Anonymous wrote:It’s beyond stupid to include PK3 not reaching the students it is intended to in any discussion involving WOTP PK3.

I don't think OP meant WOTP students were the intended target group for the program - she wrote "this program might not be reaching the students it originally intended to reach now that these neighborhoods have gentrified". To me, that clearly means that the program is now serving a lot of gentrifiers who aren't any less affluent than people WOTP, which is true. Although I disagree with her idea that free Pre-K is the primary reason that lures gentrifiers into those neighborhoods, it has certainly helped lure affluent families into DCPS.

Maybe you should actually read before you call someone "beyond stupid".

Anonymous wrote:I thought Hyde and Frances Stevens had PK3? Aren't these in West NW Neighborhoods - or not West enough?

pretty sure not even all of their IB kids get in so that's certainly not enough to serve all of WOTP

It’s beyond stupid to include PK3 not reaching the students it is intended to in any discussion involving WOTP PK3.

I thought Hyde and Frances Stevens had PK3? Aren't these in West NW Neighborhoods - or not West enough?

Anonymous wrote:Previous PP and one final thought -- you can send your kid to Pre-K 3 if you want to. They have enough spots, over all the schools, to place every kid who applies. You may not love the school but the spot exists.

Even if she doesn't "love" the school, she may love the PK program, because most of them are pretty good. They have good external oversight due to their federal funding. The limiting factor really is the commute.

Previous PP and one final thought -- you can send your kid to Pre-K 3 if you want to. They have enough spots, over all the schools, to place every kid who applies. You may not love the school but the spot exists.

I'm the previous PP -- I would.also say that gentrifiers rarely.move for the schools in such a way that would cause housing prices to go up -- school gentrification comes last. First gentrifiers move in, then housing prices go up, and finally, years later, schools improve.

OP --- NO ONE is moving to EOTP for the free Pre-K 3 (and I say this as the parent of a Pre-K 3 kid in a eotp school), and everyone here is agonizing about what to do beyond elementary. One year of school does not compare to a having a decent public option for middle school and high school.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's because PK3 was initially introduced in Title I schools in DC, but wasn't phased out when those schools lose their Title I status. The Hill was all Title I a decade ago; WOTP not so much. If PK3 were being introduced now, Brent and Maury would 100% not have it. They'd have extra PK4 classes so that more IB could get in. In fact, there is some momentum at Brent for making this change now. (There was a bigger uproar a few years ago when there was a class where a few IB kids with siblings enrolled were WLed; things seem to have died down a bit as the PK population of Brent has stopped expanding, probably because Brent has gotten so expensive.)

We've heard that before. Then along comes another record breaking application year. DC doesn't seem to be short on families who can afford million dollar houses.

There is no evidence at all that the PK population IB for Brent has stopped expanding, fwiw.

Anonymous wrote:I've seen ads that one of the Spanish bilingual private preschools has free PK3. They give preference to current families, so I assume you'd have to pay to send your kid to their 2s program in order to guarantee space.

Communikids. Great program!

Anonymous wrote:It's because PK3 was initially introduced in Title I schools in DC, but wasn't phased out when those schools lose their Title I status. The Hill was all Title I a decade ago; WOTP not so much. If PK3 were being introduced now, Brent and Maury would 100% not have it. They'd have extra PK4 classes so that more IB could get in. In fact, there is some momentum at Brent for making this change now. (There was a bigger uproar a few years ago when there was a class where a few IB kids with siblings enrolled were WLed; things seem to have died down a bit as the PK population of Brent has stopped expanding, probably because Brent has gotten so expensive.)

We've heard that before. Then along comes another record breaking application year. DC doesn't seem to be short on families who can afford million dollar houses.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here- thanks for the insights and this just confirmed my thinking. I just didn't get the history of the program since just on kid #1 who's just shy of 16 months. When you hear "DC has free pre-K," you don't understand the major caveats until you start digging into the deep dark lottery hole. Maybe if I quit working and can then drive my LO all over town in the morning.... ha. Alas, loss of income > private preK costs, so there you go. Nothing is ever truly free! I agree, seems like a reassessment is in order since this program might not be reaching the students it originally intended to reach now that these neighborhoods have gentrified (but largely due to the program one could argue).

DC does have free PK. It just might not be free PK in your exact neighborhood. There are PK programs (bilingual, montessori, etc.) that are not full after the lottery or even at the start of the school year. If you can afford to live IB for a school that doesn't offer PK3, then you can afford to live somewhere that does....and maybe you could afford to stay home too, if you'd prefer. You get to make those choices. Most people who live where there are abundant PK3 slots can't afford to make that choice or many others.

Cutting out PK3 at schools that have gentrified doesn't help get more PK slots at the schools that never had it--in fact, it would probably wind up making crowding at WoTP schools worse. And even in the schools you think have gentrified still have some at-risk kids. Also, you have no indication that free PK "might not be reaching the students it originally intended to reach" or that expanding it WoTP would help with that.

