Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm the previous prosecutor poster coming back to comment on the last two posts. As much as I appreciate their perspectives, I get frustrated when people chalk up DV to "anger issues." DV is about so much more than anger problems. If it were only about his anger, he'd also hit his children, parents, boss, server at a restaurant, other drivers on the road etc. etc. when they made him angry too. There's an additional pathology with domestic abusers that's less fixable than someone who just has problems controlling their anger.

This is a very interesting perspective I never thought of. What do you think it is about the marital relationship that makes them violent? Arguably marriage is the most intimate relationship most people have, and thus is capable of producing anger and frustration above and beyond what one experiences in other relationships.

PP back again. I don't know exactly. Probably some combination of misogyny, control issues, and good old fashioned "not being wired right." My ex was Ivy-educated, had a great job, and came from a decent family with no history of abuse. I'm entirely convinced that he was just wired wrong.

People often don't want to hear it, but I agree with your statement. Some people seem to be overly reactive from birth.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm the previous prosecutor poster coming back to comment on the last two posts. As much as I appreciate their perspectives, I get frustrated when people chalk up DV to "anger issues." DV is about so much more than anger problems. If it were only about his anger, he'd also hit his children, parents, boss, server at a restaurant, other drivers on the road etc. etc. when they made him angry too. There's an additional pathology with domestic abusers that's less fixable than someone who just has problems controlling their anger.

This is a very interesting perspective I never thought of. What do you think it is about the marital relationship that makes them violent? Arguably marriage is the most intimate relationship most people have, and thus is capable of producing anger and frustration above and beyond what one experiences in other relationships.

PP back again. I don't know exactly. Probably some combination of misogyny, control issues, and good old fashioned "not being wired right." My ex was Ivy-educated, had a great job, and came from a decent family with no history of abuse. I'm entirely convinced that he was just wired wrong.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm the previous prosecutor poster coming back to comment on the last two posts. As much as I appreciate their perspectives, I get frustrated when people chalk up DV to "anger issues." DV is about so much more than anger problems. If it were only about his anger, he'd also hit his children, parents, boss, server at a restaurant, other drivers on the road etc. etc. when they made him angry too. There's an additional pathology with domestic abusers that's less fixable than someone who just has problems controlling their anger.

I don't think you can say unequivocally that anger issues aren't at play. I'm a PP who has had people very close to me have DV issues, and there were certainly anger issues. In my experience, the person is able to hold it together for work and even kids, but they think that it's okay for the spouse to be the outlet. That's not the case in all DV situations, but it certainly was the case in the one close to me. Yes, there are also control issues.

Just because a person is screaming at everyone all the time doesn't mean they don't have anger issues. A person can exercise self control all day, knowing very well he can go home and binge/unleash.

I didn't mean to imply that abusers don't have anger issues...they obviously do. My point was that there's more than JUST anger issues. Anger management doesn't solve the problem because the issue goes much farther than just an inability to control anger.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm the previous prosecutor poster coming back to comment on the last two posts. As much as I appreciate their perspectives, I get frustrated when people chalk up DV to "anger issues." DV is about so much more than anger problems. If it were only about his anger, he'd also hit his children, parents, boss, server at a restaurant, other drivers on the road etc. etc. when they made him angry too. There's an additional pathology with domestic abusers that's less fixable than someone who just has problems controlling their anger.

This is a very interesting perspective I never thought of. What do you think it is about the marital relationship that makes them violent? Arguably marriage is the most intimate relationship most people have, and thus is capable of producing anger and frustration above and beyond what one experiences in other relationships.

NP and DV survivor. DV is about controlling a partner so that the abuser is the only important person in their life. It’s not about the “marital relationship” being intimate. And it’s not about “anger”. My ex has excellent control over himself - and he chose when to abuse me. It may have looked like anger from the outside, but it wasn’t, not really. It was when he felt as though he didn’t have “enough” control over me, or when I “disobeyed” him or did something I knew he didn’t like.

