Anonymous wrote:I suspect that a good percentage of people who really think through this, end up not having kids. It’s one of the things I’ve noticed about choldfree people — they have a pretty clear grasp of how much work parenting is, vs those who romanticize it and want kids. (Of course, CF people don’t really grasp the joys of it, either.)

They do grasp the potential joys, but they realize that even those joys don't always happen or come at a big cost. Not all parents feel all the magic often described. But some people have trouble believing that and constantly argue that the hardship of kids is outweighed by the highs. But while that may be their experience, some people see that it is a gamble, and they decide not to take it.

A lot of people don't think about this. I did not. But I wasn't that interested in having any kids. Asked my DH if kids were a dealbreaker because it was not a priority for me. He decided he really wanted kids after we were married.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:That’s the proceational trick of parenthood. If people really understood it before entering, fewer babies would be born.

I don't think so. Yeah, kids can be a PITA. But the love and joy totally outweigh the sleep deprivation, bodily fluids and tantrums. I had no idea just how madly crazy in love I would be with my child. I think if non-parents knew they'd feel this way, more people would have kids.

This is not universal. Glad you think it outweighs it for you, but try telling this to somebody with an especially challenging special needs kid, or whose marriage is on the brink of divorce, or who has been struggling with PPD.

There are also those of us who grew up with younger siblings, in big families, babysat a lot, nannied etc and were very excited to have kids. I always knew I’d have kids and though I admit I had it easy (pregnant immediately, easy breastfeeding with all, easy babies/no health issues no SN etc). I feel very lucky to have found parenthood to be pretty much as great (for me) as I had pictured it to be. I completely respect those who chose to not have kids, it was clear for many just like it was clear for me that I would have a family. Again- choices are amazing! I was grateful for birth control in the many years that I did not want to get pregnant.

I suspect that a good percentage of people who really think through this, end up not having kids. It’s one of the things I’ve noticed about choldfree people — they have a pretty clear grasp of how much work parenting is, vs those who romanticize it and want kids. (Of course, CF people don’t really grasp the joys of it, either.)

Anonymous wrote:That’s the proceational trick of parenthood. If people really understood it before entering, fewer babies would be born.

I don't think so. Yeah, kids can be a PITA. But the love and joy totally outweigh the sleep deprivation, bodily fluids and tantrums. I had no idea just how madly crazy in love I would be with my child. I think if non-parents knew they'd feel this way, more people would have kids.

I am always shocked at the issues that dating people do not discuss before deciding to get married. I don't think you can truly understand how things will change once you have kids, but you sure as heck can discuss priorities, philosophy, ideas, dreams, etc. Having a unified vision for what you want your family to be like sure can help you navigate the inevitable bumps along the way.

Don't be afraid to put the hard stuff on the table when you are dating!

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is impossible to truly understand how having kids changes everything until you do it.

What about people like me who could understand how having kids would change everything and therefore decided not to have kids?

People who don’t think they should really shouldn’t.

If you’re in the No camp, and your spouse/partner isn’t, let them go. Everything’s already changed forever.

That’s the proceational trick of parenthood. If people really understood it before entering, fewer babies would be born.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is impossible to truly understand how having kids changes everything until you do it.

What about people like me who could understand how having kids would change everything and therefore decided not to have kids?

If you also recognize that you’d never imagine the love and joy too, sure. I mean, whatever? No one cares.

Anonymous wrote:It is impossible to truly understand how having kids changes everything until you do it.

What about people like me who could understand how having kids would change everything and therefore decided not to have kids?

Anonymous wrote:If you don't consider it you're an idiot! Everyone single knows people with kids and all you need to do is ask them and observe them. And see how your SO interacts with kids. If they don't want anything to do with them that's a message. If they are happy to get down on the floor and play with them that's a message.

No.. how you deal with other kids is not the same as how you deal with your own. For one thing, you only spend a few hours with those other kids. The other thing, and the biggest is that you get to give those kids back to the parents. Not so with your own. To this day, I'm much more patient with other kids than my own. I knew a person who was a preschool teacher, and she thought she knew how she would deal with her own. Then she had her own. Totally different story. It really is different.

Anonymous wrote:It is impossible to truly understand how having kids changes everything until you do it.

+1 I tried to explain to a woman how tired you are once the baby arrives, and she understood it mentally, but didn't really get it until she actually had the baby. I have never been so sleep deprived and tired as when I had kids. It really changes your personality, and what was once just a quirk in your spouse becomes a raging PIA. My kids are much older now, and things have settled.

of course not

especially people who marry young (in their twenties)

My parents were very acrimoniously divorced. And my stepfather, while a good person, was an alcoholic and an erratic parent.

I thought about it a lot. I don't know where I read it or heard it but one thing that always stuck with me when I was dating is that when you're thinking about whether or not to marry someone, look at their flaws honestly and don't just ask yourself if you can tolerate them, ask yourself if you could watch your children to tolerate them.

My mom didn't ask that question of herself. I made sure I did.

I really disagree that you can't have a decent idea of what to expect. You might not totally understand how much you'll love them, how tired you'll be, how frustrated you'll get, but you will know how you deal with adversity and how the person you marries deals with adversity. How they deal with sleep deprivation...how they deal with sicknesses and gross things and stepping up for family. There are plenty of things to look at to make an educated decision on who to marry.

And I am married with two kids now FWIW to a guy who steps up every day. An excellent dad.