Here's what would help make PK3 slots available WoTP: close Fillmore as an arts center and open it as either a PK3-5 school or let it do PK for a group of the schools that currently don't have it, and start those schools at K. Also take middle school out of Francis Stevens and send Ross, Thompson, and Francis Stevens elementary kids to Cardozo. Close Adams as a middle school and again either open it as another PK3-5 school or have it serve as the PK center for a cluster of other schools that will then start at K. Feed Oyster and Bancroft to MacFarland with the other bilingual programs.

Parents who want their kids to go to Wilson (or to have middle school at SWW at F-S) will HATE these ideas. 5 years from now, you will probably hate these ideas too. That's the issue--you will only feel the way you do for another couple years and then you'll be in at Janney or wherever and not want to risk a boundary shift just to let some other lady with a 16 month old have free PK near her house.

All of this. It might be great if every school had PK3, but the solution is not to cut the existing PK3 classes.

"Free PK is not totally convenient for me, a MC/UMC person who lives in-bounds for a good elementary school," is not the same as "PK might not be reaching the students it originally intended to reach."

Oh DC school debates. OP here and was really not trying to start one, but here goes. I certainly wasn't advocating for losing programs where they already are and obviously resources are always scarce in any state-funded education system and hard choices have to be made, so if expanding city-wide to truly have "free pre-k" instead of just for some neighborhoods isn't an option, then of course resources should be allocated to neighborhoods that need them the most. That doesn't change the fact that many Cap Hill families and now NE families have moved into these areas often specifically for these school options and that are causing the neighborhoods to change and housing prices to go up, so that the populations these programs were meant to help have less access to them because now they are competing for a limited number of spots against more children whose parents before would've moved to other areas of NW or VA or MD, but for the free pre-k and nearby public charter options. And the burdens for lower income families to trek across town to the schools that still have spots available are even higher than for families of means. I agree, I am very fortunate that I have options and will be weighing them heavily with the hopes to be able to stay in DC while I watch many of my friends with kids give up and move. My husband and I were public school kids and believe in it and want to support the public school system by sending our children there and being active community and school parents. I just didn't realize I wouldn't be able to do this in many NW neighborhoods starting at pk3 since they do not all have public programs. Let's hope some day they do.

Sounds like you have some good ideas and should get involved in helping shape these decisions.

Ward 3 has never had PK3.

as I understand it, the basic way to explain it is tat universal PK is DC's implementation of HeadStart. HeadStart is not for upper income neighborhoods.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here- thanks for the insights and this just confirmed my thinking. I just didn't get the history of the program since just on kid #1 who's just shy of 16 months. When you hear "DC has free pre-K," you don't understand the major caveats until you start digging into the deep dark lottery hole. Maybe if I quit working and can then drive my LO all over town in the morning.... ha. Alas, loss of income > private preK costs, so there you go. Nothing is ever truly free! I agree, seems like a reassessment is in order since this program might not be reaching the students it originally intended to reach now that these neighborhoods have gentrified (but largely due to the program one could argue).

DC does have free PK. It just might not be free PK in your exact neighborhood. There are PK programs (bilingual, montessori, etc.) that are not full after the lottery or even at the start of the school year. If you can afford to live IB for a school that doesn't offer PK3, then you can afford to live somewhere that does....and maybe you could afford to stay home too, if you'd prefer. You get to make those choices. Most people who live where there are abundant PK3 slots can't afford to make that choice or many others.

Cutting out PK3 at schools that have gentrified doesn't help get more PK slots at the schools that never had it--in fact, it would probably wind up making crowding at WoTP schools worse. And even in the schools you think have gentrified still have some at-risk kids. Also, you have no indication that free PK "might not be reaching the students it originally intended to reach" or that expanding it WoTP would help with that.

Here's what would help make PK3 slots available WoTP: close Fillmore as an arts center and open it as either a PK3-5 school or let it do PK for a group of the schools that currently don't have it, and start those schools at K. Also take middle school out of Francis Stevens and send Ross, Thompson, and Francis Stevens elementary kids to Cardozo. Close Adams as a middle school and again either open it as another PK3-5 school or have it serve as the PK center for a cluster of other schools that will then start at K. Feed Oyster and Bancroft to MacFarland with the other bilingual programs.

Parents who want their kids to go to Wilson (or to have middle school at SWW at F-S) will HATE these ideas. 5 years from now, you will probably hate these ideas too. That's the issue--you will only feel the way you do for another couple years and then you'll be in at Janney or wherever and not want to risk a boundary shift just to let some other lady with a 16 month old have free PK near her house.

All of this. It might be great if every school had PK3, but the solution is not to cut the existing PK3 classes.

"Free PK is not totally convenient for me, a MC/UMC person who lives in-bounds for a good elementary school," is not the same as "PK might not be reaching the students it originally intended to reach."