I'm sure that was the case in your situation, but I don't think every DV situation is the same. In the case close to me, anger issues were definitely a part of it. Your experience doesn't negate mine.

No it doesn’t negate anyone experience. I was just saying that what can look like anger isn’t always just that. If you want to read about DV a book I found really helpful was “Why does he do that? Inside the minds of angry and abusive men” by Lundy Bancroft. It talks about the different types of abusers, and why they act the way they do, and how they justify their behavior.

And frankly, if you aren’t IN the abusive relationship (ie, sharing a home with them or the abuser/abused party) you probably know a lot less than you think you do.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm the previous prosecutor poster coming back to comment on the last two posts. As much as I appreciate their perspectives, I get frustrated when people chalk up DV to "anger issues." DV is about so much more than anger problems. If it were only about his anger, he'd also hit his children, parents, boss, server at a restaurant, other drivers on the road etc. etc. when they made him angry too. There's an additional pathology with domestic abusers that's less fixable than someone who just has problems controlling their anger.

I don't think you can say unequivocally that anger issues aren't at play. I'm a PP who has had people very close to me have DV issues, and there were certainly anger issues. In my experience, the person is able to hold it together for work and even kids, but they think that it's okay for the spouse to be the outlet. That's not the case in all DV situations, but it certainly was the case in the one close to me. Yes, there are also control issues.

Just because a person is screaming at everyone all the time doesn't mean they don't have anger issues. A person can exercise self control all day, knowing very well he can go home and binge/unleash.

But then anger management would help the situation, and usually it doesn’t. I would think that if it was merely an anger problem that marital counseling could also help, but that’s been studied and marital counseling when there is DV makes the abuse worse and in fact helps the abuser be more effective with their abuse. So, it’s not “anger issues”.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm the previous prosecutor poster coming back to comment on the last two posts. As much as I appreciate their perspectives, I get frustrated when people chalk up DV to "anger issues." DV is about so much more than anger problems. If it were only about his anger, he'd also hit his children, parents, boss, server at a restaurant, other drivers on the road etc. etc. when they made him angry too. There's an additional pathology with domestic abusers that's less fixable than someone who just has problems controlling their anger.

This is a very interesting perspective I never thought of. What do you think it is about the marital relationship that makes them violent? Arguably marriage is the most intimate relationship most people have, and thus is capable of producing anger and frustration above and beyond what one experiences in other relationships.

NP and DV survivor. DV is about controlling a partner so that the abuser is the only important person in their life. It’s not about the “marital relationship” being intimate. And it’s not about “anger”. My ex has excellent control over himself - and he chose when to abuse me. It may have looked like anger from the outside, but it wasn’t, not really. It was when he felt as though he didn’t have “enough” control over me, or when I “disobeyed” him or did something I knew he didn’t like.

I'm sure that was the case in your situation, but I don't think every DV situation is the same. In the case close to me, anger issues were definitely a part of it. Your experience doesn't negate mine.

* should read, Just because a person ISN'T screaming all of the time doesn't mean he doesn't have anger control issues.

Anonymous wrote:I'm the previous prosecutor poster coming back to comment on the last two posts. As much as I appreciate their perspectives, I get frustrated when people chalk up DV to "anger issues." DV is about so much more than anger problems. If it were only about his anger, he'd also hit his children, parents, boss, server at a restaurant, other drivers on the road etc. etc. when they made him angry too. There's an additional pathology with domestic abusers that's less fixable than someone who just has problems controlling their anger.

I don't think you can say unequivocally that anger issues aren't at play. I'm a PP who has had people very close to me have DV issues, and there were certainly anger issues. In my experience, the person is able to hold it together for work and even kids, but they think that it's okay for the spouse to be the outlet. That's not the case in all DV situations, but it certainly was the case in the one close to me. Yes, there are also control issues.

