, the outcomes won't necessarily be all that great. You need both.