Just because a person is screaming at everyone all the time doesn't mean they don't have anger issues. A person can exercise self control all day, knowing very well he can go home and binge/unleash.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm the previous prosecutor poster coming back to comment on the last two posts. As much as I appreciate their perspectives, I get frustrated when people chalk up DV to "anger issues." DV is about so much more than anger problems. If it were only about his anger, he'd also hit his children, parents, boss, server at a restaurant, other drivers on the road etc. etc. when they made him angry too. There's an additional pathology with domestic abusers that's less fixable than someone who just has problems controlling their anger.

This is a very interesting perspective I never thought of. What do you think it is about the marital relationship that makes them violent? Arguably marriage is the most intimate relationship most people have, and thus is capable of producing anger and frustration above and beyond what one experiences in other relationships.

NP and DV survivor. DV is about controlling a partner so that the abuser is the only important person in their life. It’s not about the “marital relationship” being intimate. And it’s not about “anger”. My ex has excellent control over himself - and he chose when to abuse me. It may have looked like anger from the outside, but it wasn’t, not really. It was when he felt as though he didn’t have “enough” control over me, or when I “disobeyed” him or did something I knew he didn’t like.

Anonymous wrote:I'm the previous prosecutor poster coming back to comment on the last two posts. As much as I appreciate their perspectives, I get frustrated when people chalk up DV to "anger issues." DV is about so much more than anger problems. If it were only about his anger, he'd also hit his children, parents, boss, server at a restaurant, other drivers on the road etc. etc. when they made him angry too. There's an additional pathology with domestic abusers that's less fixable than someone who just has problems controlling their anger.

This is a very interesting perspective I never thought of. What do you think it is about the marital relationship that makes them violent? Arguably marriage is the most intimate relationship most people have, and thus is capable of producing anger and frustration above and beyond what one experiences in other relationships.

I'm the previous prosecutor poster coming back to comment on the last two posts. As much as I appreciate their perspectives, I get frustrated when people chalk up DV to "anger issues." DV is about so much more than anger problems. If it were only about his anger, he'd also hit his children, parents, boss, server at a restaurant, other drivers on the road etc. etc. when they made him angry too. There's an additional pathology with domestic abusers that's less fixable than someone who just has problems controlling their anger.

Unless it was truly a one-off, super minor incident followed by intense remorse and an immediate search for help, I would never be able to trust that it would never happen again, even after years. It would be too hard for me to find out.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If the abuser is determined to stop the abuser and get help then there is hope. The victim can only hope to escape.

Yes. It takes a real sea change from the abuser. If s/he does this, if s/he can get rid of triggers like substance abuse, anger management problems, mental illness issues, then yes, it can work and get better. But that takes a whole lot of strength and determination. Does the abuser have that? Some do. Most don't.

And medication. In my view, if the abuser is unwilling to go on meds, leave. Period. It means they aren't serious about controlling their anger and/or they really don't believe it's an issue. Either way, things might be okay for a while, but the abuse will always return with a vengeance.

OP, it depends what you define as success.

I have a close family member in an abusive relationship, and the problem is that it waxes and wanes. So there will be an incident. It will seem like they *finally* address the issues. And they will go years with calm. But then the next incident, which seemingly comes out of the blue, will be 10 times worse than the last one.

That is the biggest issue, in my view, with domestic violence. It's a lot like addiction. A person can "be on the wagon" for years and then relapse, and the relapse is always really, really bad.

I have another relative who says he has overcome his anger issues, and it seems he has, but he had two heart attacks and was put on beta blockers. I think the beta blockers are really what has enabled him to diffuse his temper.

I sincerely believe that people with anger issues that can escalate to violence need medication to really get it under control. They can usually behave just long enough to keep their spouse from leaving them, but unless they're on meds, they always relapse, especially if something stressful happens.

I wish you luck, and I hope my post helps. My first example is someone close enough to me that it affected me for years, until I basically had to shut both of them out of my life. That is the other danger of staying in an abusive relationship. It starts to affect people close to you, and if they see that you are unwilling to leave but expect them to deal with the abuse as well, eventually they will distance themselves from you.

Do not stay with an abuser. Stop making excuses